Great Eastern Shipping Company Ltd (GESHIP) Q2 FY23 Earnings Concall Transcript

 

Great Eastern Shipping Company Ltd (NSE:GESHIP) Q2 FY23 Earnings Concall dated Nov. 14, 2022

Corporate Participants:

G. Shivakumar — Executive Director and Chief Financial Officer

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Anjali Kumar — Head of Corporate Communications

Analysts:

Amit Khetan — Laburnum Capital — Analyst

Abhishek Nigam — B&K Securities — Analyst

Vaibhav Badjatya — Honesty and Integrity Investment — Analyst

Himanshu Patel — Oaktree Capital — Analyst

Rajesh Agarwal — Moneyore — Analyst

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Shivan Sarvaiya — JHP Securities Private Limited — Analyst

 

Presentation:

 

Operator

Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. Thank you for standing-by. Welcome to GE Shipping Earnings Call on Declaration of its Financial Results for the Quarter Two of FY ’23. [Operator Instructions]

I now hand the conference over to Mr. G. Shivakumar: Executive Director and CFO at the Great Eastern Shipping Company Limited to start the proceedings. Thank you, and over to you, sir.

G. Shivakumar — Executive Director and Chief Financial Officer

Thank you. Good afternoon, everyone, and welcome to the results presentation for Q2 and H1 FY’23. Thank you for. Joining us today.

Let me go through quick highlights that we’d like to present. We have Mr. Bharat Sheth, our Deputy Chairman and Managing Director here with us. So I won’t take-up too much time on the presentation, then we can get into Q&A — so that, we can get into a Q&A.

Let’s go-forward. Standard disclaimer. We don’t make forecasts of our earnings. Market is quite difficult to forecast. And therefore, we don’t make forecast of our earnings. What we’re trying to do is explain what has gone into the past performance and what are the various factors lining up to be.

So highlights. We have just declared our best-ever quarter of profits. Our previous best was in Q2 FY 2008-2009, that was the quarter just before we had global financial crisis. And that was just about INR500 crores. In this quarter we’ve had a profit of INR688 crores. That’s on standalone basis. And on a consolidated basis we have a net profit of INR769 crores. The half year’s profit was, of course INR1100 crores and INR1200 crores, standalone and consolidated respectively.

We declared a second straight interim dividend. That’s our second interim dividend for this year. And in the last. After the last five quarterly meetings, we have declared four of them have entered with our declaring — the Board declaring an interim dividend. We also finished the quarter, thanks to the strong cash flows, it finished the quarter with more cash than debt. Therefore, we are now net cash. We had zero net-debt. In fact, a negative net-debt.

As you know, we also normally present the, what we call the normalized financials, which strips out the impact of the exchange rate movements on our results. This time there is not much difference between the normalized and the reported results. So marginally up and down. It’s a couple of percentage points up and down in in terms of the impact on the results.

We’ll come to the net asset value. And this is just a little bit of the history of what’s been happening to our earnings. Obviously, the last couple of quarters have been very strong, which you’ll see reflected in this graph.

You would have seen this management commentary by Mr. Bharat Sheth. Again, this has to do with markets and what has happened in terms of the results. The last bit is important — last couple of paragraphs. We have also — we are also seeing continuing strength in oil prices and that seems to be having a positive impact on the offshore oil field services businesses well.

We have seen an uptick in asset values. We’ve seen an uptick in contract — contracting in the international market and in rates that are being awarded in international markets. Again, all of this comes with a word of caution. High inflation, high interest rates, there is certainly potential for a global recession or at least in significant parts of the global economy, and that could affect demand for commodities and that’s what really drives our business. So that’s something to keep in mind.

Tankers did exceptionally well in this quarter. That’s a crude and product tankers. They were quite strong in the last quarter. They’ve built on that strength in this quarter, that is in Q2 of FY’23. LPG carriers continue to be all on-time charter. The improvement in rates is because we — what we sold one of the smaller ships which are on-time charter at a slightly lower rate and that’s one of the main reasons for improvement in rates. We also had in the previous quarter a drydock which would have skewed this.

Dry bulk rates have come off quite a bit in the quarter, down 20% on average from the previous — that’s immediately preceding quarter and after this also, we have seen some drop-in rates. That is in the month of October.

Now one of the things that happened is that we’ve had a very big change in our net asset value and we ended March ’22 with the net asset value of INR618 a share. We are declaring a standalone net asset value of INR809 a share. The contributions to this and we’ve just taken the main contributions, cash profit of INR96 rupees a share, that PAT plus depreciation. Fleet value has gone up by INR106 per share. Most of it due to revaluation of ships. Some of it due to the exchange rate changes, because it will be a depreciated against the dollar.

We, of course, have paid in May and all this, we paid interim dividends for a total of INR10.80. So that took away from the net asset value since it was an outflow to the shareholders. So that’s how our standalone net asset value moved.

Just going back a little bit in history and this is since March 2017. This is how our standalone net asset value has moved. The CAGR of the NAV has been 17% over this 5.5-year period. So all the way from INR337 up to INR809 per share.

[Technical Issues] net asset value that’s gone up as well. That’s gone up to from INR679 per share in March to INR935 per share. For the first time in many quarters, we are seeing a significant marking up of values of offshore assets. So rigs were all on average muffed up by about $12.5 million at the midpoint of the range. Offshore vessels also saw some marking up in values. And that’s what helped the net asset values to go up even more on a consolidated basis. So we had INR190 increase in standalone net asset value. But if you take it on a consolidated basis, you have a INR256 increase in the consolidated net asset value.

Looking at the shipping markets. The story is pretty clear. If you look at that graph, we were down in the dumps on the tanker markets last year, all the way up to Q4. And — so which reflects in the rates you can see there. So in YTD FY ’22 Suezmax is around $5500 a day and YTD FY’23 they $141,000 a day. This again is not our average. This is the market — spot market average.

