Oriental Carbon & Chemicals Limited (NSE: OCCL) Q4 2025 Earnings Call dated May. 28, 2025
Corporate Participants:
Akshat Goenka — Joint Managing Director
Anurag Jain — Chief Financial Officer
Analysts:
Aditya Khetan — Analyst
Rohit Mehra — Analyst
Garvita Jain — Analyst
Gautam Rajesh — Analyst
Karan Sharma — Analyst
Suraj Khaitan — Analyst
Rohan Dhoot — Analyst
Prisha Rathi — Analyst
Saha Merchant — Analyst
Presentation:
Operator
Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to OCCL Limited Q4 and FY25 Earnings Conference Call. This conference call may contain forward-looking statements about the company, which are based on the beliefs, opinions and expectations of this call, as on date of this call. These statements are not the guarantees of future performance and involve risks and uncertainties that are difficult to predict. [Operator Instructions] Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Akshat Goenka, Promoter and Joint MD of OCCL Limited. Thank you and over to you, sir.
Akshat Goenka — Joint Managing Director
Good evening and a very warm welcome to everyone. Along with me, I have Mr. Anurag Jain, CFO and SGA, our Investor Relations advisors. We have uploaded our results and investor presentation for the quarter ended 31st March 2025 on the Stock Exchanges and Company website. Hope each one of you had a chance to go through the same. The global insoluble sulphur industry continues to face headwinds with demand impacted by microeconomic uncertainties and a slowdown in key markets, particularly in Europe. While industry-wide capacity utilization remains below optimal levels, we are beginning to see early signs of stabilization. The global market is expected to grow at about 2%-3% over the near term.
Competitive intensity, especially from Chinese suppliers, continues to exert pricing pressure. However, the current prices are quite low and we expect them to increase going ahead. Exports have also been impacted by elevated freight costs driven by ongoing geopolitical uncertainties and disruptions in key shipping routes. The recommendation for imposition of antidumping duty on imports of insoluble sulphur from China and Japan is under consideration of the Finance Ministry. It has already been cleared by the DGTR and we are hopeful of the imposition of this anti-dumping duty happening in the month of June and this will help in shoring up the domestic price to sustainable levels as well as restoring our P&L to respectable levels of margin.
Going forward, we will continue to focus on product innovation by offering customized grades that meet stringent technical specifications of global tire manufacturers We will drive sustainability by enhancing production efficiency and reducing our carbon footprint. In fact, we have renewed our responsible care certification for another three years. So that was a very good achievement in the last quarter. We will continue to focus on cost optimization. We have again been successful in doing a bunch of cost optimization in both raw material as well as fixed costs.
To conclude, while the industry continues to navigate a complex and evolving landscape, we remain confident in the resilience of our business and the long-term demand for insoluble sulphur. Our strategic priorities are cost optimization, sharp focus on expanding our global reach, deepening customer relationships, driving product innovation and operating sustainably. With a strong foundation in place and a clear roadmap ahead, we are well positioned to create sustainable value for all stakeholders in the years to come. The company has faced similar industry challenges in the past and has successfully navigated through them with resilience and strategic focus. Backed by a strong financial foundation, operational agility and long-standing customer relationships, we remain confident in our ability to emerge stronger and capture growth as the environment stabilizes. I will now hand over the line to Mr. Anurag Jain.
Anurag Jain — Chief Financial Officer
Thank you, Akshat. Now I will take you all through the financials of the company. First, I would like to share an update for Q4 FY25. Total income stood at INR109 crores and witnessed a growth of 12% quarter on quarter driven by improved realisation of insoluble sulphur and sulphuric acid and a pickup in volumes. EBITDA stood at INR20 crores and witnessed a growth of 23% quarter on quarter. EBITDA margins stood at 18.1% which was 16.6% during Q3 FY25. Profit after tax stood at INR9 crores. PAT margins stood at 8%. The improvement in profitability was supported by moderation in freight costs which started to ease compared to the elevated levels seen previously.
As far as the financial year FY25 results are concerned, the numbers that I am sharing are for nine months because the chemical business was transferred to OCCL Limited with effect from 1st July 2024. Total income stood at INR309 crores. EBITDA stood at INR55 crores. EBITDA margins were 17.9%. PAT stood at INR21 crores which is a margin of 8% and debt to equity for the year stood at a comfortable 0.14x. With this, I would like to open the floor for questions and answers.
