Speciality Restaurants Ltd (NSE: SPECIALITY) Q3 2025 Earnings Call dated Feb. 03, 2025
Corporate Participants:
Karan Bhuwania — Moderator
Unidentified Speaker
Anjan Chatterjee — Managing Director
Avik Chatterjee — Speciality Restaurants Ltd.
Rajesh Mohta — Executive Director – Finance
Analysts:
Unidentified Participant
Ankur Kumar — Analyst
Anupam Jain — Analyst
Tushar Raghatate — Analyst
Presentation:
Operator
Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the Q3 FY25 earnings conference call of Specialty Restaurants hosted by ICICI Securities Limited. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen only mode. And there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing Star then zero on your touchstone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded.
I now hand the conference over to Mr. Karan Bhuvanya from ICICI Securities. Thank you. And over to you, sir.
Karan Bhuwania — Moderator
Thank you. Good afternoon everyone. It’s A pleasure at ICHA securities to host Q3FY25 results conference call of Specialty Restaurants Ltd. From the management today we have Mr. Anjan Chatterjee, Chairman and Managing Director. Mr. Avit Chatterjee, full time Director. I’m Mr. Rajesh Kumar Mota, Executive Director, Finance and CFO.
I’ll now hand over the call to the management for their opening remarks post which we can open for Q and A. Thank you. Over to you, sir.
Operator
Ladies and gentlemen, the management line has been disconnected. I would request you all to stay online until I get them reconnected. Thank you. Yes, Mr. Rajya sir, please go ahead. Yeah.
Unidentified Speaker
Our CND, Mr. Anjan Chatterjee is to address the investors. Please. Thank you.
Anjan Chatterjee — Managing Director
Very good afternoon to everybody.
Operator
Ladies and gentlemen, the management is disconnected again. I would request you all to stay online while I get them connected. Thank. Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, the management is back. I would like to hand the call over to them. Thank you. And over to you, sir.
Anjan Chatterjee — Managing Director
Good afternoon. I don’t know how much was heard in the last preamble of mine. So while the results have been published and all of you must have got a copy and detailed it in your own way and have questions, the reason I am talking first is to give you an overall overview of the strategy that we have formed. In the last con call also we had discussed the same thing. The strategy of the company continues to be focusing on the oriental bit.
That’s Asian bit of the market which we have dominated over a period of time with mainland China as the anchor brand. Now Asia Kitchen is the new growth engine. Along with that there are one or two variants because as you know that people want innovation. There are new players coming in and without so much of a legacy, even they are doing good. Gong is an example which has been in Pune, one of the most profitable stores with the kind of square feet it has. Then we have gone into Asia kitchens all over India.
Wherever there is a mall or a balance of mall Primarily mall and standalones. And there is a new format because we need to reinvent ourselves to give the same offering vibe has become very important these days. Bendy Chennai has been a kind of a slightly formal kind of place. So we had to move out because of the ecosystem changing to the Asia Kitchen which Avik, my son, as he came into the business, started renovating and reinventing. Then the new format is Bizarre Asia. Bizarre Asia is a format which has not been necessarily seen in the oriental space.
It’s a 10,000 square feet space and it is a complete different kind of experience which we have given to the customers either made in China or in Asia Kitchen. The whole economy of this area where we are talking about food and beverage or any economy is based on experience economy. So we are trying to within the ambit of our own Melanchola being the anchorage or the fact that people know about our DNA, we are trying to give more innovative formats, be it the gong expansion or the bizarre Asia, which has been received very well.
Another point has been that existing restaurants of ours, which had been slightly fatigued over a period of 10, 12 years, which we were supposed to renovate before the pandemic, we could not do. So that’s been a plan which has been going on very well. And the interesting part is that whenever we are doing a reinventing of the brand or renovation, which is in terms of changing the.
Without changing the soul, the content and the form, making it more contemporary, we see a same store growth which is very, very good and very respectable. So these are very good indicators for us. I think I have broadly spoken about everything. Other brands will be dormant at this point of time, which we had already said. But the growth engines are going to be oriental. And the wetland, which I missed out earlier, is in the form of episode one has happened second has happened.
Third is happening in Bandra and we are going slow and steady. Last thing. Profitable growth is something we have come back to. We have, you know, not believed in expanding mindless expansion, which we had done earlier on, and consolidating on profitability while the revenues keep on growing slow and steady. Thank you very much. Thank you.
Questions and Answers:
Operator
Thank you. We will now begin with the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press Star and one on their touchstone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and 2.
Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Karisha from Venture Growth Partner llp. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Hi, good morning. Good evening sir. My first question is what is the long term vision we are seeing for this brand and how do we plan on tripling the revenue in six years?
Anjan Chatterjee
Avik, would you take this long term plan which I had already given an outline of and give a long term understanding. That’s my son Avik Chatterjee. He’s going to be talking on this.
Avik Chatterjee
So if I’m correct, the brand that you’re talking about is Bizarre Asia?
Unidentified Participant
I mean Bizarre Asia Episode one which we are planning on. So how are we trying to triple the revenue in next six years?
Avik Chatterjee
Right. So the first thing is that wherever we have done our renovations that has added to 20 to 30% of revenue jump in our current stores. So that means that is going to be one of the wings helping us to reach that number. Apart from that we are going to be increasing our footprints into modern Asian restaurants for a different TG like Asia Kitchen would be coming into malls. And as you know India is now scheduled to do more than 300 new malls. And we are in talks with all these partner malls to have a space there and also a non compete with most of the Asian spaces that we sign up with the mall. So that is going to be our growth engine number one.
