Note: This is a preliminary transcript and may contain inaccuracies. It will be updated with a final, fully-reviewed version soon.
Wpil Ltd (NSE: WPIL) Q4 2026 Earnings Call dated May. 19, 2026
Corporate Participants:
Prakash Agarwal — Managing Director
Unidentified Speaker
Analysts:
Ravi Naredi — Analyst
Deepak Parswani — Analyst
Unidentified Participant
Saket Kapoor — Analyst
Jainam Doshi — Analyst
Presentation:
Prakash Agarwal — Managing Director
The conference is now being recorded.
Unidentified Speaker
Revenue from operations was 1855 crores registering a growth of 3%. EBITDA was 318 crores increasing by 9% year on year with EBITDA margins at 17.16%. PAC from continuing operations amounted to 200 crores marking a growth of 2% while PAC margins stood at 10.77%. On a stand alone basis though, revenue for the quarter stood at 201 crore, down by 44% year on year while EBITDA stood at 50 crores, down by 22%. EBITDA margins were reported at 25.03%. Net profit stood at 40 crores reflecting a decline of 13% y on y with PAT margins at 19.98%.
For the financial year, revenue stood at 763 crores declining by 34% year on year while EBITADA stood at 163 crores, down by 19%. Year on year, EBITDA margins were at 21.3. Net profit stood at 117 crores while packed margin stood at 15.33%. For the domestic business, the product division delivered a steady performance during the quarter with revenues at 109 crores versus 108 crores in the corresponding period last year. Order booking momentum remained healthy with order backlog improving to. I’ll come back to that.
Recently we secured large cooling water pump contracts from DBC and deeper chemicals, further strengthening our presence in the power and industrial segments. We continue to witness healthy traction in both revenues and order inflows across key end user sectors reflecting sustained demand momentum and strong market positioning. Looking ahead, we expect strong demand from the power sector along with the rollout of Jal Jeevan Mission Phase 2 which should both support the product growth. The project business continued to remain subdued during the quarter with revenues at 92 crores compared to 253 crores last year as the company remained focused on project commissioning and commencement of O and M activities.
However, following the Cabinet clearance for Jaljeevan Mission Phase 2 in March, we are witnessing renewed momentum in the sector as funds are being released and hopefully new projects will be tendered soon. International revenues rose sharply to 1,136 crores in 2016 compared to 668 crores in the previous year. Driven by strong execution and robust overseas demand. The order backlog for the product division stood at 5,796 million at the end of 26 providing healthy revenue visibility going forward.
Group of Turia continued to witness strong order inflows from the MENA region driven by rising investments across the oil and gas and water space. Demand remains particularly strong for high performance pump solutions and gas turbines supported by ongoing capacity additions and energy infrastructure expansion across the regions. The outlook for FY27 has improved significantly backed by fresh opportunities emerging across the Miele market. Sterling and United are benefiting from sustained momentum in the Australian market with healthy demand emerging from LNG and mining sectors.
The subsidies continue to strengthen their position with specialized pumping applications catering to critical industrial operations. Our JVWPL Thailand delivered a standout performance during FY26 surpassing 300 crores in revenue for the first time. On the international project side, MESA Italy has successfully completed all legacy projects and is witnessing a healthy pipeline of new irrigation and drainage related opportunities. Eigenbau South Africa had a record performance during the year in terms of both revenue and profitability.
ECI Africa continued to secure sizable contracts within the South African water sector supported by which is supported by sustained infrastructure investments and an improving project execution environment during the period. The company secured large contracts from City of Cape Town for Makassar project and the Lower Umkumazi project recently providing healthy revenue visibility for the medium term. With this, I’d like to take questions.
Operator
Thank you very much. We will now begin with the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and then one on their touchstone phone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and then two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles again. To register for a question, please press star and then one. Your first question comes from the line of Ravi Naredi with Naridi Investment.
Please go ahead.
Questions and Answers:
Ravi Naredi
Okay, sir, thank you very much to give me opportunity, sir. Double four zero five order received in from South Africa. It is not showing in investor presentation any specific region.
Unidentified Speaker
It’s come after. This is for the 31st of March. It has come, you know, this month which we report
Ravi Naredi
It is a big order. So you must mention in the investor presentation. If this is so now what is the position? How much order book now? Including the South Africa
Unidentified Speaker
Including South Africa order book is right now about 4,000 4 billion rand.
Ravi Naredi
4 billion rand. And Portal, can you describe in that?
Unidentified Speaker
Yeah. So if you see this project on a book, You are asking for the total order book.