Questions and Answers:
Operator
Thank you very much. [Operator Instructions] First question is from the line of Aditya Khetan from SMIFS Institutional Equities. Please go ahead.
Aditya Khetan
Yes, just a couple of questions. Sir, first is on the power and fuel cost and on the freight cost. Sir, we believe like this year in FY25, can you give the figure for freight cost for FY25? Like I believe historically we were at 6%-7% versus what would be the figure for FY25?
Anurag Jain
FY ’25 is about 9%.
Aditya Khetan
9%, okay. And sir, any sort of a guidance like we have like with the reduction in the Red Sea prices and all. We expect like this to come down to 5%-6%?
Anurag Jain
Now, they have moderated and in the last quarter they came down from 9% for the year to 7.2% for the quarter ended March ’25. So, they will come down to around this level and this is the level which is continuing as of now.
Aditya Khetan
Okay, okay. So, sir, if suppose this freight cost normalizes, so we can see some 2%-3% more improvement from the current quarter margin?
Anurag Jain
So, in the current quarter it has already come down from the average of 9% to 7%. If it comes down further obviously, it will add to the EBITDA margins.
Aditya Khetan
Got it. Sir, any figure that we have like for calendar year ’24, what would be the global, insoluble sulphur demand and breakup of that into countries like Japan, US and China and India?
Anurag Jain
So, there are no, as far as India is concerned, I can say that the demand in India is about 22,000-23,000 tons. More about 23,000 tons is what we expect to be the demand this year.
Aditya Khetan
Sir, what would be the global demand?
Anurag Jain
23,000 tons is the demand that we expect in the current year as far as India is concerned.
Aditya Khetan
Correct, sir. And what would be the global demand?
Anurag Jain
I don’t have the exact numbers because we have old figures which have changed and there are no published figures. But I believe the Indian demand could be about 8%-9% of the global demand. 8% or thereabout.
Aditya Khetan
Okay. Sir, with this anti-dumping duty, if it is imposed in June, any sort of numbers like we can share how much a jump in margins or in absolute EBITDA, how much it can be added? If we can share any sort of a quantum number.
Anurag Jain
That is very difficult to share but I can tell you what the DGTR has recommended. What DGTR has recommended to the Finance Ministry is $307 of anti-dumping duty on imports from China and $257 of anti-dumping duty for imports from Japan. So, this is what has been recommended by DGTR.
Now, obviously, depending on customer and what rate they are already importing from China and what are we offering them, it will not translate straightly to this number. But there should definitely be an increase in realization once this duty is imposed. It is very difficult to quantify just now. We will get into negotiation for the next quarter in the month of June and only then we will be able to see how much will be the actual translation into realization that we can get.
Aditya Khetan
Okay, got it. Sir, just one last question. Sir, when you look at this year, the numbers have been quite muted and for the next two to three years, we are expecting near 2%-3% global demand growth. In the sense of this, how do you see our numbers to move on? From this fiscal number, will there be any improvement in margins? Suppose anti-dumping duty is not imposed, how much imports are we expecting from other countries for the next two years?
Anurag Jain
Currently, our market share is already down to around 55%-58% in the domestic market. I do not see any significant reduction in domestic market share even if the duty is not imposed. However, if the duty is imposed, there could be a positive addition to our market share.
Aditya Khetan
Got it. Sir, any sort of number guidance for the next two years like margins and EBITDA, where could it be from the current level?
Anurag Jain
Normally, we do not give forecasts and it is very difficult to do so especially in the current scenario. What I can tell you is that our margins in Q4 were significantly better than what they were for the whole year. So, if you look at that as a guidance, I think that could be a good number to begin with.
Aditya Khetan
Got it, sir. Thank you, sir.
Anurag Jain
And then on that, we can add the positives of the anti-dumping.
Aditya Khetan
Got it. Thank you, sir
Operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Rohit from SK Securities. Please go ahead.
Rohit Mehra
Hello, sir. Good evening. My question is about the prices of insoluble sulphur. So, correct me if I am wrong that the prices of insoluble sulphur has moved from INR135 per kilogram to INR165 per kilogram from February to now. Is that right?
