Mold-Tek Packaging Limited (NSE: MOLDTKPAC) Q3 2026 Earnings Call dated Feb. 09, 2026
Corporate Participants:
Unidentified Speaker
Lakshmana Rao — Chairman and Managing Director
Analysts:
Unidentified Participant
Deepak — Analyst
Shankar — Analyst
Abhishek Navalgun — Analyst
Akshay — Analyst
Amit Khetan Floung — Analyst
Chirag — Analyst
Shanskar — Analyst
Deepak — Analyst
Deepak Saha — Analyst
Presentation:
operator
Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the Moltech Packaging Limited Q3FY26 earnings conference call hosted by MK Global Financial Services Limited as a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen only mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing Star then zero on your touchstone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Mohit Dodeja. Thank you. And over to you sir.
Unidentified Speaker
Yeah. Hi. Good evening everyone. I would like to welcome Mr. Lakshman Rao, chairman and Managing Director and thank him for this opportunity.
Unidentified Speaker
I shall now hand over the call.
Unidentified Speaker
To him for the opening remarks. Over to you sir.
Lakshmana Rao — Chairman and Managing Director
Good afternoon everybody. Thank you very much for joining in our Q3 results call. You might have already seen the results.
Lakshmana Rao — Chairman and Managing Director
Published on BSE and NSE that that.
Lakshmana Rao — Chairman and Managing Director
We have the EBITDA by almost 20%. In the nine months compared to the previous nine months and sales are up by around 12% in value terms. And however in the Q3 to Q3 the sales volumes are up by 6% and EBITDA is also up by 14%. You know traditionally every year Q3 is our weakest quarter. But things started moving up right from January itself.
Lakshmana Rao — Chairman and Managing Director
We have more than double digit growth in January this month, just this January and order book looks pretty strong for February also. So going forward I think we will be back to normal level of 12. To 15% volume growth which is possible in Q2 and Q1 general Q4 and Q1. So going next six months is our busy season. So things will be start looking up and we hope to catch up with. The busy demand as we are well geared up in our terms.
Lakshmana Rao — Chairman and Managing Director
As I mentioned in my press release, we have completed mostly the consolidation of manufacturing units in Hyderabad where we used to have five units and now that’s going to be only two units. Unit one and ten. The printing unit is also now accommodated.
Lakshmana Rao — Chairman and Managing Director
In one of the blocks of Sultanpur Hyderabad unit and unit four which is a small unit catering mainly to Asian pains is also moved to Sultanpur B block. So now the 5 units are going to be only just 2 units starting from already 2 units are absorbed. But the unit 4 will be absorbed from March onwards. So this will reflect better operational efficiencies, cost controls, direction and movement of goods and also personnel. So these impacts will be visible hopefully from next quarter. So and also another positive sign is.
Lakshmana Rao — Chairman and Managing Director
Wipe generation with whom we have signed a MoU for unique, I mean for developing their product patents and ideas in India for projects and other applications. We have received first two component drawings and designs have been started and pilot molds will be ready by end of this month. One of them will be ready by end of February, one by March and their commercial feasibility will be tested thereafter. And hopefully by end of Q1, we will be having commercial moulds producing these components for not only European markets, but these products can also be sold to Indian market under our MoU with vibe.
Lakshmana Rao — Chairman and Managing Director
So this is another development and coming to Pharma.
Lakshmana Rao — Chairman and Managing Director
We are now have more than 25 clients cleared our premises, audited our premises and cleared them for production. However, only less than half of them started commercial pickup and the rest will start in the next coming months, ensuring a good volume growth in the coming quarters for Pharma as well.
Lakshmana Rao — Chairman and Managing Director
This is the future outlook and I.
Lakshmana Rao — Chairman and Managing Director
Think more can be discussed over the question and answer session. I put this call back to Anushka to arrange for the question and answer session.
Questions and Answers:
operator
Thank you. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press STAR in one on their touch tone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press STAR and two participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. We take the first question from the line of Deepak from Nirmal Bank Institutional Equities. Please proceed.
Deepak
Hi, I’m audible.
Lakshmana Rao
Yes.
Deepak
Okay. Hi. Thanks for the opportunity. So sir, the first question question is on the MOU that we have signed with Light Generation. If you just can spin a little bit about the nature of the product, what will understand. That? And we have anything to anything similar to do with say the new products where the leakages are very critical in terms of, you know, that we deliver in terms of safety of liquid, even in terms of the dust particles. So if you can just elaborate little bit on the nature of the product then secondly on the MoU side with Swiggy, do you see that kind of a product more of an, you know, the churn would be materially higher compared to the churn that we have say on the other categories of food.
So these are the first two questions. Yeah.
Lakshmana Rao
Why product details now I can’t divulge because under the MOU we need to.
Lakshmana Rao
Develop the molds, establish the product quality before we make any announcement.
Lakshmana Rao
But I can tell you that this.
Lakshmana Rao
Product also has applications in India in our client segments as well. And this is adding Quite a bit of value in terms of application and user friendliness. So once these products are established and developed, probably by April or May when we discuss on Q4 results, probably I will be in a position to throw better light.
Lakshmana Rao
But I can tell you these products.
Lakshmana Rao
Are extremely user friendly, adding high value and they are patented by Vibe and we have the right to use the patent here in India and we see applications very much welcomed here also in Indian industry.