Ravi Naredi
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Company as a whole.
Unidentified Speaker
Company as a whole is about 6000 crores.
Ravi Naredi
6000 crore. And in how many years it will be educated?
Unidentified Speaker
There is different time cycles. For example, the biggest sector right now is the South African order book which we have. Which is tentatively from three to four years. 36 to 48.
Ravi Naredi
Three to four years. And what expecting we are the revenue from current year.
Unidentified Speaker
We are expecting good growth based on the execution profile of these contracts. However, you know these. The biggest areas we find are two. Which are the product business as we have said is a good growth trajectory it has got with its backlog. The second is we expect the Jalvan mission phase two to now give fresh momentum as the funds are being released. And I think project execution will be speeded up. So we see a good thrust there for revenue growth. And thirdly, the South African projects will now move into engineering and execution phase.
Ravi Naredi
So can we describe in the percentage term how much we are expecting? 2000 crore, 2500 crore for whole year.
Unidentified Speaker
No, we would not like to do that. But we will be updating. But you can see that the growth profile is well established. Because we have cleared signals. You know, earlier, like for example in the judge even it was stuck for the cabinet approval. Now the JBMP is very clearly fund allotted. So that is a good thrust. The South African orders, as I had mentioned earlier, we have been expecting them for some time. They are now received. So that is a very big positive. And the product backlog is improving.
So the trend is there. And we will keep updating.
Ravi Naredi
So can you describe in JJ2 JJM2 how much order we may receive this year or how much work we can do?
Unidentified Speaker
I think it is better. We have to wait and watch. There are two good positives. One is you saw the cabinet approval came through. And recently fresh funds were allotted to Bengal. Fresh funds were allotted to UP and other states. So I think the process is restarted in a very positive way. It is going to move a bit slow. And I expect that by the second quarter, second quarter of this year it will gain momentum. So the better time will be to go by second quarter.
Ravi Naredi
Can I ask in JJM1 how much was the order book from the government and how much they are predicting in JJM2
Unidentified Speaker
For us? The order backlog in phase one is approximately 1100 crores from JJM.
Ravi Naredi
Okay. And
Unidentified Speaker
We have 500 crore in omn. So that is also starting. So we see a good move there.
Ravi Naredi
One last question. Can we.
Operator
Sorry to interrupt. Ravi sir, may we request you to return to the queue for further. No problem. No problem.
Ravi Naredi
No problem. No Problem. Thank
Operator
You so much sir. The next question comes from the line of Deepak Parswani from Swan Investments. Please go ahead.
Deepak Parswani
Yeah. Hi, good evening sir and thank you for the opportunity. Sir, firstly wanted to check it out on the South African operation. I mean if I were to look from the order book point of view, at this point of time we have the 5000 odd crore kind of thing. Order book. Eventually from the project business point of view, does it also mean next year there would be a significant ramp up on the overall Consol project business or how should we see.
Unidentified Speaker
We can clearly see the South African business ramping up and I expect the, as we have said the JJM also to be released. I’m a bit cautious on jjm, you know, because of the last year’s experience. But the timing may differ. But the momentum will surely be very positive for JJM also and South Africa as we have these contracts in hand. This works in two ways. One is the visibility of revenues is there. It will obviously take some time. The engineering site establishments will happen now. But I think from the second half we will see momentum, revenue momentum.
And JM also, you know, and also South Africa. This is positioning us very well for future because with these large contracts we are now, you know, at a different qualification and profile. Execution profile level, sir.
Deepak Parswani
I mean this year on the African side, international project side we did a 388crore and based on the current order book, would it be fair to say we will do, I mean assuming a three to four year kind of time frame you mentioned, so 1200 crore kind of run rate from the international business itself, would that be the clear assumption?
Unidentified Speaker
I think it would take some, as I said we will see more visibility on the revenue conversion. But there is no, we have to, you know, this entire order book in the project order book in South Africa have to be executed in the next three to four years. So I think the starting second half we will see momentum next year will be higher momentum. So typically that’s the general profile of these projects.
Deepak Parswani
Okay. And on the domestic part of the business, again if I were to look from the order book point of view now since as you mentioned, I mean on the JGM front there is some kind of improvement looking at the previous quarters and previous year, how should we see the execution on the domestic side of business in this year? And secondly if I want to look into trade receivable as a whole for the year, despite the flattish revenue growth, there seems to be a little bit of increase in this year. So just wanted to Check is it mainly because of the jj and still there are some receivable which.
Which are yet to be received or we have received all the payment at this point of if you can give a broader sense on that.