Apart from that we are going to be doing growth engine number two with the brand called Bizarre Asia. Because that’s the company’s only all you can eat buffet restaurants where you restaurant in the Asian space where you can pay one price and you get an entire Asian experience, so on and so forth. Apart from that we have in our wet LED space episode one which is going to be our high revenue cash cow which is going to be coming into all the youth oriented spaces.
Like we’re doing another one soon in Bandra Mumbai which would be up and running by the next quarter or maybe the quarter after that. And we also are going to be expanding our brand gong which is a modern Asian restaurant that’s going to be coming into high football, high spending powered locations. And this would be the entire mix of our brands that would help us cage to that number in the next three years.
Unidentified Participant
Thank you very much. So how are we looking at these business models? Like is it franchisee owned and company operated or is it company owned and company operated plus what kind of like incremental ROC and ROE are we looking at these 25 stores which are going to be up and running?
Anjan Chatterjee
Madam, these Rajesh Mota decide.
Rajesh Mohta
Madam, these Rajesh Mota decide. These are the planned restaurants which have been just communicated by my directors are basically company owned, company operated. When you talk in terms of payback, when we initially do a financial evaluation we ensure to get the capital payback between three to five years time.
Unidentified Participant
So apart from that incremental ROA and ROC which we look into,
Rajesh Mohta
The incremental ROE would all depend because initially when you start opening restaurants there is a front end pressure of the break even which is extended in the current times between six to eight months because of the economic environment and spends which you all know Mehta. But yes, introductory pricing, etc. Also plays an important role for us. But we expect that the ROE which is almost to the extent of in five years period it would be in the range of 20 to 22%.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, you mentioned three to five years. So in three to five years we are saying that we’ll be able to reach break even for this year for this capex.
Rajesh Mohta
Sorry, I am talking in terms of rose capital employed. Return on capital employed, madam.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, and what is the payback period for this storage?
Rajesh Mohta
These are ranging between three to five would be. Let’s say for instance it all. I am talking in terms of an average. It depends upon individual stores but this is the average which we work on.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. Also could you highlight on the restaurant level and company level EBITDA margins?
Rajesh Mohta
See if I may, let’s say for instance the broad number if I look at company level EBITDA if you look at it is ranging between 22 to 25% on company level basis and if you look at the restaurant level basis on the basis of India’s accounting it would be at the range of 30 to 32%.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, so this is the range which we are planning to stay on in the next few years as well.
Rajesh Mohta
Yeah, God willing, yes, that’s the target of the organization.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, so any benchmarking which we’re trying to keep, like considering we have a lot of global peers, so are we trying to benchmark us against them? Because I’m trying to understand what is the strategy for the next values. Like I got the fair opinion of the management but is there any particular timeline in mind so that we benchmark ourselves with global peers and expand rigorously?
Anjan Chatterjee
Madam, there are not too many of these global peers excepting the PF Chang who has been expanding in the area of Orient and unfortunately there is not any chain which we know of which has been expanding, you know, like the P F Changk. So I have not actually gone in because my inspiration originally was a P F Chang’s from when my Maasi used to stay in us. And I saw that and if. And they did a wonderful job of it and then we would come to the Gulf and very successful. So I would not know the number, so I can’t comment. But I can say this to you that we’ve been here for 30 long years.
We have done mistakes, we know that. But now what we are looking at is profitable growth. And I can only say that since we are back on track, we will keep on expanding the oriental space with the anchorage of the mainland China, the bandwidth that we have of around 29 chefs, our understanding of the whole DNA of this particular category and the expected ebitda. I can’t give forward looking, you know, numbers but surely our attempt would be to maintain similar kind of emitters.
Unidentified Participant
Thank you very much, I’ll join back with you.
Operator
Thank you. A reminder to all participants, you may press star and one to ask a question. The next question is from the line of Zaki Nazir, an individual investor. Please go ahead Sir.
Unidentified Participant
Good afternoon. Anjanji Awek and Rajesh Ji. Sir, congratulations on a very very steady set of numbers this quarter. Sir, can we assume that for the restructured and reworked on company this would be a kind of a benchmark quarter going forward? Sir, that is my question number one and my question number two would be sir, we are seeing a new trend whereby the home delivery SEG is moving from the low ticket segment to the higher ticket segment. Like ITC has got into it. Taj is focusing and focusing has a new focus on it. So what are your thoughts on it, sir? Thank you.
Anjan Chatterjee
Okay, I would take that up and we could back me on this. So firstly the question you asked Mrs. Zaki, it is the attempt and of hours to ensure that we maintain this kind of result. And obviously the quarter is the best quarter. So I can’t promise that every quarter will be the same. For example, the JFM OMD being the best. That’s October, November, December, JFM is usually not good because 28 days in the month of February and you know that this is the time there are examinations that there are a bit of a headwinds which happen in any restauranting business. However, on the average of our understanding on an annual level, I think that our attempt would be to go near to the Q3 OND.
And now on the second part, I think that you’re talking about the deliveries in which the Taj Group, Cumin or the Oberoys, et cetera have entered. As you understand that since I know Taj very well, I’m an ex Taj it. So cumin has not been able to penetrate more than 0.1% or so of the whole population. Unfortunately, what happens is that delivery has become a price discovery model and it is on the platform. So they have not gone into the platform at all. So they do their own deliveries, they send their own boys or the cars. So that’s a huge limiting factor. But Taj has got a strategy that we will not dilute our brand and go to the platform like Zomato or Swiggy.
And at this point of time, as I understand they’re contemplating, maybe they’ve done a pilot somewhere. But that is one high end which is there. But our average order value for a mainland China is the highest in the industry. And there has been a respectable growth from the fact that we used to do only 1 or 2% of deliveries pre pandemic. It’s a new normal that people actually get food back home and it is bound to grow. But we continue to be an aspirational, upwardly mobile company wherein we are getting into people who are at the level of professionals and self employed and who want to have good service and food at a price which is not necessarily a five star.
