Power Mech Projects Limited (NSE: POWERMECH) Q3 2025 Earnings Call dated Feb. 12, 2025
Corporate Participants:
Nani Aravind — Chief Financial Officer
S.K. Kodandaramaiah — Director – Business Development
Unidentified Speaker
Analysts:
Teresa John — Analyst
Dhruv Bhatia — Analyst
Pritesh Chheda — Analyst
Anupam Gupta — Analyst
Deepak Poddar — Analyst
Manthan Jhaveri — Analyst
Anush Mokashi — Analyst
Kamlesh Jain — Analyst
Presentation:
Operator
Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the Power Met Projects Limited Q3FY25 earnings conference call. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen only mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing Star then zero on your touchstone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Eja John from Nirmalbank Institutional Equities. Thank you. And over to you, ma’am.
Teresa John — Analyst
On behalf of Nirmal Bank Institutional Equities, I would like to welcome you all to the TQFY25 earnings call of Powermat Projects Ltd. The management today is represented by Mr. N. Nani Arvind, CFO of the company and Mr. S.K. ramayan, Director of Business Development. I will now hand over to the management for their opening remarks after which we will open up the floor for Q and A. Thank you. And over to you sir.
Nani Aravind — Chief Financial Officer
Thank you sir. Sujan. Good afternoon everyone. I am Nani Arvind, CFO of the company. I have with me Mr. Amaya, Director, Business Development. I welcome you all to all quarter three FY25 earnings call. The performance for quarter three and nine months for this financial year continued as per our set targets for the entire year. The reported total income for quarter three financial year 2425 is 1347 crore against 1115 crore in quarter three FY24 an increase of 21% year on year. EBITDA is 160 crore as against 141 crore.
A growth of 13% and PAT is 87 crore which has grown 39% compared to 62 crore in quarter three FY24. EBITDA margin has decreased from 12.66% in quarter three FY24 to 11.87% in Q3FY25 due to increased overhead cost. PAT margin has gone up from 5.6% to 6.5% due to lower tax and increase of other income. Revenue mix for quarter 3F identifies as follows. Mechanical business has contributed 277 crores against 230 crore in quarter 2 FY24 showing an increase of 20% year on year.
Civil business including railways, water distribution contributed 522 crore against 596 crore in Q3FY24, a decrease of 12%. O Revenue are 481 crore against 260 crore in corresponding period last year reaching a growth of 85%. Electrical business 25 crore against 21 crore increase increase of 19%.
Mining business 34 crore against 0 in Q3FY24 during last year. Other income is 9 crore against 7 crore in Q3FY24. So during quarter three of FY25 the distribution between domestic business and international business is 95% and 5% respectively.
Contribution from the power sector remained at 65%. Non power sector contributed 35%. Similarly, the total reported income for nine months of FY25 stands at 3,409 crore against 2,922 crore in nine months of FY24, an increase of 17% year on year.
EBITDA is 417 crore against 360 crore. A growth of 15% PAT is 218 crore against 164 crore in nine months of FY24 a growth of 33% year on year. So on nine months to nine month basis EBITDA margin has decreased from 12.45% in FY24 to 12.22% in nine months of FY25 due to increase of overhead. Cost pad margin has gone up from 5.7% to 6.4% due to lower finance cost, lower tax expenses and increase of other income. Revenue mix for nine months mechanical business has contributed 608 crore against 517 crore in nine months.
FY24 showing an increase of 18% year on year growth. Civil business including railways, water distribution contributed 1459 crore against 1586 crore during last year. A decrease of 8% year on year. O Revenue SIR 120013 crore against 755 crore in corresponding period last year A growth of 61%. Electrical business 42 crore versus against 47 crore. A decrease of 10% year on year.
Mining business 60 crore against 0 during last year. Other income 28 crore against 17 crore of other income during last financial year. So during nine months of FY25, the distribution between domestic business and international business is 94% and 6% respectively.
Contribution from the power sector remained at 62%. Non power sector contributed 38%. With regards to the other financial parameters are concerned, net current days excluding cash and cash equivalent have increased from 147 days in Q2, 255 days in Q3 due to delays in certification of the waterworks and delays in realization of receivables resulted in increase in the current assets of the company and on stabilization of MDO business.
From FY25 and 26 onwards we can expect a significant Improvement in networking capital days. The gross debt and net debt remained controlled despite delays in certification of water bills and delays in realization of receivables. As on 31st December 2024, the gross debt is around 614 crore and the net debt stands at 141 crore. The debt equity ratio as on 30th December 31st December stands at 0.29 times. 0.39 times Order Book Status. So far in this financial year the company has secured orders worth of 4,242 crore till December. The order backlog as on 31st December is around 57,915 crore.
If we exclude 2 MDO, the unexecute order book stands at 18,284 crore. We are actively pursuing upcoming tenders targeting 3,000 crore in new orders by March 2025. Additionally, we have been declared as a L1 bidder for the 49 km Devagar bypass highway project in Jharkhand valued around 973 crore under HAM and we are awaiting for the issuance of LOA from nha.
With reference to MDO business is concerned, we are making significant progress in our two MDO projects at Kotrap Asantapur KBP Mining. We have achieved a key milestone with the state Forest Department release of 564 hectares of notified forest land in the month of July following the securing of tree felling permission in October tree felling beginning December 24. We anticipate OB removal to commence in next month March 25 with coal supply scheduled to start from April 25.
The other Mdivo Kalyana Shri T Asra project is gaining traction. We have completed equipment mobilization for initial mining and received environmental clearance for 3.5 million tons per annum washari on October 24.
OV removal and coal production have been ongoing since January 24 with approximately 5.38 lakhs tons of coal excavated and dispatched to sale as of January 25th. Although sale offtake is currently lower than the planned due to limited washtree capacity outside, we are working to address this constraint and scale up production Now I request Mr. Ramegaru to update on the development of business side.