Unidentified Speaker
So we haven’t received most of it. So the funds for JJM are yet to be released. I mean we are hearing of the process. The process is well established. You see without the. According to my understanding, without the cabinet approval, the fund sanction was not there first. The fund sanction happened then because of the JGM 2 procedure. The state signed MoUs with the Jal Shakti ministry. And third step is fund release where the first lots of funds have been allocated, some have been released. So I think you will see we are confident that we will have a.
We should see very good fund release in the next couple of months. But maybe starting this month, increasing next month sort of. Okay.
Operator
Deepak sir, we request you to return to the queue for follow ups please. Is there are several of the participants waiting for that one. Thank you. Sure. The next question comes from the line of Nikon Supriya with Carnelian Capital Asset Management. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Yes sir. So we have seen in console balance sheet that the trade receivable has increased from 1030 crores in March 25 to 1184 crores in March 26. So is there any particular reason for that? Because the revenue has largely remained stable only in this year.
Unidentified Speaker
The major reason as outlined is the Jaljeevan mission funds in India which were not released and which we expect to be released shortly.
Unidentified Participant
So out of total receivables how much pertains to the geomission?
Unidentified Speaker
I think approximately. I would say the total clear receivable overdue to us is roughly about 350 crores. And the others are invoiced and in the process. So you know. So it’s a major area which is stuck with dead. No movement on this for some time.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. And one more question. So in our control P and L EBITDA margin has decreased from 20% to 14.9% in Q4. Whereas in our standalone it’s still at 20 25%. So if there any strain to any particular subsidiary or something like that.
Unidentified Speaker
No, no, I don’t think so. Our main mandate has always been to have the ebitda margins between 15 to 20% on a whole. Like this year, just to give you an example, this product division has been higher performance. So they have been doing very good performance. So that has increased the EBITDA margin in India. But on a Normalized level, we are looking at 15 to 20% and we are at about 17% now.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, understood. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Disha from Sapphire Capital. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah, hello. Hello.
Unidentified Speaker
Yes.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah, so currently our AudioBook is at 6000cr. Can you give me the split between the project business and the product out of this order book?
Unidentified Speaker
Yeah, the. So the project business would be so about thousand crore and five thousand crore. Thousand crore product and five thousand crore project.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. How do you see the overall pipeline? Where do we expect major projects from? Will it be international, Will it be domestic? Just a little bit more color on that.
Unidentified Speaker
I want to just clarify one thing that the point we are trying to make is that what we did in this financial year which is very critical is that the international revenues are roughly at 65% and domestic revenues are 35%. And we have now divided this equally between the sort of. We have got a good project business internationally and a good project business in India and we got a good product business internationally and a product business here. So what we’ve done is diversified well. And the point we try to highlight on the Jaljeevan is that there is a positive out news in the Jaljeevan which supports the outlook for the future.
Similarly South Africa, the orders which we expected have come and it strengthens our outlook for the future. But all our businesses are performing so we should not and we are not going to be very much totally project focused. But we have strong project businesses and strong product businesses. So the project is just needed for higher revenue visibility over a period of time.
Unidentified Participant
So what is the pipeline? So that you currently, what sort of projects are we currently beginning for how much inflow are we expecting this year?
Unidentified Speaker
So right now say for example in South Africa, obviously we will try to now work on revenue increase and consolidate on this order backlog. In India, the project business, we are hoping that new tenders are announced. The water sector has been very subdued for the last one year. So we expect the pent up demand to be released in the form of new tenders. And once they are out we will be able to update you better on the pipeline. But presently it is quite low. The pipeline and the product businesses are doing excellently.
Across both the businesses we are seeing record order books across the sector.
Unidentified Participant
So this water sector that you mentioned that we’re seeing these orders, any sort of timeline or when you’re expecting these bids to come out.
Unidentified Speaker
So just on timeline, let me just give one is the south, sorry, the Jaljee one was announced now with an end date of 28th December.
Unidentified Participant
Right. So
Unidentified Speaker
If you take that we are looking at two and a half years, 30 months to finish the Jal Jeevan which is. I think the balance investment they are talking of is close to 5 lakh crores. Which was, you know, because 3.6 has been spent and 8.6 is the total outlet. So within the next 30 months will lead to huge amount of pump requirements.
Unidentified Participant
Correct. Okay. And so I just can term.
Unidentified Speaker
I see by the second half of this year a big requirement
Unidentified Participant
And just on a gross margins front. We’ve seen the gross margins declining from around 76% to 71% in Q4 on a consolidated basis. So what, what led to that?