MR tankers had — also had a spectacular increase from $6,000 a day to $36,000 a day. Now what caused this? In phase in — change in trade patterns, so more of West,-East and East-West trade flows, shortage in middle distillates in the Atlantic Basin, which resulted in longer movement of products. And we have some statistics on the increase in trade. So we have demand on both; crude and — the crude and the product rate back to pre pandemic levels, which is an important milestone because we’ve been expecting this all the way from middle of 2021 and it did not happen, but we are finally there. And this is despite China — Chinese demand actually not growing and because of the lockdown.

The fleets have grown but the very heartening fact is that the order book for crude and product tankers is between 4% and 5% for both.

Coming to dry bulk. Dry bulk performaned significantly worse than in the previous quarter and in the previous year. So you had a 50% — more than 50% drop in Capesize earnings year-on year. We also had a drop between Q1 and Q2, and that was more pronounced in the case of the Capesize and less in the case of the smaller vessels. You can see it on the right as well in the Supramax, we dropped by about 24% year-on year. And we haven’t mentioned that number here but it’s dropped by probably 15% to 20% in the — from Q1 to Q2.

Again, trade growth has been flat to negative YTD over the previous year. And again, because of weakness in the iron-ore trade which has been compensated to some extent by the bulks. That weakness in the iron-ore trade explains why the Capesizes have been so weak. We had lower congestion, especially for Capesizes. And that really is just significant amount of the feed into the market and that again, change the demand-supply balance.

The current order book to fleet ratio continues to be, again, not high, and therefore, give some semblance of comfort for — that we don’t have too much of a supply overhang going forward.

LPG, the spot market really doesn’t matter or really hasn’t affected our earnings, because our ships were on tank charter through this quarter. However, markets have been stronger, the YTD FY ’23 versus FY ’22. And, they’ve become even stronger now over the last two or three weeks. However, our ships, our four LPG carriers, all are on time charters and therefore, will not be participating in this market.

Looking at fleet supply. I already mentioned this about the order book. So we have about 4% to 5% for the crude and product tankers. We have about 7% for the bulk carriers.

The prices, of course, have gone up, reflecting what has happened to earnings. Dry bulk have come down by about 15% to 20% during the quarter, again, reflecting what has happened to earnings. And that we’ve seen of course reflected in a net asset value.

Sscrapping. I won’t go into, because it’s been nothing significant since the markets have been quite strong.

Coming to the Oilfield Services business, Greatship (India) Limited. There is an increasing number of cold-stacked rigs, but there is also — there are also more rigs coming off from idling and moving into contracts. We’ll see it here. There’s a gradual improvement in utilization and the rigs under contract. So we are back again to pre-pandemic levels. If you recall, in early 2020, we said we seem to have turned the corner in the drilling market, oilfield services market.

Unfortunately COVID came in and derailed that recovery. But we have — the market has got significantly tighter since then. Of course, we’ve had removal of rigs as well. We have seen very much improved pricing coming in from contracts that have been announced in the Middle-East by listed players. So there is a lot of optimism in the market and significant amount of tightness in the market for Jack Up rigs. This is also reflecting in a slightly lesser way on the vessels.

We have one rig coming off contract in H1 FY ’24 which needs to be repriced. We have six vessels coming off contract between now and March ’23. And that’s the other scheduled. And the other two rigs are coming off contract in FY ’25.

Looking at couple of financial ratios and this is our — we’ve been showing this graph for some time. So we levered up in 2000 — in FY ’17, ’18, ’19 to to buy ships. And what has happened since then is that we’ve had very strong cash flows because those investments paid off and we are now down to a negative net debt. Again, this is all standalone numbers.

Just an indication of where we stand today. We’re still trading at a significant discount to net asset value. Our net asset value, as I showed you earlier, is about INR935 in the middle of the range for offshore asset values, We are still at about 40% discount — 35% to 40% discount to those values.

We continue to make initiatives on the environment. We try to save on fuel consumption and therefore, it gives us CO2 emissions. For anyone who is interested in our ESG efforts, we have a lot of information available on our website under the tab called sustainability. We have first published — last year we published our first ESG report. And, of course, we are looking at different things that we can do in order to reduce our emissions.

Thank you. That brings me to the end-of-the presentation. And we’ll now throw the floor open to you for questions and we’d be happy to discuss our markets with you.

Questions and Answers:

 

Operator

Thank you, very much. [Operator Instructions] The first question is from the line of Amit Khetan from Laburnum Capital. Please go ahead.

Amit Khetan — Laburnum Capital — Analyst

Hi, thank you for the opportunity. Firstly, congratulations on a very good set of numbers. Just coming to the tanker market, so we’ve seen very good rates and the fundamentals look very supportive. My question is based on your understanding of the market, what are the mean two or three risks or rather events as you’d like to see it that US management are most mindful of which could take freight rates on a sustained basis back to the levels that we saw for much of 2021?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

So. A, we don’t think that can — that should happen again. Because as we know, Cal ’21, the average for the year was at a 31-year low. So that’s not likely to happen. Can the markets downward, correct, yes they could. And what could drive that downward correction? Although I don’t believe it’s going to be anywhere close to the Cal ’21 numbers, but some correction can always take place.

And it all depends on, I guess, the level of demand destruction — possible demand destruction on recessionary fears. And on, what can happen on interest rates and the whole impact of that on demand for some of the products, particularly on diesel oil. But if you look at the inventory levels, they’re all running pretty low.

So, hopefully some demand instruction will be able to taken a strike but a lot more demand destruction than currently anticipated can upset the applecart.

