Orchid Pharma Ltd (NSE: ORCHPHARMA) Q1 2026 Earnings Call dated Aug. 12, 2025
Corporate Participants:
Unidentified Speaker
Manish Dhanuka — Managing Director
Mridul Dhanuka — Executive Director
Analysts:
Unidentified Participant
Vishal Manchanda — Analyst
Rupesh — Analyst
Pranav — Analyst
Viraj Parekh — Analyst
Rupesh — Analyst
Rahul — Analyst
Ankur — Analyst
Vishal Manchanda — Analyst
Presentation:
operator
SA Foreign. Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the Q1FY26 earnings conference call of Orchard Pharma Limited hosted by Systematic Institutional Equities. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen only mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on attached on phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Vishal Mantuanda from Systematic Institutional Equities. Thank you. And over to you sir.
Vishal Manchanda — Analyst
Thank you Muskan and good evening everyone. On behalf of Systematics Institutional Equities I welcome you to the Q1 FY26 earnings call of Orchid Pharma. We thank the Orchid management for giving us an opportunity to host the call. Today we have with us the senior management of the company represented by Mr. Manish Dhanuka, Managing Director, Mr. Mridul Dhanuka, Full Time Director and Mr. Sunil Kumar Gupta, Chief Financial Officer. I’ll now hand over the call to the company management for their opening remarks. Over to you sir.
Manish Dhanuka — Managing Director
Thank you Vishal. Good evening ladies and gentlemen. I am Manish Dhanuka, Managing Director of Orchid Pharma Ltd. And I welcome you all to our discussions for the results of first quarter financial year 2026. I will take you through our performance for the quarter share updates on our key strategic initiatives and outline our priorities for the year ahead. First, the financial year performance for the Q1 26. For this quarter our sales stood at 173 crores compared with 244 crore in the same period last year. This is a steep decline of around 29%. This performance must be seen in the context of an unprecedented global slowdown in the antibiotics market.
The current environment is unlike anything we have seen in the last five years with both prices and volumes under pressure. Despite this, we have tried to maintain our gross margins at around 42% and have consciously chosen not to participate in the ongoing price war. This has been achieved through disciplined pricing, a more resilient product mix and continued optimization of input costs. Operational EBITDA for the quarter was 14 crore rupees. On the cost side, employee expenses and other operating costs remain broadly flat in absolute terms even as we continue to invest in our strategic growth initiatives.
Market Outlook the antibiotics industry is currently facing one of its sharpest short term contractions in recent memory. Our analysis of exports out of India show that for the quarter overall quantity of oral antibiotics exports fell by about 30%. While average export prices dropped by about 15 to 20%. This double impact of lower volumes and lower prices has created a challenging environment for all the players in such a scenario. Orchid has focused on preserving value by moderating our product mix and maintaining margins rather than chasing volumes in a cutthroat market through aggressive price cuts. We believe this indisciplined approach will protect long term positioning and profitability once the market stabilizes.
Now on the strategic initiatives Coming to our strategic initiatives, I am pleased to announce that following our update last quarter on Electrus insolvency and the resulting uncertainty around Orcid’s royalty stream, Orcid has now acquired the global right to nmetazobactam and the trademark xblipep from Elecra. This is a transformative development for Orcid, giving us complete control over the regulatory and commercial strategy for this novel antibiotic worldwide. Once the acquisition is formally completed, Orchid now becomes the only Indian pharmaceutical company that can call itself innovator of a new chemical entity that is internationally approved. While the commercial terms for this deal are confidential, I can assure you that the transaction is economically significant.
All future economic benefits from the product will now accrue to Orchid Pharma. The double digit royalties previously receivable by Elecra from Advance in Europe will now come directly to us globally. The product has already been licensed in Europe and Middle east and North African markets and we are in advanced stage discussions for several other geographies. The US market remains elusive for now. Our immediate focus will be to identify and resolve the challenges that Allekra faced in the past and put in place a robust plan for a US entry. Oblisap Our brand in India Our domestic brand oblisep continues to perform steadily.
The combination of cipla’s extensive hospital coverage and our AMS Division’s targeted engagement ensures we are building sustained prescriber awareness. Demand patterns remain consistent with our expectations. Antimicrobial Stewardship the AMS Division continues to expand its engagement with hospitals and clinicians, focusing on responsible antibiotic use and AMR awareness. While still in the investment phase, it is helping position Orcid as a trusted partner in critical care antibiotics. This platform will also be a key success factor in driving the adoption of Cepidrocol in India given its position in the hospital segment and the specialized prescriber base it serves. An update on the 7 ACA project in Jammu the 7 ACA project is progressing in line with our revised timelines.