S.K. Kodandaramaiah — Director – Business Development
Yeah. Thanks Arvind for your update on the overall numbers. Thanks for investing community. As I said, you know the as Arvind is doing his update as far as the the business side is there, the backlog of order which was 17,362 at the beginning of the year has gone up to 18,284 crores upstairs of 5.3%. With the overall addition of 4,242 crores which has added up to the three quarters.
And in this case a few important things is the mechanical and etc. Business has gone up by 7% from 6422 crores to 6857 crores. Civil backlog from 7814 crores, 7310 crores, a reduction of 6%.
O&M. There is a huge upstate in that in terms of order booking there is a positive indication from backlog of 2197 crores to 3228. About 47% more electrical and modest decrease from 930 crores to 887 crores minus 4.6%.
The overall order backlog has gone up by 5.3% from 17,360 crores to 18,284 crores. And the domestic business continues to drive the business substantially more than 95, 96%.
And international operations recently some mainly on the O and M and the maintenance jobs we are now trying to catch up. There is a balance portion then power sector continues to drive the substantial business because of the huge surge in the opportunities which have been available both in the insulation business, civil business as well as the O and M business. And then MDO has given update about the overall position in terms of the present execution and the actions taken.
Now what we can say is that at the opportunity side there is a positive thing in terms of the investments particularly in the power sector. What I can give that is an important thing which is driving the business. What I can give an update on this is that VHL has been ordered with substantial orders in both the EPC and the main plant works. Along with the civil wars. That comes to almost 24,000 megawatts in the last two years in the EPC business they have taken about 81,680 crores. And the main plant installation. Main plant works in the supply and installation. And then the civil works also has civil works. That is the main plant boiler and turbine 55,302 crores. And LNT is also entry. Now they are taking further interest into this one. They have taken two major jobs of 4,000 megawatts. And that is around 27,523 crores. And therefore in that way the overall ordering which has been done in the last two years is about 28,900 megawatts. In that the major players are Adani group has taken six projects about 10,920 crores.
They have done the ordering Ariana Ariana Generation Co. Ltd. 800 megawatts DVC 1600 crores. And then recently the latest news is that they have taken additional the ragnar for the boiler island of the work that has come over 6500 crores or something like that. And then Mahajan Co this is also latest their development Karate they have taken forward the addition which are spending on the karate investments 2 into 800 megawatt. Now that has come to 1600 megawatt and then they have ordered on BHL for about 8,000 cross the main plant plus and then NTPC substantially ordered on BHL about 11,580 megawatts totally comes to 28,900 megawatt.
In that you know the EPC portion as I explained to you BHLEB portion comes to 81,680 crores. Now balance ordering has to be done in many places. Karate they ought to order about 1600 megawatts.
Adani because they are doing the packaging themselves in the 10,920 megawatts they are doing enough. Of course there also the opportunity can be there in many of the civil work, mechanical works, coal handling, clean works etc Then NTPC the research bulk tender which has the audit two to be a LNT and one to be one to BHL in Telangana that is our 6400 megawatts that opportunity can be substantial. Now Raghunathur latest update about 6000 crores which has been awarded on the.
This is the latest yesterday’s news to BHL on the boiler island. That means they have split the entire EPC into two EPCs. One is the boiler island, another is the turbine island and the boiler island.
They have taken this job and then the MPGCL and there are new projects which will be expected on other eight sets also. Therefore from the combined opportunities in the power sector I would like to dwell in the first instance. The main business interest for us is the installation business civil and structural business for the main plant and wherever balance of plant is there we have measured out the total opportunity size about 27,250 crores.
27,250 crores new projects which have been allotted about 13,560 megawatt. And then there is a recent development where in KSK Mohanadi the NCLT project which has been gone for liquidation has been awarded to JSW that is there are existing three units are running three into 600 and the one more unit they are going to complete it. That is 600 megawatt and two more units.
They are going to change the configuration from 600 megawatt to 660 megawatt. These are the major things. And the other areas. Yes. And the infrastructure said government continues to be bullish investments in railways, drinking water schemes, roads and then metro projects, etc. Therefore, what we are focusing is that you know the experience what we gained in the drinking water.
We want to expand the business. Because this drinking water scheme has been extended up 2028. And the total investment may exceed about nearly from 3.6 lakh crores. It will go up to nearly 5 lakh crores. And it is expected particularly in the southern states. Karnataka, Andhra Pradesh, Tamil Nadu, Kerala and Maharashtra. Lot of investments are expected. And now with the experience what we gained in the UP where we have done substantial work for about 2723 crores. 1969 villages. The work is in progress. Substantial work has been completed.
That is a focus on that and O and M. What I can say is that we are very bullish on the O and M. Because one is that a lot of new projects are getting commissioned. In fact last year the commissioning was expected about 6,000 megawatts. And that will bound to go up to 8 to 10,000 megawatts in this year. And then if they maintain the space. Because the government’s plan is to ramp up the capacity of the power plant installation from the existing 218 gigawatts to the 2 lakh 18,000 megawatts to nearly 3, 3 lakh megawatts. That means 80,000 megawatts. And lot of ordering is there. And many players are coming with investments. GISPL is planning two projects. One in Orissa and then another in West Bengal.
They will get in the salmon already they yesterday the news is that they have been awarded. That is JSW Energy. Then jsw, the sister group is also planning two major plants in in Orissa and also in Chhattisgarh.
And then there are other players also expected. They were after all the utilities also. Sorry.
Many utilities are expected to make investments including coal India and many other public sector government undertakings. In Utranchal is also planning 1320 megawatt for whatever reason requirements are there. Then Coal India.
I said they are planning investments in Warisan, Rajasthan in a joint venture basis. Therefore we are really bullish. Sorry.
On the power sector investment in the next two to three years, which is exposure to go for another four to five years. It will draw up two major opportunities. One is the complete installation business which will be available which will be our major player.