Amit Khetan — Laburnum Capital — Analyst

Got it, Got it. And you have a preference for operating this spot market, but given the kind of rates that we have been seeing lately, are you tempted to lock-in more time charters and broadly, how are you thinking about the right now what would your tanker mix be in terms of spot versus time?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

So currently — so we need to break it up into crude — gas, as you know. So when we talk tankers we’ve got three surf action, right, drive crude. clean which petroleum products and then LPG. LPG is all fixed. On the product tanker side we have two vessels that we fixed a few months ago, so at pretty elevated levels.

We have two of the tankers — two of the product tankers which we have fixed. Before the big rise in the market, they come back to us in the next few weeks. So that balances out what we had fixed at some elevated levels. We’ll be fix more in the product sector. We are at this stage, uncertain, obviously some of the numbers which we are seeing for short periods of time are very tempting. But with utilization level is now running at 90% plus, a little pickup in demand can really take this market up even further. So we’re going to, be very careful.

On the crude side, we don’t have the level of exposure. Ideally we would have liked to have had as you’re aware. We sold one ship so we’ve taken some money off the table. Basically by selling a ship, all your have done is, you have cash the next four years of earnings, right, because the ship was little over 16 years each. So we’ve taken some money off the table. So I think we are currently going to keep the rest of the fleet spot.

Obviously this is a moving target and whatever I might say on this call, our thinking could change tomorrow.

Amit Khetan — Laburnum Capital — Analyst

Understood. Have have the period markets rates moved in line with spot or is the market still skeptical?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

No, no, period rates have gone up considerably. So there is a lot of optimism in the market and — but as night follows day as you know when everybody is very optimistic there is always something that plays out which was unanticipated. So — but, I think there are two critical events. One is the maritime embargo on crude oil. Europe, Russia which kicks in on the 5th of December. And then similarly there is going to be an embargo on movement of petroleum products on the 5th of February 2023. And we got to see how both these very-very important events play out.

Amit Khetan — Laburnum Capital — Analyst

Understood. Lastly, we’ve seen some softness in the dry bulk market. So, are you seeing opportunities for deployment of capital there?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

So as the — as Shiv has just mentioned, values have corrected 20%. We think at this stage that if this market were not to pick-up and this market has a much greater bearing on some of the recessionary trends we have seen globally, particularly a lot of the real estate construction levels that has come off in China and if therefore markets were to remain weak for let’s call it another six months or so, it is possible that values good drop another 10%- 15%. It’s possible. We at this stage with this first 20% correction, would still prefer to sit on the sideline.

Amit Khetan — Laburnum Capital — Analyst

Got it. Thank you, and all the best.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. The next question is from the line of Abhishek Nigam from B&K Securities. Please go ahead.

Abhishek Nigam — B&K Securities — Analyst

Yeah. Hi, thank you so much for the update. Sir, congratulations on a great set of results. So my first question is on the use plan to impose a price cap on Russian oil and eventually, sort of move away completely from Russian oil and oil product imports, how do you think is that impacting demand and supply and could there be further upside? That’s my first question.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Yeah, as I said. You know what that is we are now at 90% pls utilization level, both for crude oil as well as for petroleum products. Now once you hit these levels of utilizations, even the slightest uptick in demand or the slight test uptake in trading patterns can lead to pretty meaningful uptick in freight rates. Once you hit 90% plus, anything can happen to this market, on the positive side, right. And that is precisely one of the reasons why we would like to keep whatever we have now pretty much in the spot market.

And even if, a lot of people have asked us this question before. I might as well answered it now which is that what if this — what would be called off tomorrow, what would happen and would the markets all collapse, et-cetera, et-cetera? In our thinking, even if the war were to come off, I think, Europe is unlikely to go back to the energy dependency that they had on Russia previously, I mean, pre the war and from whatever we are reading, people are going to be a lot more cautious and some of these newer trade routes that we are seeing which is all adding to ton mile demand. Is likely to continue.

Abhishek Nigam — B&K Securities — Analyst

Fair enough. Yeah, that makes sense. So the second question that. I have is on the offshore side. So that, you know, pretty good improvement on the revenue side, EBIT margin is in mid-teens. I just wanted to check, is there any one-off over there? And is this kind of EBIT margin I think that we can expect in the future next two-three years?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

So, as we’ve discussed, I don’t know if you were there in the last quarter’s Investor presentation. We had mentioned that we received pretty lumpy insurance claim. Last time, people had asked us when it’s likely to come in. And we said in quarter two. So, that’s — money has come in. So, that — to that extent of course, there is an positive impact on the results. But instead of discussing it on a quarterly basis, which really makes no sense, I think the important thing is that. As the CFO has also just mentioned now and we mentioned it in the last investor presentation.

The worst seems behind us and we are seeing a meaningful improvement, more in the rig side, where utilization levels probably now hitting 80%. And on both sides there has been an improvement, but it’s still in the low to mid 50s, the utilization level, but that will come up, because for every rig. That is incrementally deployed you need a lot of support services and you can call the ratio as roughly 1:3, 1:3.5. So, for every time a rig gets deployed, you need between three and four boats to support the activity of that particular rig. So, all-in all, I would say big norm. Some of these one-time incomes or expenses and just take the bigger-picture, which is that there’s a lot more optimism in that sector as well.

Abhishek Nigam — B&K Securities — Analyst

Fair enough. Sir, last question from me, LPG market. I think six months back my own view was that it’s kind of peaking out fairly aggressive supply growth that was coming in.

Now, what has happened is, that there is a shortage of LNG, and there is effectively very little LNG growth till 2025. And what very-high LNG prices is doing is it’s fueling the demand for LPG in turn. So, could LPG despite a fairly strong Street outlook growth outlook, could it stay strong for another couple of quarters?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

It always good, right? As I said, we don’t look at all these quarterly things. We look at the big-picture and clearly there is a lot of supply of LPG coming in. The first-half of ’23. In terms of number of assets, but how the arbitrage gets play out, so the big trade in LPG is the arm spread between Asian LPG and US LPG, right? And a lot of this spread is determined on also the weather and the demand for our domestic LPG in the US. So, if you get a warm winter, there’s less demand and therefore more exportable commodity. If you’ll get a strong winter in the United States and there’s greater domestic demand, then you have a drawdown on inventory and less LPG to export, that’s number one.