Lakshmana Rao
However, I don’t say that this is.
Lakshmana Rao
A hundreds of crores worth of value.
Lakshmana Rao
But certainly it will be tens of.
Lakshmana Rao
Crores which over a period of next one year we can see its potential.
Deepak
Got it sir. Secondly, coming to the overall volume number at the starting of the year we were of the view say 43 to 45,000 total volume we can achieve nine months. We are say 31,000. Now looking at Q4 even if we go say a little bit of only double digit, is it fair to ENA for you to be say of the guided range of 43 to 45 you would be on the lower, closer to the lower threshold of the guided range. Or you think since you highlighted the momentum is strong at the starting of the year we can have a little bit of a better quarter than expected.
And Q4 numbers can be relatively better than what we had in Q1 in terms of volume.
Lakshmana Rao
Probably we’ll be matching Q1 in the Q4.
Lakshmana Rao
We were not able to cross it. The Q1 is pretty strong. We had 11,400 tons production and sale in that quarter.
Lakshmana Rao
Hopefully we’ll match it and bring bring.
Lakshmana Rao
It to 42.5 thousand is as against 44, 45 what we initially projected.
Lakshmana Rao
But still that will be somewhere around.
Lakshmana Rao
11% volume growth a bit less than what I anticipated due to extended rainfall in the first especially in the second quarter.
Deepak
Got it sir. And so on the pharma side if we see the traction remains strong and only nine months already we have done say 25 crore and just want to understand the Q3 seasonality trend that we have. Does it apply to pharma as well? And given that 4Q we should go back to the same normal, normal run rate of 10 crore, 11 crore that you had. Again given that 35 crore kind of earlier target that we had should be attained.
Lakshmana Rao
Yes, we will be achieving 35 crores.
Lakshmana Rao
Though we are at around 25 crores in the first three quarters.
Lakshmana Rao
As you correctly said, Q3 is a.
Lakshmana Rao
Dampener for pharma as well.
Lakshmana Rao
This time it is little more because.
Lakshmana Rao
Of the uncertainty of tariffs from us. There was some uncertainty of volume pickups from the pharma industry. But I think now that it is clarified it might start picking up really good. And whether it is done or not. For the Indian market also winter months. Are low for EV tubes which are the major segment which have impacted in Q3. But looking at the strong order book. In January, middle of January onwards we feel we may able to cross or at least reach the figure of 35 crores for the full year. And next year we kept a target of 50 to 5055 crores.
Lakshmana Rao
That is again a 40 to 45% growth on the current year number we have taken. And that will be adding sizeably to the bottom line as well because we are now way above the breakeven point.
Deepak
Got it sir, last question before I further on the news side, if you can call out, I mean on the volume side we have seen continuous decline. We know that this is the space where we have faced some challenges. But any incremental sign as further discuss that we had with clients of volumes growing a little bit on the higher side or improving here on this one last question. Thank you for the opportunity sir.
Lakshmana Rao
Yeah, lubricants we are noticing a dip. Considerable dip actually even in this quarter we ended up with a minus 10% volume growth in lubricant. It’s basically because we are not actively. Participating in the very low grade lubricant market of DEF loops which are mainly urea based lubricants. So those areas have become very low cost product range where Maltech is not inclined to keep its capacity.
Lakshmana Rao
So that is one of the reasons and general trends in lubricant this year is down. I don’t know much about how the lubricant company per se has performed but. Due to five to six months of. Extended monsoon this year the movement of. Goods and hence lube consumption has dipped. Is what the news I have. So as whereas the clients like Castrol we still have growth, positive growth but. There are clients where we have noticed dip in their volumes. So that may be universal in reason. Another reason as I said is we. Are letting go some of the low end loop opportunities.
Deepak
Thank you.
operator
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Shankar from Iraya Capital. Please proceed.
Lakshmana Rao
Hello.
Shankar
Yeah, hi sir, thanks for taking the taking my question. So while you have shared some color around how the growth trends and shaping up. Can you just share more color around like as you said that 11% volume growth but what kind of sales growth we can expect in Q4 and if you can share a Further outlook for next year if you are in a position. So that’s my first question.
Lakshmana Rao
Yeah. This year we may close the year. At 870 crores top line. So for next year we certainly have. A target to cross thousand crores, that is capital. I mean the internal target is to cross thousand crores comfortably. So that’s close to 13, 14% volume growth. And going by the trends of aditya Birla Group ABG which has grown around 21% in Q3, we are confident with their Mahad plant also going full stream we may continue to see a good double digit growth in Grassim.
Lakshmana Rao
And with the RCP issues with Asian. Paints being settled we also started seeing volumes of Asian paint picking up. From January onwards. The RCP they want 40 to 50% recycled plastic in their paints due to the government statutory obligation. So we have successfully developed that formula and able to start supplies from December and in January onwards it will give them confidence that Amaltech will be pioneered or at least first one of the first pail manufacturer to meet the statutory compliance. So with that being done we hope Asian paints which is hardly 3,4% volume growth can go into double digits in the next financial year which will be a big pull for the rest of our other segments which are all definitely in the double digits, healthy double digits.
Lakshmana Rao
So we are confident next year also.