So we’re not competing at that price level, but surely the brand value level, service delivery and food, we continue to do that because you know, it’s India at the end of it. You know, if you don’t serve a glass of Coke with a buffet or a glass of Pepsi, people change their mind. But kitty ladies who come in, everybody is very extremely price conscious. So I’m while we have a headroom, but we don’t want to go to that premium level of market.
Unidentified Participant
And if I may sir, your thoughts on Sweet Bengal and your future plans for that segment of your business?
Anjan Chatterjee
Yeah, so Sweet Bengal has expanded very well. SSG also is respectable. The point I’m making is that this has been a question of many investors and we respect that. But you know, the last time we had pre pandemic etc. We’ve gone through a lot of bandwidth issue in which we do have a. We will only do business which we can control back of hand. We are adding a few stores in Bombay and also Pune. We wish to go to Bangalore and to your city, Hyderabad.
But the only thing is that you can’t open a Sweet Bengal with one store. You need to have a commissary for which you need to have carriage. You have to have a control mechanism, hygiene, etc. We are looking for someone to actually lead this from haldiram over a period of time. But we have not been able to get the best person. So till then, Mr. Zaki, we would rather because you know what we see the return on investment and the future of the Asian cuisine is much better than that of maybe a sweet Bengal compared to the Asian space. So we would rather if you see the food cost of Asian food that we do is ranging between 22 to 25, wherein we understand the game, we have 29 chefs. So you know within one company can do so much.
So hence we don’t want to digest and do Street Bengal expand it to a level that we, we will have to have another vertical for which we need bandwidth given the time today we have the mind space that we have. We don’t want to add another load because I think in oriental we are in a very, very, very, very secure space and we are continuing to surge ahead with new formats. However, I promise to you that I mean we will definitely look at it. It’s a brand very close to our heart. You know, I’m a Bengali Tusreen. Bengal is a name which came in from that.
So I promise to you that we are renovating some of them. In fact, Avik is working on the new model, new format because people want new things to come in without putting too much of money. You know that it’s a very small store, around 250 to 300. And we will surely come back to you as we have the final plans of expansion.
Unidentified Participant
Thank you. Best wishes sir. And looking forward for a sweet Bengal in Hyderabad. Thank you sir.
Anjan Chatterjee
Thank you so much.
Operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Ankur Kumar from Alpha Capital. Please go ahead.
Ankur Kumar
Hello sir. Thank you for taking my question. Sir. I wanted to understand is it in last one and half to two years type our total store count hasn’t changed because in we have changed the mix as in we have opened more Asian cuisine and while we have reduced other number of stores. But given and our revenues have also increased, our gross margins have also been stable. But because of this store change I think employee cost has gone up and depreciation has also gone up. So can you comment which has hurt our margins over say last two years periods?
Rajesh Mohta
Yeah. Good evening. You are right in saying so. The total count of restaurants and confectionaries has almost been steady. The whole idea behind the company’s objective was to have profitable growth. Like you would have witnessed. There have been conversions of existing mainland Chinas into Asia Kitchen and a couple of closures during over a period of time. This has resulted into the headcount numbers of restaurant and confections to be same. But with the changes the revenues have also grown.
Like Mr. Anjan reported that the same store sales have also grown and overall the revenues have also grown. If we look at the quarter three of FY25 our same store sales growth has been around 4.7% and overall revenue growth has been 9%. This is aided by the stores which have been converted and the new stores which have got added. As a result of addition of stores and the capital expenditure in the renovation as well as new restaurants, the depreciation has increased. So you would have witnessed we are able to maintain the EBITDA margin with an additional depreciation but the returns are higher.
Ankur Kumar
Got it. So any color on what kind of steady state margins we can expect going forward?
Rajesh Mohta
See if I may, if you would have looked at your last 13, 14 quarters, we have been into profits after long so we have been able to maintain our EBITDA margins at company level between 20 and 25%.
Ankur Kumar
So that that kind of number we then this, this margin include the other other income. Right?
Rajesh Mohta
Correct sir.
Ankur Kumar
Got it. So we expect these kinds of numbers to sustain going forward.
Rajesh Mohta
Right sir.
Ankur Kumar
And sir, when you talked about 25 store edition, how how much time that will take.
Anjan Chatterjee
I’ll take that question. Some of the you know, delays happen because of the real estate deliveries. That’s a primary, primary reason now as you know that we need. We’re not going to be working for the real estate owner. We are very careful about the store matrix and hence for example. I’ll give you an example that we’ve been you know suffering because Borivilli Asia Kitchen which is owned by the Oberoids 2nd Obra Mall has been you know going on for last four years and they were supposed to deliver it 2024 mid but for reasons best known they’ve been delayed.
And as we talk now we’ve just started the fit outs. So considering the fact that there are, for example Godrej one building which is in you know for gong in Pune were to deliver it in the you know, end of I think December in 24. But now as we talk even now they have not been able to do this and they just got the OC so it’s just on track.
So we’ll start the fit out now and it takes three to four months to do a restaurant. So majority of the delays actually happen because of the real estate delivery and we are taking quality space at the best possible price. Not getting into work for the real estate owner which unfortunately at a point of time we were doing. But this time we are extremely careful. Every store matrix is measured. We know the pros and cons and then we get into it.
Ankur Kumar
Got it, sir. And sir, in the last con call I think you guided about single high single digit growth this year and double digit next year. So what should we expect?
Anjan Chatterjee
Trend should be similar, right? Yeah,
Ankur Kumar
Sure sir. Thank you. And all the best.
Anjan Chatterjee
Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Charisha from Venture Growth Partner llp. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
So I wanted to understand how are the margins different between the cloud kitchen versus kitchen within kitchen because both of them work on the delivery side of the business. Right?