Construction continued during the quarter and the procurement of major engineering equipment is completed Once operational, the facility will strengthen our API capabilities, reduce import dependencies and deliver the cost synergies. As expected, the Sepidro Coal project is going on track as per the expected timeline. Even as we invest in new projects and differentiated products, operational discipline remains central to our approach. Maintaining cost competitiveness in an inflationary environment while safeguarding margins in a declining market speaks about the resilience of our operating model. I’m now going to discuss some of the risks and challenges that we face in the current environment.
Persistent volume and price pressure in antibiotics could weigh on the near term revenues at this stage. We see no revival in the near future, at least not in the current year. There may be some risks related to the insolvency acquisition of NMETAZOBACTAM from Allegra. As you are aware, insolvency acquisitions are conducted on as is where is basis. In a code run process. There is limited time to perform detailed due diligence. Although this acquisition involves intangibles and we have a good visibility on what we have acquired. Once the acquisition is formally completed, we will need to obtain more details and assess any implications.
Our priorities remain as on today. Our main priorities would be to take control of and then expand the licensing of XBLISP across the globe. Deepen penetration of Orblisph in India, progress the construction of seven ACA projects in Jammu, maintain margin disciplines while selectively investing in high impact growth areas. With the regained control of NMET Azulectam, a stable domestic hospital presence and strategic backward integration underway, ORCID is positioned to navigate near term pressures while laying the groundwork for future growth. In closing, I want to thank our employees, partners and investors for their Support. Financial year 26 will be about bracing for a muted year.
Disciplined execution, protecting profitability and positioning for growth as the market recovers. Thank you for your attention. I now welcome our questions.
Questions and Answers:
operator
Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask question may press star and one on the touchdown telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from question queue, you may press star and two participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we’ll wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Rupesh from Sri Rama Managers pms. Please go ahead.
Rupesh
Hi. Hi Sir. Thank you for the opportunity and I must congratulate you to let you both and Manish for resolving this matter fairly quickly of Electra insolvency that the speed was I think commendable. So my Question is. I mean Electra I think is out licensed to Advanced Pharma. So now though whatever royalty Advanced Pharma was going to pay to Alicra, that will now accrue to us or is there some change in that part?
Manish Dhanuka
There is expected to be no change in that part. Once the transaction is completed it’s subject to certain CPs. Right now we will take over the role of Accra in the existing agreement. So whatever was the commercial interest which was due to them will now become due to Orchid.
Rupesh
Okay. And. And so our. Our share initially I thought was high single digit. Which now goes to double digit. Double digit. Is that a fair. Okay. Okay. And any. Any cash flow, cash outflow indication you can give for this transaction. You maybe you have given in press release and I missed it. But.
Manish Dhanuka
As per the terms of the agreement, it’s confidential. Especially right now because the CP’s are also not completed. So we will only make the mandatory disclosures regarding the price in the reports as needed.
Rupesh
Maybe. Let me ask you another way. Is it. Is it significant to our equity base or do. Do we have to take significant debt to fund this acquisition? Let me ask you this. I don’t need an exact number.
Mridul Dhanuka
So no debt will be taken to fund this acquisition.
Rupesh
Okay. Okay. And I also heard you said that this is now also out licensed in Middle East.
Mridul Dhanuka
That’s correct.
Rupesh
So that is like. Which. Which company? How many markets in Middle East? Some. Some color around. That would be very helpful.
Mridul Dhanuka
So it is out licensed for Saudi Arabia, entire UAE and South Africa to a Swiss pharma company called Achino Pharma.
Rupesh
Okay, so this was done by Electra but now we’re taking over.
Mridul Dhanuka
Or this is new development done by Electro only. Right now we don’t have control. We have signed the agreement. Like I said, it’s subject to certain approvals from the government. So we are just waiting for that till the time it has been done by electronic.
Rupesh
Okay. Okay. The other other question is for the important markets. Can you give idea about the patent expiry of Nmetazobactum? I think some markets are 2034, some markets are 2031. But. But it will be good to hear it from you. Maybe let’s say us, Europe, uk, Japan, India. These high markets maybe Rough. Rough idea about patent expiry. If you can give.
Mridul Dhanuka
Yeah, it’s country to country like you said it’s bit complex. U.S. i can confirm it’s 24. Early 2434. Sorry. Yeah. So other countries, Europe also is similar, you know, 2024 because the patents are filed similar time and exclusivity periods are also similar. There is an ongoing pediatric study for this which might extend the exclusivity by some time. But that’s all to be understood and sometime in the future. But right now only Feb early 24 is what we can say.
