Vascon Engineers Limited (NSE: VASCONEQ) Q4 2025 Earnings Call dated May. 16, 2025
Corporate Participants:
Santosh Sundararajan — Whole Time Director & Group Chief Executive Officer
Somnath Biswas — Chief Financial Officer
Analysts:
Akilesh Gandhi — Analyst
Unidentified Participant
Himanshu Upadhyay — Analyst
Madhur Rathi — Analyst
Prateek Bhandari — Analyst
Tanish Shah — Analyst
Moksh Ranka — Analyst
Presentation:
Operator
Ladies and gentlemen, good morning, and welcome to the Vascon Engineers Limited Q4 FY ’25 Earnings Conference Call. As a reminder, all participant lines will remain in the listen-only mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal the operator by pressing star then zero on your touchstone telephone. Please note that this conference is being recorded.
I now hand the conference over to Mr Akilesh Gandhi from Stellar IR. Thank you, and over to you.
Akilesh Gandhi — Analyst
Thank you, Ryan. Good morning, everyone. Hi, Akhilesh Gandhi on behalf of Tela Investor Relations. We welcome you all to Engineers Limited Quarter Four and FY ’25 Earnings conference Call. We shall be sharing the key operating and financial highlights for the 4th-quarter and the full-year ended, 31, 2025. We have with us today the senior management team of Engineers Limited; Dr Sundarajan, he is a Group CEO. And with him we have Mr Biswas. He is a Chief Financial Officer.
Before we begin, I would like to state that this call may contain some of the forward-looking statements which are completely based upon the company’s beliefs, opinion and expectation as of today. The statements made in today’s call are not a guarantee of future performance and also involve unforeseen risks and uncertainties. The company also undertakes no obligation to update any forward-looking statement to reflect development that occur after the statement is made. Documents relating to the company’s financial performance, including the investor presentation, have already been uploaded on the stock exchange and the company’s website.
I now invite Mr Dr Santosh Sundarajan to state his opening remarks on the company’s performance for the 4th-quarter and the full-year ended on March 31. Then we will open the floor for Q&A session. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Santosh Sundararajan — Whole Time Director & Group Chief Executive Officer
Thank you. You. Good morning, everyone. I warmly welcome you all to the earnings conference call of Valcon Engineers for the 4th-quarter and full-year ended, 31, 2025. Thank you for taking time to join us today. I hope you’ve had a chance to go through our Q4 and FY ’25 results as well as the investor presentation available on the stock exchanges and the company’s website. It gives me great pride to say that FY ’25 has been a landmark year for Vascon. We have delivered the highest-ever revenue in both the 4th-quarter and in the full financial year, which reflects the strength of our business and the strong momentum in our APC segment. The performance is the result of our focused efforts on project execution, cost-control and business expansion. The record-breaking Q4 stands as a major milestone in our journey and highlights the dedication of our team and the trust of our clients and partners. FY ’25 has not just been a year of growth, it has been a year of setting new benchmarks and laying a strong foundation for the future.
Coming to our segmental performance, we reported strong revenue growth of 64% year-on-year in Q4 and 41% for the full-year FY ’25. This growth was mainly driven by excellent execution in our EPC segment. In Q4 FY ’25, EPC revenue stood at INR344 crores, showing a 49% increase over last year and a 24% increase over the previous quarter. For the full-year, EPC revenue grew by 41% year-on-year to INR1013 crores.
Looking ahead, we remain confident about the future of our EPC business. Our order book stands at INR2825 crores, which is about 2.8 times our FY ’25 EPC revenue. Out of this, INR2371 crores are from external EPC projects and INR448 crores are from our internal projects. About 78% of the total work order from external projects is from government projects, which helps us maintain a stable cash-flow and sticks to project timelines. With the strong pipeline and continued focus on efficiency, we expect execution to improve even further in the coming quarters.
In addition, we’ve received two new EPC orders in April 2025, one from Royal Rights Private Limited and one from UCA Promoters totaling to about INR311 crores. These projects will be executed over the next three years and further add strength to our order book.
Let me give you an update on the real-estate segment. As you may know, due to accounting rules, revenue and expenses in real-estate are recognized at different times. Because of this, profit in FY ’25 appears lower even though the work continues as planned. In FY ’25, we achieved new sales booking totaling to about 35,000 square feet, generating a sales value of INR23 crores and total collection of INR58 crores. We remain optimistic about the trajectory of our real-estate segment, supported by a strong pipeline of upcoming projects. We are positive about the outlook of our real-estate business, backed by a strong pipeline from new projects that are getting lined-up. We believe performance will improve as these projects progress.
Coming to the financial performance of the company in Q4 and FY ’25. Let me begin with the consolidated Q4 FY ’25 numbers. The company reported a total income of INR392 crores as against INR239 crores in Q4 FY ’24, registering a 64% growth year-on-year. EBITDA for the quarter stood at INR42 crores compared to INR26 crores in the same-period last year. The EBITDA margin for the quarter was 11%. Profit before exceptional items and tax came in at INR36 crores compared to INR21 crores in Q4 FY ’24, showing a 70% year-on-year increase.
Coming to the full-year FY ’25 performance, the company reported a total income of INR1,090 crores as compared to INR775 crores in FY ’24, reflecting a growth of 41% year-on-year. EBITDA for the year stood at INR100 crores as against INR87 crore in FY ’24, marking a growth of 14% year-on-year and the EBITDA margin for the year stood at 9%. The slight margin correction was due to lower contribution from real-estate businesses, while EPC margins have remained stable at 10% to 11%. Profit before exceptional items and tax for FY ’25 was INR75 crores compared to INR68 crore in FY ’24, showing a growth of 11% year-on-year. Net profit stood at INR126 crores in FY ’25, including income from sale of GMP, which was INR6 as against INR61 crores in FY ’24.