Unidentified Speaker
Our margins are fluctuating because they are fluctuating between say products, projects and different countries. So overall as you can see at the end of the year we are working on between 15 to 20% and we were at 17% EBITDA. And last year we were at 16%. This year we had very strong EBITDA in the domestic operation but the revenue was lower. And internationally we had 13%. India, we had 21%. So you know, so I think best to look at us between 15 to 20.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. On EBITDA. Yeah. Yeah. Understood. Okay. That is it. Sir, from my side. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from Saket Kapoor with Kapoor company. Please go.
Saket Kapoor
Hello.
Unidentified Speaker
Hello.
Saket Kapoor
Sir, when we look at our South African piser. If you look at our subsidiary PCI contribution that is total to amounting to rupees 1800 crore. Out of the two projects that we have been sanctioned. So 1172 was the earlier one and 1172 the current one and 630. So 1800 crore worth of business will be rooted through the subsidiary PCI over a period of four. Four years.
Unidentified Speaker
Yeah.
Saket Kapoor
Okay. No, sorry.
Unidentified Speaker
There is. There is more. These are the two orders. They have a balance orders also.
Saket Kapoor
Balance orders are in pipeline. I’m talking. Please explain. Sir.
Unidentified Speaker
The total order book in PCI is roughly 30003100 crores. Sorry. In South Africa. Sorry, South Africa, you’re right. PCI would be approximately that much
Saket Kapoor
1800 crores. So in our revenue profile this 1800 will flow through post the execution.
Unidentified Speaker
Correct.
Saket Kapoor
Okay. Sir, when we look at our quarter four performance and just give me the time to explain. What I’m trying to express is that generally Q4 generally works as a very good quarter in terms of execution scale. But for I think so this quarter we have seen a dip in revenue, especially from the. From the project business. So how do we explain this lower revenue profile for us and going ahead for the next fiscal? How will the mix now be towards the product and the project business? Since the order booking and everything is now evenly skewed, how should this profile look forward?
Unidentified Speaker
I think first is that we should be looking at this year’s performance and seeing the growth. We see good growth going forward. But the mix and the profile would be very similar. So As I said, one is that I think 60 to 65% international would be there. That is one key. The second key is I think this fourth quarter is more applicable for India. And Indian revenues were lower in project in South Africa. The third quarter is better because their financial years are different.
Saket Kapoor
Sir, only what I am trying to make sense is that when we look at our P and L for the consolidated part, we find the employee cost at 78 crore which is not in line with the revenue. Last year with revenue mix of 572 crore, the employee cost was 60 crore. Now with a revenue profile of 511 crore, the employee cost is 79 crore. 78 crore. So here comes the first aspect that has lowered our EBITDA margin which all participants have been questioning about that on a Q on Q basis also on a year on year basis also the quarter four is not appearing to be the normal business quarter for us.
So we are trying to make sense or understand what are the factors on the execution in the Indian operations have led to this decline in the margins and this will get even outgoing. What should we conclude?
Unidentified Speaker
You should conclude, as I said that you cannot take one quarter and one area because as a benchmark and extrapolate because it’s quite fluctuating depending on revenues. So for example, in projects work you can have higher cost because sites have to be manned and managed whereas revenue recognition may not happen. So I do not think we are a business which you can take on a straight line multiplication basis. Basically you have to look at the overall profile and the overall EBITDA margins. You will have great quarters.
Suppose you have a great aftermarket execution or some good contracts are executed. But it’s the balance and the mix which will happen. So it should not be. You will have certain and it’s not predictable also to understand that.
Saket Kapoor
Yes sir. Only to conclude and join the queue. Sir, you. You are using the adjective good growth. So in. In. In that objective, what should good amplify in financial terms? 1806. So agarap order booking or current setup co.
Unidentified Speaker
Different moving parts project Business India may down Chalagaya. If you had added, if that had not stayed normal which and it was a circumstance which was beyond our control. So if that went down, if that had been normalized you would have seen the growth. It’s a lot of moving parts. But however we enter FY27 with a, you know, positive on all fronts. That’s what we want to highlight and that’s why we are confident of growth.
Saket Kapoor
I got your point sir, but give us some color sir. What should good indicate? Dust percent 5% what is good according to the roadmap for us?
Unidentified Speaker
As I said, I think we should be looking at a longer term picture. I think the best point here which we would like to highlight is to see how sustainable and the businesses are. If you can see if the weakest part of this business over the last year was the Indian project business dependent on Jaljeevan 2. Sorry Jaljee 1 and whereas Jaljeevan 2 with an enhanced outlay has been announced then it shows the strength of the business going forward. I think that is a key area and you know we will keep you updated as things happen.
