Network People Services Technologies Limited (NSE: NPST) Q4 2025 Earnings Call dated May. 27, 2025
Corporate Participants:
Deepak Chand Thakur — Chairman, and Chief Managing Director
Analysts:
Harshil Ghanshyani — Analyst
Rupesh Tatiya — Analyst
Akshay — Analyst
Abhishek Sharma — Analyst
Harish Kumar Gupta — Analyst
Vinodchandra Agrawal — Analyst
Yash — Analyst
Ashish Soni — Analyst
Gopi — Analyst
Nishant — Analyst
Shrinivas — Analyst
Hardik Gandhi — Analyst
Presentation:
Operator
Know what ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the Network People Services Technology Limited Q4 FY ’25 Earnings Conference Call hosted by Advisors Private Limited. As a reminder, all participant lines will remain in the listen-only mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal the operator by pressing star then zero on your touchstone telephone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I would now like to hand the call over to Mr Harshal Ganshani from Kiran Advisors Private Limited for his opening remarks. Thank you, and over to you.
Harshil Ghanshyani — Analyst
Thank you. On behalf of Kiran Advisor, I would like to extend a warm welcome to everyone joining us for the NPSC call Q4 FY ’25 conference call. We are pleased to have us with esteemed Management and Mr Deepak, Chairman and Managing Director; Mr Ashish Agarwal, Joint Managing Director; Mrs Ms Samita Agashi, Executive Director. The call is released for 40 to 15 minutes to ensure that everyone has the opportunity to participate.
We currently request that each participant limit their questions to two, hence this will help the management address as many queries as possible within the timeframe. If you are unable to address any questions during the call, please see us — please free-to reach us to us at infoAther at currentadvisors.com. We’ll be happy to coordinate with the management team and arrange further discussions. We appreciate your understanding and cooperation. We look-forward to an engaging and productive call. I’ll now hand over the call to Mr Deepak Chandapur. Over to you, sir. Thank you.
Deepak Chand Thakur — Chairman, and Chief Managing Director
Hi, thanks. Thank you so much. Thank you. Very good evening, everyone. First of all, let me congratulate for the breakneck progress quarter-on-quarter your organization is going through. So the decision at management levels, guidance from Board, efforts from NPS, shareholders’ expectations and adoption of several key practices has helped us rebuild the growth parameter of the organization After what we saw in Q3. We have closed the financial year positively with the upward trend. I remember you know either there is a win or there is a fundamental learning, well, this year we went through both. So it was not an easy journey, you know, but by the closure of the year, I can say that we are well-prepared for the coming financial year. So after our Q3 impact, we decided to double down on our efforts to strengthen our core values and also reestablish the growth curve. You know, like I said, it has taken time, but we know we have picked-up at the right direction. So there are four commitments we had with the investors and I think last three, four months we have been able to conclude that. One, we got listed on main board both NSE and BSE. Second, we declared dividend, which is 20% on the face value. And third, we have set-up new subsidiary in UE to focus on the international deals. And fourth, I think it is related to this where you know people kept on asking us when are you going to a global market? Well, we have cracked the multimillion dollar contract in Africa to build a digital payment infrastructure. So I believe you know, these are few things which we have been working for a very long-time and it has paid the result. In continuation to our efforts in scaling the business, have increased our footprint in Allied Services and new segments. Like I said last-time, our organization’s entire focus is going to be derisking and diversification, so that the fundamental core of the business is reestablished and we don’t go back to you know, the impact we had in Q3. So — and also there are a lot of, you know suggestions which came from the investors last-time when to host the call and you know, giving the business analysis straight with the numbers. So I believe we have given as much information as possible. It helps you understand your organization better. So our quarterly growth has been about 24% Q-o-Q jump over the last Q3 results, whereas when it comes to yearly growth, it’s almost about 36% in FY ’25 as against FY ’24. If you look at the numbers straightaway, I would say that in last financial year, it was INR130 crore in revenue. It has gone up to about INR180 crore, which is almost about 39% 40% odd growth and EBITDA margin on the other hand has gone from 35% to about 37%. So your net profit again has not shrunk. In fact, it has gone up from 20% to about 25% and earning per share we have given you know as against 13.85%, it’s about 23.27, which is about 268% jump. Okay. So that’s about the number. So there is question about the talent pool in the organization. We thought we’ll take it straight. Last year, there were about 20% addition in our talent pools. And this year the estimated upward trend is going to be about 30-odd percent incremental talent along with the AI implementation. So there were improved efforts in restructuring due to the Q3 results. And while we were doing that, there are a lot of effort around all the other areas of business. So we — we have really grown well in terms of offline payments. We got multiple TSP wins. We got — we declared about risk engine, AI-based risk engine last quarter and today we have three orders already even before launching it. And account — you know, when it comes to global deal if that’s something which happened yesterday and I’m glad that we have called today to share this with you. Upgrade has taken time, the payment platform to pick-up, but in a short-term, we have been able to sign multiple banks and about 15 payment aggregators in the platform. When it comes to technology partner business, you know, I can say that today in about last four, five months odd with all the efforts from my sales team, we got six new orders worth over INR100 odd crore in the next four to five years. It’s one of the largest deal being Central Bank of India, which has — which is majorly because we ensured that we pivot into more areas of business and offline payment was one, which is about INR70-odd crore order in next five years. And of these six orders, five orders have SaaS-based revenue, which means if the market grows, it has a direct impact on our business. I mean the growth trend visible. We have shared the growth trend for the payment platform for this year as well as up through the year 2029, 30, so that you can visibly see the what exactly we are targeting. For all the new businesses, which I mentioned, our P&L will start showing the numbers from by the half yearly, first-half yearly itself in FY ’26. When it comes to payment platform, like I said, we signed 15 plus aggregators and large merchants. This itself will give us a GMV peak, which we did last year coming in the first-half yearly itself. And when it comes to new revenue stream, like I already mentioned, RIDP, which is our risk engine over AI, our offline payment business. We have already added revenue to us. And when it comes to international foray, we have already got Global Dean, which is about setting up a digital payment infrastructure in one of the — in one of the economy in Africa. That’s what we are doing. So when it comes to small and medium-sized banks, we decided to build our own posted solution so that we can target this side of the business as well. And I’m glad to say that we got most of the product certified and our tag to go-lives in the market is much faster than what we had earlier. So along with this, you know, when it comes to new product, obviously, this helps us build new funnel, internal banking interoperability, which was declared in last April by RBI. We are already one of the POC vendors in the country. And then at the same time, when it comes to BBPS corporate payments, which is again a new initiative, we are one of the POC vendors and ONDC on the buyer side of the business, we have already picked-up that. Interesting piece here is, we decided to conclude this in-quarter one itself so that we get 3/4 entirely to add a funnel and incremental business mix. That’s all from my side. I think there are numbers already available and you know, whatever maximum we can give as part of analysis, we have done that. But rest I’ll take-up calls around whatever questions investors have. I think that will be good.