The number two is also a lot of this is driven by delays in the Panama transit. Now, this has nothing to do with the big headline news of how many ships are delivering and what is the demand for LPG, it is also to do with these significant delays, so there our ships that wait after loading for 20 and 25 days to transit the Panama Canal. And the only way you can go US to the Far East predominantly is Panama. And if you avoid Panama and you go right around the Cape, you’re any case adding a lot more to tonne mile. So there are lot of these factors that really determine freight. These are all singular events. And I have often said it that don’t try and call these markets, because nobody can forecast these events, so.

Abhishek Nigam — B&K Securities — Analyst

No. Fair enough. That’s very helpful. That’s it for me. Thank you so much.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Yeah.

Operator

Thank you. The next question is from the line of Vaibhav Badjatya from Honesty and Integrity Investment. Please go ahead.

Vaibhav Badjatya — Honesty and Integrity Investment — Analyst

Yeah. Hi, thanks for providing the opportunity. So, our tankers, crude and product, if you can just broadly help us understand that in which states are they currently deployed? Is it like Middle East to India or. Which which state our vessels are — our tankers are currently deployed?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Sure. Basically they deployed — sometimes they get deployed into India sometimes they get deployed internationally, but broad rush, if you see about 75% of our revenue, approximately, between 70%, 75% of our revenue comes from international trades. And the balance from Indian trades.

Vaibhav Badjatya — Honesty and Integrity Investment — Analyst

Oh, okay. So, largely it is our international trades only.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Yeah. So, we will try and optimize. So, there will be certain months when we are — we get better remunerated on Indian trades there are certain months we get better remunerated on international trades and we try and keep an exposure across regions, because each region — so when we say — let’s say we say the tanker market’s is doing well, it does not mean every region of the world is doing well, right? So, there are times when the disparity between region A and region B can be x to 2x or 3x.

So, a lot this is — a lot of end earnings or average earnings are determined by how you have positioned your fleet and where you have positioned your fleet.

Vaibhav Badjatya — Honesty and Integrity Investment — Analyst

Understood. And for — so do we want to increasingly deploy our fleet for imports from Russia or — given the regulatory and sanction related risk we just don’t want to do that and we want to stay away from that trade?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

So, we haven’t done any trade from Russia from the time of the declaration of the war or the the Russian troops moving into Ukraine, we haven’t done anything and we have no intention at this stage of doing anything.

Vaibhav Badjatya — Honesty and Integrity Investment — Analyst

Got it. Yeah. That’s it from my side. Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. The next question is from the line of Himanshu Patel from Oaktree Capital. Please go ahead.

Himanshu Patel — Oaktree Capital — Analyst

Hello, am I audible?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Yeah.

Operator

Yes sir.

Himanshu Patel — Oaktree Capital — Analyst

Yeah. So my first question was, earlier we used to have a — lots of your thought process that the cash on balance sheet would be equal to what principal and interest and opex will be required in case of tough time and some cash for the acquisition if the opportunities [Indecipherable], okay? With the balance sheet becoming more of net cash, okay, what amount of cash you would like to have on balance sheet or build cash for the opportune time and what would be the guiding principles for that? Will it be, means x number of ships as we can expand or — means, how would be your thought process now versus historically when our balance sheet used to be always leveraged, okay? Let’s say [Speech Overlap] ’07 ’08 versus today?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Yeah. I have understood the question. So we don’t keep a target for how much cash should we have on the balance sheet, right? What with the current availability of cash and the fact that we are net debt zero or or in fact negative and that we have capability to leverage, we will leverage at the right time with two objectives in mind. Clearly, one is to modernize the fleet. As you know we do have an aging tanker fleet and there is a need to modernize it. And, of course, we wish to grow the business.

Now, I mean, growth — even I say grow the business means grow the number of assets that we currently operate. So whatever cash we built. Today it is 500 million or 600 million and maybe — the later that we expand, the greater will be the case build, but it’s not as if we secure okay now we will struggle to find utilization of cash.

One thing I can assure all of you listening on this call that at the right time, we will have capability to deploy this cash and deploy it in a very profitable manner. That’s the end objective. So, whatever, cash we build…

Himanshu Patel — Oaktree Capital — Analyst

Okay.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

…we have to be comfortable with.

Himanshu Patel — Oaktree Capital — Analyst

Okay. And vice-versa, how should the dividend we have been saying regularly and in last three, four quarters, okay. So what would be the dividend philosophy from here on if let’s say market situations remains like this but next three to four quarters?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Well It will broadly — I don’t think that will change. We will keep paying out — let’s say if the markets remain strong over the next few quarters or whatever, few years, whatever that timeframe will be, we’ll be happy to keep declaring interims.

Himanshu Patel — Oaktree Capital — Analyst

Okay. And one thing on offshore, we have seen pretty strong improvement in the rates between Gulf and for the offshore or rigs, okay? After — what is the — happening in Indian subcontinent okay we are there. So relationship 1:1 for similar increase because generally Indian markets have not always been in correlation, because we are allowed to keep older ships and all that [Phonetic] stuff so can you elaborate on how has the Indian market or subcontinent behaved in last three months or six months versus other markets?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Yeah. So. Clearly, what has happened in the Middle Eastern markets as you very rightly pointed out, Indian markets tend to lack. And we lack for two reasons one is, of course, the fact that we have these incredibly old rigs, which cannot be housed anywhere else that very sadly are allowed to operate in Indian waters. So, that is one reason why there is a lag. And of course the other reason is the old way this L1 system works in this country, but that’s it is what it is and we can’t go and change it all, although we do believe there are going to be now some newer age norms that are kicking in and the regulator has also just now issued some guidelines which will mean that even the older rigs will have to spend monies towards safety to enhance their safety norm, so what they call 89 [Phonetic] I’m not going to go into all the details but it’s all available in print, the new requirements.