Saket Kapoor
I’ll join the queue for other participants also. Availability. All the best sir. Hope to get an opportunity again.
Operator
Thank you. Your next question comes from Jainam Doshi with Chris pms. Please go ahead.
Jainam Doshi
Good evening sir. So like can you please guide us with respect to the contractual terms pertaining to the orders received by PCI Africa? Like how is the general advances, the milestone payments and the retention money and how does it pan out like this?
Unidentified Speaker
So I think the commercial terms in South Africa are excellent, margins are excellent and contractual periods are very good. Four years, three years they get. So I think you know it’s completely, it’s a very big positive and learning for us and we are very excited about how it will play out. But it’s much, I mean there are, you know, they get advanced and the payments are within seven days time and very good terms.
Jainam Doshi
Understood, understood. And as you mentioned
Unidentified Speaker
Most of these business, sorry these businesses they are mostly running cash positive.
Jainam Doshi
That’s great to know. Like
Unidentified Participant
And
Jainam Doshi
So one more thing is once the order as you mentioned goes into the engineering stage
Unidentified Participant
Like how the execution of such orders pan out in terms of like 2, 3, 2, 3 years in terms of percentage, like
Jainam Doshi
If
Unidentified Participant
10, 20% in a year 1 or 50% the peak revenues will come in your 2 of the execution or how is it like
Unidentified Speaker
As a thumb rule the peak revenues will come in year two as you have correctly pointed out. But we have A mix of projects. So different ones are running different, you know, time schedules.
Jainam Doshi
Understood, understood. And with the amount of cash which we have. So like, are we evaluating the inorganic opportunities or where are we currently in terms of utilization or.
Unidentified Speaker
Yes, I think one of the key areas for us has been our focus on key acquisitions in the product space. Now we did some acquisitions in the project business which has played out very well. So these opportunities are being actively explored and we hope to have some results soon.
Jainam Doshi
Got it. Thank you. Thank you for the update. Thank you so much.
Unidentified Speaker
Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Balu from Parami Financial Services Private Limited. Please go ahead.
Ravi Naredi
Yeah, sorry
Operator
To interrupt. Balu sir, your audio is not coming through clearly.
Ravi Naredi
Is this
Operator
So your voice is still modulating.
Unidentified Participant
One second.
Operator
Yeah. Is it better now? This is much better.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah. What is the, you know, the last call you had said approximately 300 crores are outstanding on the judgment mission. So has any money received in last quarter and you know, one and a half months in this financial year?
Unidentified Speaker
No, I think we haven’t received money. And that is expected now. So we hope to receive it this quarter, start receiving it this quarter onwards.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. I have one question. You know, we sold this rutsy business, okay, a couple of years ago and we had received the proceeds, you know, from the sales. I remember you mentioning that there was some tax provisioning you people had made, you know, for the same as per the, you know, the orders from those tax authorities basically.
Ravi Naredi
And your,
Unidentified Participant
Your, you know, tax advisors has guided you for that, you know, you will get a refund from this, you know. And you had made those provisions, basically. Made those, yes. So what is the status on that now?
Unidentified Speaker
So we have filed the appeals necessary and we are pursuing the process. It will take some time. But you know, it’s a litigation, it’s a long medium, you know, sorry, medium style litigation there. It will be appealed at various forums, but advisors are very confident of getting a positive result.
Unidentified Participant
And when can we expect that money to flow in?
Unidentified Speaker
I think we will update you, but maybe in 18 months if the result is possible. We will have a result in 18 months. I cannot assure the money will flow.
Unidentified Participant
Sure. And my last question on the orders, you know, which we have won on the South Africa region, you know, through your subsidiary. So the EBITDA margins are similar to what you always guide for or they are low margin orders?
Unidentified Speaker
No, no, we are much higher margin. Much better margin we have got there. So we are very, very excited about how it will play out.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, thank
Ravi Naredi
You, Mr. Rawal and best wishes.
Unidentified Speaker
Thank you. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Tanya Kothari with own capital market. Please go ahead.
Prakash Agarwal
Yes sir. Good afternoon and congratulations on delivering another strong year group. I just have couple of questions. Just now we mentioned the project order is 5000 crores and of which is 3000 crores are from South Africa. So can you give me a breakup of order book outstanding for Australia, India and other international market product and project wise?
Unidentified Speaker
Yeah, I can. In Italy we have approximately total order book of about 330 crores and in Australia approximately 80 crores. In India we have about 2000 crore of project order with about 500 crore of O&M. So 140050 crores of EPC. These are all of 31st March.