Questions and Answers:
Operator
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, we will now begin the question-and-answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and 1 on their touchstone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and 2. Participants are requested to use their handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question comes from the line of Rupesh Tatia from Sri Lama Managers. Please go-ahead.
Rupesh Tatiya
Thank you. Thank you for the opportunity, sir and congratulations on turnaround in Q4. I have two questions basically. So first question, sir, is can you give Q4 revenue, can you split it into a transaction-based and then the rest, that is one. And can you also give some color on how much of this revenue is from industries or applications where, you know MDR is charged.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Rupesh, last quarter, most of the revenue is from TSP domain. I think transition-based revenue realization will happen in Q1, majorly because the way our policy has been restructured, it is — it is going to happen in Q1, the entire building. But mostly 90-odd percent is from the TSP domain. So MDR, there is no MDR, like I said, UK does not have MDR. What we do essentially is we provide tech stack to banks and to payment aggregators. And on that, we get paid-for the services we provide. So the — so it’s not the MDR revenue, it is against the technology, like if there is a reconciliation model being used, there is a super transition some that we get paid. If at all there is an entire infrastructure that we are sharing on — on — for you to transit, then there is certain revenue-share.
So what essentially we do is, as a technology service provider, we translate the entire tech cost into a small opex based cost for you and then you pay me on the transaction model.
Rupesh Tatiya
That’s. I understand the SaaS model. Sir, my Question is, question is, I mean, in the value chain, somebody has to charge MDR, right? And then we’ll get a share of that and credit card on UPI, there are some categories where India. So my — so my question is, next year, let’s say, transaction-based revenue you get, what percentage of that will be where the end transaction is where the MDR will be charged.
Deepak Chand Thakur
So other than your account-based transactions, rest all has interchange income. MDR is charged to the merchant, there is an interchange income that goes to bank. And by virtue of being a technology partner in this domain, there is a percentage share of that interchange income which bank pays us. So let’s say, I’ll just give you an example of one of the NCMC prepaid business that we recently structured, structured wherein there is an 50 odd bps for the NCMC travel where when you travel in a metro or somewhere there is a cost of 50 bps, bps 0.50%.
Now the MDR in the interchange in this case can be about — I don’t want to share my number, but let’s say somewhere around 50% to 60 odd percent approximately, where the bank will pay me. Here, the bank, what I do for the banks right from the technology to the acquisition cost to the entire solution domain and the entire, everything is taken care by us. Against that bank will pay me a certain interchange share. That is how it will work. So when it comes to credit card on UPI, there will be certain — a similar story. It’s about 0.7%, 0% and above. And there again, there is a revenue-share.
When it comes to — so credit line has not picked-up, so I don’t want to share about it, but the number is somewhere between 0.70% to 1.2%. And when it comes to normal transactions, there we get paid-for the reconciliation and the overall services that we set with the customer. Coming back to your second part of the question, we see that we’ll be peaking our GMV like we did last year in this half yearly results. Results. And then so we see that we anticipate our payment platform to be going back to the same 70-odd percent revenue-share this financial year coming from 65% to 70% odd from this particular business.
Rupesh Tatiya
So the GMV composition next year you are seeing, it will be similar in terms of where you can charge this interchange, where you will get this interchange. I mean, I don’t know what was the — let’s say your GMV was INR100 in, let’s say, FY ’24 and let’s say, out of 30, I mean I’m just making up some number. Out of 30 of that is where you were eligible to get a intercharge, that proportion will remain same in FY ’26 or that composition of GMV will change?
Deepak Chand Thakur
That will remain same, but the ticket size will go down. So the proportion of
Rupesh Tatiya
— what you’re charging for transaction?
Deepak Chand Thakur
Yeah. Yeah, the cost, let’s say, if your reconciliation cost is 5%, I may get three pace or I may get about four se, but the volume will increase. That is majorly because of the increase in volume happening in the market. So as and when the volume increases, this is the impact which happens. So I’ll just give you an example with one service. So we signed a deal with 5, then we signed a deal with 4 PCA also. So that’s how it will work.
Rupesh Tatiya
But the realization will go down compared to FY ’24.