Lakshmana Rao
We are aiming 12 to 15% volume growth. And once we achieve that we may probably cross the benchmark of 1000 crores top line. And this year EBITDA will be now as you know for the nine months it’s 125 crores and hopefully we close this at around 170 crores is the target for the current year up from 144 last year. So that’s again a 2022 percent EBITDA growth. And next year we will comfortably cross 200 or maybe 215, 200 to 210 crore IBITA.
Shankar
Understood and thank you for such detailed information. And from EBITDA to pat, can you share some color around growth like where this operating leverage you are expecting to flow in from EBITDA to PAT level.
Shankar
Like
Lakshmana Rao
yeah, in these nine months we. Have declared 18% PAT increase from 44.3 crores in the last nine months to 52.25. And earnings per share also gone up from 13.3 to 15.75. So we have healthy growth at PAT. Level also which is around 18% and probably hopefully next year it should hit 20% growth. This is for the nine months period. So hopefully for the full year we’ll. Be in a position to reach somewhere around 7075 crores, 73 to 75 crores PAT up from 60 last year. So that’s around 20% PAT growth similar to EBITDA growth.
Lakshmana Rao
So similar growth we can anticipate for.
Lakshmana Rao
Next financial year also as well.
Shankar
Understood. So you are saying that similar 20% growth we can expect for both for this year as well as next year at the pat level?
Lakshmana Rao
Yes.
Shankar
Got it. And can you share some color around Capex that you would be closing this year? Are there any changes in your guidance as you stated earlier in Capex for if you have any estimation for next year?
Lakshmana Rao
Yes, we have made our budgets during. The last month for the next financial year and the good news is the Capex is going to come down considerably next year because all greenfield projects are more or less completed but for a little bit work at bahad. So next year the major expansion will.
Lakshmana Rao
Be in Pharma wherein we anticipate to spend at least around 25 crores and we may enter into a couple of new products like eyedroppers and maybe nasal droppers towards the end of the year. Nasal sprays. So these two products already idroppers is in a pilot model development stage but the project will be out only in the second half of 26:27. And towards the end of the year we hope to enter into Nafal sprays based on our market research if there is a positive demand gap.
Lakshmana Rao
But for ophthalmic we are definitely going ahead.
Lakshmana Rao
Already pilot mounts are under development and as we go forward Pharma will at least keep growing at least around 30% thereafter after we hit 5055 crores next year thereafter we have a target of 30 to 35% volume growth coming from Pharma and very heartening thing is majority of our clients who have started buying commercial are very happy with our quality and timely supplies and a couple of them are even asking us to set up warehouses near their plant to enhance our business.
Lakshmana Rao
So these trends give me a lot. Of confidence that we can become a reasonably big player in Pharma in the next two to three years time.
Shankar
Understood. Can you just repeat the Capex rupees.
Lakshmana Rao
Per Capex for the. Sorry I didn’t tell that last year capex was 140 crores, this year it will be close to 120 crores and next year target is 80 to 85 crores.
Shankar
This year will be at 140, next year is 82.
Lakshmana Rao
No no no. Last year was 140 this year it is closing at around 120 and for next year the target is 80 to.
Lakshmana Rao
85 crores dot.
Shankar
Understood. Okay, thank you sir. That I’ll move back to the Q and A.
operator
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Abhishek Navalgun from Centrum Broking. Please proceed.
Abhishek Navalgun
Yeah, hi sir, thanks for the opportunity. The first question on ABG in paints, in the last earnings call you mentioned that I think in 1 inch we have done around 2900 tons of volumes, broadly 30% of the total paints volume and we have guided for around 6,500 tons by end of the year. I mean full year number. So where are we after nine months? I mean what’s the number in broadly 3Q because you mentioned about some 21% growth in this quarter ABG but broadly tonnage wise where do we stand now?
Lakshmana Rao
Yeah, ABG this quarter was around 1480 tons and so far it is around 4400 tons. And we hope to hit the 6000 mark in the by end of this year.
Abhishek Navalgun
Sure. And the 10,000 tons capacity that we mentioned about ABG. So this includes even the Mahad one or it is only the existing two.
Lakshmana Rao
Including Mahar.
Abhishek Navalgun
Including Mahar. Right. Okay.
Lakshmana Rao
Yeah. So currently this year we may be utilizing only 60 of that capacity and. We hope next year onwards it will be about 70.
Abhishek Navalgun
Sure, sure.
Abhishek Navalgun
And since we’ll be moving ABG to Mahad, have we, I mean got some indication from Asian paints also because you mentioned the RCP thing. But apart from that, I mean the volume Satara plant was like underutilized for quite some time earlier. So do you expect that the ramp up from Asian paints will be far stronger from maybe upcoming quarters once we move the production for ABG to.
Lakshmana Rao
Yeah, once that RCP issue has been. Resolved, the numbers started going up and we could develop a recipe which is adopting 40% RCEP which is a government statutory compliance. Thereafter we are now seeing the numbers moving up and we hope we will gain a double digit growth in Asian prints in the coming year.
Abhishek Navalgun
Sure. Any possibility for market share gains there? Because you said you are the only player who has crack that.
Lakshmana Rao
No, no, no, it’s not necessarily.
Lakshmana Rao
The others also will be simultaneously cracking that recipe because obviously the suppliers will go to all the, all the manufacturers. Hence it will be couple of weeks plus or minus. So it won’t be a great advantage as such. But once this particular thing has been. Done, we’ve been, we are confident that we’ll get back our old percentage.