Another is the follow up WINDM jobs which will come up as part of the new commissioning which will take place every year. About 8,000 megawatts. And that is a substantial business opportunity.
And that we have seen in the major orders we have taken recently in many O and M jobs. For example the major O and M jobs what we have taken last year is the drinking water about 681 crores as part of the commissioning operations which is going to take place. And then minoxy rehab and windham job of 685 crores.
And then 951 crores for Talwandi. 3 into 660 megawatts. 392 crores for 2 into 600 megawatt.
Singularly 2 into 600 megawatt. 343 crores. And there was a major job we have taken in Nigeria where we have done the commissioning of the crafty PowerPoint 139 crores.
There are other jobs in for the JP Group in Bara then jobs you are taking about 100 crores. And JSP Langul also have taken Colonial 66 crores. In all this is how it adds up.
Now certain things which we have to care factor in that the mainly the election processes happen continues state after state. It had some some sort of a postponement of the ordering and also decision to call the tenders and all. There is another positive development which companies trying to foray into it.
That is in trying to see how much we can make the make use of our best of our experience in terms of the complete installation and then civil structural and then material handling jobs and then main part works etc. Particularly trying to balance the plant packages. Because the NTPC has got plans to do the balance of plant packages. And we are working with BHL then other customers also making also the synchrony. There is an opportunity is coming up. Karate I said about 2 into 10. That also is coming up. And then there can be other opportunities. Therefore balance opportunities can throw up at least around 12 to 15,000 crores.
More than 15,000 crores of opportunities. Then we have to see how to take that call. And then other things. What we are doing it in the international market. The focus is more on the domestic market and the. And the areas of railways. Yes, railways particularly metro jobs. Metro jobs refers to the maintenance sheds. Over 10,000 crores of opportunities are there. And we are already working in many such maintenance shops and railway workshops. Also this is what I would like to say. Thank you very much.
Operator
Shall we begin with the question and answer session?
Nani Aravind — Chief Financial Officer
Yes, ma’am.
Questions and Answers:
Operator
Sure. We will now begin with the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on the Touchstone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star in two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. Thank you. We take the first question from the line of Troop Patia from AUM Funds. Please go ahead.
Dhruv Bhatia
Yes. Hi. Am I audible?
Operator
Yes, sir.
Dhruv Bhatia
Thank you for the presentation. My question is sir, obviously the opportunity is very very large. What you are pursuing your order book already reflects. But in terms of execution, what are the challenges for you to grow much faster than the 20% sales growth that you have done because you have a massive order book. So if you can give us some guidance in terms of execution also what we can expect next year and maybe in FY27.
Just focusing on FY26 and 27, what is the internal target? What are the hindrances to grow much faster in terms of people, capex materials or working capital? Is there any constraint? And linked to that question is what are the margins that you expect with higher and higher scale where should the margins stabilize Both across the non MDO business and in the MDO business as well. Thank you.
Nani Aravind
Yeah, so thank you sir. With reference to the scale of operation is concerned we last year we have touched almost 1500 crore per quarter execution capacity. So we may scale up this because of the number of new line of business we started and O and M also there is opportunity we received more orders during the year so we may touch. We can execute up to 1800 to even we may can touch up to 2000 crore of revenue.
So the next year target for 26 and 27 guidance is that we have earlier we have committed the 7,500 we targeted for the 26 and 27 is around 9,500 is including the MDO operation together. But there is a delay in terms of the starting of the projects in MDO. Most likely maybe 10% or 15% here and there probably will touch between 7,000 to 7,500 between Metajin 26 and maybe around 9,000 we can touch in 27.
So in terms of the profitability is concerned the MDO business will give a more EBITDA margins once we reach the peak rated capacity which we are expecting from FY28 onwards till the time during the development phase, we may not expect that much of EBITDA increase in the overall margins. But regular business we are choosy about picking the right orders and high profitable orders. We are planning to execute and O and M orders also we are going to increase.
So the O and M, the EBITDA margin maybe every year on year basis, maybe around 0.52 next two to three years. Maybe in the range of 1 to 1.5%range. We can expect to grow.
S.K. Kodandaramaiah
Yeah, I will add a few things to what Arvind has said. The other thing, what we have built upon right is on the capacities and the methodologies. What we can do to ramp up the revenue. And also the growth that is obviously comes from the capacities organization has built up over the years. In fact, one of the basic things is that the organization capacity what we have seen is which was around 30, 32,000. Including the all the manpower, direct and indirect manpower and also engineer supervisors and the contracting labor. Now it has gone up to 37,000.
That itself shows that for the OEM in the last six months we have ramped up the organizational strength of both execution, operation, maintenance, skilled people, engineers from total figure of 12 to 13,000 to 17,500. Therefore, that is because of the large pool of the peace rate workers. And these skilled people we are having in our roles from our peace rate workers or contractors and other agencies and all.
Second thing is that the organization has failed to gather a lot of expertise in terms of site execution that they want to convert into high end value jobs. That is mainly in conversion. In the civil work, for example, end to end solution, civil, structural, mechanical and then O in depth.
Therefore, we are perhaps next to L and T or some of the bigger companies which are not into this traditional, this type of business. We are perhaps the only player who can provide end to end solution from in the entire construction as a construction partner. That capacity we established in terms of physical capacities of mechanical was about four to four and half lakh tons at one time we had demonstrated.
And then in the concrete inside 2 1/2 to 3 lakh cubic meters. That is substantial. And when we have reached the type of capacities, when the new orders are expected and each plant post a 2,800megawatts 16megawatt plant has got a capacity of 1 lakh 50,000, 40,000 tons.
And then doing couple of jobs parallelly is not a challenge for us, which we have demonstrated earlier. And therefore in that not only that, in the infrastructure side also a lot of lot of expertise has been developed. In the recent years. Sorry.