Deepak Chand Thakur
No, the volume will increase
Rupesh Tatiya
For per transaction realization. I understand the number of transactions will go up. Okay. And then the final question is UPI incentives last year I think was INR1,400 crore INR500 crores and this year’s budget financial year ’26 budget is, it has even gone down further to INR500 crore. And I think what basically government now is saying is the industry now is mature, we don’t want to sort of hand hold you you guys figure out how to make money with such large-volume. So how — I mean, how do you read it into this and which categories do you — I mean, at least my expectation now is that the MDR will come in some categories at least large, large merchants, retailers like that. So what is your view on MDR being charged in UPI transaction in FY ’26 or FY ’27?.
Deepak Chand Thakur
I take lot of positive from this. There is always a backup to such kind of decisions whenever happens. In the sense, it’s easy-to-understand that if India’s digital growth has been due to this instrument, which contributes 82% as on today to the entire digital volume in the country. Then this instrument will definitely have a backup if the mighty incentives have gone down. So very first thing, where-is the mighty incentives now applicable? It is applicable on small-size businesses, which is fair and that is where we should be looking at. Second, when it comes to the contribution coming from the credit card in UPI ecosystem, that is ramping-up. It has an MDR already. So that’s where the revenue will start increasing.
And third, there are lot of new players in the market beyond, Google Pay who are into this business and they are doing virtual credit card only model. So this again increases a tremendous potential around the MDR to be generated from the new instruments in it. And third, like you rightly said, you have to figure out. And we being early in this stage, I wouldn’t say that there was — I don’t think there was anyone else to start getting into this segment than us from that technology domain. So what we analyzed was there is a huge potential in the risk-based modeling which is required to safeguard the payment ecosystem. And for that, we started building the risk engine way too early.
So the result, even before we launch it, we have three orders in-place. So this is nothing but an output of how the maturity comes in the system. So there will be more-and-more models coming up and there will be more-and-more opportunities. And yes, MDR will hit the business, I mean, upward and that will come as and when the instruments start adding value to the system?
Rupesh Tatiya
And maybe just one clarification. So some of these things you are saying, right, credit card and some of these things, this is basically already-existing customers or existing merchants who are used to paying MDR, right? Credit card people are already — merchants are already playing MDR.
Deepak Chand Thakur
No, no. No. I think the issue is
Rupesh Tatiya
In UPI, just let me finish, sorry. The issue in UPI is there is a lot of new people we got to do digital payments through UPI and these people are not used to paying MDR. So how will that transition work? So I just want to separate the two things.
Deepak Chand Thakur
One, it’s not just the existing — existing users, but it is also the new cards issued in the market and that is ramping-up way fast. Second, and it is version only process, okay. So you will see that complete shift in FY ’26. Second, so that has an impact. Secondly, when you say, what was your second one? The MDR contribution, right? So because 90% of UPI people who are using UPI, they have never paid MDR in their life. So how do you make — transition them to start paying MDR? Yeah. So I gave an example. I gave an example. I’m not again going back to MDR. I’m going back to interchange, which is a component of MDR.
So now I’ll just give you an example. Again, don’t quote me for the number. I’m just giving you an idea how it works, okay? So let’s say approximately the interchange is sitting at 0.90% to 1% for a credit-based transaction. In a UK-based transition, the same interchange will not be 0.0% to 1%. It can be one-third or lesser than that, okay. So UPI will still be the most preferred instrument because you are — you are paying one-third of the entire interchange that is payable in the ecosystem well. Secondly, there is a very clear demartation of small, medium, large merchants,
Okay. So wherever there is a small and medium merchant, the call can be taken by the ecosystem. Wherever there are large merchant, if you go to a mall or you go to a shop where you’re spending about INR5,000, INR10,000 rupees and you are still using QR code payment, I think 82% is UPI, then in that case, the merchant does not have a problem. The problem is where you’re transacting for INR100 rupees, you’re transacting for maybe INR500 rupees and the expectation is Is that you pay 1% over it as a cost. Now when you segregate the ecosystem and you understand where there is a paying capacity and again the pay — what you’re paying is one-third of the actual cost, then UPI is the most referred option. So let’s see how it goes, but yes, this is a very positive move-in the industry. I’m just trying to give you an understanding of the ecosystem.
Rupesh Tatiya
Yeah. Thank you. Thank you for very elaborate answers, Deepak, and I’ll come back-in the queue.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Yeah. Thanks.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Akshay from AK Investment. Please go-ahead.
Akshay
Hello. Congratulations, sir, for the good turnaround in-quarter four. So my first question is yeah, so in financial performance, is the worst behind us? And if yes, then how much revenue growth are we expecting in FY ’26 based on all the visibilities and all the things and new products we have talked about, if not for the full-year, but at least for the half-one of this financial year.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Well, I would say that Q3 was worst, it’s behind us. We have taken time, I mean, again, as if you really ask me, the kind of effort which has gone into it, we really want to see the cumulative impact of all the effort which has gone, which I’m seeing coming up very soon, like we have, you know, businesses coming from offline, which we did not have around Q2, Q3 coming in. We have revenue models in SaaS base in risk engine coming in Q3, Q4.
We have payments coming in dollars now in quarters here onwards. So all of this will contribute to the growth. I would still like to — I don’t know, I would still like to avoid the number right now, because we would like to still stay put with the growth number that we have already push from Q3 to Q4. But one thing I can say is that there will be a quarterly growth like the way we did it last year. So that’s the trend that we’ll be currently committing right now? And as and when we go-ahead, the numbers will only multiply.
Akshay
Okay. Sure, sir. And sir, currently, how many total banking clients do we have in our ecosystems and how many are live and how many are yet to live? Like we had talked about the CBI, Central Bank of India. So is it our new customer or is it already onboarded before? No, so Central Bank of India is completely new customer.