Abhishek Navalgun
Okay. And the capex for Mahad broadly out of 8085 crore, how much would be for Mahar broadly?
Lakshmana Rao
No, Mahad is hardly anything because already.
Lakshmana Rao
Those machinery are being installed at Satara. So what is happening? There is only the shed and auxiliary equipment worth around maximum 5 crores. But the other plants tool room itself. Replacement of moulds itself around 20, 25. Crores for every year. And injection molding machines worth around 9 crores are planned for all the plants put together. Especially for north plant where we are. Seeing a good traction for our thin wall and Q packs. So that is causing confidence to go up to capture the north market.
Lakshmana Rao
So there is injection molding enhancement of. Capacity in Panipat not for ABG but mainly for the sake of Q packs and food and FMCG products. And around 25 to 30 crores will go towards Pharma. That is why the next year Capex could be controlled within 80 to 85 crores.
Abhishek Navalgun
And last question from my side. I mean since you mentioned Panipat FNF facility, so where are we in terms of the client engagement there? Because have we finalized any clients there?
Lakshmana Rao
Yeah, yeah, not one. We have at least eight to 10 clients already started buying from us. And we in this season we expect it to go up to 25 to 30 clients in both Qpack and Tindal put together. And we are expecting that numbers to double in this coming season.
Abhishek Navalgun
Any categories which you would like to highlight if not names,
Lakshmana Rao
all the categories. Be it confectionery, be it yogurts, ice creams, protein powder, edible oils, cashews, basmati, rice like Q PEC in the case of Q pec. So there are several ghee. All these features we are introducing to start with six ThinWal products immediately and. Another six by June, July, that is for the festival season. So there will be 24 molds, that. Is 12 sets operating in the north by June which will be which is currently four sets. So there will be huge increase in the food and FMCG in that segment. I am expecting.
Lakshmana Rao
Already we are seeing a very good. Trend in QPAC sales which are established six, seven months ago. And you all know that Pinwell started only in September, October. So that also is picking up and we see a good improvement in the coming season.
Abhishek Navalgun
Okay, so the element of seasonality will be relatively lower right from Panipat FNS.
Lakshmana Rao
Not necessarily. Again, Q3 will continue to be our. Bad, I mean least season because all the consumption of paint, you name it, or sweets or ice creams, they all come down in winter. So generally Q3 continues to be our weakest quarter. Next weakest will be Q2, but this year it was pretty little worse than. Previous growth rates because of extended range.
Lakshmana Rao
Otherwise Q2 also would be moderately good. And always Q3 is the worst quarter. And that is over now. So hopefully next three quarters will be seeing a good volume. Guys.
Abhishek Navalgun
Okay, I’m sorry. Sultanpur capacity utilization as far as FNS broadly would be 50, 60% or lower.
Lakshmana Rao
It is around 60 now and it.
Lakshmana Rao
Will go up now.
Abhishek Navalgun
Got it.
Lakshmana Rao
Yeah, but it has to go up. Now because all the mission they have been erected in one premises and. There. Will be, you know, fungibility in case of some machines are idle easily, moulds can be put on and then other products can be produced. So this gives a lot of fungibility. And better capacity utilization at Sultanpur.
Abhishek Navalgun
Sure.
Abhishek Navalgun
Thank you so much and all the best.
Lakshmana Rao
Thank you.
operator
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Pratyush Damani, an individual investor. Please proceed.
Unidentified Participant
Hello.
Lakshmana Rao
Yeah, yeah,
Unidentified Participant
yeah. Thank you for the opportunity. This one question. Once all the greenfield plants are up and all the factories are running, what would be the peak revenue potential?
Lakshmana Rao
Peak level? We can, with the current missionary and.
Lakshmana Rao
Plant itself we can reach 1,200. But what happens is the capacity utilization won’t be steady beyond 75%. Typically beyond 7580 you will tend to have mismatch of jars and caps. And typically in injection molding anything above 75 is excellent. So I can safely say with the machines that are currently there, thousand crores can be reached and we are adding 21 more machines in the next three months and for first six months of next financial year. So that will further add another 10 to 12% of the capacity. That means up to 1150 to 1200 crores. 1200 crores you can easily say is possible with the existing and planned missions.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, but so like.
Lakshmana Rao
Sorry,
Unidentified Participant
yeah, injection molding. Sorry. Oh, hello.
Lakshmana Rao
Yeah.
Unidentified Participant
Yes. I’m saying you mentioned that around 75% plus is a very good number for injection molding. So just wanted to understand what kind of difficulty do you face or do manufacturers face to scale UP utility beyond 75 and injection molding.
Lakshmana Rao
Yeah. What happens is the product mix won’t. Be perfectly matching your machinery capacities and. Jars and lids are not completely fungible. Manufacturing a lid and a jar machine is not viable. You can do it, but it is. Expensive and won’t give the yield. So sometimes you may have to use a bigger machine for a smaller component. Thereby capacity utilization effectively will come down. So and. So that is where anything above 75% injection molecular capacity is bare considered good. And also you do not use the entire machine’s capacity.
Lakshmana Rao
For example, a machine is rated to. Produce 1200 grams component you may produce from 700 to 1200. So effectively your output volume will not. Be as good as your capacity. And sometimes the width of the mould or depth of the mould component is different. Then you need to use a bigger. Machine but you get a lower productivity. So all this makes in injection molding capacity utilization. Anything about 75% is a very good deal.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, and in pharma what would be the ideal capacity or utilization level?