So that’s at least a good beginning. As far as India is concerned on the drilling activity now in terms of percentage increases, we have seen the Middle-East has probably doubled the kind of earnings that are now being offered in the Middle-East have probably doubled. In India, I would say, closer to a. 70-odd-percent. Maybe 70, maybe 80% improved in that region.

We still don’t know what’s going to happen, because there are — there’s a tender in process. We’ll wait to see the levels at which it is awarded. And. I think we will then have a much better fix, but this is what we think will happen, because you can’t lag it too much. Otherwise, people will just move away from India. And then you won’t get rigs in India in any case.

Himanshu Patel — Oaktree Capital — Analyst

And one last thing, basic question. See, historically we always had a financial leverage on-balance sheet, okay. And which would always result in movements on the NAV side, okay? Because whatever increase was happening, the debt was not increasing and hence equity would be much more faster moving or NAV. With more more cash and the strength of balance sheet, should we expect that NAV should not were negative surprise also? And even on even if it goes slowly on the upside, but it would not give that much negative jerk what we saw in let’s say 2008 to 2015 type of time period.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Look, if you get a Lehman — no, so if you get a Lehman crisis, right? What happened in 2008? There was a significant black swan event and capital availability just dried up and therefore you saw these big correction in asset values. Now if you get that kind of an event again, of course, there’ll be a sharp correction in net asset value, right?

However. If you ask, you know, compared to 2008 when we were really completely invested, today we’ve got plenty of cash. So, would we welcome a big correction in asset values very clearly you won’t. So, everybody gets really excited about these quarterly results, which really a waste of time in many ways. Eventually the company will get built to go from strength-to-strength an a more meaningful manner in weaker markets as opposed to stronger markets. So, stronger market gives you the cash and then hopefully the weaker markets will come and that’s when we got to redeploy the capital in a significant manner and so long as we do that it will serve the investors well.

Himanshu Patel — Oaktree Capital — Analyst

And one last thing. Earlier, we used to trailing Handysizes also okay in eight, nine years back we used to have, so is it a completely no for us now or we might look for opportunities in that segment also on dry-bulk side.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

So. I hate to say ever no because shipping is all about uncertainty. But currently our thinking is to go for the larger sizes. Where we think that the longer-term returns are superior to this and then the smaller ships you have to spend in a lot more managerial time both on technical issues, operational issues, marketing issues as compared to the bigger ships. So, there is, the bigger ships are easier to fix, provide you the same return or superior return so why call us the trouble.

Himanshu Patel — Oaktree Capital — Analyst

Okay. Thank you from my side.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you the next question is from the line of Rajesh Agarwal from Moneyore. Please go ahead.

Rajesh Agarwal — Moneyore — Analyst

It is the same issue. [Indecipherable] it is the same only.

Operator

Rajesh, your line has been unmuted please proceed with your question.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

I think he’s got his answer.

Operator

Okay. We’ll move to the next question from the line of Rajesh Kattar [Phonetic] from Individual Investor. Please go ahead.

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Yeah, Hi, am I audible?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Yes.

Operator

Yes, you are.

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Okay. I have a very — I have a few very short questions so. I will just like some data points like how much lower is the time charter rate compared to the spot rate in tankers?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

So when you say time charter rate it all depends on the duration you’re talking about. And therefore there is no one answer. The longer the duration, the steeper backwardation, right? So and the shorter the duration, the narrower the backwardation. So, there is no easy answer to this. And also, we are still not. I mean, there are if you had very-very modern tonnage, if you had a new building for example. You could probably fixed for five years on 10-year-old ship or a seven year-old ship fixed for five years? Most unlikely.

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Okay so let me put it this way, like, usually when you fix your ships for time-charter in whichever of four segments, you typically fixed them for like six months or one year or two years. And so if you take an average of that, so in that sense how much is the time-charter rate lower to spot? Can you give me some indicative figure like is it 15% 20% lower or is it a steeper than that, just some qualitative answer on that?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Yeah. So first of all, what do you call spot? I’ll tell you why I’m not trying to — I’m more than happy to answer it, but I wanted to understand the business, right? What do you call spot? Do you call yesterday’s rate spot? Do you call today’s rates spot, do you call tomorrow’s rate spot? And this is the business, where the difference between earning yesterday today and tomorrow, could be $5,000 and $10,000, a day, right?

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Yeah.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

So what do you benchmark it with? But what you really need to understand, right, is of course as you rightly said, we very rarely go beyond two years, very, very rarely. Typically, tend to fix for one year. Sometimes we will fix for a little shorter duration, because a lot also depends on what the customer wants. So, sometimes customers say, we don’t want to take a one year exposure, we are happy for, five, seven months. Sometimes customers says, we want minimum two-year. So it depends. But roughly, you could take the discount, the shorter the duration maybe the discount. If you just take — you freeze a certain spot rate, it could be between five and, 20%, something like that. But the spot it self is moving, so what you call a 20% discount today may suddenly flip into a premium to spot or the discount may steepened from 20 to 50 you know what I mean.

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Okay, okay. Yeah understood yeah, so, so.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Yeah. Because your spot itself is moving by multiple $1,000 a day. So, it’s not a it’s not a static number spot.

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Okay. Understood so in terms of your tanker fleet. So, today the rates are quite profitable for you and at multiyear highs probably. So, what will make you locked-in the higher rates even if you were to let’s say fixed time charter at, let’s say, 15% discount or 20% discount. You are not going for the time charter in the tanker market, so what will make you go for it?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

So, currently — so, I think if we were really to get very concerned about some events, which may possibly play out. If there was an internal view that, look, and we view this trust me we view this almost daily. But if there was a real concern of an event that could very significantly negative play out and that four a meaningful period of time, not for one week or two weeks or three weeks or something like that. We may think of fixing out.