Deepak Chand Thakur
We got the order somewhere at the end of Q4, if I’m not wrong and we have done a turnaround within about in less than 30 days to make them go-live in Phase-1, so that we see the SaaS-based number coming in from Central Bank of India from Q1 itself. So that’s the — that’s about CBI. It has gone live, okay. And the execution is still going on and we see that you know the impact coming in quarter-on-quarter as and when the number of merchants grew in the model.
Similar — and back to your first question, we have more than 22 plus banks and payment — payment prepaid instruments PPI holders right now, both are regulated entities in various models. We have added nothing less than seven or eight or I think six or seven clients in a short-time. When it comes to payment platform, we had just one. We are now in three. And when it comes to aggregators, these are all like 15 odd aggregators now signed for the deal.
Akshay
Yeah. Okay. And my last question is on the South Africa deal. So if you can put some color on that as to how — what service — what type of service do we provide and you said that it is a multimillion dollar deal. So the revenue from the same will start occruing from this quarter or when? So can you put some light on that?
Deepak Chand Thakur
So it’s not South Africa, it is in Africa. We cannot disclose the country. Country as for certain agreements. And so the execution has already started this quarter. We are expecting this is going to be seven, eight months execution period, but the revenue will start hitting from Q1 itself. And because there are milestone-based payments. This is about at least six-plus seven years contract for us, what is a bigger advantage for us is this is the first of its technology in Africa, which we believe will be, you know, the big jump for us in the entire African continent. So this is a multi-year on-track now.
Akshay
Right, sir. Right. Sure, sir. And sir, small suggestion from my side is that if you — if this type of large deal happens in our company, then you might — you can share these details to all the investors so that we can get — we can get better idea about it. That was from my side. All the best for the FY ’26 and thank you so much for answering my questions.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Thank you so much, Akshay. I would like to share something here. There was a slight discussion around because we signed you. So although we started earlier, we got it in our hand, the signed document we got it in our hand yesterday. And as per certain policy guidelines, it was supposed to go today. And we decided to lot of things happening together. So I left it to my team to make a decision around it. But yes, your point is taken. We’ll do it the way you’re expecting?
Akshay
Sure, sir. Thank you so much. Yeah.
Operator
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Abhishek Sharma, an investor. Please go-ahead.
Abhishek Sharma
Hello. My question is, could you please explain how the AI machine-learning power tech solution performed in Q4 in terms of client traction, use cases and monetization potential?.
Deepak Chand Thakur
So Abhishek, like I said in Q4, we declared that we have completed our testing and we have trained the module with about 640 million data. So that you — to bring this up, we have taken about 1.5 years, two years of effort because any AI engine needs lot of accuracy and confidence to predict. We are not in a model wherein we are writing and rule engine if it breaches and then it gives the result. We are in a system. What we have built is it predicts anything beyond the rule also. So for that, it took about 1.5 years, two years. Last quarter, we decided to finally do the POC.
And this quarter we have actually got the output. We have already — so existing customers wherever we go. So they are so you know, it solves their regulatory problem in such a way that you know, most of them have said yes and we have three already in our hand. What it does is it evaluates the entire merchant information, it picks up the information from the market and then it also picks up the transaction nature and behavior. This is that it tells you where exactly the challenge can be. So what is the trust score on a particular transition and what is the trust score on a particular merchant, basis which you can start taking decision.
We have further gone to a level where it can predict the liability amount a bank can sit on for a particular, you know merchant, if at all not addressed on-time. So that’s the evolution the system is going through. That’s why even though we have this in our hand three orders, we decided that there will be a massive launch in Q2 odd. And then we will see numbers coming in from Q3.
Abhishek Sharma
Okay. Sir, my next question is what progress was made in Q4 on the pilot projects such as BBPS switch and credit line on UPI?
Deepak Chand Thakur
So credit on UPI, there is not much progress because it’s taking its own — the industry is taking its own time. So as and when it progresses, we’ll work on it. When it comes to BBTS, we have additional orders. I think we have got two new orders from the customers. And at the same time, it has added a very strong funnel to the company. Further, we have also gone into the BBPS corporate payment model, which is a separate engine altogether.
So we have also added BBPS Agent Institute model, which further allows us to get into the new segment. So that’s from the product side and the business side.
Abhishek Sharma
Okay, sir. Thank you, sir. That’s it from my side.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Harish Kumar Gupta from Nirmal Bang Securities Private Limited. Please go-ahead.
Harish Kumar Gupta
Hello, sir. After you last-time Batar taking Jovi last quarter plan issue at last quarter my mentioned was issued is all or like May make a revenue lose. Sorry, of upon last Jew quarter — second-quarter cost revenue 4th-quarter may perfect, yeah. So job, thereby to shy it, but coffee, but I gave her. So I think keep missing it. So is to explain.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Yes, sir, yes. I’ll explain that. Key Johamara Q3K work challenge IFRA. Address multi-bank model. Johame Turant Karnata and it is not like overnight Hutani. I mean what I’m the. I think the call happened somewhere in the month of February — mid-February — aspas came over. The BB, we have just addressed it. We have got the approval in somewhere end of January or some ISCO revamps anyway. So many in, when I almost, Hamara eight quarter, next quarter, we are going to pick it up, which was the quarter that we were sitting on. The Swed gap I had, but like I said, we used to make time block, QCG, Pura rebuild, model change, Herl. So, those two areas maybe add revenue.