Anurag Jain
See, for the current year, the volumes have not grown significantly. There has been insignificant growth over the last year.
Rohit Mehra
Okay, sir. How have freight costs evolved in Q1 FY26 so far and have you seen any corresponding improvements in margins as a result?
Anurag Jain
So, freight costs were at their highest in Q2 and obviously because we are exporting, so we felt the impact of the freight costs in Q3 as well. As I have pointed out earlier, in Q4 they have come down. And for example, the freight costs for the year were at about 9%. Now they are down to about 7% for the quarter, which is the same as the same quarter last year. So, they have come down to the level that they were in the last year and therefore there has been a consequent improvement in margins as well.
Rohit Mehra
Got it. So, the freight cost has now stabilized, right?
Anurag Jain
Currently, yes. Currently, they look to be stabilized.
Rohit Mehra
Okay, okay. That’s it from my side. Thank you, sir.
Operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Garvita from Seven Islands PMS. Please go-ahead.
Garvita Jain
Hello, sir. Good evening. My question is about the prices of insoluble sulphur. So, correct me if I am wrong that the prices of insoluble sulphur has moved from INR135 per kilogram to INR165 per kilogram from February to now. Is that right?
Anurag Jain
Sorry, I didn’t get the exact numbers that you were saying. So, can you please repeat?
Garvita Jain
Sorry, sir.
Anurag Jain
Could you repeat? The numbers that you were saying, can you please repeat that?
Garvita Jain
Sir, could you please tell me what is the current insoluble sulphur price?
Anurag Jain
So, the current insoluble sulphur price is not something which is very scientific because the insoluble sulphur prices will vary from region to region. From India, they are very less today. Export market will depend on the exchange rate which is changing very quickly. And then my average price will again depend on the percentage of sales that I have in different geographies with different rates. But to give you a flavor, internationally, China is importing into India at about $900. Then there are areas where there are $1400 prices there. There are areas where the price is $1600.
Garvita Jain
Sir, can you please correct me? The information which I have according to that in India, the insoluble sulphur price trend has been, in February, it was approximately INR135 per kilogram. And currently, it is around INR165 per kilogram. Is that right?
Anurag Jain
No, no, no. That’s wrong information. It is significantly lower.
Garvita Jain
Okay, okay. So I can take $900 per kilogram is dumping of China to India, right?
Anurag Jain
So, currently, if you look at the average price of import from China, that will be somewhere around INR95 is the average import price of insoluble sulphur from China.
Garvita Jain
From China. Alright. And, sir, going forward, what could be the trend of the realization of insoluble sulphur?
Anurag Jain
Except for the anti-dumping duty that we are fighting for in India, internationally, there are no indications of any significant price movement which might happen. The price that we tend to look at is by correcting our basket, correcting where we sell. And, of course, if the anti-dumping duty kicks in, that will be another increase in our price.
Garvita Jain
Okay, okay. Alright. And, sir, could you please give me the number on the spread between COGS and realization?
Anurag Jain
Sorry?
Garvita Jain
I mean, if you could give me what is the gross margin we have?
Anurag Jain
Gross margin? By gross margin, you mean the margin over the variable cost?
Garvita Jain
Right. I am asking for the spread, sir.
Anurag Jain
Well, this is not a number that we share because this is competition-sensitive information of how much margin we have because that could be used. So, that is not a number that we share.
Garvita Jain
Sir Can I expect gross margin to be around 60% to 65%. If you could justify it.
Anurag Jain
I do not appreciate the gross margin. It is a competitive sensitive information.
Garvita Jain
I would not like to share the gross margin figures, please. This is competitive-sensitive information.
Anurag Jain
Alright. Not an issue, sir. You can look at my balance sheet and you can derive the gross margins from there. But, that will be a mixture of sulfuric acid and insoluble sulfur. I am at a loss here. You please try to understand. Because my competitors make so many products, so their gross margins are buried deep into the mixture of so many products.
Garvita Jain
Not an issue. That’s fine. Sir, if you could please give me the full-year number for the full-year turnover and EBITDA impact?
Anurag Jain
So, I can give you the full-year turnover because that is very easily gettable. The full-year turnover was including the chemical business turnover for the first quarter, which was in Oriental Carbon and Chemicals Limited, the total revenue was INR413 crores.
