Mishra Dhatu Nigam Ltd (NSE: MIDHANI) Q3 2025 Earnings Call dated Feb. 06, 2025
Corporate Participants:
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti — Director (Finance) and Chief Financial Officer
T. Muthukumar — Director – Production and Marketing
Analysts:
Amit Dixit — Analyst
Anil Bagaria — Analyst
Rakesh Roy — Analyst
Unidentified Participant
Parimal Mithani — Analyst
Viraj Mithani — Analyst
Presentation:
Operator
Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to Medani’s Q3 FY25 earnings conference call hosted by ICICI Securities Limited. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen only mode. And there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the call, please signal an operator by pressing Star then zero on your touchstone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Amit Dixit from ICICI Securities. Thank you. And over to you, sir.
Amit Dixit — Analyst
Yeah. Hi. Good afternoon everyone. On behalf of ICICI Securities, I welcome all the participants for Midhani’s Q3FY25 conference call. At the outset I would like to thank the management for for giving us an opportunity to host this call from the management. We have with us today. Mr. M. Gauri Sundara Rao, Director Finance and additional charge of Chairman and Managing Director and Mr. T. Muthu Kumar, Director PNM.
Without much ado, I would hand over the call to Mr. Sankara Rao to take this forward. Over to you sir.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti — Director (Finance) and Chief Financial Officer
Yeah. Thank you Mr. Amit. My dear esteemed investors and representatives of financial institutions most welcome to the today’s our financial highlights presentation. Nidani UAW is a very cute company and for the quarter three our results. I would like to mention that as far as revenue and VOP is concerned compared to the last year third starter applied 24 and FY25. So little decrease there. However in the form of EBITDA, DBT and PAT there is an improvement. Last year we did for the same quarter 251.98 crores revenue. This year it is 237.97, a dip of 5.56%. Last year we have done VOP of 279.2 crores. This year it is 257.45. A dip of 7.82%. Whereas when it is coming to EBITDA. Last year for the quarter three it is 17% 42.11 crores. This year it is 59.44 crores. It is 25%. That is an increase of 41.15%.
I will explain in detail the regions for the Same same way PBT also there is a growth of from 18.92 crores of last quarter. Last quarter 3 of FY24 to quarter 3 of FY25 is 36 crores. An increase of 90.27%. Same with tap also it is last year it is 5% 12.49 crores. This year it is 11% 25.27 crores an increase of 102.32% for nine months. If you see there is last year FY24 we did 667.18 crores whereas this year cumulatively we did 663.544 more or less at the same level only 0.0.55% is the dip. Coming to VOP it is 865 crores 865.77 crores last year. This year it is 736.46 crores.
As our intention is to reduce the higher inventory. As we have discussed in earlier several meetings, we have concentrated more on revenue than VOP. Coming to EBITDA it is last year it is 20% for nine months. The sea rate is 22% from 135.55 crores to 148.02 crores. The same PBT also has gone from 66.29 crores to 78.88 crores. TAP is 44.88 crores to 53.92 crores. That means nearly we have seen some 2% growth in EBITDA and and 2% growth in PBT also and 1% in that. Mainly this is because this year we have an advantage of price reduction in raw materials on account of nickel. Where compared to last year we see prices have come down so in some cases prices increase.
Nickel being used maximum in Birani because all these raw materials we import from foreign countries not available. So there is a reduction on account of nickel. Some prices like titanium spawns moly though it has gone up we could manage we could save nearly 29 crores on account of raw material price reduction and 19 crores on account of consumption.
Another thing I want to tell in addition to raw materials we also consume plant rivets. We say scrap but it is a plant rivet. Plant reckons this can be also be used where all these precious raw materials will be there in the composition waste which normally we value at recoverable basis. When that consumption is there also it will impact on iMed profitability. Compared to last year there is an improvement on this also. Yearly last year our consumption of virgin materials to scrap is around 66 around 60 averagely 66 to 66% virgin and 34% plant reverse.
Whereas this time it has come down to around 65% to 55% virgin and 45% is a square due to which we could gain in the consumption also and also as I told raw material prices and as far as the order booking is concerned. 20, 24, 25. FY25 is an excellent year for Madani. We have already booked nearly 1115 crores worth of orders. And we are expecting in these two months, two to three months we will get another 550 crores. So we will reach 1700 crores worth of orders in this year. As of today we have nearly nine GNOME fixed crores orders. Executable orders are there. So we hope quarter four of FY25 and all the quarters of FY26.