Rupesh
34. Right, sorry. Just.
Mridul Dhanuka
I mean, sorry. Sorry. I’m. I’m really sorry. Early 34.
Rupesh
Okay. Okay. It makes a big difference. Sorry. So, okay. And how is the response to N metals of Actum in. In India if you can give number maybe for FY25 between shipline and where is it used? I mean we have always said that it’s a PENM resisting PENM sparing antibiotic, but maybe if you can give some order in some SOP where it is used.
Mridul Dhanuka
So yeah, with respect to number of patients we have shared last time, 10,000 patients roughly. So that’s the volume till last year. And we’ll be reporting this maybe once in a year or maybe twice in a year. Quarterly numbers, you know, can change due to our supply to supply and their supply to market. All of those, some of those would be confidential also. But we will keep you broadly informed of the overall patient number that we are treating.
Rupesh
But revenue you are not ready to divulge.
Mridul Dhanuka
As per our agreement with Cipla, we cannot.
Rupesh
Okay. And maybe, I mean, where is the Avivactam sales overall? If you can give some idea? Because I think that probably should be the benchmark for us. So where, I mean, not our IV backthum sales. I mean if you can give our Avivactam sales, that will be good. But overall, what is the Avivactam brand sales in India if you know, see.
Mridul Dhanuka
First of all, this molecule should not be compared with IV Bacter because that is a Pfizer molecule and that is the last line. You can say the reserve category of antibiotic and that is used in extreme cases. Whereas this, we are trying to create a position where this can be used as a first line of antibiotic. And this is used because the first line of piperacillin, tazobactam and ceftriaxone has developed significant resistance. So our experience has been that the hospitals are very well accepting the fact that these first line antibiotics are not working and the doctors are compelled to prescribe Meropenem, which as per the standard protocol should not be done.
So our target is to replace these first line antibiotics and prevent Meropenem from being prescribed. So comparison would not be right. But since you asked the question.
Manish Dhanuka
If. I know correctly, Pfizer had made a very big brand of Avibactam and despite being generic for now 1 and a half years, it has still continued to grow. Significant. But of course that is being, that is being promoted by multiple companies now. So. But I mean if you consider that if this, if we succeed in making it a first line molecule then it has a significant potential.
Rupesh
So in 10,000 patients so far, I don’t know, maybe some sort of phase four tracking we are doing in some these 10,000 patients, do you have some idea where it was used as a first line and where it was not used as a first line?
Mridul Dhanuka
So mostly for the Cuti it is the preferred choice. Now whichever hospitals we have promoted it is very well accepted. The other indication that it is approved is for Hapfact. Our team is working with pulmonologists also to promote in that indication. These are the two indications.
Rupesh
The final question on Nmetazobactum is, I mean have you started any preliminary discussions for out licensing in us? I think that part was a little bit slow and always a source of irritation I think for you and for all the investors. So have you, I mean had some preliminary discussions? I mean I know that you have to go through the process to take control of the asset.
Mridul Dhanuka
Yeah. So Olekra had hired some consultant. We are discussing with the consultant and trying to understand what were the challenges. And once we understand where was the gap between expectation of Allegra and of the prospectus licensees, then we’ll try and find a via media to solve, you know, to find a middle path where some agreement can be achieved with the prospective licenses. Maybe we will restart the discussion with the past companies with whom discussion was happening.
Rupesh
But I mean you, you have some aspiration that the deal in US should be done in let’s say six months after you take ownership of asset, 12 months after you take ownership of asset, at least aspiration of the management. I mean there will be nitty gritty that you have to deal with.
Mridul Dhanuka
The most prudent thing would be to close the deal within a year. Definitely. Because the NDA, the registration, whole process has been completed. But of course, I mean you would like to optimize what you get out of the deal.
Rupesh
Okay. Okay. Okay, thank you. Now moving, moving to safidero. Com 1. So cefiderocol, just to be clear is again a last line treatment today, right? Is that a correct statement?
Mridul Dhanuka
Yes. Yes.
Rupesh
Okay. So now what has happened is Wackard has come up with a Zdebactum and I think Zdaybacter will probably get an approval in India this year sometime before March 2026 as per public information. And zidobactam I think is a significantly superior molecule to Cefidoroc. And I think in our planning at least the cefiderocol is I think significantly dependent on India and the emerging markets. Right. So now how are you seeing things in this aspect? Maybe you can give some strategies or ideas or how you are approaching this.