On the balance sheet front, we made significant progress in reducing net-debt. Net-debt reduced from INR124 crore in June 2024 to INR110 crores in September 2024 and further to just INR17 crores as of March 2025. This steady reduction reflects our focus on financial discipline and improving liquidity. We have recently-completed the divestment of our entire stake in Ascent Hotels with the consideration expected to be with us by end of Q1 FY ’26. With this, we have exited all non-core assets and are now fully focused on core operations. This strategic shift allows us to allocate resources more effectively, supporting sustainable growth and long-term value-creation.
To conclude, our strong financial performance, robust order book in EPC segment and a healthier balance sheet give us confidence for the future. We remain committed to delivering value through disciplined execution, innovation and a dedicated team.
So with that, we now come to the question-and-answer session. Thank you.
Questions and Answers:
Operator
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, we will now begin the question-and-answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touchstone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and 2. Participants are requested to use their handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question comes from the line of Deeps from Mass Capital. Please go-ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah. Thank you for the opportunity. Great set of numbers, Dr. While I’d like to congratulate you on the great performance on the EPC front. A little concerned with the real-estate division. I understand about the revenue recognition part. But somehow, have you lost some momentum when it comes to real-estate? And the second part of this question is, are we looking at a new market, especially markets like Hyderabad? If you let’s study recently, Godrej entered this market, just one project, right, 300 flats sold straight in two months, INR1,000 crores net. So if you can just look into that latter. Thank you.
Santosh Sundararajan
Sure, no, for your point — first point on the real-estate looking sluggish even now and we’re missing out on momentum. There is no doubt that our trajectory to push real-estate upwards has started a bit late maybe. There is no point looking into the past. But going-forward, we first concentrated in the last four, five years, we concentrated around pushing the EPC segment into full throttle. We’ve achieved that and it is showing results over the last two, three years. We have steady growth and in both top-lines and bottom-line. Now we have a dedicated team doing exactly the same on the real-estate front.
We started all these efforts in the last couple of years. We’ve lined-up a few real-estate projects in Mumbai as well as in Pune and Coimbatur. These are all getting launched, sales are happening. The revenue from all of these would be seen in our books over this year and next year and the year-after that. In the last couple of years, I agree with you, it was only a few of the old projects in-hand, which were sluggish and slow to bring in revenue into our books. But going ahead, our order book or our pipeline is much, much healthier than it was a couple of years ago.
So we are expecting significant growth in real-estate revenues over the next three, four years coming — we have a very-high target for ourselves and we want real-estate to come to at least 60%, 70% of EPC. And so we are working steadily on that.
As regards Hyderabad, yes, Hyderabad is having an excellent market, high-end housing, a lot of sales happening. We are aware of the situation, but we would continue to focus only in the micro markets of Pune, Mumbai for small redevelopment and. This is where we are. At this point of time, we are focusing our energies in trying to stabilize and grow and get more projects in these regions. We will not, you know, go to other cities at this point of time.
Somnath Biswas
And just to add-on this particular aspect in terms of the real-estate number, if you look at that last year, we are not able to launch any new project due to some approval not only partnering to us, most of the developer facess this problem in view of the the EC bans and NGT’s issuers and all these things which recently got resolved.
So by — by end of March only, we are able to launch Central coach, we didn’t have any attraction during the financial year. So whatever the number you are seeing from the real-estate, it is the — it is the outcome of the unsold inventory of the past launch project, which is a very meaningful numbers. Though the revenue is not recognized, revenue will be recognized after completion.
So that’s why that this financial year, we kept on saying this ’24 25 is not supposed to be a good number for yet. We kept on communicating all the times in every call and that is the reality. But way forward, definitely there is a good attraction is there and couple of launches are — we are at almost large job launches, launching couple of projects. So next year will be this will have a good attraction of the real-estate numbers.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah, sure. I appreciate that. My next question was, I was looking at the kind of orders that we recently — I mean, which is part of our order book, like majorly across four or five verticals like namely medical colleges, IT parks, police starting quarters, metro and airport, right? Are we — are we not focusing on the data center construction because that’s a huge runway that we see that’s coming into India. Are we not focusing on data center is?
Santosh Sundararajan
Yes, very valid point. We are focusing. We have a team trying to make an entry into the data center space. The thing with data center contract is that for the first time in-building industry, the data center contracts have about 60% 70% of their value coming in from the mechanical and electrical part and only about 25% 30% coming in from the civil part.
Now is primarily a civil contractor. In all other projects like our hospitals and IT parts that we take, about 70% — 75% is civil and finishing and only 20% 25% comes from MVP. So therefore, they prefer to choose a civil contractor as the main contractor and pass the MEP under us, whereas the situation is reversed in data centers.
So they try to look for a big MEP player to take-up the full contract and they would expect him to subcontract the civil part to people like us. So our scope would therefore be much lesser. No data center cost more than INR10 crore INR150 crore of civil, whereas the total project cost could easily be INR500 crore INR600 crores.
Having said that, INR100 crore INR150 cro is also a good number for us from a civil standpoint and we are trying to align with people like BlueStars and couple of other MEP players so that we bid for data centers together. Hopefully, we will bag something on this front as well.
Unidentified Participant
Sure. And if I can squeeze in one last question. We had kind of touched upon this part, which is the Thane land and I think rightly this is like the gold mine that we have. Any update on this in terms of how are we planning to monetize this.