A good picture can be seen in Madani. Even coming to the Capex side also we have invested with a major investment in order. Still we planned around 60 crores to be invested in this year. And capex already 40 crores. We completed balance 20 crores also we are going to invest now Major plant figure plant also is there in the company. And Mirani also is developing various new alloys. Requirement for the aerospace and some requirement of energy side. And also some naval side also we are developing even whatever earlier Merani has done. Suntan products on army side, tank side. Certainly we are expecting certain barrel gun barrel Also we are expecting to re enter the market. And other alloys also as last name also we discussed like ultra advanced ultra supercritical alloys. Also we want to develop which will be used by VHEL for electricity generation.
Electricity generation. That is also we are expecting. We have already discussed with IG CAR who is developing with alloy with them. They have also placed a developmental order. And we have also involved in this further development which is already established. Once orders comes from vhel, we will be able to execute very sizable figure of this alloy. In addition to that so many other materials also we are doing and we are expecting. You know earlier Midani is getting got the order of nearly some 2000 crores from ISRO. Now again we are expecting order is mostly completed. Very nominal quantities are pending this year. At the end of the year we are expecting to get another 200 to 200 above order. 200 crores order we will get with that of Mirani because it is already in established for marriage. So we will be capable of supplying the same material within a year. As we have a facility available now. Wide plate mill which can be used and produce supply the items.
Other one is rings are there where the PSS’s own facility is there and funded facility. And we also have the facility we are taking up. If that is successful, entire 200 course can be executed in one year.
This is from My side with me. My director Production and Market Mr. Muthu Kumar is there also. GM Marketing, Mr. A.K. sharma, AGM Finance. Mr. A.P. rao also is available here. Now I’ll request the investors to raise your queries. If any on Maidani will try to explain you. Thank you.
Questions and Answers:
Operator
Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask questions may press Star and one on their touch tone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue you may press star and 2. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking questions. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. To ask questions, please press star and 1. The first question is from Anil Magaria from Equicorp. Please go ahead.
Anil Bagaria
Hi. Am I audible? Sir. Hello.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Good afternoon.
Anil Bagaria
Good afternoon, sir. So thank you for the opportunity. And congratulations on good set of numbers. Just a few few quick questions. So as you mentioned that you are developing supercritical alloys for bail. Does it refer to the ultra high megawatt thermal power plant that the government had? And this alloys are regarding to that project.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Yes. Yes, you’re right. So what would be the tentative size of. I mean such the entire industry as such for the supercritical alloys.
Anil Bagaria
And what. What is the government ambition on all these. All the ultra high megawatt power plant in terms of megawatts.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Megawatts. Can you. Our DPM will
T. Muthukumar
Now to the development stage 42 and 440. That is in the development stage. And we have been established that. And since it is establishment now there is going to be. They are thinking about five mega projects. But full detailing it is not known to us.
Anil Bagaria
Okay.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
But we have submitted our bid our budget report to bhl. It will be a big figure. Thank you. Based on the whatever successful as we got now we have submitted a very big figure. Once that is finalized, we let you know. But it is a give it very good turnaround to Hidani.
Anil Bagaria
I believe in this industry we are. We are the only one Indian players we have placed bid for this order. I guess with the other bidders would be foreign. Right. So we are looking at some kind of import substitutes in these kind of alloys.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Yes.
Anil Bagaria
And what would be the duration if the order materializes for us? I mean two years, three years, five years.
T. Muthukumar
Ally has been already developed. Okay. Actually whatever budget is given they are comparing with the import. So the formal approval has to come from the government. So once it is done, there is a tendering process. After tendering Merani will get the order. When Merani gets order like any other alloy, which we do depends upon the product size. We able to start delivering it within six months of time from the date of delivery, from the date of order because of the product already established and given the budget report.
Anil Bagaria
Okay, so coming down to the SMRs and the using our chemo titanium chemistry. Titanium alloy chemistry. So what is your thought process given the finance minister also emphasized on. I mean amending the entire act allowing private participation. And a lot of companies have started hunting for technology partners in reactors. So what would be your thought process on this entire industry that’s panning out because they’ve given a target of about 100 gigawatts of nuclear by 2047. So your understanding on this particular industry and I guess we are the only ones in the titanium alloy chemistry would be using would be making, I mean alloys for a number of components. If we’ve also done some projects in past with respect to the coastal side nuclear plants, if I’m not mistaken.