Garvita Jain
INR413 crores. With EBITDA margin of.
Anurag Jain
It could be around INR74 crores-INR75 crores.
Garvita Jain
INR74 crores EBITDA. And PAT would be? It could be around INR74 crores-INR75 crores.
Anurag Jain
INR74 crores EBITDA. And PAT would be? We can’t calculate the PAT on this.
Garvita Jain
Yes, that’s fine. Thank you so much, sir. That’s all.
Operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Gautam Rajesh from Everflow Partners. Please go ahead.
Gautam Rajesh
Thank you for this opportunity. I have a few questions. My first question was, how do you see the global cost curve for the insoluble sulfur look like? How does the cost of OCCL compare versus the Chinese players in terms of cost of production?
Akshat Goenka
Our cost of production is amongst the lowest in the world.
Gautam Rajesh
Is it comparable to the Chinese one, sir?
Akshat Goenka
Yes. Definitely.
Gautam Rajesh
Okay, but would they be cheaper than us?
Akshat Goenka
We have no issue whatsoever in the cost of production.
Gautam Rajesh
Okay, it’s always the realization that’s the problem, yes.
Akshat Goenka
Realization and fixed cost.
Gautam Rajesh
Understood, understood. So the next question was, what are your views on the impact of antidumping duties? I know they recommended a particular amount. How much would it affect the company’s financials? And how long would it take, like if it hits in June?
Anurag Jain
See, according to the timeline, it should be notified within the month of June. We are very hopeful that it will be notified. And once notified, it will be for five years. It will definitely have a positive impact in terms of sales price as well as to some extent domestic quantities as well. But it will be very difficult to correctly estimate the exact quantum until and unless we finalize the contracts post the imposition of the duties.
Gautam Rajesh
Okay, post the anti-dumping duties, you could give a clearer picture? Okay, and my final question, sir. With higher tariffs on China versus India, is there any big export opportunity for our products in the U.S.?
Akshat Goenka
No, because China is not really present in the U.S.
Gautam Rajesh
Okay, so we don’t see the duties affect. What about the European sector? Does this give us more opportunities or contracts coming from other countries? Because China is being imposed by a lot of countries.
Akshat Goenka
China today is predominantly present in Southeast Asia. China and Southeast Asia.
Gautam Rajesh
Understood.
Akshat Goenka
Today, they are not a direct player in the West. And after anti-dumping, things will change a bit in India as well.
Gautam Rajesh
Okay, understood. Thank you, sir. That will be my set of questions. All the best.
Operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Karan Sharma from KS Capital. Please go-ahead.
Karan Sharma
Hi, sir. Thanks for the opportunity. I have one question. There are several global auto OEMs which are issuing weak guidance. So what level of impact do we foresee on our insoluble sulphur export volumes in near term?
Anurag Jain
We are already sitting at some export volumes. We do not anticipate a big increase in Europe where they are giving weak guidance. So that has already been taken care of in our projections or in our budgets. Anyway, in long term basis, we are only looking at 2%-3% growth in demand of tires and therefore of insoluble sulphur. So, we are not too much. As of now, this is something which we have factored in.
Karan Sharma
Okay, got it. Thank you so much, sir.
Operator
The next question is from the line of Suraj Khaitan from SKP Securities. Please go ahead.
Suraj Khaitan
Hello. Thank you for the opportunity. So, my question is regarding the raw material prices. Particularly like the trench. How do you see it right now and going forward?
Anurag Jain
Sort of raw material. Most of the raw materials are having stable prices. Except for sulphur, which has gone up since February. And it is currently a little stable at around $300. And we were hoping that it should come back down from May. But it has not come back. And it might extend these high prices for the next one or two months also. And the guidance that we have got from sulphur manufacturers is that this year the sulphur prices are expected to remain on a higher level. On a $200 plus level for the year.
Suraj Khaitan
And sir, what about coating oil prices?
Anurag Jain
More or less they are stable.
Suraj Khaitan
Okay. Coating oil prices are stable, right?
Anurag Jain
Yes.
Suraj Khaitan
And do we hedge our raw material prices by any means?
Anurag Jain
No, it is not possible to hedge sulphur prices or oil prices. The only way we can do it is to increase stock. But then there is a limited debt. So, there is no way to hedge prices.