Having said that, we are more inclined to remain spot and I’ll tell you, why. As I said utilization today is at 90-plus-percent and we have seen in the past that when utilization hits these levels, the earnings can go up very steeply and very quickly, number one.

Number two, we have plenty of cash on the balance sheet. So, even if things go wrong, it’s not as if we need to run for cover we are worried about debt servicing, etc. Having taken a very conservative approach to leverage, on the balance sheet, we are going to roll that die on the operating leverage, which is running more ships in the spot market.

Now, clearly today anything that we fix for, say, six months or one year is incredibly profitable, but can the — you may still leave lots of money on the table, because of where utilization levels are. And then you will return.

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Okay.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

So all-in-all, we are more inclined to be spot players, all-in-all.

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Okay. So, how one.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

But again as I was telling one of the earlier speakers, we are and I’m not exaggerating when I say this that we review this on a daily basis, so we are always in the market wanting to know what, customers are willing to pay us for six months or one year always.

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Okay. Understood. So how have been the tanker rates in October and November till now compared to the rates which you witnessed from July to September quarter?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

So, October and November onwards till-date because we’re in the middle of November now.

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Yeah.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

On the crude side, it is stronger. On the product side. I would say on the smaller ships it’s a little weaker. On the bigger product tankers, it’s a little stronger.

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Okay. So when you fixed…

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Again don’t don’t look at all this day-to day, because it I can tell you something today and by evening it’s all changed.

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Yeah I understand that is a standard disclaimer, because. I have attended all your con calls, I understand that.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Okay.

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

And I give you everything —

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Have you seen what can happen right, one month than then the other month. Yeah

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Absolutely that is absolutely fine. So, when you fix your ships on the spot, typically the journey is for how many days. I mean I’m just trying to understand like is it like the spot journey is like also it depends on the trade that I understand, but the trades — where you have deployed your ships on the spot. So what are the typical journey days like?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

So, let me — I understood your question. So, we keep changing our trade routes right? Because we are trying — to when you have a ship on the spot within the region you’re operating, you’re trying to optimize your earning. Now, within the same region, so let’s say. I am trading my ships south of the Suez Canal, right? Either I made was to duration of 20 days, because that’s giving me the highest yield over the 20 days or I may say that all right. I’m happy to go at this rate I don’t mind fixing my ship or locking my ship for 40 to 50 days, but the average in multiple. If you just take different regions of the world you can say it will be somewhere between the shortest will be 15 maybe, yeah, 15, 20 days. And the longest will be about two months.

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Okay. Okay. Understood. In this quarter’s profit, is there any contribution from the sale of ship or that is completely on the balance sheet site?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

No. It’s there P&L.

G. Shivakumar — Executive Director and Chief Financial Officer

Yeah there’s about INR115 crore profit on sale of ships.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

That’s on standalone basis. And we have as an earlier had hit asked about offshore. We have INR45 crore what is that growth,. Which was received on account of of vessel insurance. In the offshore business so that’s in the consolidated accounts.

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Okay. Okay and sir you had said that the LPG carriers are in time charter so when is there time charter getting over?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

So, basically our customers have an option. So we fixed it for one year within their option to extend it by one more here. So, if they extend the option then it will go to the middle of ’24.

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Okay. And their right to exercise option is at the same price or at a higher price?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Same price.

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Okay. Okay, sir that’s it from my side for now. Yeah thank you.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. The next question is from the line of Vaibhav Badjatya from Honesty and Integrity Investment. Please go ahead.

Vaibhav Badjatya — Honesty and Integrity Investment — Analyst

Yeah. Can you hear me? Hello?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Yes.

Operator

Yes.

Vaibhav Badjatya — Honesty and Integrity Investment — Analyst

Yeah, yeah. Thanks for providing the follow-up. So, in anyway, can this — EU ban on Russian oil, both crude and products. Can turn out to be negative for for the tankers market? Can you visualize any scenario that this can happen?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

At the moment, no.

Vaibhav Badjatya — Honesty and Integrity Investment — Analyst

Okay, but actually if it turns out to be effective completely effective then obviously some of the oil and products will go off the market and the tankers who are deployed in that region might come to the rest of the regions, don’t you think that demand/supply might incrementally turn negative in that case?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

No, so basically Russia has to find then oil for the market, right, and there are a number of owners who will be happy to continue [Indecipherable] Russian crude, Russian products. Because it’s not as if supply completely goes off the market, where will those countries get their supply from? There is not enough global excess supply to say that all right even if Russian export go to zero, we as a country provide it. No country in the world can provide it. So, you I mean, and then you know what will happen to oil? You’ll see that 150 [Technical Issues].

Vaibhav Badjatya — Honesty and Integrity Investment — Analyst

Yeah, that’s — that I understand.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Yeah. So, I don’t think that you will see a situation whereby Russian exports of crude oil and petroleum products go to zero. That will not happen.

Vaibhav Badjatya — Honesty and Integrity Investment — Analyst

Okay.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

And so long as there is oil to move you will always find a ship to carry it. We will not do it, but there are lot of people who may do it.

Vaibhav Badjatya — Honesty and Integrity Investment — Analyst

Right, right. Yeah so. You some of the values that we are seeing on the current market in terms of asset values, do you think it can have effect of probably people are preparing to — preparing for the impending [Indecipherable]. I mean to say that, some of the Russian shipping companies might be in a hurry to buy the assets and that’s why these values are inflated to that extent. Is it a case in your view?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

So clearly at the moment values are being held, let’s break it up into older ships and more modern ships, right? The more modern ships have a closer relationship with newbuilding prices. And, due to all these inflationary pressures which we’re all reading about, right? Newbuilding prices are at a very elevated level today. That’s supporting the values of your, let’s say, Middle East, to modern, yeah, to the –. Now the older vessels are clearly partly being supported by the fact that there are owners willing to take Russian rates.