T. Muthukumar
But anyway, that requirement comes. We are geared up with respect to titanium production. Because recently we had commissioned our new titanium plant. Okay, new titanium plant. So now we are. There is a sentence earlier that we are geared up for the. Whatever the future requirement of the titanium will set up not only nuclear for any other applications. So that already we had made and we also provision about this. There is going to be a huge requirement of titanium. Then there also provision that we can install further two more work in the same state. Already we are having ST and what are supportive facilities for accommodating for that we also already installed. So we will be geared up to take up any other challenges with respect to titanium.
Anil Bagaria
And is the titanium, the new titanium furnace operational? I mean earlier we were doing test runs for orders to find the consistency in quality. So is it commercialized for commercial batches right now?
T. Muthukumar
Yeah, already it has become fully operational. And we started delivering products from the new technician. All our trial runs are over now we started producing one titanium.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
We are already supplying for the strategic projects for commercial purposes. No issue at all. More stringent specifications we are meeting. So it is not difficult for Midani to produce titanium. Further only thing we have to concentrate more on getting the sponge and Marshall alloys which that also now we are getting. We are sourcing the more suppliers and indigenization also we are doing.
Anil Bagaria
Okay, so if you could also share some more details on the ISRO order that you just mentioned that we had got earlier orders and right now you are expecting to get about 200 crores order from ISRO.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
ISRO already whatever orders they have placed for the future launches Also they have taken material. Now they have some shortfalls which they are taking up. We are expecting that order by this month year end. That means FY 25 year end in the month of March. Something we have submitted a budget report. We need to finalize. We have. We need. They need to finalize and we’ll get some orders that only we. I told totally 500 crores order we are going to get.
Anil Bagaria
So out of the 500 crore marginal orders that we are expecting in Q4 the 200 crore order is from ISRO. The other 300 crore order we are expecting from which industries?
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Other miscellaneous. Maybe defense. Defense side, Aerospace side. I mean it is a miscellaneous other regular. Regular customer.
T. Muthukumar
Actually every year we get a Q4 that you know we are a strategic producer for giving arrow and energy. Energy sector. So now for the next year recruitment. Normally we get orders in the last quarter of every year. So this year also we are expecting order work of about 5, 4 in this last quarter.
Anil Bagaria
Okay. So that happened from the all the sector including defense, Naval everywhere it will come. So that will be delivered in the next year. So that happens now.
Operator
Thank you. Mr. Bagadia. We request you to rejoin the queue for follow up questions. We move to the next question. The next question is from Rakesh Roy from Boring Asset Management. Please go ahead.
Rakesh Roy
Hi sir. My first question regarding your alloy super alloy that you are making for bhl. Can you highlight the overall market size for this alloy for mission Dhakunigam.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
This is first time developed in India with Mithrani. So this market, this even this technology also I think new. They are not yet clear. Government of India has to clear Once it is cleared. The Tamil flower plant with the AISC material they will plan. Once that is planned. They wanted to know whether alloy can be developed in India. Maybe it can be imported also. They will see. But they asked us to develop. We developed. Now we are waiting for the final clearance from the government and inquiry from the bhel.
Rakesh Roy
Right sir. Right sir. Thanks. My next question sir. Can you highlight on the working progress of our gaming medical for aluminum plant where we are currently?
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Yeah, aluminum plant. Again we have made that. Utkarsha you are talking. Now that we are discussing whatever data we obtain it is not so much encouraging. Encouraging or giving that much of investment. Nalco and designee does Again the consultant has to firmly give recommendation. Then it is not some positive recommendation. Still we are studying even ministry level also there is a studying the project. We will let you know once the final outcome comes on. This we will inform definitely our investor.
Rakesh Roy
And till date how much we invested in this JV. It can be based how much invested in this JV?
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
In 4500 crores it is only land was procured. Actually we invested 2020 crores. Vidani invested 20 crores and in the form of capital. And Nalco also invested 20 crores 40 crores. In that 10 crores we spent on land and compound wall.
Rakesh Roy
Okay.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
No more. Only now whatever we appointed the consultants and environmental clearance these things we have done. That is in one or two crores. But ultimately major investment was not there. Major investment will be decided based on the outcome and decision of the government on this. As this project appears not that much of encouraging profitable or viable. So still discussions are going on. Because the requirement of defense also very small. In this and other other areas like transportation like railways and logistics. Car manufacturers using the aluminum alloy Fees not started at fully. So presently even other other suppliers competitors also coming into the market in importing parin by suppliers are cheaper than making in India. All these aspects they are studying. They have pointed one consultant. Their recommendation is given. We ask them to further study. Once the further report comes then it will be discussed at ministry level. Then addition will be taken on this. Till such time whatever we invested it will be in the form of FDR only. There.