Mridul Dhanuka
In our understanding. I have not seen any comparison between Cefidrocofol and Ctibactam. And to the best of my knowledge as on today, I mean it would be difficult to comment on a molecule which is still under trials. But as on today, cefitrocol is the most potent antibiotic available. And whenever we go to the hospitals and you know some people have read in the news that we, we have got the license for Cefedrop. A lot of doctors are very curious to ask when, when this product is coming in the market. So I really don’t know where you got.
Rupesh
Okay, okay. Zirrebact trials are completed. Maybe just to keep the record correct. Okay. And as how is Ivipactum generic sales doing in in India? Any color around that? How big a brand has that become?
Manish Dhanuka
The molecule has really done well. I think it’s one of our good products as well.
Rupesh
And we remain, I mean in API. What would be our market share in API supply And then how many, you know, brand players are there?
Manish Dhanuka
Some 60% of.
Rupesh
Okay, okay. We supply the 60% of the market and this is not part this. We don’t need the form. I just. I’ll come back in the queue. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I’ll come back in the queue.
operator
Thank you. A reminder to all the participants, you may press star N1 to ask question. The next question is from the line of Pranav from Lotus Filth. Please go ahead.
Pranav
Opportunity. Congratulations for a multiple.
operator
Can you speak little louder please?
Pranav
Congratulations for a multi billion dollar acquisition for just 28, 500 Euros. 28,500 Euros. My first question is Ritu how Orchid Pharma will commercialize N Meta was atom globally? Would it like partner with Indian multinational companies like Cipla or a global pharma company? Since as you mentioned the patent will expire in 2034 in U.S.
Mridul Dhanuka
Yeah. The selling model would be exactly the same as it is now maintained by Elecra. Orchid will license it out to companies across the world. And as we were discussing on the previous question for Europe, UAE markets and South Africa, the license is already done and Electra was in Advanced stages of discussion of several other markets. So by the time the transaction is closed, hopefully we may be able to announce a few more.
Pranav
Okay. Also following question going forward, how much royalty are we expecting from China?
Mridul Dhanuka
So in China there is currently no agreement with anyone. So there is no forecast number or which I can share that this much loyalty can come from China now. So the agreement that Electrite signed in the past no longer exists.
Pranav
Okay, so it’s. It’s no longer an agreement. There’s no agreement as of now. Also, one last question. Going forward, uh, will we use n the brand that is X BL or on globally for the commercialization?
Mridul Dhanuka
Yeah, because it’s already developed and you know, included in guidelines worldwide as we don’t want to change the global brand name.
Pranav
Okay, thank you so much.
Mridul Dhanuka
Thank you.
operator
Thank you. A reminder to all the participants, you may press star and run to ask question. The next question is from the line of Burman Chetty Suresh from Burman Financials. Please go ahead. Yes, Mr. Suresh, go with the question please. If there is no response from the Paris fin, we’ll move to the next. The next question is from the line of Viraj Parekh from Karnell Asset Management. Please go ahead.
Viraj Parekh
Good evening sir. Am I audible?
Mridul Dhanuka
Yeah.
Viraj Parekh
Hi sir. Good evening. I just had a one follow up question on the first participants question. Wasn’t clear on my end. For this acquisition, have we. Will it be enough from internal accruals or will we have to take some external debt to fund the Electra acquisition?
Mridul Dhanuka
Yeah, it will be enough from internal accrual. No debt will be taken.
Viraj Parekh
Right. Second question. Sir, we have seen the numbers for Orchid Pharma. If I think the resolution for the merger of Dhanuka Labs also has gone through. So if you can have some indication of the annual performance we are forecasting for Dhanuka Labs as well since it’ll be soon merged. And if you can give us an idea on that front as well, it’ll be helpful. Guptaji, can you. Can you explain 31st March numbers?
Mridul Dhanuka
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Sir, actually March 25th we have closed our sale at 503 crore with and. EBITDA was 42 crore.
Viraj Parekh
So my question was more in relation to FY26 outlook for Dhanuka Labs. We are seeing a 30% decline in Orchid pharma for the current quarter. I’m not asking for a short term estimate of a quarterly number for Dhanuka Labs. But if we can get an annual forecast of how this 500 crore would pan out for FY26 for the company. Given that it’s a little bit of a low margin company than Orchid Pharma as well on an EBITDA level.
Mridul Dhanuka
See, I mean we had expected to have a significant growth in pharmacalabs also, but considering the market conditions that are prevailing, I think it would be difficult to give a guidance on that at this point of time. We really have to see what has really triggered such a steep decline in the market conditions. Until we really do an assessment, it would not be proper to give any estimate. So we are just trying to understand the reasons for this and how this recovery will happen and what we can do to tide over this challenge.
Viraj Parekh
What will be the timeline for the merger?