Anjan Chatterjee
Mr. Bother will take the question.
Rajesh Mohta
Madam, these are formats which operate for us. Our cloud kitchen business is very insignificant to the total. When we talk in terms of kitchen within kitchen it is more to do with the sweating of the asset which is available for restaurant operations. So it would be wrong on my part to savor the efficiency of cloud kitchen Visa. We kitchen within kitchen because kitchen within kitchen is a better format for us in order to utilize the installed capacity and to have more revenues per square foot of operational area. Okay. The fixed cost Grammarly with the manpower.
Unidentified Participant
Yes. So it has kitchen with the kitchen has good dining and delivery.
Rajesh Mohta
That’s correct.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, second question which I understand we have very less of catering business but you said that we are also. You’re trying to increase that as well. So any vision on that?
Anjan Chatterjee
Yeah, I’ll take that question. What? Over a period of time we have realized that because of the offering we give from. You know if even if it means that less number of restaurants of Sigri Global Grill or a Riyasat. We also have an Indian…
Operator
Ladies and gentlemen, the management has been disconnected. I request you all to stay online while I get them connected.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, we have the management back with us. Thank you. And over to you sir. Sorry the call dropped.
Avik Chatterjee
I don’t know where we left off before the call dropped. But we were talking about our catering division Specialty Experiences. We’ve seen a very very good response from what we started a year ago. We started specialty experiences as a wing in Mumbai city just to test it out. And from the revenues of last year to this year we have seemed to more than double and getting great feedback as well. And we have been now put together a focus team which will be driving this division by itself. And this would add to our revenues as a parallel division alongside the other concepts that we spoke about earlier.
Unidentified Participant
So how do we get this business? Is it like tie ups or contacts? Because it’s a little different. Right? Catering segment.
Avik Chatterjee
Correct. So the way we work is right now we work with the hnis. So what happens is this is purely on word of mouth, marketing, heavy social events and our credibility of course with the kind of legacy that we come from and the guest list. So what we’ve seen is cities like Metro cities, especially like Mumbai where we’ve tested it out.
A lot of people are having parties at their homes because of the larger homes of HNIs. This is the core segment and our main focal point. As of now we are not getting into the mass catering of a corporate events as of now, as of yet, we’re going to be penetrating the household catering and smaller wedding functions at the most post, which we would be expanding it to corporates and so on and so forth.
Unidentified Participant
Glad to notice sir, thank you very much for giving a, you know, vision on catering business. So one more thing which I wanted to understand was are we trying to do something on the loyalty side of the customers like increasing the customer value for the overall company? If they could do that. So are there any loyalty programs
Anjan Chatterjee
At the current moment? What is happening is that we had done a loyalty program. I think we were the first to do this. But what we have evaluated over a period of time that even if we give loyalty to our customers and do an app which we experimented at a point of time in Andheri where it’s just an app, I think that because of the platforms and people who are preferring to go to a Dine out or a Zomato booking where they have a Zomato Gold etc. The space has changed so they would rather go to a, you know, Zomato Gold or an offering coming in from dine outs of the world and even if we give them more discount on the more loyalty points as against discounts, this is not working at this point of time. So we’ve just parked it. We’ve got a software ready, we’ve already interacted with the partner but currently we parked it.
Unidentified Participant
Got it. And sir, how is drgu, you know, helping us improve our base Pro sales? You mentioned something in the last concept. Could you please elaborate a bit on it?
Anjan Chatterjee
Sorry madam, could you just pose the questions once again?
Unidentified Participant
Yeah, I was just saying like in the last con call you had mentioned that DrGo is helping you improve your bistro sales by some interactive, you know, bar noun. Could you please elaborate a bit on that? And how are the, you know, how do you See the margins of these sites like episode one.
Avik Chatterjee
Sure. So number one, we’ve been partners since many years and because of our strong partnership we tend to gain from the kind of liquor discounts because of the bulk buying capacity that we have as a whole company. Usually our formats like mainland China and Asia Kitchen would pure dine in food centric formats which after evolution of the brand we have also made it a bar centric format for which our beverage state. Yes. So we’ve gotten bars in the line of sight at every restaurant that we have today. So when you see a bar, the liquor tends to move better.
And of course with the offerings that we have, that’s also helping us move the liquor sales better. We’ve in fact doubled our beverage sales for before renovation till now. And best part is we also have introduced bar trolleys and because of Diageo having a great bartending team which comes and trains our team on ground, that trolley also helps us upsell the liquor between dining zones.
Unidentified Participant
Got it. Thank you. One last question. On the same store sales growth and the average daily sales of mostly the kitchen, Asia Kitchen and bizarre. If you could you know, throw some light on that
Rajesh Mohta
Madam. On our same store sales basis we can definitely share that during the last quarter we had a growth of 4.71
4.7%.
Unidentified Participant
Okay.
Rajesh Mohta
Which is? Which is a combined factor of all the brands which have been operating in the last two years. My quarters basically on a company level basis.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. And any numbers on average daily sales which you could mention,
Rajesh Mohta
It would be difficult to give us on a same store daily sale basis, ma’am.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. And one just clarification which I wanted to make. You mentioned that we need a capex of 3.5 crores per store and the payback would be 8 months. So is it 8 months or 3 to 5 years?
Avik Chatterjee
No, it’s actually the payback is 3 to 5 years depending on the location, seasonalities etc or any ad hoc factor in that location itself. But the P L breakeven is between six to eight months of the store.
Unidentified Participant
Got it. Thank you very much.
Avik Chatterjee
Thank you.
Anjan Chatterjee
Thank you.
Operator
The next question is from the line of Anupam Jain from Indira Securities. Please go ahead.