Operator
Thank you. Mr. Roy, we request you to rejoin the queue for follow up questions. We take the next question from Pranav Bastavala who is an individual investor. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah. Good afternoon sir. There’s one question. Basically we are. Titanium dioxide is the raw material for us. And. But when we are looking at it. Since last so many years not tried to buy any ore mine ore for any captive consumption. If there is a plan for buying any kind of this kind of mines in the future. For this kind titanium dioxide or for anything else. Because there is a company called PTC which has already commissioned a war furnace for the production of the aerospace grade titanium ingot in the country. First private sector company. Are we planning something of similar sort.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Coming to this titanium from the war we have to produce spawn Sponge will be used in the wap. Seen from more to spawn. There is a lot of processes there. It is a huge investment. Midani’s present requirement is around 1000 to 1500 which will go to 3000. If this type of project is to be kept nearly the capacity should be 20,000 tons. Like that even PTC all this they have to put that facility now already in Kerala one KMML is there. Their capacity is only 500 tons. That also they are not able to produce normally. In this they concentrate more on titanium oxide side. So whatever sponge is required. Presently everyone is dependent on the foreign source only.
Which is competitive and better product. You will get Presently we are getting from other even PTC they are trying from the foreign only. In fact they also planned. But it is a huge investment side. Huge investment side. So that investment has to be seen. And there are there are talks that eastern side will be planned like this it has to materialize otherwise till the touchdown we have to depend on KMML and also foreign sources only. Even KMML also they are planning state government organization. They are also planning for enhance their capacity. If they enhance also that can be used. But the size wise in India presently only Nidani is producing. Maybe PTC may might be added. And if the PTC added also how much is the input required? Depends on that based on the size in future they may decide and Mirani also. But as far as the requirement. I told you I did a 20,000 tons like that. That much of requirement Milani is not having even down the line four or five years. If you take also so investment in titanium. Making the titanium spawn or buying the titanium Oregon may not be present.
Condition of Medani may not be suitable so strong only we will source from outside outside India by way of import and also from KMML which is a government organization.
Unidentified Participant
Okay sir, only the last question we have been. We have this JV with Nalcos in several years but it has not structified. And in one of the con call 12 years back it was said that the actual whatever was envisaged and the require the what is required anticipated is absolutely low the demand. So what you would like to say today for this JV will go ahead or it will remain as it is on paper question.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
You must have heard from the previous question and also you asked the same question. I have replied in detail. We have. We have appointed a consultant to study the market to see the prices of the import prices. What is our prices who are all other people are there. So still it is as far as I told it is not an encouraging situation. That’s why we are review rethinking. And it was. It is discussed in the joint venture board meeting also. But still it is not finalized. We are. We have to take up with the ministry to be done. And the strategic requirement also very less.
Unidentified Participant
Okay.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
So definitely something will come next by next another another one quarter something may come. It is in the last stage only. But it is Not Anchorage, I don’t know.
Operator
Thank you. Next question is from Parimal Mithani from Credential Investments. Please go ahead.
Parimal Mithani
Can you hear me? Hello?
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Hello. Yeah, thanks.
Parimal Mithani
Yeah sir, thanks for the opportunity. So I just wanted to know the decrease in raw material price. If because of what reason statement highlighted and what is the inventory level currently?
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
I didn’t catch you. Can you please repeat?
Parimal Mithani
Hello, can you hear me? Yeah, so I just wanted to know the the raw material price have decreased. What is the reason for that? And if you can tell the inventory which we are carrying since long time. What is the stated on that question?
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Raw material prices it is volatile. As I told you earlier Nikhil before this global situation, Russia, Ukraine, war, geopolitical situation, certain prices have gone up.
Certain prices have normalized. So in that way whatever prices earlier in the standard form, certain prices have increased and subsequently reduced. Some prices are going up and down. In that way it is a see whatever material raw materials purchased by Nidani is not available in India. Number of sources also left because of the situation. Sometimes we may not get the material from the required country. And further buying from China also certain restrictions are there. Even Australia also interested. But they are not coming forward. So that’s the reason some prices are going up. It is a market condition. And you see even it impacts even the dollar price also. And dollar goes up also prices goes up. This year what we have seen nickel has come down. Moly chromium little bit increased. Titanium sponge also because of the restriction titanium sponge also increased. So other prices is normal only. But majority because Mirani is consuming more nickel, the other items are there.