Santosh Sundararajan
So monetization of Thane land is still a medium-term story. There are two immediate things that will happen. One, there is a government corridor that has been announced in the DP, which is going through about 40 acres out-of-the 150 acres that we hold over there. So of course, again, half of it, less than half of it is Vacon’s share.
So — and when that takeover happens, then we would be compensated for at decent prices by the government. So that is one monetization, which we — it is unavorable, but it is good. They do give us good rate, good multiples from the rates. So that is one thing that will happen. Not sure when exactly because it has been on the radar for a while, but the government will sooner or later take it up.
The second thing we are also doing is they’re trying to accumulate about 20 acres touching the road and get an access from the road — from the main road by making a culvert and a bridge. And then once we are in a position to accumulate 20 and compound it, then we will look — I mean, out of 20, almost 16 17 already belongs to us, it’s a few parcels in-between that we are trying to accumulate and get continuity. And then this 20 also once it’s available and you know encumber through a fence, then we will decide whether we want to develop or sell or part sell, part develop. So that is another monetization strategy.
As regards to the rest of the land, it’s a longer-term thing. So these are the two immediate things which we hope in the next couple of years will buy some fruit.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah, sure. I appreciate that and wishing you all the best for FY ’23. Thank you.
Santosh Sundararajan
Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Himanshu from Bugal Rock PMS. Please go-ahead.
Himanshu Upadhyay
Hi, good morning. I had two questions, okay. One was to Mr Santosh and the other was to the JFO. So the first question was, in last year, one place where we have lagged is was on order book, okay. It has fallen by 15% in FY ’25. So what are the reasons for it? Because we were optimistic till last quarter. Is it comp — is it competition has increased or new tenders got close towards less and hence the order book fell.
Secondly, how does it impact our FY ’26, ’27 trajectory growth trajectory and our thoughts on the business in the near-term or for next two years? And third, can you give an idea of what is the outlook for FY ’26 on new order things and do we expect that we will be able to grow the order book and replace the what we’ll be doing in FY ’24. So that was the first question.
Santosh Sundararajan
So I’ll take that and then you can then pose your question to Sumna. Yes, we did not achieve our order booking target that we had spoken about last year. We are well aware of that. The reasons are also that a couple of orders that we are in-line or negotiating to close have not happened in the last year. We are hoping that will happen by July or so.
Point number two, yes, if this year also, we do not bag about INR50 — we bagged about INR350 already. We do not bag another INR1,200 crore INR1,300 crores of order book in this financial year, then our trajectory for ’26, ’27 will take a hit. ’25-26 is not a problem. We have enough work-in hand to achieve at least 20% growth from what we have done this year that looks very plausible and we are working on it.
But for the next year, if we do not have at least INR1,000 crores to INR1,300 crore minimum order intake this year, then a further 20% growth would not be possible. So we are very well aware of that. We have a BG limits in-place for this order intake. We have created the collateral and got the banking facilities in-place. We are in talks with a couple of agencies, couple of projects we are targeting. But we have to win this — over the next 10, 12 months, we have to win at least crores to keep our promises or our growth story alive and we are well aware and we will do it.
I mean, the reason it didn’t happen in the past is because some of those projects which we are talking for have got postponed, those will come. And we are also trying for a lot more projects. So yes, that’s the prime target for the year to back these orders.
Himanshu Upadhyay
Yeah, slightly more. Is it predominantly government where the orders have got delayed or is it private also where the closure is taking more time and hence the order inflow was less in FY ’25.
Santosh Sundararajan
Both actually.
Himanshu Upadhyay
Okay. Both. Okay.
Santosh Sundararajan
Yeah.
Himanshu Upadhyay
Okay. And this question is to. See, I am looking at Page 16 and this is what was given on the BSE website. So it is operating cash-flow or consolidated statement of cash-flow so there is a significant increase in amount due from customers or due from a customers by INR175 crore on consolidated basis, I think hence the cash-flow from operations has been only INR4.76 crores and which was negative last year, the operating cash-flow. This is Slide 16 array, 816 I am talking about the results. So can you tell what is it and why such a large increase amount due from a customer?
And secondly, what are we doing to improve our operating cash flows because that one place you may keep on selling our assets, the operating cash-flow has to be very, very strong for a longer-term value-creation in the business as we keep on getting diluted, equity keeps on getting reached. So that was the reason.
Somnath Biswas
You see basically if you look at that number, last year, eventually there is a good amount of money has been invested in the real-estate in terms of the approval, permission and all these things. So that’s why since it is a part of the investment, that’s why you are not getting that kind of free-cash flow from the operation as because it is one thing, it is a blended one. If you look at EPC, it is having a good enough operating cash-flow is there.
But blended cash-flow is less in view of the significant investment in the real-estate what happened in the last year. So this Bombay project, this Santa Cruz, then II project and Powa, all this required a good amount of investment. So all the approval are in-place. We are just Santa Cruz, one project is already launched, another two is launching as because we are waiting for the TC to happen.
So whatever the money has to be invested, it is already investment or significant money, except some minor investment is there. So no significant investment is there. So due to this investment in real-estate, your apparent operating cash-flow looks lower as compared to the last year. But otherwise, we will have our — our financial position is very strong enough.
Himanshu Upadhyay
Can you give an idea of what has been the cash-flow from EPC business if we remove the real-estate business, how much is it in FY ’25?
Somnath Biswas
Approximately INR40 crore kind of INR35 crores to INR40 crore operating cash-flow from the IPC beginning.
Himanshu Upadhyay
And what would it have been for FY ’24? Because there also when we see the blended, it was minus INR22 crores for FY ’24. Figure for FY ’24 EPC, how much cash-flow was generated in.
Somnath Biswas
I’ll come back on this issue during the call only disclose about that number, I’ll come back to you about 30%. I’ll come back on the number last year okay.