Manish Dhanuka
I think next six months it should be. I mean the results of the EGM have already been accepted by the judge and now the final formality is will have to be done. We have a hearing in end of September. If all authorities give permission by then, then I think final verdict should come in that or maybe in the next the hearing after that.
Viraj Parekh
Got it. Manish, in your opening remarks you mentioned that core markets are seeing a lot of challenge in terms of price wars and the demand also really, really not supporting the capacity which has come up in the antibacterial range. Given that Danuka Lab has also been in the market for some time and even Orchid’s significant portion of revenue comes from emerging markets. Maybe if you can give us some qualitative comment on terms of the market sentiment where both these companies have an overlap that will also be helpful for the investors.
Manish Dhanuka
Yeah, I mean we cannot see any scientific or medical reasons that would reduce the demand with such a large percentage. So I mean all I can think of is maybe the turmoil that’s going on and uncertainty in the markets which has led customers to maybe reduce inventories or not take any risks, reduce the investment. That could be the only reason I can think of why certain demand decreases there. And I am optimistic that it should change in one or two quarters and that would lead to a sudden recovery like what happened after after the COVID I don’t see any reason for such a sudden decline in demand.
Viraj Parekh
Right. So this last question before I get back into. It’s a bit of a hypothetical situation. You may answer if you have we don’t have a lot of operational details of Nanoca Labs, but given that this quarter has been quite worse for the entire sector, can there be a situation where we have a loss in Dhanuka Labs if the situation continues.
Manish Dhanuka
At this point of Time. I don’t think we have the numbers for the quarter but there are some high value items that Dhanuka also manufactures. So we are not looking at such situation.
Viraj Parekh
Got it sir. Thanks a lot. All the way back. I’ll get back in queue.
Manish Dhanuka
Thank you.
operator
Thank you. A reminder to all the participants. You may press star and one to ask question. Participants may press star and one to ask question. The next question is from the line of Rupesh from Sri Rama managers pms. Please go ahead.
Rupesh
Yeah, thank you. Thank you for the follow up. Just finishing on IV vactum. So Ivactum formulation, is it part of our AMS division?
Manish Dhanuka
So AMS division has about 30, 40 products. Avibactam is just one of those products.
Rupesh
Okay. So we are also supplying formulation for ivibactum also in the market. Okay. Okay. And any, any indicative growth, any indication of how the market has expanded post it becoming generic. Any growth rate, some color around that and it’s fair to assume Avivactam will keep growing at healthy rate for three, four years like that.
Manish Dhanuka
I don’t think, you know after becoming generic there is, there had been a surge of new brands coming in the market and I think at Last count I rem 55 or 60 brands in the market and that resulted to I would say a significant growth at API stage. I’m not sure how much of liquidation that would have resulted in. I think once that demand or the pent up demand because of high price of Pfizer was met, I don’t think there is a scope for this product to go exponentially in the future. Because like Manish alluded this is a last resort product currently so it is used when other products don’t work where carbapenem resistance or meropenem resistance.
Rupesh
Okay, okay. And, and just fine. Concluding on every vactum we are the still first to file in US. And what is the launch date? I. I probably forgot. I think 2026 or 2028.
Manish Dhanuka
We had announced that we had received an RTR and we are not first to file anymore.
Rupesh
So we are not first to file anymore. Okay.
Manish Dhanuka
Yeah.
Rupesh
And, and when is when? I mean when is the dandic expiry patent expiry for IV vector?
Manish Dhanuka
The first to file launch date would be sometime August 27th and Orchid product should be available six months after that.
Rupesh
Six months after that. Okay. Okay. And then where, where are we on the generics of newer generation antibiotics sector rolling Sefoisin if you can give some color around newer products.
Manish Dhanuka
The product stability is going on. The DMF is under Preparation and we are looking for some partners in those two. On those two products.
Rupesh
So when, when. I mean filing. Can you put a year. It will be done in next 12 months.
Manish Dhanuka
The DMF will be definitely filed.
Mridul Dhanuka
The API DMF will be fine for sure. For the FDF cannot give a timeline.
Rupesh
At this time for both the products. Is that correct?
Manish Dhanuka
Yes.
Rupesh
Okay. Okay. So that is the other, other question is this 30% decline in export out of India and. And all of that. So there is. Correct me if I’m wrong but there is no significant China competition in these products or there is a significant China competition.
Manish Dhanuka
So there is competition from China and. But the major product like cefixim India is much stronger than China. And Chinese companies only cater to domestic demand for the injectables. Yes, there is competition from China, but the overall demand has slackened for sure. There is no doubt about it.