This year we have an advantage. Last year we have a disadvantage we have to see in the future also. But indigenously developing these materials are difficult. Except this titanium spawn some cobalt recovery also we planned. But otherwise mostly we have to depend on the foreign sources only.
Parimal Mithani
And sir, in terms of the order book, is it safe to say that we’ll be having a healthy order book going forward from now? Because you’re close to 2000 crore. Do we expect a jump in order book from now going on?
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Already we have earlier earlier years it is only thousand crores. Like that order book. Now we have 2000 crores. We have a very good order book going forward same will be maintained in Midhar also We’ll try to achieve achieve that order book. Whatever is there to execute. Once I execute, I will get further orders also. And another another important thing. Because of brilliant situation even foreign customers also approaching Nidani in foreign customers are approaching Nidani foreign customers do not place the entire requirement at one go. They place in small parcels.
Suppose once I execute those parcels at their satisfaction, they will continue to give some more order like that also if you see this year we have already touched a 60 crores export ever in the history of Nidani. This much of export we have not done. And going forward exports also will go up because we have already started with the high level customers like Boeing, Pratt and Whitney, Airbus, ge.
These customers are also approaching Merani now. So only thing they should get a confidence on Merani. That confidence will come over a period based on my supplies. It would any delays and quality once I do there will be good question will be there. Let us see now. 2004 order book is a healthy book. Healthy only 1996 I have today.
Parimal Mithani
Thank you sir. Join in the queue. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. Next question is from Anil Bagaria from equp. Please go ahead.
Anil Bagaria
Thank you for the opportunity again sir, just to carry on the that you are supplying to most of the large aerospace companies and you’ve also got a lot of contracts from them. So are those supplies related to critical aero engine components or non critical aero engine components? So if you could elaborate the way MRO is also being developed in the MRO ecosystem is being developed in India. So how do you see that space going forward?
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Yeah, my DPM will explain application.
T. Muthukumar
So we are the major suppliers of whatever raw material it is required for the ARROW components to ha. Recently as we have been discussed in the earlier conference also that one of the major order we assessed for making Sukhoi engine to hm. Okay, so that ALA which was being imported now we are in the way to make components and we will be supplying to the ch. Okay, that is one part and the reason is the starting once you are successful in that that is supposed to be the most critical one and we are supposed to get a many of such orders as on today. Now we our major component, whatever we are supplying major component is going to arrow one.
So some of them are going for the critical application for the arrow. Some of them are slightly non critical. But however, whatever we make since it is going for we have to say all are for critical component only. And it is all very stringent quality assignment that we are able to meet it under this whatever component product we are giving it which is connected into components it is being used in various parts of the era. Okay? Right from engine up to the shaft, every part it will be used. Coming to space the space as we know that we only Developed a material for space and we continue to support for space and that will continue. So as we being deliberated we are going to get a major order with respect I think in the another one month. One month name by March and this will be continuing. We’ll be continuing because whatever the space they have a program and will continue to support.
Anil Bagaria
With respect to that actually I actually meant on the MRO side. How do you see the MRO industry and our supplies for such critical. I mean both critical and non critical aerospace engine components to. I mean Boeing, Pratt Whitney, Rolls Royce, Safran etc. So I actually was. I meant that entire industry as such. How do you see that panning the maintenance.
T. Muthukumar
Now whatever. Since we have started developing this supply and other things now already we started developing some of the components for hl. Okay. Coming the export now productly and other company like we already initiated. As DS has told these are all export order they will not go for the bulk. Now GE and all we started getting orders and we started exhibiting it. And that’s why compared to last year 23, 24, 24, 23 our export order has gone up. These are all mostly for the regular command as well as for the replacement of the existing. Once it is established.
We are very sure some of the party like daughter Whitney or GE Safran all those things we will be able to supply in future.
Anil Bagaria
Lastly sir. So lastly are we making any material or components or anything got to do with the outer body metal alloys for the upcoming fighter jet programs?
T. Muthukumar
Outer body we don’t make.
Anil Bagaria
Okay. We just do the engine parts, we don’t do the outer body. Thanks a lot sir. Yeah, thank you.
Operator
Thank you. Next question is from Rakesh Roy from Boring Asset Management. Please go ahead.
Rakesh Roy
Yes sir. Can you light on that your recent tire with the data that is working for two supply companies for their business.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Please repeat.