Anupam Jain
Yeah, thanks for the opportunity. I kind of joined Dave, but can you give me a guidance for margin?
Anjan Chatterjee
Sorry to interrupt. Could you be a little louder please?
Anupam Jain
Yeah, can you hear me now? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I joined a bit late. I was wondering can you give me guidance for FY26 margins and terms?
Rajesh Mohta
See what we are working on, a strategy is the Current trend of our growth and EBITDA numbers, we would work towards sustaining the same over next couple of quarters.
Anupam Jain
Okay. And revenue,
Rajesh Mohta
The similar growth numbers, it would be, let’s say for instance, in single digit or early teens.
Anupam Jain
Okay. So I did heard before that they’re opening 25 new stores in the next year and that should also still result in single digit growth.
Rajesh Mohta
Sorry, Mr. Anjan mentioned that 25 stores would be in the next two to three years. Yeah, that’s what he’s saying. He’s saying three years, one year.
Anjan Chatterjee
So I’ll just take this. I think there’s a bit of a misunderstanding. See, while we would love to do 25, we would love to do this kind of a business becomes very difficult in terms of the, you know, because the bandwidth of trained manpower, which has been the biggest challenge. There’s so much of cash lying in the balance sheet in the treasury. We would love to expand much faster. So.
And the real estate delivery, I wish I could give you examples of the kind of, you know, levels at which we get stuck. And obviously, as you understand, we are not a qsr. We need. It’s not that high street. It takes a little time to ensure that we have an identified space with footfalls coming in either in the, in the high street or off high street where we have our parking. So there are considerations coming in. So I think the total number of stores which we have spoken about is with the horizon of three years over a period of time.
Anupam Jain
Okay. Okay, sir, then the last question will be like, okay, let’s forget this year or last year. What numbers can I expect in three years from the time? And what will be the landscaping as a specialty restaurant, as a brand image all over Pan India? If you can throw on some light on that.
Rajesh Mohta
Yeah, we would be growing in the range of between 10 to 15% every year. That’s bare minimum. Yeah, that’s a bare minimum.
Anjan Chatterjee
We don’t want to be too over enthusiastic in saying and quoting a number, but definitely the objective will be very simple. 25%. But then 20%, 15 to 20% is not something which we will accept less than that. And the idea would be, see, growth, sir, is not difficult. It’s not difficult to do growth. But we have taken a pledge that we will do profitable growth. So with that pledge in mind, we would definitely form a matrix and be a little more careful about this because this industry, after having 30 years of going up and down and then we’ve been able to get our handle back. So with a lot of difficulty and we want to be firm on that.
Anupam Jain
Okay. Thank you sir. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Priyam Tana, an individual investor. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Hello sir. Thanks for taking my question. This is Priyan Tanna from Ahmedabad. Actually sir, I follow your company since last three, four years. But sitting in Ahmedabad I have never experienced any of your restaurant store in Gujarat. So just would like to understand why you are still not very aggressive in Gujarat. So can you throw some light on it?
Anjan Chatterjee
Thank you for your patronage and the fact that you’re missing the brand. That’s. You know, you. You have so much of brand love that you’re missing the brand. Thank you. That is where we exist and we live for customers like you. Just to tell you historical that we were in Ahmedabad and as well as in Baroda. Baroda got shut down because it was a fence sitter during pandemic. We had to, you know, abort all the fence sitters.
It was going up and down. Then we came with Ahmedabad which used to be there till recently in a mall called. Which was.
But as you know this Gulbohar mall itself has you know gone under renovation of. For a building that they want to do a kind of residential building and the mall we had to do an exit. I give you a good news. Since you’re from Ahmedabad, Alpha mall is being discussed which in fact I would like to have a feedback whether we should be in Alpha Mall or not. Would you tell me whether we should be in Alpha mall, sir?
Unidentified Participant
Yes. 100% is one of the successful mall in Ahmedabad.
Anjan Chatterjee
Okay, Terrific. So fantastic. So I got your endorsement. We are in Nexus is the owner of that. The Blackstone. So I have great relationship with Dilip Sehgal and others. So we almost closed it but you know it’s only in terms of the rate and the cap. So we should be giving you a good news very soon.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, thank you. Thank you so very much. And also. Also try for the other brands also not for only for the mainland.
I would like to experience your other brands also.
Anjan Chatterjee
Sir, we will do everything that you say. But slow and steady in terms of oriental growth. With your love and passion and blessings. We will definitely be there Ahmedabad with some good brands of ours.
Unidentified Participant
Sure, sure. I’d love to meet you if you are planning to open a store. Would like to meet you over there also.
Anjan Chatterjee
Definitely, definitely looking forward. Thank you.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. Okay. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you so much. The next question is from the line of Tushar Ragatate from Kamakya Wealth Management. Please go ahead. Sorry to interrupt. Thank you so much. The next question is from the line of Tushar Ragatate from Kamakya Wealth Management. Please go ahead. Sorry to interrupt. Tushar, your voice is echoing. Could you please come a little closer to your microphone? Since Tushar is no longer there, we would move to the next participant. That’s Charisha from Venture Growth Partner llp. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Sir. I am trying to understand like we are focusing mainly on Asia Kitchen, maybe Bizarre Asia and episode one, these three. So would we be diluting the other or even Sweet Bengal for that matter. So would we be diluting the other brands where we just have one store or we have insignificant revenue?
Anjan Chatterjee
Absolutely right. You got it right. Because whenever there’s a profitable understanding of the store matrix, for example Sigri Global Grill, just give you an example. There are two of them. One Flaming grill, two Flaming Grills in Calcutta. All of them are profitable and they’re very respected brands. In spite of the fact that, you know there is huge competition in the space and plus we have a headroom. We can increase the prices because of quality and the range. So this is 1/2 1 Sri Bengal I’ll come to later. Second one is in the form of O Calcutta, which is a growth engine. There’s been almost double digit more than that. In fact it’s almost 18% growth this year.