Lakshmana Rao
Same again. There also injection molding and IBM machines are used. IBM is blow molding machine. There also you have similar limitations. So anything about 75% is a good utilization.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, fine. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Akshay from Canada Mutual Fund. Please proceed.
Akshay
Yes, sir. So thank you for the opportunity for just one question. This is regarding the movie that we have signed with Suzee. Can you just talk a bit more about it? Like what is the incremental opportunity that we get from here? And also what kind of margins can we expect from here? Would it be like say FNS kind of a margins or it would be like a paint of a margin?
Lakshmana Rao
Which one you’re talking about?
Lakshmana Rao
Vibe. Sorry?
Akshay
Swiggy, sir. Swiggy MOU that we have done.
Lakshmana Rao
Oh, Swiggy. Swiggy will be similar to our food and FMCG margins. Basically they are buying restaurant packs and. Food packs for their brands which they promote. So they preferred, they put us as. A preferred vendor for packaging products. So they will be directing their restaurants. And partners to buy the packs from Maltech. So we have been selected as a preferred vendor for 3G restaurants. So that will be similar to our restaurant packs, that is food and FMCG. EBITDA, which is around 70 to 80 rupees per kg.
Akshay
And any volume estimate or assumptions that we can have for this 100 tons or so for the next year.
Lakshmana Rao
Next year again we are planning hoping to do around 12 to 14% volume growth. That’s why from 870 crores we are. Hoping we’ll be crossing the thousand crore benchmark.
Akshay
Okay, I was looking more from the Swiggy perspective. Like what incremental volumes can come from Swiggy?
Lakshmana Rao
Oh, Swiggy. I can’t say now because it’s just a very recent mou. They have to spread the news and some of the restaurants have to be contacted and it will be like one more client. I don’t think it will be very. Huge addition unless we see it for next couple of quarters. I can’t comment on it, but the. Reach will be very big and this. Will enable us to reach more and more restaurants and food delivery partners more rapidly. So we have to wait and see. Just it was done a month ago, 15, 20 days.
Akshay
Okay, thank you so much.
operator
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Shiv, an individual investor. Please proceed. I would request shift to unmute and then speak. We will proceed with the next participant. We take the next question from the line of Amit Khetan Floung from Lipham Capital. Please proceed.
Amit Khetan Floung
Hi sir, thank you for taking my question. Can you. You talked about the decline in lubricant segment. How much of that is sort of cyclical and should come back next year. How should we look at the volumes. In the lubricant segment for FY27?
Lakshmana Rao
See, actually I missed one point when I answered that question. Here I want to add it. One of the reasons why we have. A drop in the loops segment is we lost the tender for bpcl. The BPCL tender was completed last year and this year BPCL tender has not come in our favor. So that is one of the reasons. Why there is a decline in the loop numbers, especially in this quarter. Because till last year, second quarter, I mean few months ago the tender has been completed and we couldn’t get the tender for the current. That is one of the reasons for the loop drop.
Lakshmana Rao
But I think overall nine months the. Drop is not as steep as 10%. It is somewhere around 6, 7% I guess. So hopefully next year we should come. Back to at least recover this loss because we have added weed all recently and they started picking up volumes for last couple of months and it may. Not be as big as bpcl, but to some extent it can fill up the gap.
Amit Khetan Floung
Understood. And can you talk a little bit. About the competitive intensity in general and specifically in the food segment?
Lakshmana Rao
As I mentioned to you in the. Last couple of quarters ago, there is a competitive activity in IML segment now. But with our variety of robos and huge range of product and multilocational supply. We are in a position to retain. Most of our clients and even add. Several of them in this current year. Last year we suffered the shortage of printing capacity which we have completely eliminated. By adding quite a bit of capacity in printing and lamination which has now become handy and enabling us to to deliver goods in time which has again Gained confidence of even smaller and mid sized companies and the growth is again back to mid teens.
Lakshmana Rao
So going forward with north coming in. Picture into production full swing will be sure of mid teen growth in food and FMCG. While QPAC is continue to grow around 25 to 2030%. Basically because the court cases we have put on competitors copying our patented design are bearing fruit. And recently a high court bench has given a order in our favor stopping three of our competitors who have infringed our patented model.
Amit Khetan Floung
Understood. Lastly, if you can, it will be. Very helpful if you can share what. Is the EBITDA per kg for the different segments? Just a rough thing.
Lakshmana Rao
I think I’ve been sharing that for the paint and pails and even Q.
Lakshmana Rao
Packs it is in the region of around 30 to 35 rupees and food and FMCG it’s close to 70 to 80 rupees. And pharma it’s about 120 to 140 depending upon the product range
Amit Khetan Floung
and lubricant should be higher than 30 to 35. Right.
Lakshmana Rao
Little better than paints.
Amit Khetan Floung
Okay. All right. Thank you and always
Lakshmana Rao
thank you.
operator
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Chirag from Keynote Capital. Please proceed.
Chirag
Thank you for the opportunity. My first question is related to the paint segments. What will be the volume growth in paint segment X?
Lakshmana Rao
Overall growth is 10.3%. In that ABG alone has contributed about.
Lakshmana Rao
21%. That is around 250 tons. So out of. ABG is contributed 21% of the 50%.
Chirag
If you could provide the volume of ABG in last year.