Himanshu Upadhyay
And a third, lastly, the Santa Cruz project what we have launched, how has been the response to it? And should we expect the remaining three projects to be launched in FY ’26, sir, residential three projects which are there in the presentation on Slide 20 that.
Somnath Biswas
This Sandra we are getting a significant response and we are hoping to continue this thing as because Ganadu is being assigned as a wholesale agency for this project and is specialist on dealing with all high-end projects. So we are expecting a good attraction already there is attraction is there, but the conversion is happening gradually because last one month also, 15 ’20, the market also little bit sluggish in terms of the couple of global issues and geopolitical issues are there. So people are little bit. So we are hoping to catch-up very soon.
And for the launch of the remaining project, yes, Prakash is almost another two, three months for the launching and the same was that why one is because as I told sometime back also for a long-time there is no EC approval is happening in view of the knownability of the EC bench due to the NGT issue with the governments and all this thing, which has recently been resolved and we are expected to be ECE bench set very soon.
So once EC is there, we got the AC power within a month or two, we’ll get the data approval and then go for launch. Rest all approval are in-place. So two projects is definitely — definitely another three to four months is definitely by October, definitely we are expecting the launch. Portion also once again, it is that entity issue once the EC is done, then by another six to nine months, it will take to consolidate everything and get for the launch. So we are quite hopeful that this financial year, all three is supposed to be launched, if not at least two, definitely, yes.
Himanshu Upadhyay
Okay. And the completions in this year will be in.
Somnath Biswas
Completion this year, we are expecting that is getting completed this year and that commercial we are doing at Karadi that order is getting completed this year. So this year, we are expecting almost close to INR175 crore to INR200 crore kind of top-line from deal estate.
Himanshu Upadhyay
Okay. Thank you from my side.
Somnath Biswas
And last year our EPC operating cash-flow was INR25 crores. The INR25 has increased to INR40 crore in FY ’25. Correct. Correct.
Himanshu Upadhyay
Okay. Thank you. Thank you for the clarification.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Madhur Rathi from Countercyclical Investments. Please go-ahead.
Madhur Rathi
Sir, thank you for the opportunity. Sir, I want — sir, I want to understand regarding the project that we have launched. Sir, one of the question was, sir, earlier guidance was the gross value would be closer to INR270 crores, but it has been jumped up by to INR300 crores. So why that has the average been increased in that market or were we pricing ourselves lower earlier and so on the rates front?
And the second question would be, sir, how much has been the bookings till-date from this project because sir, I think in previously you mentioned that during launch, we usually 5% to 30% kind of order booking of our project. So if you could just throw some light on that.
Somnath Biswas
We are right initially our excel state, our internal assessment talks about the top-line is likely to be INR200 — sorry, INR270 crores. But while before the launch and all this thing, once we’ve tied-up with and all these things, so we have been quite bullish and keeping in view of the current rate happening on that area. So we are quite hopeful that it will touch the top-line of INR300 crore. So that is our estimation.
But one second that currently we were talking about that how much attrition all this thing. There is a good amount of movement is happening, but conversion is getting little bit slow in terms of the current geopolitical situation. Still people are holding for the investment. They are just voting and watch how this is shaping up. So now it is — things are getting stable. We are hopeful to get good conversion in what next one to two months. That’s because we haven’t gone for any megawatts kind of on that project. We kept on what is the?
Madhur Rathi
Okay. So sir, on the gross development value, sir, are we pricing our projects similar to other developers in that market or how is our pricing? And sir, second question would be, sir, the — I think another housing society project said it’s similar in Santa Cruz area, sir. So can we expect a further increase in sales value for that as well or this INR330 crore is a fair estimate that we can generate from that?
Somnath Biswas
I think we talked about INR300 crores for that — that, that home finance project that is the outcome has been given. So we are quite hopeful that INR300 crore will be maintained or not INR30 crores. We are expected that number to come and the improvement of the numbers after launch of has been depends upon the supply-and-demand supply gain.
We cannot comment on the same as of now because marketed slightly whatever — this is as if you’re talking about the pricing, it is as comparable to the other developer keeping the space and facility what we are giving. It is comparable with other players. So will be in the same kind of range. We are not expecting any upside or any significant growth on the top-line on this aspect. So it will be the status quo be maintained. We’re happy to maintain this kind of numbers, but let’s not be too much.
Madhur Rathi
Got it. Sir, my next question would be on our EPC time, sir, when you compare our EPC business with the likes of Aluy or PSP or even other smaller EPC players, sir, our asset turns and working capital are very-high compared to these guys. So even after considering the real-estate portion of our business, sir, it has been very on the lower side because our — it has been on the higher side, our asset turns — asset terms would be 0.6 0.7 times versus these would do around 1.2 times, 1.3 times. So I’m trying to understand us selling all our the low-hanging fruit of our business, sir, can we expect some improvement in our EPC working capital cycle as well as requirements going-forward?
Santosh Sundararajan
Yeah. So the EPC working capital cycle is in fact fantastic. We do not have any issue. I think there is always a confusion when we read our balance sheet because it’s a 40-year-old company and when you look at assets and there are a lot of other old real estate-based inventories and assets, which might be getting mixed up. Purely from an EPC standpoint, you know, we are very comparable to the likes of or any other competition in all ratios. And in fact, our working capital cycle, our debtor cycle, everything is now very much under control.
Somnath Biswas
So one, I do understand you are looking at number of real-estate, that’s why it is looking little bit higher. But if you are looking, if we are able to segregate that distance, our number is as comparable — pretty much comparable with, the same picture? I’m talking TPalia, Aluvalia, L&T, if we keep on competing with these things, so that is at with them only.