Suraj Khaitan
We do not see any impact. In fact, we have been in talks with our customers and currently we do not see any impact of tariff on our business with America.
Anurag Jain
We do not see any impact. In fact, we have been in talks with our customers that currently we do not see any impact of tariff on our — on our business with America.
Suraj Khaitan
Okay. And is then capex plan going-forward for the financial year ’26?
Anurag Jain
Only the normal capex that we do. I mean there is no special capex that is planned except for the normal capex.
Suraj Khaitan
There is some maintenance capex.
Anurag Jain
Maintenance capex, yes.
Suraj Khaitan
Okay. And can you quantify it and what will be the amount.
Anurag Jain
I do not have that number with me currently. Usually, it is in the range of INR10 crores to INR12-INR13 crores.
Suraj Khaitan
Okay, okay, thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Rohan Dhoot from Dhoot Industrial Finance Limited. Please go ahead.
Rohan Dhoot
Thank you for the opportunity. I just had a couple of questions. Is it possible to share a volume growth figure quarter on quarter?
Anurag Jain
For the year, I have indicated that we have had not a very significant growth over last year. So it is roughly the same with an odd percentage increase over last year as far as the volumes are concerned.
Rohan Dhoot
Okay. And is it possible to share a capacity utilization figure? Blended one is fine as well.
Anurag Jain
So, the capacity utilization this year has been around 70%.
Rohan Dhoot
Okay. And the margin like this quarter we bounced back I think blended was around 17.4% EBITDA margins. Is it possible to sustain if we think that the pricing, not taking into account the benefits of the anti-dumping or pricing to increase from here on? Do you think like 17% odd EBITDA margins is sustainable going forward?
Anurag Jain
One of the major factors which contributed to the increase in the margins of course is correction of freight. And if everything remains as they are except for the minor glitch that we have on account of increase in sulphur prices, I think this is something that we are looking at for the current operation also currently. But it is very difficult to say what will happen in the future.
Rohan Dhoot
And is it also possible to share the EBITDA per ton value of this quarter by any chance? Like both the sulfuric acid and insoluble sulfur, you can’t give that?
Anurag Jain
So, you have the EBITDA with you. I cannot share the EBITDA as I said earlier also that this is something I would not like to share currently because of competition. I am so sorry. You can have the blended EBITDA with you.
Rohan Dhoot
Okay. No issue. No issue. I just wanted to understand something. One more thing. Is that possible? What’s the maximum capacity utilization we can go up to for insoluble sulfur?
Anurag Jain
We can go up to 100%.
Rohan Dhoot
Okay. Okay. Thank you.
Anurag Jain
Yeah, of course.
Operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Prisha Rathi from NM Securities. Please go ahead.
Prisha Rathi
Thank you for the opportunity. I have two questions. So, my first question is… What were the key drivers of the sequential growth in Q4 FY25? So, was it primarily led by improved pricing, higher volumes or a combination of both?
Anurag Jain
So, the primary driver was, of course, one of the primary drive, if you look at, is freight. The other is we had some improvement in margin of sulfuric acid. So that was another thing. So, these were the two primary drives we had. Of course, there was an increase in realization also driven by marginal increase in prices and by positive exchange rate. So, there was an increase in realization, number one. There was a decrease in freight costs, number two. And we had a better margin profile in sulfuric acid as well.
Prisha Rathi
Okay, got it. And my second question is, given our strong balance sheet, how are other players in the industry positioned financially? Are many of them heavily leveraged or they also have this strength to withstand this challenging environment?
Anurag Jain
All our competitors have strong balance sheets. Of the significant competitors, there are two in China, one in Japan, and one is multinational by the name of Flexis. All have strong balance sheets.
Prisha Rathi
Got it. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. [Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of Saha Merchant, an individual investor. Please go ahead.
Saha Merchant
Hi, thanks for taking my questions. The first question is that the notes to financials say that the other expenses for the current quarter include a INR3.5 crores charge incurred for the demerger implementation. So is that a charge taken in this March 2025 quarter? And would it be correct to assume that if it wasn’t for this kind of exceptional charge, then our EBITDA margin would have been higher to that extent?
Anurag Jain
That is right. That is right. These are majorly stamp duty charges that we paid during the quarter. And if that was not there, then our other expenses would be less to that extent.