So that nothing gets — we have a consistent growth in the organization, which was missing in Q3. Same revenues Q2 Qatar. Ab Uspo anticipate? Yes, still you’re looking at that 50% odd growth in financial year. I said we are sitting here right now in mid February. And I feel that you know, our aspiration is there, but it is very difficult due to the time which is left right now. So many. Like I said, it is all the fundamental value that we are pushing in, but Usmet, Thora, time Sukar, but, the eight revenue impact. Many, milestones out numbers keep up.
Harish Kumar Gupta
Okay. Okay. Thank you. And revenue though each quarter at 28c LA. So are you confident give up a bum 10% quarter-on-quarter growth to open, you have a continue ahead? Sir, many I think the only dip which happened in Q3, scale, Kobi as a, Joe, Maglab Gabi, 10% — 10% minimum. Yeah. What the quarter-on-quarter of exceptional growth IP, post that I right quarter may be deco with a 20% growth here. I like 15% right. I’m very quick cautious, sir, right. But again, I said that don’t put numbers in my mouth., we both a multiple revenue stream at company.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Yeah. So we will definitely give you good results. Don’t worry, sir.
Harish Kumar Gupta
Okay. Thank you, sir. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Vinod Chandra Agarwal, an investor. Please go-ahead.
Vinodchandra Agrawal
Thank you for the opportunity, sir. So I have — the first question is like what would be our total number of employees we have? I think about 330, maybe 335 SAO which. Okay. The second question is about I would like to understand about this market size, estimated market size for each of the product which you have presented. I believe that is only the Indian market size or is it a global market size you have presented?
Deepak Chand Thakur
Up, you’re referring to my presentation which you have shared today?
Vinodchandra Agrawal
Yes, yes. The last quarter and this quarter as well. So for example, let’s say if I take, which is a risk intelligence platform, right, we have a $2 billion market size. So is it in an Indian market size like $2 billion?
Deepak Chand Thakur
Yes, Indian.
Vinodchandra Agrawal
Okay. Okay. And in calculation of —
Deepak Chand Thakur
That’s our calculation of the products, is a much larger ecosystem, okay.
Vinodchandra Agrawal
He bought an AI.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Abhi, SMA Innovations correct and there will be people who will be building their modules. We have already built certain modules, which according to our calculation, like what kind of revenue we are expecting, what is the total transaction volume in the country and where exactly it can cater. So basically the module that we have developed right now, there is a 2 billion market size. Now it can be as and when the module multiplies and the market evolves, it can go beyond that also. So there will be more-and-more innovations, is ad only, there will be new regulatory compliances that will come into picture. So as and when that happens, the market size can only increase, it will not decrease.
Vinodchandra Agrawal
Okay. Okay. And in that additional question is like I see the which caters with risk and intelligence platform, that is banks, PAs and regulators that I can understand. But I don’t understand like what is the merchant? Is it a merchant also requires the risk intelligence because generally merchants is something who pays the MDR or some charges to the banks, right? So do they require the risk intelligence?
Deepak Chand Thakur
Assume that — assume there are utility companies. So assume there are — there are companies who are doing more than two to three payment aggregators taken together. That’s the transition volume they do. So — and then there are companies who face the payment challenges day-in and out to impact sub companies. So there is always a potential there. So merchant may care of there will be certain categories. Let’s say there may be — there may be hospitals, there may be hospitality industry where there can be fraud chargebacks. There can be — there are a lot of businesses which have gone complete online. There is no offline nature at all.
For such businesses, how do you — how do you justify that goods were delivered or you know the payment transactions were — that were made on-time, you know the refunds were done on-time. There is no fraud like goods and services or be risk of the. Okay. And what are you going to do in that case? So there are a lot of impacts there. So our focus right now is banking ecosystem and aggregators and PPIs. These are all regulated entities. And then this will pivot into the merchant problem understanding, which is the next step?
Vinodchandra Agrawal
Okay, okay. Understood. And one more question about like last quarter, like you presented that we have also won the contract for the Middle-East, some technology services, right? So if you can just give some more insight like what kind of a contract is it like something
Deepak Chand Thakur
Based contract with service-based contract so ideally what happens is when you want to enter a new market like what we did in Africa for last one, 1.5 years, we have been consistently nurturing this particular account. So wait for a quarter more, we’ll share more information. So what happens is your nature of product and the solution that you’ve built-in India may not be accepted or may not be feasible to be sold exactly as-is in those markets,, geography, Alagher, Regulation and we are building a solution for the regulated ecosystems.
So in that case, you’re supposed to venture into certain service-based model and then start building the product stack and then get into IPR. So your service-based business we started building the stack and then it will evolve.
Vinodchandra Agrawal
Okay. So work is already started. Is that you are saying?
Deepak Chand Thakur
Yes.
Vinodchandra Agrawal
Okay. Okay. And just last one question is about like generally like right now, we claim like 7%, 8% of the transactions of the UPI transactions, that is what our market-share we have, right? So in a similar way, do we expect like in this all the categories, we will have a similar kind of a market-share or is it something we expect lower or higher kind of that market-share in all of these products.
Deepak Chand Thakur
So when I — got it. So when I say 7% to 8% market-share, that means there is the total transition we are processing in our technology partner domain. It is not related to the platform, which I just discussed with the first-call. That’s a different size altogether. So as and when we grow that size, for sure, that means we are increasing the contract value and we are increasing the contract with the number of banks. That’s Why today, whatever I have shared, I’ve shared that we decided to get into a hosted solution so that we cater to more-and-more banks in the system. Like BBPS we have launched, we wanted to go on a hosted model as well while this UPI. So that’s — that’s how we study the overall requirements. Second, like I said, if there is a first more, the market-share has to be higher. If you’re a late entrant, then market-share will be lesser. So like we anticipate that will give us larger market-share in its segment. I’m not expecting a huge number, but yes, it will not be like 7% odd because UPI, we were very right. We are almost five years after our large competitors who are in-market, as an organization, we went there after five years. So again, there will be a market-share benchmarking for every product that we go, wherever there we get a first entry wherever we have some better understanding, our share will be larger.