Madhur Rathi
Got it. Sir, my final question would be, sir, if I look at ’25 2000 FY ’26 on an overall basis, sir, what kind of revenue can we get from both our segments EPC as well as real-estate and what kind of margins can we expect from our business.
Somnath Biswas
So EPC, we have done INR1,000 crores as of March ’25. For March ’26, we have set a target of 20% growth. We are looking at achieving INR1,200 crores. Our PBT in EPC has crossed, it’s about 8.5 this year. We hope to push that towards 9%, a bit over 9 over the next year with scale happening.
As far as real-estate is concerned, I think Sona has already pointed out, we expect close to INR200 crore of or INR200 plus crores of revenue coming in this financial year, we have two projects reaching completion and real-estate gross profits are in almost double of EPC gross profits in general. So we do expect at least 12% 15% EBITDA coming from minimum 15% EBITDA coming from the real-estate top-line this year as well.
Madhur Rathi
Sir, I didn’t get the EBITDA number.
Santosh Sundararajan
So the EBITDA numbers on the EPC are in the range of about 11% 11.5%. In real-estate, these would go up to about 15% to 17% as we get the top-line in this year.
Madhur Rathi
But sir, we said that they are double of that. So it should be in 20% so they would.
Santosh Sundararajan
So the thing is, so the gross profits are double. The gross profits in real-estate are double of that in EPC. But moment we achieved scales in the range of INR400 crore INR500 crores, INR400 crore of revenue recognition, see, we were in the same cycle five years ago for EPC, we were doing INR300 crore INR350 crores. While gross profits were always there, the overheads you know, at INR30350 crores, it wasn’t sustainable and therefore, the EBITDA and the PBTs used to come down. The real-estate is in the same situation at this point of time. If we do INR200 crores, we will see about 15% EBITDA.
If we achieve INR300 crore INR400 crores of revenue in real-estate, which is our target for two, three years from now and going upwards, that is when the full potential of absorption of overhead costs and reflection on the balance sheet as far as PBTs are concerned will come. So gross profit level, our projects in real-estate even today have doubled the gross profit that EPC has.
Madhur Rathi
Got it. Sir, thank you so much and all the best.
Santosh Sundararajan
Yeah. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Bandari from Art Ventures. Please go-ahead.
Prateek Bhandari
Hi, sir. Thanks for the opportunity. You mentioned that we are anticipating an order inflow of roughly INR1,200 crores to INR1,300 crores in the next 12 to 13 months. Hello.
Santosh Sundararajan
Yeah, that’s right. Hear me?
Prateek Bhandari
Yeah. So I wanted to understand that during this year, we have seen an order orderance of around about, I guess INR225 crores, right, for FY ’25.
Santosh Sundararajan
Almost INR300 crores, INR225 plus INR70 crore or INR300 crores. Almost INR300 crores, INR300 crores.
Prateek Bhandari
And out of that, what would be the quantum that we got in-quarter four? Was there any order in-quarter four?
Somnath Biswas
No, all-in quarter one. Quarter one of this year, of this year.
Prateek Bhandari
So entire were from quarter one.
Santosh Sundararajan
Yeah.
Prateek Bhandari
And you mentioned about the guidance that you have given for the EPC. So this 11%, 10% to 11% margin that you are speaking about, it’s inclusive of other income or is it exclusive?
Santosh Sundararajan
No, excluding other income, we are looking at 10% to 11 EBITDA. If you see there is no significant other income, only some crab sale and some interest on the margin money that we have for our BG limits with the bank. Nothing other than that.
Prateek Bhandari
Okay. So the top-line growth stays at roughly 20% from 1,000 to 1,200 and margins would be 10% to 11%.
Santosh Sundararajan
Got it.
Prateek Bhandari
Yeah. Okay. Thanks a lot, sir.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Danish Shah from SRC Investment. Please go-ahead.
Tanish Shah
Yeah. I just wanted to know the current size and location of companies land parcels and how are they going to be utilized in coming years?
Somnath Biswas
See, except that we already talked about, we don’t hold any land parcel over there. So whatever we are doing, we are doing either joint-venture or joint development and we have one small land parcel close to INR500 cred that is in the partnership entity, which is in Ajant Enterprises in is in Karadi. Bearing that, we don’t hold any land.
Santosh Sundararajan
We have a land in, which is project, which we are developing anyway. So that’s why said, I mean, these are the only three land parcel. In is under development, about five acres in Karadi Pune will go for development in the next year or so. And other than that, it’s mainly the Thane parcel.
Tanish Shah
Okay. And what kind of development is coming up in the location that you just mentioned?
Somnath Biswas
Already you were developing that affordable housing. It is almost fag end of this project.
Tanish Shah
Okay. And one another question is that what are the non-core assets that the company has sold or divested since COVID in the past four or five years?
Somnath Biswas
See, last couple of years already we kept on targeting to of the all non-core assets. We kept on saying all-in all our presentation, all our — it is a company target. So last three, four years, what is sold that we our subsidiary GMP that is that is done in the Q3 of the last year. Then we sold that — we hyped up our land, which was part of — which is a part of with HBI, we are replacing that.
So that has been sold up. Now the last one was there that our stake in Athen Total that also that we enter into share purchase exhibit, we are expecting the fund to hit our dragon within a day or two. So apart from that, as of now, we don’t have any non-core asset to look at, so we want to focus back on our core operation. Nothing is there.
Tanish Shah
Okay. Do you have an approximate figure on how much capital has been raised through these divestments?
Somnath Biswas
See for GNP, we raised almost INR157 crore gross that tell their land almost close to INR32 crore that is one second gross and this asset total also gross is around INR45 crores.