Prakash Agarwal
Okay, sir. And the board has increased the authorized capital. Does this signal a forthcoming major fundraising or a kind of potential acquisition?
Unidentified Speaker
Yes, that is something we are pursuing. You know, we are pursuing for some time and I think the environment is now very positive because we are not wanting to pay expensive valuations. So we think we can get good strategic assets at a reasonable valuation now. So that’s why we have taken this enabling resolution.
Prakash Agarwal
Okay, sir. And sir, are there any kind of gain and loss because we are dealing with so many international markets in Q4 as well as current financial year.
Unidentified Speaker
Forex gain
Prakash Agarwal
And losses. Forex gain and losses, sir, because we deal with so many international markets and we just saw rupee depreciating more than 11%. That’s
Unidentified Speaker
A big gain for us. Yes, it’s a big gain for us. I think one of the reasons we are liking this diversified, if we were very much India exposed, we could have had lot of tremendous margin pressures.
Prakash Agarwal
Yeah. Because considering
Unidentified Speaker
This is playing out very well for us this international which we have, you can see in our balance sheet also the consolidated results. You have got a 139 crore exchange difference.
Prakash Agarwal
Yes. And so given the strong international order pipeline, do we see foresee any execution bottlenecks in procurement or labor availability or logistics in next two to three years concerning this geopolitical scenario.
Unidentified Speaker
So I think one more point I’d like to highlight here that the international projects which we are doing are high end process related businesses. So they are not similar to the Indian environment. Most of these are very sophisticated plants and there is less pipeline or low end civil work. So this is very high end technology projects which they are doing. For example, they are doing water reuse projects and wastewater projects, very complex wastewater projects. That is the strength of Our South African businesses.
So we see good margin and they are very stable. There is no margin risk or pressures. And the time frame is internationally fortunately is given according to the requirements. So you know, three to four years is a significant time. And they are well planned out. Very much pleased. This is a 100-year-old company with very strong systems. So we are very, very confident of the performance going forward.
Prakash Agarwal
Okay, sir. Thank you sir. That was very helpful. Wishing the team all the best for the upcoming results. Thank you.
Unidentified Speaker
Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next follow up question comes from the line of Ravi Naridi with Naridi Investment. Please go ahead.
Ravi Naredi
Yes, I would like to ask a small question. What margin we expect for in financial year 27?
Unidentified Speaker
Definitely
Ravi Naredi
Due to high order. Due to high order, definitely margin will expand. Sir, can you quantify in terms of percentage?
Unidentified Speaker
I think we will see on the higher side, as we have said the bandwidth we look at is 15 to 20%. But on as you can see this year in domestic operations we have got 21% EBITDA. So I think as you are correctly pointing out going forward this should lead to margin enhancement also. Surely.
Ravi Naredi
Okay. And congratulations again for a good order from South Africa and all the best. Thank
Unidentified Speaker
You. Thank you. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Vinay Nathkarni with Hathaway Investments Private Limited. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah, thanks for the opportunity and congratulations for the international business expansion that you’ve always wanted. Just one thing which I wanted to check out with you is is it possible for you to share because since now internationally also you have diversified over such huge geographies whether it will be possible for you to share the revenue and EBITDA in these four geographies,
Unidentified Speaker
The international, as you said, on a yearly basis the revenues jumped up from 668 crores to 1133 crores. And the EBITDA went from. EBITDA went from 88 crores to 152 crores. So more or less doubled both or you know, let’s just less than double for both.
Unidentified Participant
Can we get a split or is it not possible between South Africa?
Unidentified Speaker
Yeah, I don’t have the exact split one on one but I would like to qualify this and say that PCI Africa we bought in the middle of last year itself, financial year. So we got only I think 9 or 10 months performance in PCI Africa. The order booking has been great. But the revenue, we did not get that much benefit of it last year because we just acquired it. So some of them are in the process like that and I think this year is the full year. We should see the revenue now.
Unidentified Participant
Will it be possible for you to respond if I send a mail request into this data?
Unidentified Speaker
I think we will come back. This is a good point you are making. Next quarter we will come back with year on year for the subsidies also.
Unidentified Participant
Thank you very
Deepak Parswani
Much.
Unidentified Speaker
Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from Deepak Paraswani with Swan Investments. Please go ahead.
Deepak Parswani
Yeah, thank you for the follow up opportunity, sir. Just wanted to check it out. If I were to look into your product business. I mean this year we have grown at 10%. Their Indian business is growing at a 15% and international business is growing at a 5%. If you can give just from next two to three year perspective how should be this product business evolving for us in both the region and also which are the key promising products and vertical where you see there would be significant scope for the growth.