Rupesh
Is a significant part of the demand driven, was driven by funding. Is that a speculation you can make or we can make?
Manish Dhanuka
I would say this. The overall sentiment is low. So maybe the pipeline inventories have gone down. That’s what I am thinking.
Rupesh
Okay. Okay. And where are we on the penicillin prices? When do you see realization stabilizing?
Manish Dhanuka
Yeah. So the penicillin prices have gone down significantly. So that’s why I feel that there is a demand slackening because the raw material prices have also gone down. If the Chinese were also buying lot of raw material, the raw material prices would still remain firm.
Rupesh
So you think that people are waiting for Pengi to bottom out and then try to hold the whole pricing to bottom out and then start refilling the inventory. That is. Is that what you’re trying to indicate?
Rupesh
That could also be a possibility.
Manish Dhanuka
Okay. Okay. And then on 7 ACA commissioning is Q1 FY27. Is that correct?
Manish Dhanuka
There is no change in what we mentioned last time. Yeah.
Rupesh
Okay. And sedara poll is December 26th.
Manish Dhanuka
Yes.
Rupesh
Okay. Okay. And then seven ACA PLI scheme. I mean, I think we’re significantly behind the schedule. But still, I don’t know. There are written commitments, oral commitments that PLI benefits would be given.
Manish Dhanuka
So I talked about it in the previous call. Every call we have to explain this. Unfortunately, there are no written approvals. There are only oral commitments that this will be honored.
Rupesh
Okay. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Thank you. Thank you for answering my questions and all the best.
operator
Thank you. A reminder to all the participants, you may press star N1 to ask questions. The next question is from the line of Rahul from SW and Company, please go ahead.
Rahul
Hello, Am I audible?
operator
Yes, sir.
Rahul
Yes, yes, yes. Thank you for taking my question. Congrats on a great quarter. Basically I have some questions regarding Expl. So my question is like the Electra is bankrupt in the US Will explain it will be still commercialized in the US or by when it can be commercialized.
Manish Dhanuka
Yeah, Once the acquisition is completed, we will find out licensing partner in the US and partner with them to launch. And we are targeting to do that within one year of acquisition completion.
Rahul
Okay, I have a follow up question on that. So is there availability of automated susceptibility testing for as of now?
Manish Dhanuka
Unfortunately I don’t have this detail. But I think they were working on it for India. We have developed that. So we are distributing those in India. So I am assuming it would have been done for available.
Rahul
It’s being used in Europe. Yeah. A few more questions. What are the target patients for Exblifep?
Manish Dhanuka
Currently we are targeting two indications, HAPWeb and COTI.
Rahul
Okay, one last question. What are the key target regions we are focusing on? US or universe? I mean, sorry.
Manish Dhanuka
In the. As we said, Europe is already licensed, Middle Eastern countries already licensed. There are some discussions going on in Brazil and in Japan. US There was some discussion in the past. These were the territories where the discussions were already initiated by Electra. We are looking to expand this further to other regions also like maybe Russia, Vietnam and other countries as well. And maybe we will initiate those discussions after the takeover.
Rahul
Okay, thank you very much for answering my questions.
Rahul
Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Ankur and individual investor. Please go ahead.
Ankur
Hello? Yeah, hi. You know you previously mentioned that the peak sales for N Metazoo backed in are expected to be between 150 to 200 million dollars per year. Now could you give us the geographical distribution of that sales number you expect?
Manish Dhanuka
No, unfortunately not. You know, this number was just a forecast from our side. Right now we don’t have any details of the Allegra partnerships, what they have done, the agreement, the forecast, the sales, what is happening only after acquisition is completed, we’ll be having a better picture.
Ankur
Okay, so and the royalty that you get from Advanced Pharma that double digits and are we looking to like get a better deal with them or that. Deal and there’s nothing we can do to improve that?
Manish Dhanuka
No, the deals already signed, we are not looking to renegotiate any.
Ankur
Okay. And they were also, I think during that agreement with Advanced Pharma there’s some milestone payment as the molecule is commercialized. And there’s a milestone based payment. So do we expect that also to flow in or they’ve already been like done with in the past.
Manish Dhanuka
I think most of the milestones are completed. If one or two are left then that would accrue to us. Otherwise most of the milestone with regard to advance would have been completed.
Ankur
Hello. The initial milestones have already been paid to Elecra. But later on some sales related milestones are there. Once those are achieved then they might come to us. But that’s not going to be in very near future.
operator
Hello, Mr. Ankur. Hello Mr. Ankur, does that answer your question? There is no response from the participant. We’ll move to the next. The next question is from the line of Sagar Arya from Exponent tribes. Please go ahead.