That is something which will continue. For example, there’s one coming up in Pune and we’re considering Chennai. So that’s because as you know that the whole space of Indian food is not anymore a Mughalay or a Punjabi. People are more adventurous. They’re going to take, you know, they’re ready to accept more regional cuisines besides the South Indian or maybe somewhere which had become popular at a point of time. The Punjabi food which was originally, which has become an Indian food now.
So Oak Alcutta has given us great results. So we will do it. But small Oak Hakitas Pune for sure, very soon the work is almost starting. It’s an area very small, 150 to 60 covers. We are reinventing the look and feel as you understand that, you know, everybody now wants new fresh wine. So Avik is working on the project of reinventing them.
And that doesn’t take too much, you know, money also because it’s just that we need to do certain cosmetic changes. We have lived for over a period of 14, 15 years in all these oak Alcitas. We need to do refreshing and as you know we have a mother brand which has gone as an extension of Oak Alcator to London which is called Chowrangi.
So people do recognize us as this space. And I think that in given, you know, Next couple of years we’ll have, but it will be controlled. It will not go like Chinese or Asian is much more popular than an O Calcutta food Indian. I told you Sigri O Calcutta. I have already given you what the outline is now coming back to the one which is Sweet Bengal. Sweet Bengal is something which is not an easy business.
We were not mithai walas. Historically we were restaurateurs and we did this as an experiment, but that got expanded wonderfully. We are extremely careful about the hygiene and health. We are mechanizing a lot of lot of it back end. And as we get into that, while the Sigri global grill will be dormant, O Calcutta will have a one one and a half expansion and we will consolidate on ssg. And the one which you’re talking about, Sweet Bengal, the next stop should be Bangalore. And we will do it as we get a little more confidence in hygiene and commissary and of course the artisans who bake sweets.
Unidentified Participant
So we are mainly trying to keep the important brands which give more revenue and maybe we’ll dilute on the ones where we are not getting enough revenue.
Anjan Chatterjee
Absolutely right. Absolutely right.
Unidentified Participant
Second point, sir, I wanted to understand, are we trying to optimize cost in any way? Because I understand we are a premium brand, but are we having that headroom as well?
Anjan Chatterjee
Okay, I’ll take this question again. See, over a period of time we have understood that there is an offering which we have been doing at the level and we’ve been holding the price line and in very intelligent price increase. But we do understand that the peers are charging more and we can afford to because of our quality. So we are considering a small, you know, price rise which is now due. And because of the fact that there are tremendous headwinds on the inflation, particularly food.
I don’t need to tell you it’s all over the place. And you know, the households are also suffering. They understand a chicken dish, if it’s costing around 350 to 400 or 450, if it increase by 10, 15 rupees, it doesn’t change their life.
So that is one area. But the cost we are talking about the fact that there have been huge amounts of costs which have gotten the repair maintenance over a period of time, that whole thing is going to go down because most of our restaurants have been renovated and repair maintenance will go down drastically, which we have completely that line item we’re focusing with all microscopes we have. And then secondly, we are talking about operating supplies.
Most of our restaurants are ready now. All operating supplies have been done and it will last us for five to seven years for sure. You know, accepting the replenishment of some clinical crockery or maybe cutlery, as it were required, so which we have in the inventory as it is in every restaurant.
So these are two major areas we want to do that on. The food cost also, in spite of the fact that there has been an inflatory trend in the economy. We have because of our relationship with our suppliers and the contracts that we have, long term months we’ve been keeping our supplies as partners. The 30th is not an easy or small time, short time to really keep relationships people do understand and they hold the price line for us also because of the bulk purchase. So I can reassure you that every line item is being revisited, focused on and we know what is happening. For example, asp, that’s advertising, sales, promotion.
We do it because the Zomato and the swiggies have become necessarily evil, if I may say so, because the fact that you have to go to the platform, but the commission that we pay to them, fortunately because of our average order value, they have been able to be contained much, much better than. Or it can go better. We are still fighting it back. And so every line item, you could reassure that, be reassured that we will be looking at the input cost of this particular, you know, business will go down as we go upon.
Unidentified Participant
Got it, sir. Thank you so much for showing that confidence. So we are intact with the numbers that, you know, we’ll triple the revenue in next six years and we’ll have a 20 to 25% EBITDA margin
Anjan Chatterjee
Inshallah.
Unidentified Participant
And one last question from my end. You mentioned about inorganic growth as well. So are we looking something on Daddy?
Anjan Chatterjee
Madam, it’s been going on for a long, long time and we would love to because of the fact that, but unfortunately, you know, the, the people who are coming to us with their memorandum, unfortunately they’re EBITDA minus to a debt level. I’m sorry to say this. And you know, somehow or the other we’ve done these mistakes by adding an inorganic part in our body. We are organically here. What do we gain? We will only gain the fact that either we don’t have the expertise, we’ve not been able to build any brands, which is not the case, but we have been respectfully building brands over a period of time, or if we take the brand, they have something on the balance sheet. So we evaluated many of them. So we’ve come to a conclusion that at this point of time. It’s better. We are capable of doing it internally. So I will come back to organic. Unless otherwise there’s something which is very attractive and coming on our table.
Unidentified Participant
Correct. Hoping for, you know, better this tripling the revenues and EBITDA margin so that we get a good BE rating. Thank you very much.
Anjan Chatterjee
Yes, ma’am, thank you.
Operator
Thank you so much. The next question is from the line of Tushar Ragata Day from Kamakya Wealth Management. Please go ahead.