Tanish Shah
That’s all. Thank you so much.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Moksh Ranka from Aurum Capital. Please go-ahead.
Moksh Ranka
I wanted to understand our business is directionally moving. Are we going to be more of a after you there…
Operator
But your audio is not clear.
Moksh Ranka
Okay. Is it clear now?
Operator
Bigger.
Moksh Ranka
Yeah yeah. So I wanted to understand directionally where our business is moving over the next three, four years. Are we going to be more of a real-estate player and our EPC division will be lesser than a real-estate division. Could you give some color on that?
Santosh Sundararajan
No, we will not be primarily real-estate or primarily EPC. We look at both engines as a significant engine that we have capacity in, we have a brand in. So both will be parallelly growing, not at the expense of each other. Having said that, at this point of time, the EPC top-lines and the EPC division in terms of volume and size is well-ahead of the real-estate division. And so for the next three, four years, EPC has reached its sort of critical momentum.
It will continue to grow at 20% 25% year-on-year organic growth at every stage, we need to continue to accumulate collateral, augment our BG limit and then augment our team asset our staffing and grow sustainably, which we think is about, 20% 25 a year percent a year is very healthy growth. That’s a target we have set for ourselves. So we are at 1,000 in the next four years, maybe we can double that turnover to 2,000 that’s the target for us from the EPC division.
Real-estate, on the other hand is hardly giving numbers on the balance sheet at this point of time. As we said, we’ve lined-up quite a few projects. We have more than about INR1,500 crore of revenue to be recognized in our books from the project that we have already lined-up. And so even over a period of four to five years, this is easily INR30 crore INR400 crores per year.
But unfortunately, these revenues do not come in a linear fashion unlike EPC because of the AS7 standard of recognition. And so all-in all, what we would like to say is real-estate has a JA type growth looking — going ahead because the base point of comparison as we stand today is very low.
And so we want to reach INR500 crores INR600 crores INR700 crores of real-estate revenue happening year-on-year over the next three to four years. So that is the target. So the percentage growth in real-estate revenue will be much higher than EPC revenue over the next three, four years. But in terms of volume, I think for the next four years as well, EPC will be doing more than real-estate for sure.
Moksh Ranka
Okay. And in the past, we have diluted equity a lot and that was because our balance sheet was not very good because of our past struggles with EPC. Now currently, our business we have a significant order base and good amount of cash flows from non — by divesting a lot of our non-core assets. So do we feel we will have the need to raise more equity going-forward or our current cash flows are sufficient.
Santosh Sundararajan
See, that’s a very tough question to answer in the sense, we can grow without equity. We can grow, sometimes we feel we can probably grow if there are opportunities in the market, especially on the real-estate side, we can then probably grow a bit faster with equity. Having said that, when the price was around INR80, we did think of raising about INR100 crores through a QIP in the market.
Fortunately or unfortunately, the price dropped, the QIP hasn’t happened. So that dilution didn’t take place. If we feel at an appropriate time with a good market cap, if raising some equity is going to help us grow faster, we will consider it. No hard and fast rules on this, no. So I don’t want to answer as a yes or a no. In the immediate term, we just had our Board meeting. We have no discussion on trying to raise equity at this point of time for the immediate short-term.
Moksh Ranka
Okay, that was quite helpful. Thank you. That answers my question.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Harish Shiyat, an investor. Please go-ahead. Harish, if you can please unmute your line and ask your question.
Unidentified Participant
Hello. Hello. Am I audible?
Operator
Yes.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah. Good afternoon, sir. Thanks for the opportunity given. I just wanted to understand this inventory of INR591 crores that you marked ’25, what is the broad breakup between the EPC inventory and the real-estate inventory?
Santosh Sundararajan
The bulk of it would be real-estate, okay. Okay. Only about INR5 crores EPC inventory actually, nothing much.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, okay. Does it include any land parcel value also?
Santosh Sundararajan
Yeah, it does. Would come., we have a — I mean, the land is not in our name, but we have an agreement with a landowner to develop a five-acre parcel.
Unidentified Participant
But they are sitting in our balance sheet. That value is sitting in our balance sheet.
Santosh Sundararajan
About INR120 crores-odd is sitting in our balance sheet as inventory on that project. So it’s all real-estate inventory actually. It’s all waiting to be converted to — and the value actually is much higher. I mean, this is just land value. So we develop more product unit is the development right. Yeah, it’s a development right value over there or land value in. I mean the actual value of this inventory when converted to real-estate would be much higher.
Unidentified Participant
You said you can expect INR1,500 crores revenue from this inventor that’s what you said sometime back.
Santosh Sundararajan
No, so that is from also the joint-venture projects that we have, which have not even translated to inventory. Some of the joint-venture projects we’ve signed-up or redevelopment project, they do not reflect as inventory in our books at this point of time because we haven’t started expending on those projects. So those will also give us revenue.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. So — but what is the actual approximate value of the land parcel sitting into this INR591 crores?
Santosh Sundararajan
Land would not be more than — approximately it will be around INR200 crores INR250 crores kind of.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. Balance are all the project WLB.
Santosh Sundararajan
Yes, yes.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, okay. Thank you. Thank you very much. All the best.
Santosh Sundararajan
Thank you.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Shah, an investor. Please go-ahead Haneef, if you can please unmute your line and ask your question. Since there is no response, we move on to the next question from the line of Rajendra Kulkarni, an investor. Please go-ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Hello. Am I audible?
Santosh Sundararajan
Yes.
Unidentified Participant
I have three questions, sir. Congratulations on great set of numbers.
Santosh Sundararajan
Thank you.