And. The very strong learning, so even if you take our vessel which may be two years left for trading one year left for trading, the difference in earnings between a very modern ship and that ship is not so great. So, people on because what is the alternative? Alternative is you say I will scrap it, right? Now, on — why would you scrap a ship which is giving you a potential yield of 40% to 50%? So there are buyers for older ships because of the very strong earnings. Of course, there are also some buyers who will be happy to trade Russia. So it’s a combination of two, three events. Eventually, even if you are willing to trade Russia but if the market is weak, why would the asset value remain strong?

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

No, I mean to say like if Russia has to export its goods, obviously, their state-owned companies have to arrange for the shipping. And they might be…

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

No, no, there are also a lot of other owners — just to interrupt you for a minute. There are other owners, there are Greek owners, there are Middle Eastern owners, there are Far Eastern owners who are willing to do Russian trade. It’s not just Russians.

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Okay.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

It’s much more broadly based than prima facie may appear.

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Okay. Got it. That answers my question. Yeah. Thank you. That’s it from my side.

Operator

Thank you. The next question is from the line of Devesh Chawar [Phonetic], Individual Investor. Please go ahead.

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Yeah. Congratulations, sir, on an excellent quarter. My question is like GE Shipping is trying to maximize its shareholder value by giving dividends and by doing buybacks. Most of the other players in the world are also doing the same. They are also doing buybacks. They are giving dividend. No one has done a significant capex till now or the order book is very low for tankers worldwide. So what is your outlook in the medium term? Like everyone is — I like the approach GE Shipping is going on. But what if everyone is using the same approach in the same manner?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

No. So first of all, I think if we look at — just break it up, one point was buybacks and dividends, right? Now overseas people have a lot more flexibility on buybacks than we have in India, right? In India, as you know, between two buybacks, there’s a gap of pretty close to 18 months.

But overseas, you don’t have that restriction. So there are regular buyback programs running. And one of the reasons why shipping companies tend to buy back is not because they don’t wish to acquire tonnage. It’s only because paper is cheaper than steel. So today if we buy a ship for $100 and the equity markets are saying we value this asset at $70 or $60 because the book discount to steel, then may be you’re better off buying a paper, right? That’s number one.

Number two, why are people not placing orders for tankers? There are people wishing to place order for tankers, but shipyards currently are full with container orders and LNG orders. So there is very little available shipbuilding capacity. That is free. And again, when I talk about shipbuilding, I’m talking about reputable shipyards. I’m not talking about every Tom, Dick, and Harry. So there are very few reputable shipyards that are available to deliver you today a tanker till second half of ’25. Now an owner will say, look, ’25, what may happen, what may not happen, nobody knows. So what am I better off doing today, especially if I’m trading at a discounted net asset value?

Unidentified Participant — — Analyst

Okay, sir. Sir, that answers my question. Thanks a lot.

Operator

Thank you. The next question is from the line of Shivan Sarvaiya from JHP Securities Private Limited. Please go ahead.

Shivan Sarvaiya — JHP Securities Private Limited — Analyst

Hello, sir. Am I audible?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Yes.

Operator

Yes, you are.

Shivan Sarvaiya — JHP Securities Private Limited — Analyst

Sir, thanks for the opportunity. So just one question on the scrapping. While we can — I can understand that the scrapping on the tanker side is weak because we’ve got a super earnings cycle. But what explains the weaker scraping on the dry bulk side? Because these rates are like one of the lowest level seen, so just some thoughts on that, please.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

So even on the dry bulk, earnings are still well above operating costs. And an owner does not like to scrap their ships until there is a sustained period of time when earnings are below operating cost.

I think I explained this earlier also in one of the earlier investor calls that every trading day that is left in the ship is basically like a free option, right, because markets can turn on a dime. And therefore, why would somebody want to scrap a ship when they are earning more than operating costs? See, even at today’s earnings, there is a meaningful EBITDA contribution.

Shivan Sarvaiya — JHP Securities Private Limited — Analyst

Okay. Okay. So sir, at what level would this EBITDA contribution become NIM, a broad understanding, it means 10% lower than the current rates, 5% lower than the current rates?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

So again, if you take an average, you’re talking about almost 30%, 40% below current rates. 50% below current rates in certain classes. So there is still a long way to go. But the one thing I must put a caveat here that there are a lot of new rules and regulations that are kicking in from January ’23. Now that itself, there will be ships that may not be able to comply with the new rules and regulations, number one. They may have to find a — they may have to be forced to scrap. There are some ships whereby customers who are also getting more conscious on decarbonization may say we will not take vessels that do not meet certain standards on decarbonization. And some of that decision-making may lead to further scrapping.

Shivan Sarvaiya — JHP Securities Private Limited — Analyst

Okay. And sir, what…

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

So it may not forcibly [Phonteic] limited to earnings drop.

Shivan Sarvaiya — JHP Securities Private Limited — Analyst

Okay. And sir, according to you, what would be the percentage of fleet that would be forced to scrap, as you mentioned?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

No. That — see, as I said, how many ships in the world can meet, cannot meet the statutory norms, it’s impossible for us sitting in here to know or anyone to know for that matter because which ship can meet, which ship cannot meet, it’s impossible to tell.

Shivan Sarvaiya — JHP Securities Private Limited — Analyst

Okay, sir. Okay. Got it. Thanks for answering my question.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you.

Anjali Kumar — Head of Corporate Communications

Since there are no more speakers, we can take the text question now.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

The what questions?

Operator

Yes, ma’am.

Anjali Kumar — Head of Corporate Communications

I’ll read out — there are some of the investors who have put their questions in the text box. So I will read them up one by one. The first question is from Tejas Parekh [Phonetic], who is an individual investor, and he’s asking, why the tax expense is so low for us?