Tushar Raghatate
Yeah. Good afternoon, sir. Thank you for the opportunity. Just wanted to know your future plans on Bizarre Asia.
Anjan Chatterjee
Yeah, that my son will take the question of what Bizarre Asia is all about. But I’ll just tell you, you know, there is a concept called proof of concept poc. Now it’s not point of contact, it’s proof of concept concept in this retail industry. I’m sure you know it, you track it. So proof of concept has been done now, just started, we’ve given birth to it and going forward, this is what the plan would be which I think that Avik, because it’s his baby, he will be able to give you a little more light on that.
Avik Chatterjee
Right. So Bizarre Asia in a nutshell is an all you can eat Asian specific concept that we have conceived. Like rightly said by Mr. Anjan that it’s proof of concept. The idea was that this market seemed very, very interesting and growing market for us and we have seen a few of our peers who are also in the buffet, rather all you can eat concepts which have grown phenomenally. But what we understood is that not many players are doing this in the Asian focused cuisine.
But there is a high demand for it because Asian cuisine as you know, is not easily been made at homes as as good as restaurants. But Indian cuisine can be mocked similar or as close to 90% of how you get it in the restaurants. But Bizarre Asia is basically a concept that resembles the streets of Shanghai, Tokyo, Bangkok and Malaysia, Vietnam, etc.
It has open counters, live music, it has a liquor shop there you can actually walk in and pick up bottles that are on offers. So it’s a very new age, new for the new customer, but also not pinching on the price on the pocket. So hence this is what we have created. Soon, as soon as we understand that it has completed the journey of proof of concept and has proved it to us, we would be taking this to various high footfall locations like malls, entertainment zones, high street retail. And the expansion is probably anywhere where there’s a need for Asian food.
Tushar Raghatate
I just want to know the Price range for this. What is the price range and your plan for, you know, expanding in the metro city?
Anjan Chatterjee
The moment is 9, 900 to 1000, 900 to thousand rupees all inclusive.
Tushar Raghatate
Just wanted to know out of the all the stores or all the restaurants you have in the percentage terms of which, how would, how much would be the mature restaurant.
Avik Chatterjee
Sorry, could you repeat that please?
Tushar Raghatate
Wanted to know as a percentage of your total restaurant which you own, how much of it would be a mature restaurant which are, you know, stealing profits and good revenue and the non matured restaurant as a percentage of your total.
Anjan Chatterjee
See, let’s say for instance at restaurant level we don’t have. I could see that in the north India you don’t have much restaurants over there. Why? All right, so I think that question as you understand that there is a bandwidth issue at this, at a point we thought that we will mature markets like Bombay city and Calcutta where we are dominating very, very strongly because return on investment is much better. But Delhi, we didn’t have the bandwidth of manpower. We’ve just recruited people and as we go in, north is completely vacant for us. We’ve not done anything.
We used to have around seven restaurants in north pre pandemic which we had to abort. But soon you will hear good things because in Bombay by and large we have been able to with the kind of locked spaces that we have done. In next six, eight months we will be maturing our area of opening, accepting a few malls which are coming in 26, 27. So I think that Delhi is the new focus. Inshallah. We will be able to start and give you some good news in the next couple of quarters.
Tushar Raghatate
And you came up with the burger like delivering brand Walter Burger. So any update on that or like how are you seeing that?
Avik Chatterjee
Yes. So Walters was again a new brand that we created last, last quarter. The idea was to sweat our assets. For example, when wherever we have an Asia kitchen, we also have a mainland China food delivery from that same kitchen as well as our delivery brand Hakka, which is on a lower price point. Now coming from that analogy, because it’s been so successful and profitable for us, we created Wolters Burger to be delivered from the same manpower and same kitchens of our continental restaurants for which we have done three of those delivery zones from our existing restaurants in Mumbai city.
But we are also trying very shortly, we’re in almost close, close to ending the contract with JIO Mall in BKC to have our Walters Burger in the food court that they call nine Dine. That Would be up and running soon, hopefully. So we will see a response with a physical store for the first time with the same brand.
Tushar Raghatate
Got it. My last question, just wanted to know, like in the bizarre Asia, the format is the buffet format doing in the range of 900 to 1,000, all inclusive. And in the mainland you’re giving the same offering. Don’t you think that, you know, these both brands will cannibalize your sales?
Anjan Chatterjee
So mainland China is actually primarily Chinese cuisine. Whereas bizarre Asia has a lot of influence of Thailand, Vietnamese, Malaysian and bits of Chinese. So mainland China, apart from the buffet at some locations also has mainly a la carte dining which is the Highest seller for us, 80% is Alakat. And most of our restaurants do not have a buffet offering. Hence we thought that proof of concept for a place which is purely buffet would be something that could be a great growth engine.
And one reason for us to be experimenting with this is because the more chain restaurants come in in a single city, that tends to be brand fatigue. We do want to dominate the Asian space in every location of a city. But we probably think that a same brand creates a fatigue. Hence we want to be a part of the Asian market share of every location with various brands of ours. That’s why we took this strategy call.
Tushar Raghatate
Sir, Liquor is what percentage of your sale as of now and any targets for that.
Rajesh Mohta
It the liquor says ranges between 10 to 12% of the total revenues except in the website on overall basis it is. But on a wet LED basis it is 40, 50% at episode overall gross percentage 12 to 14. No, no, with the episodes etc.
Anjan Chatterjee
Yeah, yeah, yeah. It’ll be around 15 because we are as Avik said that we are now. You know, we used to be having a dispensed bar and which was recessed and not in the line of sight. All new restaurants of all new restaurants we have a fairly large line of sight bar as you know. And then we also doing a lot of promotions in the form of bottle, you know, prices. So we are working very, very hard with the trolley which he had mentioned to be on the line of sight and making liquor.