Dhruv Bhatia
My question on the margin. So you expect for the next two years at least margin to be constant in the 12% range.
Nani Aravind
So we…
S.K. Kodandaramaiah
See we there is one basic thing change which has happened in the market. Why we are little bit bullish on the market is that the OMPI of the execution has gone up substantially in terms of the backlog by 50%. 47 to 50% as we all know provides better EBITDA margins and all. Now on the bullish trend in the main plant power plant ordering it is now demonstrated that lot of order flowing is there.
And then competition is little bit much subdued now because of the historical reason and we are well able to handle that. And the realization of the average value has gone up by 20 to 30% in the last couple of years. And both in the mechanical works and the civil works and the OM side.
That is the main reason why perhaps Arvind is working on these figures. And in the coming years we should be able to show better margins.
Dhruv Bhatia
What would be the margins you think going forward? Just as an indication for the core business or the non MDO business? And then what would be in MDO business over the next the margins?
Nani Aravind
Mdo? Our mining operations are progressing well and we expect this segment to contribute around 2000 crore to our top line by 2028 as we reach full operational capacity. The growth will further solidify our market position and support our overall revenue targets also. And we are actually targeting to annual growth of around 25 to 30% over next four to five years of top line. This and the EBITDA margin.
Right now we are at 12.2% average. We are giving so O and M division with margins exceeding 15% is a key contributor for the major increase in the O and M the EBITDA margins.
So looking forward we are projecting an increase of EBITDA margin with 1 to 1.5% over next three to four years as the mining revenues also will continue to grow along with and contribute major top line. So both mixed together maybe 1.5% of the peak rated capacity. We are expecting in next two to three, three years, three years it will be 1.5% higher. Both together over a period of two to three years. When we reach the peak rated capacity. It will not happen immediately. It will year on year it will go and we reach the peak rated capacity. We expect another 1.5% jump in the EBITDA margin.
S.K. Kodandaramaiah
Yeah. The one more thing I would like to add up is that since we are having a single establishment doing multi area Jobs in construction, particularly the civil works, the structural works and mechanical work. Our overheads can come down reasonably that will can contribute some better margins and then oh backlog and capacities is going up and that will definitely add a pass for the margins down the line.
And the other trend is that the customer is now preferring outsourcing with the OEM on a comprehensive basis that brings lot of value addition not only in the private sector. Private sector they started now public sector also has started. Many of the public sector companies also like kpcl, GMDC and then other many companies are going to catch up because you know they don’t want to increase their establishment and this is a better option to work on that.
And some of the private customers are further expanding the O profile into such a way that we take the entire responsibility because of the capacities and the performance what we demonstrated so far.
Dhruv Bhatia
Thank you for answering my question.
Operator
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Pritesh from Lucky securities. Please go ahead.
Pritesh Chheda
Sir any reason why you know when you see your 9 months number and when you also see this quarter’s number the O and M in your revenue mix have risen quite substantially and the growth is also a bigger growth is coming from the O and M revenue itself. So why isn’t that your operating margins are moving up. Why have you taken some orders in civil which are a lower margin order any what. What is the key reason? If you could tell us. We are executing. See if you are saying that your margins are going to go up because of O and M they should be visible now also. Right?
Nani Aravind
Right. I’ll come to that sir. See the current last year because of the general elections and there were delays in terms of the realization of receivables. And moreover there are new WINDM orders we received during last year.
We have taken up a lot of manpower on the roles of the company and so the conversion will happen slowly. Initially we will have more overheads in terms of the starting of the new projects. That is one reason.
And up Water division we are executing this project under Jaljeevan mission Because of the general election there was a no fund allocation at that point of time. So there is delays in realization of these bills and subsequently Jaljeevan mission timelines has expired in the month of November. Again there is no fund allocation for this project.
So again there is the department notified the lot of bills pending from the certification. So this this resulted more overheads and we are incurring working capital limits to utilize for the running the projects further. So that caused the more expenditure overheads increase in the current year. Sir, next year once this O and M operations are stabilized automatically initial cost whatever we incurred is normalized and we may improve the maybe Q4 onwards. We may there may be increase in the EBITDA margins compared to the Q3.
Pritesh Chheda
So you are saying. If I understand your answer correctly, you’re saying costs associated with new projects have come in the P L But the corresponding revenue related to those new projects are yet to come in your P and L.
Nani Aravind
No, no corresponding revenue we received. But initially we have to startup cost will be there to start. Major overheads we have to incur to start up this works. We have to set up the site establishment and everything so that incurs more cost in terms of the overheads is concerned the revenues we realize. But this cost will be normalized during the subsequent quarters.
In the initial period of starting of the transact operations. It will incur the more cost in mobilizing the resources. What is your usual margin that you bid at for in the O and M contracts? It ranges from.
It ranges from case to cases so depends on the scope of work. And also it ranges from 15 to 20 21% is also there some cases we are having 2120 on an average we are getting 16 to 17% average.
S.K. Kodandaramaiah
Actually there are two categories in this.
One is a long term om contract there is a steady margin. Then short term shutdown jobs, repair jobs, maintenance jobs that will can get a better margin. Also because you know customer is in a hurry to get the job done because of the shutdowns and all there some opportunity cost is there.
That is how the overall wind M PI you know both the AMC the short term jobs can provide better margins. As I told in the main plant installation business receiver was because of the competition is being reduced little bit and also the higher demand the the margin profile has gone up and realization will come in coming years.
Pritesh Chheda
Okay. And sir, last on the order or let’s say the order visibility available in the power sector. So you guys gave a lot big analysis. But if I have to shorten it and understand how much of the orders for BTG which have been given out to Bhal by various utility companies out of that order. How much order is yet to be ordered out for the main plant direction and the balance of plant. If you could.
S.K. Kodandaramaiah
So I am taking on the.