And thirdly, in terms of the particular gaps which you have evaluated in your product portfolio and where you are looking out for the inorganic growth that would be. If you can share your perspective on this product portfolio as a whole, that would be really helpful.
Unidentified Speaker
I think a product portfolio this year as the domestic has improved and the backlog has improved. I think what we are doing is positioning ourselves well and all our markets, be it Europe I think we are very well positioned now to see this growth. As we have just mentioned a few lines. Lot of things have been postponed because you see from the time of there are a lot of geopolitical issues today. Let us face one thing. We are in one of the worst climates right now. For example, India has fiscal challenges.
Europe has been struggling with these gas pressures. The entire Middle East Mena region, it’s inaccessible right now. So these are geopolitical issues playing out which lead to postponement of some of the demand. So Europe in a European operation, lot of demands have been postponed and not concretized which we expect now. So I think time frames is the only challenge. But as far as businesses are concerned, we see all our product businesses growing be it in like Thailand we mentioned this is a joint venture.
But the business has in last become three to five times. I think we were at 50 crores during COVID and it’s grown to 300 crores. So we had a big jump in Thailand. Similarly Australia, we are one of the strongest or the strongest player in Australia now. And the mining sector and the LNG because LNG has become in big demand, huge investments are planned there. So all our product Businesses we see good growth and I don’t see niche. We are looking for geographical reach. As you can see we are concentrated in Africa, Europe and Australia.
We want to go to the US is one clearly and other areas in say for example Saudi Arabia. Market reach is something we are looking for but only market reach. No products are. We have a very strong product profile.
Deepak Parswani
Okay, so just continuing on that part. Let’s say we are looking to enter into the US market. So inorganic strategy would be aligned towards getting the front end in the US market and supplying the product from other subsidiaries. Or how should we perceive that inorganic route?
Unidentified Speaker
I think that’s what it’s a mix. I mean first is that getting presence there is critical, the front end there and you know what we can do, how we can support the businesses, surely you know all the businesses. We find that our core strength lies in supporting them with our engineering and manufacturing resources. So it will surely be a lot of support from all our other subsidies.
Deepak Parswani
Okay, so finally on the project business trends, if I were to look from the South African market, if you can give some sense in terms of the things, this is relatively a new market for us. How should we see from the supply chain management point of view and labor issue and not exactly the labor issue but ramping up of the labor and everything we are for executing a project. And then what is the kind of the margin profile is there for the South African business versus the Indian project
Unidentified Speaker
Business? As I mentioned, South Africa is a process and you know, electromechanical more than civil. So there is small amount of civil, less amount of, you know, very less compared to India and no pipeline at all. So it’s very high end projects and therefore labor involvement is not very high. It’s more engineering, more supply, more process, etc. So you can imagine that, you can imagine how valuable that is relative to a project in India. So if you take the project order book of 3000 crore, sorry the total order book of 3000 crore in South Africa it translates into a much higher order book in India.
Because in India you would have a lot of pipeline and civil works. Okay,
Deepak Parswani
And then sir, would it be fair to say South African business margin profile would be aligned with the Indian project business?
Unidentified Speaker
It will be better.
Deepak Parswani
So finally on the Capex trend, how should we see capex as a whole in both domestic and international project? We
Unidentified Speaker
Don’t see much career perspective, we don’t see much capex demand, you know, requirements but we do see some small brownfield addition needed to take care of the excess. You know, the capacity required for Indian growth. Product growth. Thank you and wish you all the best. Thank you. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next follow up question comes from the line of Saket Kapoor from Kapoor company. Please go ahead.
Saket Kapoor
Yes sir. Just a bit of clarification only sir on the order book front as per presentation. Sir, our pending order book for, for the product division is closer to 984crore. And the the project one is at 3900crore. So.
Unidentified Speaker
Correct. And plus if you add what that other gentleman had asked that whether if you this is up to 31 March is added to this. Yeah.
Saket Kapoor
Okay. Sir. Pertaining to also sir, the NSC Listing Part RVs are listed under the permitted category or this is a permanent listing that we have gone through earlier. NSC would have done a permitted category for a ensuing period and then again the delisting happened. So can you confirm that this is. We have followed the procedure and this is a permanent listing on nsc. Now
Unidentified Speaker
We haven’t applied yet. There is some particular, you know, condition which we are unable to as far as capital is concerned which we are unable to comply until we raise funds. So you know it’s a. We have taken the resolution. We hope to apply soon.