Rakesh Roy
Hello. So can you light on the recent with the platinum to supply component? Yeah, that we already taken some order.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Okay. That we have executed and we have got the repeat order which we have been executing and we are having a regular meeting with them once we execute the present order. Okay. Which I don’t want to limit the what sort of a component which case we executed by the financial year. There is the assurance from partner Whitney that we will get double the numbers what we are exhibiting now. So this will continue to do that. So this is in the form of rods, disc, ring. So we are getting this thing. These are all raw materials which will be made component by the sub suppliers.
So this we are continuing to Support and we are very sure that we will be one of the partners for problem because they have done a lot of audit on us and with our quality system they are very much satisfied and they are going ahead with placing a bomb.
Rakesh Roy
Try to understand how much order we are looking every year from this one this qualification. No. Then only no.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
As I’ve been telling that what order value with respect to product it is going to be very. This is the first I tell you what are the steps have been taken. First day they had come they had audited a plan and subsequent auditor they placed order worth of 10 crore that we had executed. Subsequently we placed the order that they were executing. On executing this they may give one more trial order then that we had executed. Subsequently we become a partner to that. Otherwise you can go to the tune of maybe 2 to 300 course because product is a big company and they want all sorts of super alloys which already we are established and proved to broader that we are capable of making whatever forms they want. So it is a question of winning the confidence over the period which they are establishing by giving different trial hours.
That is the EC as I told earlier they don’t place their entire requirement at one go. They will place in small parcels. Once we establish over a period then they may go for a rate contract. Lot of conditions will be there. We also have to see whether we can go for rate contract with them to price volatile and all these are there maybe some price escalation they give. Still we are establishing with them all these foreign suppliers. It is an opportunity came to Mizani because of the present global situation which we are able to encase to the extent possible designing capability and we are trying to establish ourselves with foreign bias. We are doing that. So if you want to quantify, I mean we may not be able to quantify that much but definitely it is a positive growth will be there.
Rakesh Roy
Right sir. Thank you sir. Okay, thank you.
Operator
The next question is from Amit Dixit from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.
Amit Dixit
Yeah, thanks for the opportunity Sir, I have a few questions. The first one is on the margin EBITDA margin. Very encouraging to see that we have returned back to 20 plus and this quarter was 22% EBITDA margin. Now I just wanted to ask in the light of the orders that we have and the raw material cost of course because nickel doesn’t seem to go up now. So is 22% is the kind of sustainable margin that we can build in for next couple of quarters at least.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Yeah, we can see 22% this quarter averagely we got definitely we can maintain it may little bit that side or this side it will happen. It all depends on three factors. One is raw material prices. Another one is my composition of consumption of virgin materials or scrap. If I am able to utilize my plant, I don’t get scrap. Also the plant returns scrap means it gives a wrong meaning in plant returns. It is having a very high value material. If I am able to use in some of the applications here I will get the desired yield. Definitely it is encouraging. You may you might be seeing earlier. There are the days where we got more EBITDA also 25, 30% also. So we wanted to see that also that is also possible. Once we improve on yield definitely 22% we can maintain.
Amit Dixit
[Technical Issues]
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Your voice is not audible.
Amit Dixit
Am I audible now? Hello.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Yeah.
Amit Dixit
Yeah. So I was asking more in the context of the fact that now we are going to get. You know, possibly is through order again generally improves margins we have seen in the past. So definitely we can, you know kind of see that margins might go up further from here.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
I should not say because of Israel I’m getting more margins. I if my my performance improve definitely we get margin that performance improves. Because when I am establishing new new grades initially I may be getting lesser yield over a period. Once the grade is established I will get more yield. Definitely my margins will go up. And it depends on the market condition. Also based on that improvement will be there. I don’t conclude or I don’t say that because of ISRO order I got very good margin.
T. Muthukumar
As you see now that if you compare year wise that with the almost same level of our sales we could able to make more profit compared to last year. One reason as it has been stated this price of raw material but other reason also because of our increased efficiency with respect to usage of more results and also our operational efficiency. That is why we were able to say so this we had established some of the grace and this whatever EBITDA we have made it will continue going to the level of 30 38%. Again our main motto is. You will see. Last year our inventory was to the work of same period it was 194 crore. Now it is only 73 crore.
So our main thing is we don’t want to build any further inventory. So by controlling the inventory at the same time by operating efficiency, we want to increase the equipment. So the figure will be definitely at the paid level and we’ll try to improve upon this. Again depends upon the product constraint and our usage of rewards. So definitely There will be improvement in coming quarters.