I gave overall figures of what the BHL order has taken the last one of two years. That is about 29,000 megawatt, right? What you said 10,000 megawatt roughly it comes to nearly almost 1 lakh 40,000 crores. Okay then LNT has taken recently 27,523 crores.
Therefore all these things will come. Of course a few orders have been converted getting converted and all. But bulk of the orders have to be converted.
And this year and next year major ordering will happen. That’s what I gave a figure of the total opportunity save and the etc civil packages for the balance ordering to be done by out of these things about 27 to 30,000 crores is left. This is one the orders already placed by BHL on BHL and LNT.
Then there will be another 13,005 60 megawatts of new ordering has to be done by the utilities. By various various utilities with the outer place order. Because the urgency of doing it is very important to ramp up the capacity to by 80,000 megawatts by 203032 from the present 220,000 megawatts 3 lakh megawatts. That is also there will be better margins which will come because of the increase in demand. As you know, the demand goes up. The margins also slightly can go up also.
Pritesh Chheda
So basically simple to understand out of whatever is ordered with BHCL plus NTPC put together the main plant direction worth 27,000 balance of plant worth 15,000 are yet to be ordered out to various contractors like you. And over and above that there will be new tenders for BTG or new new tenders for power plants. 13560 megawatt which is yet to ordered out completely correct?
S.K. Kodandaramaiah
Yeah.
Pritesh Chheda
Okay, now what you have a 50% market share in. So we. You know is there a change there in the. In the BTG direction? And to the first participants question you never answered. Why is it that you have orders today in the non MDO area in the non nbo but when it co-mes to revenue execution, why is it slow?
S.K. Kodandaramaiah
No revenue execution. So that was mainly because the drinking water. There were certain fund allocation issues. That is where we had some shortfalls there and then there were certain delays in this local that happens in some of the projects and all because of the engineering issues and clearances and all that is. That is a.
That is also a factor when we are doing a lot of projects in the open area. There can be local issues on the land acquisition clearances approaches and this type of this are all. These are all to be there and that is how there is some sort of this one.
But even then as said with the 3380 crore and then our. Our figure was to exceed the 5000 crores revenue in this year that we are confident of achieving it.
Pritesh Chheda
Okay. Okay.
Operator
Does that answer your question, sir?
Pritesh Chheda
Yeah, I’m done. Thank you.
Operator
The next question is from the line of Anupam Gupta from IIFL Securities. Please go ahead.
Pritesh Chheda
Yeah. Thanks for the opportunity. So you outlined the opportunity size pretty well. But we have seen DHCL getting orders quite some time back. So when do you actually see DHL tendering out and you being able to book these etc or BOP orders incrementally. Do you expect anything to come in 4th quarter or when should we start seeing the tendering happen from BHE given that they themselves have a large order book.
S.K. Kodandaramaiah
For example couple of tenders we already bidding process is on. Unless it is extended. Let us see. It will take one to two months.
Particularly BOP karate tender is due and that is the that we are working with BHL and there is going to be synchrony tender also 1 into 800 megawatts that is also due. But first of all BHL has to get the order and that is in the final process of their given the offer and all. And perhaps that needs to approve the state government at the cabinet level.
Then there can be other projects also which are expected there. That’s why I gave a figure of 15,000 cross in the BOP. And then as far as the the installation, civil and other opportunities or the BHL has got and even the LNT has got about 27,000 crores.
What I said is that this should happen maximum in another six months to nine months. Because including Adani or direct orders, BHL mainfranch orders and then balance of plant orders whatever they are there then LNT also then all these things in various areas. Main plant, baluster plant, quantum coal handling, the civil work, structural work, piping works, etc that is where you know.
But in the worst situation it’s extended to nine to ten months. I, I Because if they don’t award all these things by end of the another eight to ten months perhaps your projects get delayed. That is what I can say. Sorry.
Anupam Gupta
Understand. So next year when you say that you’ll deliver to short 7,000 crore of revenues what is the minimum ordering which you are looking at for this year at least.
S.K. Kodandaramaiah
Looking at the trends of course this election process continuous phenomenon. Many of the projects are located in these segments and all. And then perhaps you know about 10,000 crores should be reasonable.
Anupam Gupta
10,000 crores total ordering in this year.
S.K. Kodandaramaiah
No, next year. Next year.
Anupam Gupta
Next year. Okay, okay, understand. And, and in this 18000 crore order of we should assume that the same thing which you had mentioned in the last call that the Adani orders which have not started are not going to be executed. Right around 4000 crores. That’s the right assumption.
S.K. Kodandaramaiah
Yeah. Mirjapur is. We are discussing it stage three, stage two. We already executing stage three. Then Mirjapur new units and then Amar Kantak we have taken it. And they are also planning Kawai and all of course kawaii. Out of four units, two units were shifted to the projects in western in Madhya Pradesh. These are all not to be expected. So you’re saying that ports on those can still be executed or they will not be executed. Sorry Anupam, can you repeat your question? I think the FGD orders which were there from Adani of 4000 crores which on which work had not started. Will that happen or will not light happen? What is the clarity on that as on today? Except for that 900 crores which are in Mundra they have taken out for the time being we are executing would be project then other projects as on today? Yes, it is. It stands because one more development I can say is that Supreme Court recently has taken a very hard call in terms of that.
You know, they don’t want to make compromise on the pollution. And some postponement can be there in the implementation of your daughters. Because there are other related issues in terms of the tariff adjustment and tariff compensation by the electricity boards and then discoms.
And that is one of the reasons which is little bit delaying all this implementation. Otherwise in our opinion I don’t think they will compromise much on the fgd. It may take some more time.