Vinodchandra Agrawal
Okay, understood. And one last question is about like this market size, when we said $2 billion, right, annual market size, is it like only for our type of service provider, right, not for the entire ecosystem.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Yes, for our type of service word.
Vinodchandra Agrawal
Okay. So basically, we are saying like this $2 billion that is annually and if we just even say, let’s say, say 5%, 7% market-share, it turns out in a good amount of revenue.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Yeah, that’s the journey.
Vinodchandra Agrawal
Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. That’s all from my side and good luck for the future quarters.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Yes. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Yash from CD Integrated Services Limited. Please go-ahead.
Yash
Hello, sir. I’m from Asset Management. I was continuous tracking a company. So my question is, will our Y-o-Y growth in H1 in terms of number will be — will be grown as we have seen in last two quarters, there is a massive decline in Y-o-Y. Yeah, Y-o-Y growth you will see now this year. From now onwards, we can always — sir, you’re referring to quarterly numbers Y-o-Y. Yes, sir. Like in Q — in like in H1 — in Q1, so the growth was 58 crs. So are we — are we projecting that we will beat that estimate or we need to see?
Deepak Chand Thakur
I can — I can definitely look at a higher number coming in from Q1, Q2. But to be honest, if you benchmark it with the — with the — no, not exactly. So if you benchmark it with the highest number ever achieved by the company in those two quarters, I believe that the role is definitely going there only. It has the direction. But numbers meaning.
Yash
Okay, sir.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Yes, there will be a growth, H1 number?
Yash
Like if you can, if you can give some value.
Deepak Chand Thakur
I committed there is a quarter-on-quarter growth and later on how I said our committed quarter-on-quarter growth to you are committed growth also. But benchmarking a certain number is something that let the results — as and when the results come, we can do that.
Yash
Thank you.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Yeah. Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Ashish Soni from Family Office. Please go-ahead.
Ashish Soni
This talent will grow 30%. So where exactly will this be deployed? Is it for product development or is it for the Africa project or where exactly? Can you throw some light on that?
Deepak Chand Thakur
Yeah. We have a major requirement around the tech and the product domain because if you see what we have shared, there are four new product launches that we are doing in Q1 itself. We are going globally for us to execute so many — and then there are six wins. So for us to execute, there is a need for the tech and the product team. So I feel that about 60-odd percent, 60%, 65% or maybe more will be the tech and product domain.
I think about 30-odd percent of that, maybe 10% 15% will be around sales as and when we expand in new product and new territory, there needs to be more-and-more domain expert to sell the solution. So there will be sales and the rest will be the operations in the other areas.
Ashish Soni
And regarding this Africa project, so do — is it only — do we expect or are we in negotiation or discussion for other geographies, some similar projects or is it like one-off? What’s your sense based on the win?
Deepak Chand Thakur
So we are in discussion with multiple partners because we decided to go with the partner model, channel partner model. We want to play a specific role around OEM so that the IPR and you know those kind of you know the quality ownership is with us and that is where we decided to focus on these solutions alone. We will not be focusing a lot around the service-based revenue, which is where the channel partner locally will help.
And on the product and the core tech side will be playing the role. So we have about three to four-channel partners with whom we are working day-in and out.
Ashish Soni
So this global expansion will be like this with partner-led and your own products, do you think it will come around maybe?
Deepak Chand Thakur
So one is like service-based to get an entry and then selling your product. Is that the strategy if I? You build — so what happens is you — based on the product requirement of the local market, which, let’s say your product may be just about, 40% 50% there. So on a service-based model, you revise the entire platform, it takes time and once that is done, the product shipment is identified and then you are the product owner and the local channel partner is your service provider.
Ashish Soni
Okay. And just one request. In AGM, can you come up with your strategy roadmap for next two, three years, at least what’s your thought process? Because I know you are giving some, but at least annually, because I think you guided earlier, I think one or two quarters back that you were trying to give a yearly guidance sort of thing. So if you can come with that by AGM, that will help all the investors.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Yeah. I will definitely note that and let me work-out on that.
Ashish Soni
Thank you. All the best.
Rupesh Tatiya
Thank you so much.
Operator
Thank you. Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Gopi, an investor. Please go-ahead.
Gopi
Hi, congrats for the good set of numbers.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Thanks, Gopi.
Gopi
I have one specific question around what happened in Q3. So there is one event happened and we lost revenue of Q3. That’s clear from me from the API transaction side. That means in that Q3 whoever was depending on us for payments through this API flow, can I assume that they all got impacted and that’s why they have shifted to some other player? Because when I compare Q4 of last year and Q4 of this year, there is still a lot of gap, right, INR46 crores versus INR24 crore INR25 crores. So we didn’t regain that revenue.
So is it because those customers move to somebody else?
Deepak Chand Thakur
So let me tell you there was a three-pronged strategy. One is you know obviously we took guidance from our Board and all the guys that has been working with us. One is derisking the entire existing model. See, our core is where the revenue comes in and we believe that’s a fundamentally very strong value proposition. That’s why we have grown that well. So derisking for that it was required to first reestablish the you know the payment flows and the overall tech stack with the multiple banks. Now, see, it’s a regulated segment, right? It cannot be overnight change.