Amit Dixit
Got it. Sir. The second question is on the titanium wire that we actually commissioned last quarter. Just wanted to understand that. You know what is the status of that? Have we taken the first ingot out? What is the utilization over there? So if you can comment on that.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Yeah, yeah. Presently we are utilizing RWAR fully as we have. Titanium sponge is available earlier. Utilization stabilization is there. Now. Because of non availability of master alloy some production decreases there last water. But now we already tied up with master lice and sponge also. There is no issue of utilization of titanium wire. It will be utilized 100%.
Amit Dixit
No issue. Sir, is it possible to give a breakup in your order book sector wise?
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Breakup Sector wise?
Amit Dixit
Yeah. Yeah. 1916 crores.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
One second. If you see my order book here Aerospace is more. Today I have 1907 crores. In that 800 odd is zero. Naval is 500. Army space 150. 150. Like that missile also is the missile also. You can say it is a different exports. We have a pending order of 50 crores. Energy another 30 crores and others around 40 crores. Like this Major is now aerospace. Okay. And railways we have something or no it is around. I can say it is around 45%. Aerospace naval is next level is around 30%. And army space is only below 10%. As we told we have already executed ISRO’s order. New order comes again. It will build up missile and other things are same exports also. We already executed 60 crores. Another 50 crores order is there. And if this is executed we are expecting some more orders like this. We have the majority wise arrow only Arrow and naval balance are. It is around 20, 30%.
Amit Dixit
Okay, got it. Sir. I will just get back in the queue and maybe come up for some follow up questions.
Operator
Thank you. Next question is from Viraj Vitani from Jupiter Financial. Please go ahead.
Viraj Mithani
Yes. Good afternoon sir. And congratulations. My question is what would be your guidance for this year in terms of top line growth and the bottom line? What guidance? What guidance do you give for this year and next year?
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Next year means we have very good orders. We have to try to execute these orders. One is aerospace. Another one naval. If these orders are executed, as you know government is sanctioned so many lcs cages and all. Once that is happening we are going to get some some more orders in aerospace. Either HAL and other side exports also exports. If I complete I’ll get some more orders. And another important area is titanium. Titanium being used in the aerospace. In naval also some other area. Now since I have established My RWAP I am planning, I get and material availability also increase. I may be able to do more titanium and other facilities. Whatever is there. But in Rothakar WPM also we are concentrating how to get more business. As some tenders were there of Defense army and Aero. If that is that is successful, we will get load to the water plant also.
Viraj Mithani
Okay, so it will be 20 growth at least.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Your voice is something not audible.
Viraj Mithani
It’s fair to assume it’ll be 20.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Sorry.
Viraj Mithani
Hello,
Operator
Mr. If you’re on a hand hands free require request you to use the handset and maybe speak. Your voice is not very clear.
Viraj Mithani
Yeah, Hello. Is it clear now?
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Yeah, yeah, tell me.
Viraj Mithani
Yeah, yeah. So is this fair to assume that the sales will grow by 20% at least?
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
By 20%, definitely.
Viraj Mithani
Okay, thank you.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Because I have order book of 2000 cross.
Viraj Mithani
Okay.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Almost all facilities being established grades also established. 20% is not a difficult target.
Viraj Mithani
Okay, thank you, sir. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. Next question is from Anil. Please go ahead.
Anil Bagaria
So just a clarification. When you said naval orders of 500 crores. Does it pertain to the armor plate contract that we got from Navy?
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
No, no, no. There is no such. This one is different. A strategic project. Certain things are there. It is a confidential. Products are there. Okay, is going on. We are supplying.
Anil Bagaria
Do you see the application of armored plate in most of the and a lot of naval vessels.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
The armor plates will not be used in that navel. Armor plate will be used in the vehicle or aircrafts. And all certain armoring will be done. That is different in naval application is something else.
Anil Bagaria
Okay, thanks a lot for the clarification.
Operator
Thank you. Next question is from Amit Dixit from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.
Amit Dixit
Thanks for taking my questions again. Just a couple of more questions. So the order inflow that we had this quarter. I mean your order inflow. If I compare it with other different companies, it has been relatively better. So just wanted to understand some of the key programs for which the inflow was there. And whether this inflow also included something in export.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Exports. Exports is very nominal. But key major we are expecting from the programs only. And as I explained, VSSC ISRO order. But exports will be how much renom. In this fourth quarter we have to complete this 50 crores order. We have been discussing export. Whatever order they got. We are planning to exit and finish the exporter that the further order will flow through the next year. But as well as for strategic program, we continue to get the order and we’ll get in the Fourth quarter also from mostly different states that some arrow also. So this will continue and once we execute then furthermore order will come.