Anupam Gupta
Understand. And the next question is on the mdo. So let’s say the revenues are obviously pretty volatile. Given that sales, the washing capacity gets. Washing capacity. Clarity is not there. But broadly if you look at let’s say FY26, what sort of revenues would you expect for the mining MBO from Scala and CCL project separately maybe around in the range of 300 to 400 crore range. Because per month we are executing around 1 lakh tons in Tasra.
Nani Aravind
We may execute from April. So the tent Most to around 200, 220 crore roughly we can execute for the next year. And CCL also we may execute around 50 to 80 crore of revenue. 0.4 MT NDP is the initial capacity we have to execute. So to get that maybe 300 to 400 between we can execute the MDO business.
Anupam Gupta
Okay. And your washery for which groundbreaking had happened. What is the execution timeline? For that.
Nani Aravind
By 26 we have to, by September 26th we have to complete the washering. We have already acquired the all the required permissions and everything. So major equipment designs are also completed and we have ordered, we have identified, finalized the vendors and we have ordered some equipment also. So remaining are also under negotiation and discussion. Most likely ordering will happen in next two to three months.
Anupam Gupta
Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Understand. That’s all for myself. Thank you. Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Deepak Podar from Sophia Capital. Please go ahead.
Deepak Poddar
Hello, I’m audible sir.
Nani Aravind
Yes sir.
Deepak Poddar
Yeah. Thank you very much for the opportunity. So just first up I just wanted to understand the debt side. How, how are we looking to. I mean in terms of debt. How, how, how how do we look the outlook.
Nani Aravind
Sir as of today we are having fund exposure of around 700 crore. 714 crore resource utilization. And going forward we are executing this CAPEX requirement. I mean the Washeri requirement in the Power MacBook.
So there may be requirement of around 700 to 750 crore capacity addition in next two years. So roughly by 28 we’ll have roughly around 1200 core addition will happen. In terms of capex is concerned term loans will be added to that and working capital side maybe another 100150 crore will be added to that.
Deepak Poddar
Okay.
Nani Aravind
Projects so roughly, maybe 800 to 2000 crore roughly will touch by 28.
Deepak Poddar
So 2000 crores dead by FY28. That’s what we are we are looking at.
Nani Aravind
Yes.
Deepak Poddar
And which is currently.
Nani Aravind
No, no it’s not debt. Sorry. It is a capex. Total debt will be around 500 only we are adding to the capex 500 plus another so around 800 will be added to that 800 plus another 7001500 to 1600 will be. Is it roughly the debt number by 28?
Deepak Poddar
So 1500 to 1600 crore debt by FY28. Right. And which is currently 600 crores right cross debt.
Nani Aravind
Yeah. Seven hundred and fourteen. Yeah.
Deepak Poddar
Seven hundred and forty crores debt right now and it will be about 15 to 1600 crores by FY28. And this addition, I mean each year it will be like 200300 crores. I mean the addition will be on the phase manner or will there be…
Nani Aravind
The CAPEX requirement is roughly around 700750 crore. In that 240 we have equity UIP funds we raised. So 450 to 500 will be added in next two years plus the regular capex. The new orders we received so around 100 crore every year we regular the capex will be added to that.
Deepak Poddar
Okay. Okay. So so 750 croes is the capex for next two years. So out of that 400500 crores debt will be added in next two years, right?
Nani Aravind
Yes.
Deepak Poddar
That’s the right understanding.
Nani Aravind
Yes. Yes.
Deepak Poddar
Okay. Okay, okay. Okay. I. I got it. And in terms of execution, I mean this year FY26 we are looking at 7000 to 7500 crores. Kind of a revenue, right? FY26. Out of which how much is coming from MDO in this year itself? FY26.
Nani Aravind
FY26 we are projecting maybe 300 to 400 between. Depends on the momentum of the on the address intake from that sales. So we are projecting 300 to 400 in between.
Deepak Poddar
300 to 400. And you mentioned by FY28 optimally MDO can do 2000 crores of revenue. And so at optimal levels what sort of EBITDA margin one should look at in MDO? Is it close to 20%.
Nani Aravind
Both together average of 20 to 22% we can take up. Sir, we have higher margins in Tesla and lower margin in KBP. Weighted average of around 2,020.
Deepak Poddar
And this year earlier we were targeting I think close to 5500 crores of execution. Now given the nine month the execution that we have done, what would be our revised target for this year? FY25.
Nani Aravind
We may touch this year around 5000 to 5200 between sir, roughly. And we are as of nine months we have executed around 3400 crores.
Deepak Poddar
Correct.
Nani Aravind
We are, we are short by 1800 crore. And the water utility certifications are pending. Roughly around 200 crore works are there in the WAP that certification happened. And another 1600-1700 crore we can execute in the Q3 fourth quarter. Actually for the both government and private sector clients are likely to expedite the certifications and payments. So we can able to touch at least 25 growth for the current year. So 5,200 crore we are targeting to reach how much last point I missed 5200. 5200. So fourth quarter we are looking at 1700 close plus kind of execution rate. Yes, because already some certification spending from water division. So that is already there. 150. It was supposed to happen in Q3 but there is a delay in terms of certification because of the timelines expiry of Jalga mission. So now the recent budget also extended the timelines. They’ll release the funds in April.
Deepak Poddar
Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Understood. And in terms of order book accretion we are looking at around 10,000 crores of order inflow in next year. FY26.
Nani Aravind
Right.
Deepak Poddar
Okay. Okay. Okay. That clarifies. I think that would be from my side all the way. Best to you. Thank you sir.
Nani Aravind
Thank you.
Operator
The next question is from the line of Manthan from Nexus Equities. Please go ahead.
Manthan Jhaveri
Hello.
Nani Aravind
Hello.
Manthan Jhaveri
Am I audible?
Nani Aravind
Yes sir.
Manthan Jhaveri
So I. I think earlier we were targeting order inflows of around 10,000 crores to 12,000 crores for this fiscal year. So now till December I think we have just received 4200 crores of order. And what you said that we might receive another 3000. 3000 crores of order in the remaining three months.