The margins of liquor usually made by others is around 40, 50%. I said that legitimate margin low and then go. So that’s shown us in last three months. For example bizarre Asia Mizuna in Calcutta, the one which is happening here, the mall, the one which is in Pune and also in, you know, Malad which we renovated from Indian China to Asia kitchen. We are seeing the graph growing, going up.
Tushar Raghatate
Thank you so that was helpful. All the best.
Anjan Chatterjee
Thank you.
Operator
The next question is from the line of Priyankar Sarkar from Square 64 Capital Advisors LLP. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Hi sir. Good afternoon sir. I’m really looking at the company after quite a few years to be very honest. So just had a couple of questions. So one thing which I’m unable to understand completely is that what is the need to make so many sub brand? I mean it seems like there is a long tail. For example a Cafe Mizuna, right? You have only a few stores and I’ve been to that store in Calcutta many years back. Almost seven, eight years back. So I mean what is the need for us to dilute this way?
Anjan Chatterjee
See, I think you came in late. I’d explained this very clearly that we have understood that at a point of time we had given birth to a lot of babies. We did not do Parivar neogen. So family planning was not done at a point of time. So what came across is that now we understand that which is the growth engine, which is the power brand. So we’ve completely changed our strategy. But sir, Caffeine Mizuna continues to rock with an EBITDA of in and around 15 to 18% bare minimum on band months it is 22%.
So I would not have bought anything for which we have a respectable bandwidth for South City. And you know one in forum which we are renovating. We’ve got great, great relationship with the mall. So the rentals are low and we are continuing to make respectable profits. And we are not adding any more. I can say this to you. We are not adding any more of Sigri Global Grill. But suddenly killing something which is giving us. I mean supposing Global grill gives us 1 crore 20 lakhs of revenue per month with a respectable bottom line. So why would I kill something like that? But definitely Hakka which used to be there has become a delivery brand Kitchen Visit Kitchen. We intelligently brought it back because it’s a price LED brand. And we have not expanded any one of them anymore.
And these are all pre pandemic. And you know, by the time we had already signed. So the brand basket is busy. Looks very heavy. I completely agree with you your sentiments. But today now as we talk, it’s only Asian. Asian. Asian you may say. Why not just Asia Kitchen. But you will understand that we reinvented. If you have any connections in Calcutta, please check about Bizarre Asia. How has it been taken in and accepted by the market? We are innovating formats by giving the same content In Asian Chinese.
On one side, Asian is the most popular cuisine in India at this point of time. So we’ve come back to the square one for which we built this company Made in China Anchorage and the fact that we have that bandwidth. So this is going to be a growth engine on Oriental which is based on mainland China’s existing Asia kitchen by mainland China Gong, which was given a birth, you may say that it’s a new brand, but still in this space, I will tell you there are a lot of people who are just starting up and then giving different kinds of name, not scaling it up.
So initially our strategy was to scale up a main channel. We learned a lesson over a period of time that no many places we had gone to, like you know, we went to Indore, we’d gone to places like Dudhiana where we learned that we were too early. Now these places are getting matured. We’ve come back to our track consolidating, trying to understand how to make a profitable store and ensuring that our line items actually are controlled. So one, we are keeping all the others normal, you will not see. But within the Asian space you will see some innovations coming in because we have done what we did long, long ago will not work because to be the king of the jungle, you have to kill every day, sir.
So we are with my son coming in and younger brigade that he’s brought in, he’s getting more formats. But within the Oriental space, everything will be confined to that which correlates with the DNA of the company and the bandwidth we are capable of.
Unidentified Participant
Perfect. So just one couple of follow up questions. Since you are going to be focusing only on Oriental, is it safe to assume that across all the brands oriented gives you the highest gross margin?
Anjan Chatterjee
That’s correct, yeah. Yeah, of course, very nicely. Very good question. On Indian brand, for example, an Oak Alcutta will have a 30, 32% food cost input cost. Because as you know, you being a Bali March fish is very costly. Hills are to everything else. Whereas when you talk about, you know, anything else like a noodle, the price of the noodle compared to the price of the chicken is much, much lower. And you have so much of noodle and you little, you add a little bit of chicken.
So you eat around, you add around 50, 60 grams of chicken as against fish which we have to give a chunky 160 grams into two. So there’s a lot of food cost difference and that’s one of the biggest advantages of ours because our relationship with Lee Kum Kee and others relationship with all the suppliers and one streamlined supply chain which helps us very, very strongly. And hence the oriental cuisine which we were actually the company was born and the flagship continues to be the main in China and we will continue to surge ahead with this.
Unidentified Participant
Perfect. Okay, so last question. Have you given any guidance in terms of the number of stores that you plan to add over the next two or three years?
Anjan Chatterjee
25 stores, yeah. Over a period of three years, right? Yeah. Yeah. Subject to one caveat. Subject to the, you know, delivery of the real estate.
Rajesh Mohta
For three years. 25 stores, right? Yes. Starting FY24.
Anjan Chatterjee
25. 25. 25, 26. Yeah. 2526. Yeah. Okay. 2526. Okay.
Unidentified Participant
Perfect. Sir, thank you very much and wish you all the best.
Anjan Chatterjee
Pleasure. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. Participants, you may press star and one to ask a question. Ladies and gentlemen, that was the last question for today. I would now like to hand the conference over to the management for the closing comments.
Karan Bhuwania
Dear investors, analysts who had joined our specialty restaurants investors call. We are extremely thankful to have spared your time for us to give you what strategy the company is going to take forward. Thank you once again.
Operator
Thank you, ladies and gentlemen, on behalf of ICICI Securities Limited. That concludes this conference. You may now disconnect your lines.