Earlier, we did not know-how long it will take. Later on when we got to know — we got on to it, I don’t think there were holidays at all. And then whatever time we have taken, we have been able to reestablish that. But not stopping there, it was important to diversify the Allied services and the similar payment model. Like if you’re in online business, then why you’re not on offline? So let us do the offline as well. If you’re in BBPS, then why you are not ONDC. If you’re on payment stack, why you’re not on red tech. So all that taken together, we have further diversified.
So if you see two slides, we committed that derisking and diversification, whatever we have shared, we have been able to achieve that. So model Wise, we have built that. Third is, obviously for good number of time, investors have been asking us why don’t you go global, you know, and then there is a fitment, there are a lot of efforts which is required, don’t expect us to happen so quickly. But it was all due respect whatever efforts we did, we could not project that it will come early and it has come. So what happens in global market, your margin is better, your — your market expansion is larger, you have — are you more area to work on, so that if at all there is any depth or any issue. Then you have other businesses that you have built to ensure that goes into building the stronger and larger revenue model the organization should have. So that’s the major way to underple it. And that’s what we are.
Gopi
So I have understood how we have solved it. That part is clear to me. I understood how we are ensuring this doesn’t repeat. Just trying to visualize the stickiness of our products. So when some issue happened in Q3, can I assume that the customers who are using us shifted to somewhere else because they need to do things whether we are able to enable it or not agree. So they would have shifted it was somewhere else. And can I assume that it takes time to bring them back?
Deepak Chand Thakur
Yeah, it does. That’s the reason why our Q4 number otherwise would have been much larger because we have taken that time to be. That’s why. Otherwise, it was like you know, one-side is your — you have banks, other side is you have to reestablish, retest, redo everything.
Gopi
So the peak of, let’s say last year, whichever quarter we had the peak, it’s because of, let’s say, I’m assuming majorly because of the huge transaction we have enabled through API. So when we get these customers back, ideally that peak should come back-in this year, right?
Deepak Chand Thakur
Yeah, yeah. Absolutely.
Gopi
Okay. Got it. But we don’t want to commit the numbers assuming.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Yes.
Gopi
Got it.
Deepak Chand Thakur
I mean, see, it’s all positive. It’s going upward, but what I’ve seen is that you know, we really want to put those good numbers in-place and give it and bring it back. So if I would have committed anything over me in Q4, then it would have had a — even after 20% growth, I don’t think it would have taken it — anyone would have taken it right. So that’s why there is a — there is a very strong process which has been built. I think you should focus on those kind of fundamentals with the organization has. Probably earlier no one was looking into it. Today, it’s all there. It’s right there.
So you can pick-up from there and it is easier to then anticipate whether we are taking the right decisions.
Gopi
Yes, that is very clear. I’m also very excited from the product pipeline that have seen. And also, I think we have taken all the steps to ensure that future is very bright and we never have the situation. So thanks for that.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Thanks. Yeah.
Operator
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Nishant from Goldman Sachs. Please go-ahead.
Nishant
Yeah, hi. I just had one question, which is already answered like basically regarding the guidance which you have not given. So we’ll wait for Q1 and see if we can get some guidance.
Deepak Chand Thakur
So Nishant.
Nishant
Yeah. Thank you.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Thanks.
Operator
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Vasu from TIA. Please go-ahead.
Shrinivas
Hi, Deepak. Sorry, great set of numbers.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Thank you again.
Shrinivas
My question is about BBPS, B2B, you said it is a fast-emerging space and targeting 2.5 billion market-share there. Could you share what is your go-to-market strategy, like how many billers are merchants are onboarded or in funnel? Similarly, you are saying O&DC platform is another 10 billion market opportunity. So how many merchants or banks are in this?
Deepak Chand Thakur
So and B2B, I think we have — we will be completing our — will be completing this in Q1 by 30th June, which I have mentioned in one of my slides. I see that this is absolutely new. So whatever offline market we have in India, that is the entire set of targets that we have, we intend to continue exploring the opportunity from the partners that we have. It may be our payment aggregators, it may be the corporate new banks, it be the CBS vendors, all those whom we have tied-up. So the funnel will come from these places.
There will be revenue, which will be generated based on the overall transitions in voice forces and the you know and the amount settled in the — in the BBPS corporate payment. Second is, when it comes to ONDC, we have picked-up the financial services segment, which has mutual fund, which has your insurance and then we have, you know personal loan as well. Now availability of financial services on this segment allows us to generate revenue and does a direct market entry. For this, for sure, we have a couple of banks where we are going aggressively.
And then NBFCs, fintech, these are all guys. I think we have mentioned that as well. These are all guys who will be direct customers, right? So, yeah, that’s the overall growth plan in the ONDC space because we are just focusing on buyer app. We don’t want to right now jump into supplier. That’s a little bit tedious. In the buyer app, because we are in this space wherein we have access to merchant ecosystem, this allows us easier entry.
Shrinivas
Okay. So my next question is about small technical question. How do you manage core banking integrations for the small banks or hosted — for hosted model for this corporate bank? Because most of these banks are having legacy systems without any APIs.
Deepak Chand Thakur
We have a middleware ISO2 XML which clearly so your entire legacy is ISO entry I guess and then your new-age digital payments work on XMS so we have our own IP which has been built to ensure that such legacy system has you know has no impact so it may be Jason it may be any format we can get the converter in-place.