Nani Aravind
So 973 crore. We were in L1 in road project. So we are waiting for the LY. So that will also be added to that.
Manthan Jhaveri
Okay. So overall how much order inflows that we expect?
Nani Aravind
It’s between 7,000 to 8,000 sir.
Manthan Jhaveri
So because earlier we were targeting something 10,000 to 12,000. So are there other delays in order bidding or some orders will be spilled over the next fiscal year.
S.K. Kodandaramaiah
Actually what happened was that you know this election process. Another is some of the tenders got postponed. Like the major BOV tenders. It got postponed by five to six months. Then karate it was the earlier projection. We started long back. Six months back or eight months back. No, only they have started some tentridge work and the main plot has been awarded. And then you know there were some ordering itself on BHL and lnt. There was some delays by the utilities. This is a major reason for that.
Manthan Jhaveri
Okay, but then so next year we are again order interest of 10,000 crores. Roughly. Now if I consider that 4,000 crores were which were actually going to receive in 25 will be received in FY26. So next year also incremental order will be just 6,000 crores. So the pace of order interest is decreasing despite you being. Despite Dale having such a strong order book. You said that LNT is also having strong order book. Even Adani also. Then why we can’t target much aggressive order inflows. Because our order inflows has been stagnant since last nine to ten months.
S.K. Kodandaramaiah
No, I agree with you. But basically what we have to understand, there can be a time lag between taking decisions. And then some of the places, you know there is a engineering issues. Are there more than that. There will layout issues. And then you know basic approvals will be there. These are the things we generally delay seed. Therefore we have been doing well in certain big ticket items like you know, previous years. And of course this year onwards the big ticket tickets what we are hoping for the bop it is postponement and all that is there or Optimus was making 10 to 12,000 crores earlier.
Manthan Jhaveri
Okay. So for this year as you said the previous participant that we are quite confident of achieving 5000 crores to 5200 crores over top line. Is that so? We stick to that.
S.K. Kodandaramaiah
Because we have demonstrated last year also the capacity execute fourth quarter as they said in the building and the certification process will be better in the customer also because he wants to dispose of his funds and then bill it also payment also the up water.
Nani Aravind
UP government is up find the bills only when there is a fund available in system. So they are holding the certification. So we are recognizing it as a wrp. Okay. They allard the funds they are certifying and based on the certification we are taking. So that that way we we are confident of getting the certification by March and we can able to reach our target.
Manthan Jhaveri
Okay, so. So you are. What you are saying is that 200 crores is just.200 crores of all revenue. Booking is just delayed because of certification. As soon as you will receive the certificate that 200 crores of order revenues will straight away come. Is that correct?
Nani Aravind
Yes.
Manthan Jhaveri
Okay. And so since that we might need to borrow in next one or two years. So we are as of now we are working on a patent margin of roughly 6%. So we expect that our PAT margin will be 6% net net 5 and a half to 6%. Or will that come down?
Nani Aravind
Basically the finance cost we are under the control and that’s why we are able to manage the 6.5 to 6 6.8 level of that margin. Now if the EBITDA margin is improved then automatically this margin also will go up. So the main constraint is happening at this EBITDA margin level only. So as and when we get the order get I mean the profitable address added to the portfolio EBITDA will automatically go up and your pat marginals will go up year on year.
Unidentified Speaker
We are well within the planned number and compared to the previous numbers also we have less finance cost. But going forward if we go for the because we are majorly new windows we are executing there is no working capital requirement for that. So only EPC project if I bid then I have to go for the more working capital and my finance cost will be more. And if I add more capex to my balance sheet. Then again I have to add more interest costs. So so far we are managing well within that. So it’s again the future depends on our growth pattern. And BOP works probably we may have to incur more finance costs. And so the path levels will undergo a change.
Manthan Jhaveri
Okay. And MDO revenues were 34 crores in this quarter. So which was like a significant jump from previous quarter. So we can we expect such a QOQ jump on the NDO revenues Or is that some like again in MD or MD also H2 is heavier than H1. How does it work for MD orders project?
Nani Aravind
Actually this. This ready platter readily available. So we started mining because earlier some other Ramdivo promoter has done this expression. And so we were readily available and we are doing the building directly. So now we have to. There is no appointment date. We are not received so far. And but sale. Sale is giving as and when the available quantity it depends on the availability of the washing capacity outside. So from April onwards we may get a pointed date. And then it’s a binding agreement between the sale and us for lifting the material as for the contractual tabs.
So based on that we are hoping that you know every month we can raise a bill to sail as per the agreement conditions.
Manthan Jhaveri
Okay. And of this. Of this X of MD order book of 1718000 crores. How much is slow moving or this all are like executed executable. In next 2 to 3 years. The current 18000 crores of order book X of MDS.
Nani Aravind
Except the FGD of 4600 crore roughly will be the FGD orders. Non moving rest of the order is running only 14000 crore roughly. Right.
Manthan Jhaveri
So this 1818000 crores includes everyday slow moving order of 44200 of Adani. Correct?
Nani Aravind
Yes. Yes. Yes.
Manthan Jhaveri
Okay. That. That is 14.14000cr in what in you plan to execute in next one, two years or three years. Means this current.
Nani Aravind
Average average you can two two and a half years. 40%. 40% is the conversion rate. Yeah.
Manthan Jhaveri
Okay. Okay. Fair enough. That’s it. That’s it for my.
Operator
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Anush Mukashi from Yagna Academy. Please go ahead.
Anush Mokashi
Hello. Hello. Am I audible? Sir.
Nani Aravind
Yes sir.
Anush Mokashi
Yes. Thank you for the opportunity. So my question is about this recent development about nuclear energy mission. So just wanted to understand what benefits do power make see from this. And basically do power make have the capability to develop these small modular reactors. And it’s not like Would you consider entering into this segment?