Lakshmana Rao
Yeah. ABG is about 4800. So 250 means about 5% out of the 10% growth. 5, 5.5% growth has come from ABG. Rest is from Asian Paints and others.
Chirag
The second question is related to the same. Will the RCP which would be added into the raw material for us would lead to decrease in EBITDA per KV in paint segment?
Lakshmana Rao
No. What will happen is the RCP will be purchased at a little lesser price and the same benefit will be passed on to to the client. So it will not impact our EBITDA at all.
Chirag
Okay, so RTP currently is available at the lesser than raw materials.
Lakshmana Rao
Yeah, of course more than at least. 10% to 15% cheaper. So that’s one of the reasons why we were not so competitive because we. Could not effectively use 40%. Now with the new recipe we are able to do that.
Chirag
Got it. Fair enough, sir. So my next question is related to the food and FMCA segment just wanted some understanding related to once the printing press came into once the printing capacity came into picture last quarter what has actually restricted us for growing at more than 152015 percentage in this particular quarter?
Lakshmana Rao
Yeah, this time it is around 11% growth in food and FMCG 54% in bulk packs. So put together it is close to. Around 12% volume growth. But QPAC we grew at 25%. The food and FMCG also is a tepid quarter Q3 but Q4 looks pretty strong already in January we found it’s. More than 17 18% growth we achieved. And going forward the season starts for. Ice creams and yogurts. The summer picks up in March onwards. So from right from February we expect a takeoff in thin wall sales.
Chirag
But I guess there is some issue related to the numbers that you have said the growth in QPAT was around 34 percentage for the quarter. YOY this is. You have
Lakshmana Rao
quarter. You’re talking. I’m talking about nine months.
Chirag
Okay. Okay. My. My bad, my bad. Okay. Got it sir. Got it. Next question is related to the labor law cost that you have included in employee benefit. What the Was the entire cost included for this quarter itself or it is going to be an incremental cost which would be coming in the. In the next few quarters.
Lakshmana Rao
No, that initial employee costs are already absorbed. There is no extra coming up. It will be. Yeah, it has been already taken.
Chirag
Going forward we are expecting. Can I expect that going forward in the employee cost would be a lesser. Comparatively lesser than current quarter?
Lakshmana Rao
Yes, maybe comparatively will be lesser because this quarter absorbed a little bit extra. Provisions of the previous two quarters. So going forward it may marginally come down.
Chirag
Fair enough. And just for the understanding perspective like we have signed an MOU with Sriki. Generally the containers, the plastic containers would require a significant volume from the client process. So just wanted to understand within this MA have been there any kind of talks that they are asking you to set up certain planted machinery into certain parts of the geography of India.
Lakshmana Rao
At current level they are also not very clear how the volumes pick up. Maybe in future once the volumes really pick up. Our north plant, our west plant is also equipped with capability to produce thinwal products and what mainly they will be. Looking at is restaurant packs. And in that we are actually introducing. Some more variants in this March April.
Lakshmana Rao
So probably as their volumes grow up and if they are really want to have capacities we have plants across India now so additional capacities or mounts can. Be created and production can be effectively made from those areas. But I think I would wait for a quarter to comment upon this.
Chirag
So one last question from my side. In the oil business we used to do annual volumes of about 9,500 to 10,000 empty current. If I look at the run rate which is around 1800, it has significantly dropped from that levels to almost 7000 to 8000. So.
Lakshmana Rao
Sorry, what you said 9500 is what?
Chirag
We used to have an annual run rate in NT for oil business around 9000 to 10,000. So quarterly run rate of. For 2400 to 2500.
Lakshmana Rao
Oh you mean the edible oil part of Cube Axial.
Chirag
No, no sir. The oil the. Which is. Which is included in the lubes one the loops.
Lakshmana Rao
All loops you’re talking about. Okay.
Chirag
Yes, yes.
Lakshmana Rao
So this is now currently per quarter. This quarter we have 18 tons.
Chirag
Yeah.
Lakshmana Rao
So that means about 7,000 already in nine months we did 6,900 tons.
Chirag
So earlier the run rate used to be. So after using DPC In Q after Q2, what kind of run rate should we expect? Like it would be around in 2000. So we would be doing around 8,000 volumes from Lubes for the next year.
Lakshmana Rao
Yeah, we’ll be somewhere around 8,000 tons for loops. That’s all.
Chirag
Got it, Got it. It’s the last question. Are we, Are we, are we seeing a pickup in volumes from X ABG in paint segments in high single to low double digits now.
Lakshmana Rao
I would say from last just one month onwards we. Are seeing good numbers From Asian paints which are more than 10%. From Badger and Naralac we have maybe. 5, 6% kind of growth. But there is an indication from Badger that they may move into some of the IML packs. If they do that probably with there. Also we can expect a double digit growth.
Chirag
Thank you so much sir. That’s it from my side.
operator
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Shanskar from Miraya Capital. Please proceed.
Shanskar
Hello. Thank you sir for taking my question again. So you said that we lost a tender to BPCL this year. Can you highlight any particular reason for that? Was the price, was any reason for that?
Lakshmana Rao
Yeah, price is the only reason. Because we don’t want to go below. A certain threshold of profitability and pricing. But there may be some couple of. Aggressive bidders who wanted to go at a lower price. That is the reason.
Shanskar
So. So are we seeing similar competitiveness in other tenders and contracts from other companies?