Unidentified Participant
As you said, your bank guarantee has been augmented. So my question is, are you now consciously bidding on higher projects with project cost and better margins going-forward?
Santosh Sundararajan
See we’ve sort of figured that I mean the margin plus-minus at the end-of-the day, you know do not give you excellent spikes in the EPC side. On the one-hand, we have a order booking target. So there will be a project here and there, which gives you 18%, 20% gross profit, but most others would give you 13% 14% 15%. On an average, we stabilize at about 14% gross profit, 14% 15% gross profits. And so if we have a target to grow and a target to order book at least 12 crore 1,300 this year, we cannot be always too sticky on margin.
Having said that, one advantage for us is that the design-and-build contract, the mode of contracting that comes out, good chunk of it is in EPC mode or design-and-build mode. And in those projects, we always have the ability to be a bit optimal in our design and increase our margins by a basis-point or two. But the range of margin is not going to be drastically out of this envelope which is between, say, 14% to 18%.
Somnath Biswas
And your — another part is also absolutely correct. Yes, we are looking for the higher-value of the project as because now not only the BGBG is always there, but along with the PG or PQ also, the also grown substantially. So we always intend to beat the higher-value of the project where that competition with the competition revenue is the organized player. So that is a better way to deliver.
Unidentified Participant
Correct. So that’s why I’m asking the next question. So are you projecting your baseline revenue of INR2,000 crores going-forward? Baseline revenue.
Somnath Biswas
Yes, target is always there to reach that number, but timeline yet to be decided.
Santosh Sundararajan
Yes, well, I mean, again, sticking when as futuristic numbers, not a guarantee in any way, but our targets are INR200 crore, IN 1,450 crores 1,750 crore and then INR2,000 plus over the next four years.
Somnath Biswas
The target was to least INR1,000 crores standard number that is done. So the next milestone will be INR2,000 crores.
Santosh Sundararajan
And I’m talking EPC alone, I’m talking 1,200 EPC alone, 2,000 for a standalone revenue should happen in three years from now itself because real-estate is also scaling up. So 2,000 as a standalone revenue for the company from the 1,000 that we are in currently is not at all far away for sure because real-estate is also going to be giving good numbers over the next three years. So I think the three years from now, we will see 2,000.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah. And your financial position has been quite good now. That’s why.
Santosh Sundararajan
Absolutely. Yes.
Unidentified Participant
Sir, my one more question, sir. Government of Maharashtra or other governments are slightly filling the payment this thing, the delaying payments or is it true or are you — depending on these government projects, is it happening or it is just rumour because the payments are getting delayed of government projects.
Somnath Biswas
Hey, what you are talking that some people are facing this heat those typically what do in the infrastructure, they are facing some heat and there is a talk in the market that the project is getting delayed and all this in the payment. But unfortunately for our all cases, we haven’t experienced that kind of delay in the payment for government project as of now. So that’s why our EPC working capital cycle is quite healthy still.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, sir. Congratulations on good set of numbers and for future growth. Thank you very much.
Somnath Biswas
Thank you.
Santosh Sundararajan
Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Ranu Deep from Capital. Please go-ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah, thank you for the follow-up again. I wanted to check. We launched in 2018, Goodlight in 2018 and we are still in the market to sell them. So how are we kind of tackling these because I mean, these not only kind of draws us back, but it doesn’t let us focus on the future projects. So any thoughts around that?
Santosh Sundararajan
So is sold-out. I mean, see, there’ll be one or two apartments which we hold and want to command a particular price, so it will keep coming in our list of — but it’s more than 95%, 98% sold-out. So, the last two years, we didn’t have much inventory. Goodlife, we’ve launched it in two phases.
So the first phase is sold-out and we are now in the process of selling second phase. Having said that, yes, we do admit the velocity of sales in Telegon for the low-cost housing project that we launched was slower than we expected. So we didn’t find it as easy as we hoped. And so it’s taken longer, but we are now in second phase and we hope to finish that off in this year.
Somnath Biswas
And typically I just clarify one aspect. If you talk about the windowner, yes, it will took some time, but there is — internally we have segregated the inventory among ourselves as well as the landowner. So if you look at our share of inventory has been sold long back. So whatever the unsold inventory it belongs to the landowner who want to dictate a typical price. So obviously if you dictate a typical price to assets, it takes some time. So our cash-flow is not impacted or affected due to the deliver of the sales and all.
Unidentified Participant
Understand that. My next question is more from a long-term perspective. I mean, now fee is famously redefined as instead of price-to-earnings with perception to earnings, right? And I think you’re clearly mentioning that three years down the lane, we are looking at the revenue kind of touching INR2,000 crore in their PPC and real-estate. Now with such trajectory, it’s little surprising that we don’t see any mutual fund holding in our stock, right? So any efforts from the IR team for that?
Santosh Sundararajan
No, you’re right. See the — that’s why we were in fact strategically planning to do a QLP, two reasons for that QIP. One was of course, fundraising equity for our real-estate project. But the second was also the idea that we bring in some good QIBs or some mutual funds into the mix. Currently, I think most of them, they look at a market cap of sometimes, I mean, I think we do come down as a slightly smaller in terms of market cap for their visibility.
But we have been working we’ve met a whole lot of mutual funds and in this process of trying to do the QIB, we have presented ourselves to the entire market and now I think most mutual funds are aware of us. So when the uptake increases in small caps, I’m sure there’ll be more volume coming in from mutual funds.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Madhur Rathi from Countercyclical Investments. Please go-ahead.
Madhur Rathi
Sir, thank you for the opportunity. Sir, I wanted to understand we have spent INR175 crores on a three Bombay project two two Santa Cruz and one Powei project. So what? What sir, this amount would be how much of the total investment are going to be required from our side?