Shrinivas
Something like SDK already.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Okay. It’s a middleware. So let’s say you are communicating from a CBS to Myers system on an ISO. So CBS has an ISO, okay, let’s say — let’s say top three are your and your — which is third one, TCS banks. Bags, Flex tube and which is which is the when I forgot that name. Name of. Okay. So majorly you have ISO-based message transmission from these guys because that’s the model in which it was built. So now your digital payments are on XML. So between CBS and my digital payment switch, there will reside a middleware. This metalware ensures that the communication between two systems is rightly exchanged. So we have done integration with all these three names which I have mentioned.
So we have ready Middleware. So tomorrow, if there is any bank which has either of these core banking solutions. So we know what kind of processing needs to be done. So it’s all because we have been in this space for quite a long-time now.
Shrinivas
Okay. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Hardik Gandhi from HBMG Shares and Securities Private Limited. Please go-ahead.
Hardik Gandhi
Hello, sir. Am I audible?
Deepak Chand Thakur
Yeah. Tell me.
Hardik Gandhi
Yeah. So just wanted to know, I’m really happy the change in tone from Q1 to Q4 and congratulations on the new product launches. But someone does not have that can you confirm
Deepak Chand Thakur
It’s my voice,
Hardik Gandhi
It’s my can hear you. Can you hear me? Or is the voice breaking?
Deepak Chand Thakur
This is this better?
Hardik Gandhi
Yeah. So I was just saying that congratulations on the amazing product-line and the change in tone from Q3 to Q4. So just wanted to know for someone who does not understand your products that well, for me to gauge factors which pivot your company towards a good direction and a bad one. So just wanted some guidance from you on the — on for a lay man basis that what things do you want to happen and what things will be — are which you don’t want to happen? Kind of kind of the kind of a swat analysis, but like opportunities and threats so that in case if going-forward we see some trend happening, we can directly relate to the company and the future performance. If that makes sense, sorry.
Deepak Chand Thakur
How do I — so let me try to you know, answer this. So very first thing, if there was a single-line of trend, then we would have been in Q3. I mean, that’s what we did in Q2, right? So we don’t want to be sitting on those kind of trends. What we try to do is we try to give more clarity to our investors as in what is the segment that we are targeting and what is the size of that segment? So it helps you understand whether that particular segment is growing or not.
So when you go-ahead, you do your study, you’ll come to know that, oh, okay, what is that RBI is declaring in their vision for the next three years in payments and that particular vision may carry certain digital payment growth story. This is going on for a decade now. So we gave you an idea about what is the number, which is what is the trend that is going on in the market. Now if I tell you about the online payments, you have the number.
If I tell you that I’m getting into offline payments, you’ll easily get the number around that also. You know-how many offline merchants have been digitized in this country. If I tell you about, I think that’s a niche, you’ll have to rely on the number that we have provideration. But you can look at the fraud which is increasing in India. Maybe that will give you an analysis. If the fraud has increased by twice, that means the market size was also increased by twice.
Hardik Gandhi
Correct. So on the, sorry, sorry to cut you. But on the, is it more related to cyber security or is it very much related to transaction cost transaction costs? Okay. Okay. Okay. And just to understand more about the product-line, how — like given all the products we have, how difficult or easy would it be for someone to replicate that and to develop the relations which you’ve developed with the customers given that there are so many new product launches and we’ve been in the market for some time.
Deepak Chand Thakur
So the customers we have right now, I mean, there are customers who are with us for a decade now. I mean their customers who have recently joined us and then started with one-product and multiplied with multiple products. I mean, if we have more than two, three products per customer now. So I would say that, yes, it is not very difficult to build the product. What’s important is what value-added services or what kind of you know expertise you add to the solution.
I mean, it’s not about just building a processing engine or an API. It’s about what makes sure that the API works and what makes sure that you know, all the compliances and all the other areas are rightly taken care of. So I would say that being an SME in this segment creates a lot of value-add, which allows us to visualize what next. So that’s something that enough to diverge. So it would be correct for me to assume that in future, you want to be one of you rather than one of many. Yes. We would like to be the innovator and we would like to be setting the trend?
Hardik Gandhi
But just — sorry, sorry to contradict on this part that given that you want to be the innovator, do you think a lot of lot of your money — money, time and resources will go into innovating something, which might end-up just changing because of the regulatory change or rather than following a following something established. Sorry, just putting a…
Deepak Chand Thakur
Yeah. So you should know there that we just don’t pick-up like in any left, right, there has to be a need. There has to be very, very strong calling for it. Was not something we just picked-up. We got to know the kind of frauds happening. We know we have the data points. We know what is happening in the industry with our customers. So there has to be a need to innovate something. So we just — we are not like suddenly we do something else.
There is a — there was a discussion around Internet interoperability somewhere in April when the ex-governor of RBI, Mr Ganta does declared that this piece is missing. So we decided to stay put on it and whenever there is an opportunity get into it. So we ensured we invest into it because once that happens, it becomes a compliance requirement for any bank. So you invest in such pieces. So yes, the decision is purely based on the need and we have the right guidance from Board coming in for what kind of R&D budget we should have and what kind of new product investment we should be doing?
Hardik Gandhi
Understood. Understood. Thank you for the elaborate answer. All the best for the future. Thank you so much.
Deepak Chand Thakur
Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, with that, we conclude the question-and-answer session. I now hand the conference over to Mr Harshal from Advisors Private Limited for closing comments.
Harshil Ghanshyani
Thank you. Thank you, sir. Thank you everyone for joining the conference call of NPSC Limited. If you have any queries, you can write us at info either at kirinadvisors.com. And once more, thank you management. Thank you for participant, and thank you, everyone. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. On behalf of Kirin Advisors Private Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us and you may now disconnect your lines