T. Muthukumar
Okay sir. Another one on utilization of white plate mill and rotat plant. What was the revenue contribution from both of these? In nine months of this year only we could able to execute orders for this space in the shortest possible time. That is why we could able to execute whatever pending orders were there. About two years back we could able to execute and now we are not having almost any of but the further order for the future program if everything comes on the plate that we will be executing in quickest critical time, quickest possible time. Coming to Rotak. It is a different type of system where we do both the body armoring and the vehicle armoring. Recently we had executed one big order for AFSOs. Okay. That is work of about the 42 crore. We had executed it.
So we had got lot of confidence in executing the order. So now we are expecting that such a body armoring order will come from other people also. So we are also discussing with the army so that we are going to do some trial jackets and once it is approved there is going to be a huge number of jackets. It is going to come. So we are working on that other sector which is done in the Roset is the body vehicle armor vehicle armory. Initially we had separated about 62 number of vehicles to German police.
Then subsequently we got another total numbers. In the total number we had Almost exit executed 90% of the order remaining executed in this quarter. And again we have got some more order from the J enter police. See the performance what we have done at the JNK police from other police also they started giving order like a divor Police all out started giving order. So this is it was in a buddy stage. Slowly this growth. So once it goes then definitely after one year or two years then this unit will become fully vibrant. We will be getting more and more orders in the sector Especially on body armory and vehicle armory. Apart from that we are also working with the Air force for armoring their helicopters. That one order was executed and we are expecting an Indian army year. So that is also the business change. So we are discussing. There are some issues in that. We are discussing on the pregnancy. So all this after two years I cannot say. Definitely happen next year. Maybe after one year. Definitely there will be a lot of improvement in the rot.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
For armor Roto side. Huge potential. Is there even a WE consultant was appointed? We have studied the requirement of the country. Huge requirement. Is there even competitors also? Is there only ropec as to a supplying to the state police level they have to improve and automatically we once we go on supplying we will get some more orders that we are expecting WPM also whatever load surplus load is there we are talking to the people either buying flaps and rolling it and give it or on conversion basis something may materialize either this quarter or next next year Q1 of FY26 we’ll do something. Otherwise WPM facility for our internal supplies of plates wherever required for the strategic projects or for the MSB projects we are using and we are supplying in time delay Suppose is the same route. If you apply HRM CRM it will be process will be delayed in WPM route it is becoming faster.
Amit Dixit
Okay sir. Just a. Just a follow up on this army jacket. So what is this army jackets order that we are expecting which level it is what material will be there?
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Tender is more than a lakh member 1 lakh 35 something there are to finalize whether they give it to one or one party, two party, three parties. We have to see Mizani also pursuing that and whatever samples they are asking. Also we are discussing and giving. Once the tender is finalized even we get a number of say 25% or 30% also it is a huge value.
Amit Dixit
Okay. Got it sir. Got it. Thank you so much. Thanks a lot.
Operator
Thank you very much. Due to time constraints we’ll have to take that as the last question. I would now like to hand the conference back to the management team for closing comments.
Gowri Sankara Rao Naramsetti
Thank you. Now I request my DPM to give the closing remarks.
T. Muthukumar
As we have discussed now Milan is in the correct quarter and we have improved compared to whatever we were in the last year with respect to profit, EBITDA and the reduction in the inventory. Our order position also very good. And coming years also we are accepting full order because of this government institute on increasing the session and there will not be any dearth of order. And we had also added new facilities like new work which has come and we have modernized our bar and wire for milk which is also going to be a major useful.
And we are planning to reverse further 100 coast in the next year. So these all will help further augmenting the facility which in turn will cater the retirement of all the strategic program. Now if you see I was a delayed order. Whatever it was there drastically it has come down. It used to be about two years back it was used to be about 1000 crores. Now it has come less than 200 crores.
So that shows that we had improved our efficiency in exhibiting the order. So this will further come down. And the next year, if you say at the end of the next year, there will not be any delay, but so these all will create lot of confidence on our customer and our sales. Also, since a lot of this is turnover also, definitely there will be improvement by 20% because we added a new equipment which recently has been commissioned in the third quarter and coming to operation from the fourth quarter. So this will come in hand to hand with the next year. So we will have a great future in the next year. That’s what I wanted to say. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you very much on behalf of ICICI Securities. That concludes the conference. Thank you for joining us, ladies and gentlemen.