Saha Merchant
So that’s a good 3% plus bump up in the EBITDA margins normalized for that, right?
Anurag Jain
Yes.
Saha Merchant
Okay. I was looking at the dividend that we paid out. So even if I take the last three quarters earnings, we’ve done a payout ratio of about 35%. So, I was just wondering why the deviation from our stated policy of 50% of that, especially given that our debt levels were already pretty comfortable and modest.
Anurag Jain
So obviously, our stated policy does consider the fact that we have to look at the net cash flows, the actual cash flows, including anticipated increase in working capital requirements, capexes, and if we need to shore up funds for other requirements and then give out the dividend. And we have followed our policy and accordingly decided on the dividend.
Saha Merchant
Okay. So, the next question is that given the very long, arduous and strict approval process that tire manufacturers have when it comes to approving vendors, how did the Chinese insoluble suppliers, how are they able to make inroads into the Indian market so easily?
Anurag Jain
No, no, they followed the same long, arduous route. They did not have any shortcuts. The only fact is, that they have been getting their approvals. Then over the last two, three years, and then suddenly when they were sitting on a lot of excess capacities, they started dumping material into India. In 2023, ’23, ’24, ’25, they have been consistently reducing prices. In fact, they started the whole thing in 2022 only. And it was only 2023 that it started hurting us badly. And then, therefore, we had to gather the data for the full year before applying for antidumping duty. So, we had to wait for a full year. And we could only apply by the end of the first quarter of 2024. Because that is the requirement for anti-dumping duty. Even since then, they have further reduced the prices by more than $300, $400 on an average basis. So that is something which has happened over a period of time.
Saha Merchant
Right. So where would they be placed on a quality scale compared to us?
Anurag Jain
Look, their quality is okay. That is why the tire companies are buying them. Their quality is now acceptable to them.
Saha Merchant
Right. So given this whole influx of Chinese players and their large capacities, would you say that the technology to produce insoluble sulphur, which was mainly concentrated earlier with just three players, is it becoming more commoditized rather than exclusive?
Anurag Jain
It is very difficult to say whether it is becoming commoditized because the number of players are not increasing. Right? Even in China, we always had a few smaller players. We always had two big players. We even now have two big players. There is one player in Japan. So, the number of players are not increasing. It is still a capital-intensive product, which is where you have to set up the capacity and then wait for two years to be able to sell commercially, which adds to the capital intensity of the product. The turnover to capital expenditure is very low. So, the paybacks become difficult. Now at the Chinese level of pricing, the payback has also become so long that it has almost become very difficult to make it financially viable for a new person to commit at that level in China, for example.
Saha Merchant
Right, so basically new players haven’t come in. It is just that the existing players have increased capacity significantly.
Anurag Jain
Yes.
Saha Merchant
Right. And given this whole FTA talk with the U.S. and given that the U.S. is a major player in the Sulphur industry, would you say that if this FTA with the U.S. fructifies, it would be a net negative for our business in India?
Anurag Jain
Why would that be a net negative?
Saha Merchant
Because, I mean, given that Flexysis is such a big player and they would start looking at the Indian market.
Anurag Jain
From Malaysia, they have a bigger plot in Malaysia.
Saha Merchant
Right, so they are supplying from there, so it wouldn’t make much of a difference.
Anurag Jain
So that would not make any difference.
Akshat Goenka
Their costs are much higher in the U.S. and any material that comes from the U.S. or Europe is at a very high cost.
Saha Merchant
Right, right.
Akshat Goenka
A high price, I mean. They send it at a very high price.
Saha Merchant
Okay. And given that there are so many different grades of IS with their.
Anurag Jain
We lost you.
Operator
Participant left the queue, sir. Ladies and gentlemen, due to time constraints, we will take this as the last question. I now hand the conference over to the management for closing comments. Over to you, sir
Akshat Goenka
I would like to thank everyone for being part of this call. We hope we have answered your questions. If you need more information, please feel free to contact us or Mr. Dhruva from SGA, our Investor Relations Advisor. I think particularly the last question that was happening, it got cut off from its stream and I think he was not able to join back. So, I urge you to get in touch with SGA or our team directly and we’ll be happy to answer any balance questions that were left. Thank you.
Operator
(Operator Closing Remarks)