Santosh Sundararajan
Total investment of what?
Somnath Biswas
We envisage a INR175 crore investment for these three projects. That’s correct. And at that point in time, we are planning to raise INR100 crores to QIP and INR75 crore already invested by us during that time. But since the QIP hasn’t come with a success due to the market issues and all these things, so for a short-term measure, we went for some term-loan and all these things, the fund has been mitigated.
So typically 75 to 75 more than INR75 — almost INR100 crore-plus invested by us as because some part of the GMPL also moved into that thing. So from our side, we invested almost INR110 crores to INR20 crore kind of investment in this particular project and rest has been mitigated through short-term loans.
Madhur Rathi
No, sir, my question was out-of-the total investment that will be required in these three projects, we have spent INR175 crores on that. So what would be the remaining amount of money that will be required to spend on that.
Somnath Biswas
That will be — that will be mitigated to sales. That’s the amount what is recovered that is for the construction — construction. So that will be mitigated to sales only. So we don’t need to invest any further good amount except some amount is required by housing, which is still there.
Santosh Sundararajan
Maybe about INR30 crore INR40 crores more. Not more than that.
Madhur Rathi
Okay. Got it. And sir, just one clarification regarding balance sheet I required. Sir, if you could just like mention what would be the breakup of other financial asset of INR176 crores of non-current and other financial asset of INR520 crores current. Yeah, that should merger.
Santosh Sundararajan
So we’ll just share this breakup with the seller — Stellar. So you can be please touch base with the seller and they will get back to normal nature.
Madhur Rathi
Sure, sir, I with them. Thank you so much. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Anish Shah, an investor. Please go-ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah, this is here. Thank you for the opportunity. I just have couple of questions. One on the EPC side, how is the working capital day at the end-of-the year? And how has it been changed from last year? You mentioned about the cash-flow, but if you can just help us understand with what’s the working capital cycle typically and at the end-of-the year, how has been? And we see a further change as we as we grow like I’m saying from INR1,000 crore to maybe INR2,000 crore over next three years, how do you see the working capital cycle changing in that business? That is one part.
And second is on the real-estate side of the existing — I mean, you have given the list of the projects which are under-construction and the sales and collection detail. If you can also share the construction of our construction expenses, which is net to be spent on all these projects that will be helpful in understanding the both the businesses a little better. Thank you. Thanks.
Santosh Sundararajan
Yeah. So as regards to working capital cycle, we are at around 45 days and I do not see any problem with this as we grow. So-far, we’ve been quite disciplined in our collections and in our strategy of you know, we follow a strict strategy of having a separate bank account for each project. And if the collections are delayed, we sort of put a halt to the work. And so we’ve been very conscious and disciplined in ensuring that our working capital cycle and our debtor cycle both do not exceed certain limits. And I think so as we grow, we will be conscious of that.
As regards the expenditure on the real-estate projects, I think again we will share it for each project in detail the profitability, the costs and what has already been invested, what has been collected. I think the detailed statement is available with Stellar. We will update it with them. I think you can touch base with them to collect it from them.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. And maybe one more question, how is the capex going to look like in EPC business for next couple of years?
Santosh Sundararajan
Yes, we would need capex. We’ve always said in the past three, four years that till about INR1,000 crores of revenue, we had a lot of assets lying idle, which have now been put to use refurbished and are at site. At this point of time, our asset yard is pretty empty. And so going-forward to grow beyond INR1,000 crores, every time we wag new projects, we would need assets in terms of construction machinery as well as the shuttering assets.
So typically, these you could say it would be in the range of about 5% of our additional growth or rather 10% of our additional growth. So if you’re looking at INR200 crores of additional growth, we could say about INR20 crores of capex would be needed in the next year.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. Thank you, sir.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Harish, an investor. Please go-ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah, thanks. Thanks for the opportunity for the follow-up question. My question is on your internal order book. I understand this is the LED part what we are doing the business. Correct?
Santosh Sundararajan
Correct.
Unidentified Participant
Hello. Hello.
Santosh Sundararajan
Yeah, correct.
Unidentified Participant
Hello. Yeah. So my question is regarding this mainly INR300 crores order is for the redevelopment at the Santa II project. So just to understand how the revenue model comes, that means nearly INR300 crores you will have to spend for completing that project. And again that you will be getting the sales value of the additional property — the FSI what you develop and will be to third-parties. Is it correct? Thanks.
Santosh Sundararajan
Yeah. So again, see, it’s just a projection that this is the value of construction we have in-hand. From the balance sheet perspective, it gets eliminated because it is work being done internally for our own real-estate division and what will get recognized is the real-estate revenue and PPC revenue would then get eliminated in consolidation. So while we want to point out that we have INR100 crores INR400 crores of construction value to be executed by our EPC division internally. The sales value of this INR300 crore construction would be much higher.
Unidentified Participant
I understand that.
Santosh Sundararajan
INR500 crores.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah. So I can understand that this INR300 crores is yet to be spent on these two projects.
Santosh Sundararajan
Fair enough. Correct. You’re right.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. Okay. Okay. Thank you. Thank you very much and all the best.
Santosh Sundararajan
Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, with that, we conclude the question-and-answer session. I will now hand the conference over to Dr Santosh Sundarajan for his closing comments.
Santosh Sundararajan
Yeah, thanks everyone for participating and asking so many questions. It shows a lot of interest in the company. We are looking-forward excitedly for the next year because we are now in a stage of organic growth and it’s quite exciting to be targeting 20% 25% growth and higher-growth in real-estate. I will see you all again next quarter and thanks for being with us. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. On behalf of Ascon Engineers Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us and you may now disconnect your lines.