Ankur
Hi sir. Am I audible?
Manish Dhanuka
Yes.
Ankur
Yeah. Just a couple of questions. In the last call you had mentioned that the for the combined entity that is Dhanuka and Orchid would be about 175 crores. Now in this call you mentioned that Dhanuka did 42 crores of EBITDA in FY25. So the math doesn’t add up here. I think last call which had done about 49 crores. So where is the. The gap here?
Manish Dhanuka
No, we said 39 crores.
Ankur
39.
Manish Dhanuka
That was before the audited balance sheet. We said 39 crores. That after. After the finalization of number that is worked out. 42 crores.
Ankur
42. 42 crores. Okay.
Manish Dhanuka
Yeah.
Ankur
39. We have now the audit. It has worked out 42. Okay.
Ankur
Okay, got it. Second is just to be clear. The agreement that Alicra had with advance was for mid teens royalty on sales in Europe.
Manish Dhanuka
Correct. So as per the public information disclosed by Elektra on their website. It just said double digits.
Ankur
Okay, so what. What is double digit? How should we interpret double digit?
Manish Dhanuka
It’s around 15%. So depending on the sales it ranges from 14 to 18%. If the sales go high, the royalties will increase. But I mean we can assume 15 is on an average.
Ankur
Understood? Understood. Got it. And lastly you know in earlier we. We’re also in discussions with Electra. I don’t know. I know it didn’t materialize but we were in discussions for doing CDMO for Imitazobacter as well. Now that we have. We have ownership of the molecule, is that an option which is still on the table?
Manish Dhanuka
Yeah. Now that decision will be ours. But there are some commitments with the existing supplier. So we will honor that. And once our FDF unit is up and running we Will definitely try and get ourselves approved as an alternate supplier.
Ankur
Okay. What would be a reasonable timeline if. This were to happen, sir?
Manish Dhanuka
See, I mean in regulated markets today, I mean the bare minimum is three years I would say.
Ankur
Understood. Okay, thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of rupeesh from Sri Rama managers. Please go ahead.
Rupesh
Thank you for the opportunity. Once more a few, I think one, one basic one will be this German ibc. I mean for the lack of better term, German IBC process. When will it be completed? Any approximate timeline.
Manish Dhanuka
We are expecting about three months.
Rupesh
So you will have ownership of asset in three months?
Manish Dhanuka
Hopefully, yes.
Rupesh
Okay. And then post the transfer of ownership. So I mean now also advance owns some royalty, owes some royalty to Electra. I don’t know what will happen to that if you have some view on that. But the moment asset ownership happens, the royalty will start accruing to us. Is that fair? Or there will be some delay?
Manish Dhanuka
No delay as such. So it will happen when the conclusion, the consummation of the transaction happens.
Rupesh
And are there like any second bidder, third bidder who can raise some legal obstacles like that or how is that like a home run for us? We are the only bidder.
Manish Dhanuka
So as far as my understanding goes, the process in Germany is different than India. So there is nobody else who can contest this.
Rupesh
We have signed the agreement. It is just subject to conditions like German government approving our foreign investment bid and some other, you know, basic requirements of the creditors approving and all that. As of, as of now our bid was the one that was accepted by the administrator.
Rupesh
Okay. Okay. So it looks like a home run for us. Okay. And, and the other question coming to India market is recently a little bit of consolidation happened. One of the, I think Northern based player sold out his capacities in this cephalosporin space to another I think Hyderabad based player. So shouldn’t that generally consolidation means better pricing? Is that not a fair understanding outside of whatever is the demand trend and all of that is happening?
Manish Dhanuka
Yeah, that’s what I would imagine. If the quotation goes from one less, you know, competitor, it should help.
Rupesh
Okay. Okay. So at least overall in the medium term you expect that consolidation hopefully will help to keep the pricing discipline.
Manish Dhanuka
That’s right. It leaves just three players in the market now.
Rupesh
Okay. Okay. And, and so this process, let’s say IBC process takes six months coming back to nmetazobactum, whatever royalty is poured in that time, we don’t have any claim on that. Or we can have some claim on that as well.
Manish Dhanuka
We will have claim, we will have claim for. On Royalties after the 31st of July.
Rupesh
We’ll have claim of the 31st of July. Okay. And then I don’t know how, how is the product doing at Advanced Pharma level? How many countries have they launched in some idea?
Mridul Dhanuka
It was launched just six months back. It takes time to develop the market. So in this year we don’t expect significant numbers coming out of the expectation the growth will happen in next year.
Rupesh
But you, you are in discussion with Advanced Pharma and like some, some updates you will likely to get as we go along.