Lakshmana Rao
No, only from BCS because these are government tenders. And now today more or less our government lubricant sales have become zero.
Shanskar
Not even Indian aisle, not even other lube oil companies. None of them are buying from us.
Shanskar
Hpcl, bbcl,
Lakshmana Rao
BPCL was the last to go. We let it go. And actually in fact we may start adding another private sector vendor. Last year we added the Vidal. This year one more client is in the final stage. Their CEO also visited our plant recently. And if that happens positively probably next quarter onwards we may have one more private sector loop company joining our list.
Shanskar
So what kind of growth are you seeing in this segment for next like one year or two years down the line or are we seeing it?
Lakshmana Rao
I would rather think it will be more stagnant or growth of the private sector loop companies will be directly can. Be related to Baltech because now public sector is completely. I don’t think in future also we may able to compete or get into that kind of price war. So probably we’ll stay out of it unless we get an opportunity. So having said that I would be. Neutral on lube growth. It will again go back to 2 to 3% annual growth. That is what is common with the private players.
Shanskar
Understood. And just following up on my previous question around PAT and EBITDA growth. So you told that the PAD will be in line with the bit around 20% levels only. So.
Shanskar
So we would expecting the depreciation would also be on similar level that it is right now around 20, 25%. So when can we see depreciation coming off or will it stay at similar levels? Or is there something that I’m as you said that capex will be significantly low next year. So another year after that can depreciation come off or will it be around at similar levels?
Lakshmana Rao
Yeah, I think another couple of years the depreciation levels will be high because. Of the huge Capex we did in the last four years and it may taper down now because next year it will be around 80 crores and I. Think in future it will be equivalent. To depreciation which is almost 70 crores. 6570 crores per annum. At the current level it is around 15 lakhs crores per quarter. So around 60 I think it is picking up now. It may stay around that level or maybe little higher for next one year and then it will start coming down or at least equal to stay at this level.
Shanskar
Understood. Okay, thank you sir.
Lakshmana Rao
Once we reach there the PAT growth will be better than EBITDA growth Probably. Instead of 20% if EBITDA grows 20% the PAT might grow around 25%. Now obviously like if your depreciation comes off and if that comes off, let’s say two years down the line. So then, then we can see higher PAD versus ebitda. So this last question, can you share utilization levels of your current capacity in totality and across segments as well?
Lakshmana Rao
Yeah. Okay. As I mentioned, our overall capacity utilization is around 67%. I think in Q3 it is less than 7% for sure. One second, let me tell you, it.
Lakshmana Rao
Is now down to around 62.5%. It was 74 in Q1 it fell down to 62.5 in the last two. Quarters and hopefully in Q4 it will cross 70 plus. And next year due to increased utilization of all ABG rate facilities and North Tinwal and QPAC, we hopefully stay above 70 for the next full year.
Shanskar
Thank you sir. That was my last question.
operator
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Deepak from Sundaram Mutual Fund. Please proceed.
Deepak
Thank you for the opportunity. I’m audible.
Lakshmana Rao
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Deepak
Hi sir. Sir, I have two questions. So my first question is regarding this MoU which we have signed with White Generation. So could you just elaborate what is the commercial arrangement in this mou? And let’s say what is the margin profile of off of this safety caps and closure? And when do we expect the revenue to flow through in our P and L from this arrangement? And is it mostly related to let’s say pharma segment of this caps, enclosures. That’s my first question.
Lakshmana Rao
No, it is mainly to chemicals, lubricants. Oils, high end chemicals, also lubricants. So it is something to do with. Nothing much to do with pharma. Maybe pharma chemicals, what you call it. Ingredients may use it but not for pharma application. But it is also used in lubricants. And these caps and spouts are high value add products. I guess at least the range of EBITDA will be in range of 80 to 100. Can be better but the volume pickup will be progressive. It will not happen overnight because the. Time is developmental time is longer. Their patents need to be developed first into pilot molds.
Lakshmana Rao
And once the pilot mold samples are.
Lakshmana Rao
Approved we have to go for commercial molds. So the first two products started pilot mould development. End of this month one product will be out and second month probably end of March we will have both the products which are related products, they will be ready by end of March. And once we start marketing effort by. Vibe from April, probably its commercial volumes can only go out in Q2. So from Q2 if the numbers start coming in by end of the year. We can see at least in the Q4, Q3, Q4 we can see some.
Lakshmana Rao
Numbers adding in few crores. That will be the beginning. But once the relation is established and. They gain confidence on us, they have several products to offer and we are also eager to do it because they are very challenging products. Also good value add products. Even in Indian application we are under the MoU.
Lakshmana Rao
We are allowed to sell them in India by paying them some small amount. So that enable us to explore the Indian lube market or Indian chemical market where some of them are still importing some of the closures not in huge volumes, but it’s picking up in India. And if it’s in loops, the volumes are tremendous. So there is a good opportunity. But it is little time taking. And value add, it is pretty good value add.
Deepak
Okay. The EBITDA per kg is between 80 to 100 rupees per kg. Correct.
Lakshmana Rao
At least.
Deepak
Okay. And sir, I just wanted to understand like as of now then how much of this product are import dependent and how much is catered to domestic manufacturer and who will be our competitor here? Let’s say from a local manufacturing point of view.