Saket Kapoor
Okay. So this NSC is under permitted category and they, they may again revise it. So this is not a final listing for us. As of now we have not applied for it.
Deepak Parswani
We are yet to be listed there.
Saket Kapoor
Right sir. And two, two small points that you mentioned about some allocation of fund under the JGM especially for Uttar and Bengal. So can you quantify what what is as per your understanding? And then sir, how are the RM prices going to impact our, our product and the project businesses? Raw material prices, whether steel, I think of steel or specialized steel which may be a major component have also moved up significantly. So how are we going to deal with this RM part of the story?
Unidentified Speaker
Yeah, two things. So this money allocation we have seen in the press, so we read best. Bengal has been allocated 2700 crores and the state will also fund. So that is how we are aware of it from the press. And we are receiving positive feedback from the department also that something is coming. So that’s how we know. And regarding this raw material. Yes, it is a challenge but it’s volatile more than rising curve. And the volatility as we are aware is, you know like for example stainless steel has become expensive because most of the imports are from the Gulf.
So I think it’s volatile. It’s a wait and watch. We cannot yet jump to Any conclusion here
Saket Kapoor
And concluding sir, Oenm ka part kitna for this year and the current year ensuring year how much has been the O and M component to the revenues?
Unidentified Speaker
The O and M is I think all quite a few. Sorry. Quite a few projects have gone into O and M now and you know some are in defect liability O and M transition this 27 we will see first impact of reasonable amount of O and M. So we will be updating soon on this. We will make that a part in. We will make that a part in the presentation.
Saket Kapoor
But as of now Johamari order book closing component care you can Quantify that
Unidentified Speaker
So 550 crores or something.
Saket Kapoor
And lastly sir, on the Madhya Pradesh some some reversal we took about. I think so a year ago about some projects and there were some cost overrun or something litigation part whereas these are in on any update on the same.
Unidentified Speaker
We had a contract termination which is under litigation. So we have gone into arbitration for that.
Saket Kapoor
But the process is very
Unidentified Speaker
Slow. We are not you know going through the process right now.
Saket Kapoor
In conclusion, what, what, what we can summarize from today’s conversation which which had been very exhaustive taking into account the project, the order booking profile for both the project business as well as the product business and the type of margins, higher margins which we will be exhibiting from the South African operations. It seems that there is a good optimism of us gaining higher margin profile in the ensuing years. This understanding for the participant is correct for both the segments.
Unidentified Speaker
I think the points I would like to say is that you know we look at it as a zero sum game. So in the zero sum game the first is the Jaljeevan was a weakness for us which we see as a positive going forward. So immediately if you see if our funds are released our interest cost will come down. That you can see as a margin. Similarly South Africa is stabilizing the dependence on Indian project business. So now that the South African revenues will pick up as you can see a glimpse in the last year this will further improve our project business.
It will be a stable project business and margin profile will be stable and cash flows will be stable. So that’s how the project business goes and the product business has grown. And as you can see the product business when it grows the margin improves. So these are all positives going forward.
Saket Kapoor
Yes sir. Because product business to conclude has done 22% margin on a console basis. And now with the improvement that we expect this is going to be more margin accretive only. I think so on 2036. Yeah. Please.
Unidentified Speaker
Yeah. So yeah, it’s on a positive trend. You know the only thing is that you correctly mentioned just now on the raw material. Let’s hope that stabilizes. So you know, on a quarter to quarter basis there could be some challenges. But on a trajectory progress. Yes, very positive.
Saket Kapoor
Very positive on that front. Also that even on 22% your profile product may post we have a good chance of improving or definitely improving on the. On the same depending upon. Since we have a good strong closing order book position. That understanding is correct, Sir.
Unidentified Speaker
I think the outlook is good as all the. You know, I think the bigger weakness for us was the project area which we are happy with. And the product order book and the pipeline looks very strong.
Saket Kapoor
Yes sir. Thank you once again sir Agarwal Ji sahib for answering our questions and patiently listening to us. Thank you. And all the best to the team, sir. Hope things are much better. Yeah.
Operator
Thank you. As there are no further questions, I now hand the conference over to the management for closing comments.
Unidentified Speaker
So thank you all for participating in this earnings conference call. I hope you were able to answer your questions satisfactorily. At the same time offer insights into our business. If you have any further questions or would like to know more about the compute, please reach out to our Investor relations manager at DeLorean Advisors. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. On behalf of MK Global Financial Services Ltd. That concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us. You may now disconnect.