Shiva, if you can answer that?

G. Shivakumar — Executive Director and Chief Financial Officer

Yeah. Yeah, thank you for your question. We operate like about 99% of shipping. We operate under a tonnage tax regime, where tax is paid not on the basis of the operating profits, but based on our income — notional income, which is calculated. So even if we make a loss, we pay that tax. So that regime has been in place for about 17 — 18 years now, and we operate under that regime. And that’s why the tax is low. And in some years, even if we are making zero profit, we’ll be paying the tax.

Yeah. Anjali, you can move on to the next…

Anjali Kumar — Head of Corporate Communications

Yeah. The next question is from Jathin [Phonetic] and he’s from Invest Avi PMS [Phonetic]. His question is given that the Company had been investing in the rig business for almost a decade, how do you see the future of this business?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

So as we’ve said to one of the earlier queries that currently, what we are seeing is earnings on the rig business go up. We are seeing values of the rigs go up and utilization levels, which probably troughed a few years ago at almost 60% is now back to closer to 80%, maybe 85% depending on whose data you look at. And therefore, in the medium term, and so long as oil prices remain closer to $100, which looks very, very likely, you should see the rig markets stay pretty strong.

Anjali Kumar — Head of Corporate Communications

Thank you for that, sir. Mr. Ghanshyam Bansal [Phonetic], an individual investor, wants to know — of course, he’s congratulating you for a good set of numbers. He also wants some clarification. If all four LPG ships were on charter, then how average realization has increased from [Indecipherable] in the LPG segment? And when are they coming out of charter? And any…

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

That I think the — yeah, the CFO explained why that average earning has gone up. It’s just simply because one of the older units, which was below the average got sold. Consequently, the averages went up. So that’s just mathematics.

As to when they are coming up also, we have just answered that. The oil companies to whom we have chartered the ships have certain options. If they were to exercise the options, then we are talking about the middle — some in the middle of ’24 and some in the end of ’24.

Anjali Kumar — Head of Corporate Communications

He would also like to know our plans for entering the containership segment.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Yes. So it’s something we are tracking. Just for his information, the day-to-day earnings in the container market has come off, depending on the route from — by about 60% to 70% and values are down 30% to 40%. In that space, they are still considerably higher than pre-COVID levels. And we would, therefore, be — we are tracking it. But for us, it’s too early to enter.

Anjali Kumar — Head of Corporate Communications

He also wants to know any plans for us to reduce our dollar debt.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Well, we — during the — Yeah. Shiv, you want to answer that?

G. Shivakumar — Executive Director and Chief Financial Officer

We did do some prepayments. We prepaid about $45 million of debt in the first six months of this year. But we’ll take a call on the remaining as and when we see the cash building up. If we see cash building up and we don’t see the utilization for that cash in reinvesting in the business, then we will think about further reducing the dollar debt.

Anjali Kumar — Head of Corporate Communications

Thank you. Mr. Rajesh Agarwal wants to know our outlook on the dry bulk market.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Well, at the moment, as we have just said that the market has come off. Again, I’ve often said that it’s very difficult to give outlooks because things turn on a dime. But if we had to place the bet, we would place for the next month, two months maybe. We think that earnings will be broadly where they are today, give and take. But I repeat that it’s very, very difficult to forecast markets for the next 30, 60 days, 90 days.

Anjali Kumar — Head of Corporate Communications

Correct, sir. Mr. Rajesh Khattar wants to know about our next dry dock schedule and how many ships and how many number of days?

Mr. Khattar, I think this we can take it offline and mail it to you because there are a couple of ships, which go for dry bulk every quarter, and our team can help you with that. So if you can connect with us on e-mail, I can send you those details.

The next question is from Mr. Bharat Pettay [Phonetic], he’s an investor, and he wants to know if any of our current or old ships need upgradations to increase margins, and also, what are the future plans to tap new markets.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Well, I don’t know — so first of all, on margins, I’ve not fully understood the question, but I don’t think we need to spend anything towards that. Obviously, we need to spend monies towards rules and regulations, and that’s an ongoing exercise for compliance, which we are all geared up to do. And that’s again something that is being tracked regularly to make sure that we are always in compliance with all rules and regulations.

And what was the second bit of the question?

G. Shivakumar — Executive Director and Chief Financial Officer

What are the plans to tap new markets? I mean, we are looking at new markets…

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Yeah, I mean, as we just explained, yeah, the only possible market we may look at, at some point, is containers. Again, that’s work in progress. And other than that, we don’t have any other plans at this stage.

Anjali Kumar — Head of Corporate Communications

Great. Thank you, sir. I think that’s all. Okay. We have one more question from Charvi Pandey of Fidelity. Will you increase dividend payouts or think of giving out special dividends given high free cash generation?

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

It’s really something for the Board to determine based on our own internal requirements for capex, which we present to the Board whenever we declare results. We do a presentation to the Board telling them what we think is required for purposes of modernizing the fleet and expanding the fleet. And these onetime dividends, again, we’d rather let the Board determine if they want to be in a mood to pay this onetime dividend.

Anjali Kumar — Head of Corporate Communications

Great. Thanks, sir. That’s all said in the text box. From Chorus, if you can this over?

Operator

Yes, there are no more questions in the audio queue. So I will now hand the conference over to Ms. Anjali Kumar for closing comments.

Anjali Kumar — Head of Corporate Communications

Thank you very much to all of you for joining this call and the discussion that we have today. Please feel free to reach out to our team for any further queries that you may have. And, of course, the transcripts and the audio link of this call will be on our website in a couple of days. Thank you very much.

Operator

Thank you very much.

Bharat K. Sheth — Deputy Chairman & Managing Director

Thank you all. Thank you.

Operator

[Operator Closing Remarks]