Lakshmana Rao
No, no, no. Currently there is a nobody in India making this. Are using it in a big way. They say even in the lubricant industry. Our competitors are current competitors. But this product, what we are developing. Once it is the details are completely out and we are able to demonstrate its capability. It will be definitely a different ball game in terms of its functionality and which may give us. Good growth back. In lubricant industry also if it is adopted by them.
Deepak
Okay.
Deepak
And so one final question on cost item. So this quarter we have seen that other expenses for a sharp decline of 8%. QoQ just wanted to understand what led to this. Is it one off or is it more sustainable number going forward? I mean to say in terms of operational efficiency.
Lakshmana Rao
These are definitely due to operational efficiencies. You will be keep seeing it improving. What do you mean by other expenses? Can you help me with that? What is other expenses come down? He’s saying. There’s some power incentives debates. We got. That’s what that has might have brought down the other expenses. And as I said, once the units. Are consolidated, the inter unit transfers will come down considerably. That’s also classified under other expenses.
Deepak
Okay.
Lakshmana Rao
And we are also going for solar. More and more solar plants have been getting operational. All the units. Hopefully by June, July most of our units will come under solar power. Which will also save us a forecast yeah,
Deepak
thank you sir. And all the best.
operator
Thank you. Before we proceed with the next question, participants, please limit your questions to one per participant. We take the next question from the line of Deepak Saha from Nirmal Bounce Institutional Equities. Please proceed.
Deepak Saha
One question. What would be the mix for IML and non IML for the quarter?
Lakshmana Rao
Yeah, it’s around 75% IML and HDL. To label the containers. 25% is non IML plain or skill bidding.
Deepak Saha
Thank you.
operator
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Pratyush Damani, an individual investor. Please proceed.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah, thanks a lot operator. And sir, so there’s one question that I see that we’ve been giving dividends for the past three, four years, maybe around 15, 20 crore per year. So which is around 0.5% in terms of dividend yield. But if the same dividend was directed to repayment of interest costs, maybe we would have saved 5, 6 crores in interest cost annually. So that would have added one 1.2% to Roe. So can you just once explain the rational and trade off between paying dividend and and like the payment of debt? Because I think shareholders might be a little happier with repayment of debt so that free cash flow and return on equity is better for us.
Lakshmana Rao
Yes, we have taken that suggestion from various investors. Not only individual investors but also funds. And if you notice the dividend outflow. Has come down considerably in the last three years and to safeguard the ROE and also to reduce the debt. So the similar trend will continue in future too. So there’s.
Unidentified Participant
Okay fine. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Chirag from Keynote Capital. Please proceed.
Chirag
Thank you for the opportunity. Again. Sir, just one question. Since last eight quarter Ex Pharma, if I’m able to see all the three segments, food, Q pack, drinks and view. What I’m able to see is that our realization or revenue per kg is on a declining trend this quarter. It is at the lowest of the last year. So just wanted to understand is there any kind of raw material cost passing taking place or is it because of the competition that is impacting us?
Lakshmana Rao
See there is a reduction in the. Overall cost per kg. I agree with you in the last. Few quarters but if you look at our raw material cost, the mix is also coming down. The raw material cost in Q1 was 94 rupees per kilogram has come down. To 86.67 now, almost 8 rupees. And the sale price has come down by around 9 rupees so the delta is hardly 1 rupee. And in Q1 generally our food and FMCG will be highest as a percentage of sale compared to Q2 and Q3. So whatever is the raw material, recipe cost come down, we are generally passing. It on to the clients to stay competitive.
Lakshmana Rao
So we are not going beyond into. Our own means to reduce our profitability. Otherwise we cannot sustain growth in EBITDA per kg. If you look at the EBITDA per kg, last year 9 months it was 37.6 and this year 9 months it is. Last year full year is 37.6 and this year 9 Months is 40.24. That is a clean 3 and a half rupees. You know 2 and a half rupees. Increase in the EBITDA per kg. So that shows the company’s ability to. Sustain its margins in spite of competition.
Chirag
I. I totally agree to the point that our EBITDA per kg is remaining constant and in an upward trajectory. But if I’m not wrong, in the last conference call you have mentioned that you are facing some kind of a competitive intensity in the food segments. It is a follow up question.
Lakshmana Rao
Yeah, the definitely competition in all the fields is increasing. There’s no doubt about it. Our ability to retain the clients comes. With our timely supplies rather than pricing. Because most of the food and FMCG. Companies are seasonal demand in nature and they want in season good service from the suppliers of packaging products. So there they can’t bet on anybody. Who has two or three robots and running few product range when compared to Maltech with more than 120 robos and 200 injection model emissions in 10 plants across India.
Lakshmana Rao
So definitely our ability to service them is much better. But for last year when our printing. Capacities have been somewhat misplanned. So going forward we may very rarely lose a client. We certainly lose here and there. But we are able to add much faster also.
Chirag
Thank you so much Lasmandu.
operator
Thank you ladies and gentlemen. Due to time constraints we take that as the last question for the day and would now like to hand the conference over to the management for closing comments. Over to you sir.
Lakshmana Rao
Thank you very much for all the.
Lakshmana Rao
Participants actively participating in our third quarter results investor meet. And I also thank MK Global for arranging this call and also thanks to Anushka. You all have a great day. Bye. Thank you.
operator
Thank you on behalf of MK Global Financial Services limited That concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us and you may now disconnect your lines.