Manish Dhanuka
As of now acquisition is complete, we will have more visibility.
Rupesh
Okay. Okay. Okay. Thank you. Thank you for answering all my questions so generously.
Manish Dhanuka
Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Rohan from Envision Capital. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Hello. Am I audible?
operator
Yes sir. Yes. Mr. Rohan, go with the question please. Hello, Mr. Rohan. Mr. Rohan, go with the question please. As there is no response from the participant, we’ll move to the next. A reminder to all the participants, you may press star and one to ask questions. The next question is from the line of Vishal Manchanda from Systematic Institutional Equities. Please go ahead.
Vishal Manchanda
Thanks for the opportunity sir. With respect to the kind of volume pressures that we are seeing, are we also seeing this in our long term contracts that we have with customers?
Manish Dhanuka
No, we don’t foresee, I mean there is, there is some link to the raw material main raw material prices, maybe that correction will happen but we don’t see.
Vishal Manchanda
So you mean people are waiting for the prices to correct and that’s why they are trimming their inventory levels. Is that the case?
Manish Dhanuka
So wherever we have long term commitments, generally plus minus 10% variation is there, they give annual forecasts. So I don’t see any significant change happening there. And we have not seen that trend in the first quarter also wherever we have.
Vishal Manchanda
And anyway you could have tracked China data like whether their exports have intensified in the emerging markets or.
Manish Dhanuka
Unfortunately. No reliable data is available from China.
Vishal Manchanda
Okay, okay. And on Ametos of Becktam, how quickly can we commercialize in emerging markets, the unregulated markets of the world?
Mridul Dhanuka
We are actually studying the agreements that are in place. We don’t want to do anything in a hurry where we violate any of the contracts that they would have signed. So we will need to first study that. We want to do it as fast as possible. But I would not say that you should expect that will happen very fast because as you saw in India it took us almost A year and a half to register the molecule despite doing lot of RD ourselves in Orchid. So how the registration process will go around in the non regulated markets, that’s.
That’s also to be seen.
Vishal Manchanda
Okay.
Manish Dhanuka
That’s why I said that. You know, our lowest hanging fruit is if we can find a licensee licensing partner in the U.S. there we have the registration, the NDA, everything is done. That should be our first target.
Manish Dhanuka
Okay. Okay. And any sense on what pricing would be for this drug in the. In the European markets where it is commercialized? Like per patient, per. So one treatment?
Mridul Dhanuka
Yeah. Currently I only have a gross price of $150 per vial. But the net price and per patient price, I think I’m not aware as of now. But this information we can source by next call and I can share.
Vishal Manchanda
Okay, sir. Okay. And. And Metazo backtime. Can we manufacture the API in house in case we need to do that?
Manish Dhanuka
Yeah, we are manufacturing for our domestic consumption.
Vishal Manchanda
Okay. And you will need to kind of wait for the fixed dosage facility to be commercialized.
Manish Dhanuka
That’s right. That’s right.
Vishal Manchanda
Okay. Okay. Yeah, I think that’s all from my side. Thank you very much.
Manish Dhanuka
Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Raj from Urge Partners. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Hello. Am I audible?
operator
Yes, sir.
Unidentified Participant
I just wanted to know the overall market size of N. Metazobectum.
Manish Dhanuka
Currently it’s negligible. It’s a new product. So market size saying is very difficult. But if you look at overall antibiotics market in the world, that’s about $30 billion. And cephalosporins typically command one third of that. So that’s what antibiotic is. Nmetazobactam is a new product, so we.
Unidentified Participant
Can’T give any signs like going to three years from now, how much should be the ideal size as per you?
Manish Dhanuka
That would be too much of speculation, Raj, to talk about. Four to five. Years it will take to reach the peak. So by 2029 or something, we can expect the peak sales to happen. What that number is depends on which countries it is license to, how many years that country has been selling. Ideally, Electra should have licensed in US and if it had been launched last year, like Europe, maybe the sales would have picked up. So lots of variables around that. It would be difficult to give a global number.
Unidentified Participant
All right. Yeah. Thank you.
operator
Thank you ladies and gentlemen. As that was the last question for the day, I would now hand the conference over to the management for the closing comments. Over to you, sir.
Manish Dhanuka
Thank you, Muska. Thank you ladies and gentlemen for participating in this conference. As we can see, we face some difficult market environment at present. But we feel we can tide over this time through resilience and focus. We thank you for your interest in the company, and this always motivates us to work harder. Thank you once again. Bye bye.
operator
Thank you on behalf of systematic Institutional equities. That concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us. And you may now disconnect your lines. Thank you.