S.K. Kodandaramaiah
Yeah. That is a government initiative already. Jindal started a joint venture thing. They are going to start and then you know ntp then this one Nuclear Power Corporation. They have started a joint venture. Idea is to put 200, 250 megawatt sets. Of course they’re all that has to be developed and all. Of course we have recently taken a job of 550 crores in Kaido for the main plant work and all we are looking at it. But it is going to be a challenge because the technology is there then the sourcing is there and then a lot of aspects are there. But one good thing is that these. These plants will run lot of time. 30, 40 years. And it makes sense. And that we are just thinking we are not taken any call so far.
Anush Mokashi
Okay. And. And just one next question was like you said the 200 crores of revenue booking has been delayed to Q4. So is the cost also delayed? I mean in the past booking is also delayed to Q4. Is it currently booked in Q3 only?
Nani Aravind
No, because when we recognize the WIP it automatically comes into the revenue part. Sir. So some back to back contractors are there in this project. So wherever the back to back contractors are there, the cost has not been booked and revenue has also not constituted.
Wherever direct execution is concerned. We have already recognized the WFP for the balance portion. Wherever back to back contractors are there which for that we have not recognized the both cost and because we have not received the bills from the clients subcontractors also.
Anush Mokashi
Okay. Thank you. Thank you sir. That’s it from my. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Kam Jen from Lotus Asset Managers. Please go ahead.
Kamlesh Jain
Yeah. Thanks for the opportunity. So just one wanted your thought on the fact that recently Ambuja has come out with the tenders to update their cement plants.
Operator
I’m sorry, we are not able to hear you clearly. Sir, please increase the volume.
Kamlesh Jain
Yeah. Yeah. So am I audible?
Operator
Yes, please.
Kamlesh Jain
Yeah. So sir, just wanted to have your thoughts on the development that Ambuja has come out with the tenders for some of their cement plants to operate on MDO basis or on contract basis or outsourcing. So as we are looking to diversify into other sectors. So are we would we be pursuing that particular opportunity going forward?
Nani Aravind
So is this a capital consumption power plants which you are referring by the approach?
Kamlesh Jain
No, I am talking about the entire.
Nani Aravind
Okay. So now we are pursuing Dalmia Cement, Bihar and Andhra and Tamil NAD also they are actually planning to start the Capture copper power plant, solar power plant and wind power plants. So there they want to join as the 26% partner. And and we will install the required megawatts of solar power plant and wind power plants. And we can to supply for 25 years of PPA. They will enter the Dalmia. So that negotiations are going on. We have given our quotes for them. So we’re waiting for their confirmation on that. Sir. So there is a new solar business which we are actually looking at to start with future for entering into the green hydrogen business. So we want to have this kind of experience requirement is there for the solar power. So in that plan we are in in touch with them.
Kamlesh Jain
I was referring to the to operating the entire cement plant. So like Adani has come out with the tenders like to operate their entire cement plant. Some of their cement plants on on a pilot the…
Nani Aravind
Aisle refineries and with Portland. But for. But if that kind of work is there probably we can also explore that opportunity. And we will also look into that.
S.K. Kodandaramaiah
IELTS Refineries is an option. BPCL is coming to 60,000 crore investment in Vina. Then HPCL is expanding it. We have got some experience. We have done some of the jobs in relays and other places also. Therefore it is an option because the same expertise we have to deploy it and do the work only thing most things in quality and safety issues in be there. But do we have the potential or do we look. Are we looking to operate the entire cement plant like the grinding clinker making capacity all that we can operate a power plant which is highly sophisticated. And that with a control room operation.
Like you know. We have started working in some of the windmill plants in the NMDC and then JSPL for the steel plant and all it is an option which is which you can explore it. If we can get a reasonable this one returns on that.
And there is going to be captive power plant in any cement plant. And then the kiln operation and the other auxiliaries and all those things. You know the skills which are required and all only the operating characteristics say production characteristics.
And then the various parameters in the cement plant that we have to get used to it. And that can be is a question of taking a correct call and then going about it. And as on today, we are reasonably well satisfied in the O initiatives.
Whatever we are taken. And they continue to be more opportunities which will come up because the annual capacity of 8 to 10,000 megawatts in the next four to five years.
Kamlesh Jain
And lastly sir, I’m not aware whether you have articulated about that but on the TAFARA minds like we have seen a very suboptimal operations from sale so how confident are we to execute those orders in the coming times?
Nani Aravind
As of now we have not received appointed date in Kasara project so it’s not a binding obligation at this moment from the sale Also to lift the material from April onwards we are getting the appointed date so then the contract clauses will kick in. So it is a binding on them to lift the material irrespective of the capacity is there or not outside. So we are. We are. So it said the contract is protecting our rights so there is no problem in terms of achieving a target for the next year.
Kamlesh Jain
Thanks a lot sir.
Operator
Thank you ladies and gentlemen. That was the last question for the day. I would now like to hand the conference over to the management for closing comments.
S.K. Kodandaramaiah
Yeah, thanks for your participation. And even if the inquisitive these were requirements brought out it is a very interesting discussions we had. I think power sector is highly bullish and infrastructure we are well established now the drinking water, railways, roads and other related projects and then Metro maintenance shops etc. And naturally business should look up DHL, the autos and LNT is also coming up and there are many new areas which will come up certain and this should we continue to be aggressive in our approach in both marketing and execution.
Exceeding 5000 crores in this year certainly. And then you know coming year about 10,000 crores as we said, you know that is looking at some of these UOP opportunities which are major items and then the non power sector jobs which are established in railways, roads and then material handling, coal handling, the mindset development etc. Therefore let us look into that way and then as far as the capacity the company is concerned to augment the execution capacity that is always there and that we can do it. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you members of the management on behalf of Nirmal Bang institutional equities. That concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us and you may now disconnect your lines. Thank you.