Mahanagar Gas Ltd (NSE: MGL) Q4 2025 Earnings Call dated May. 07, 2025
Corporate Participants:
Unidentified Speaker
Ashu Shinghal — Managing Director
Rajesh Patel — Chief Financial Officer
Analysts:
Unidentified Participant
Ramesh Sankaranarayanan — Analyst
Yash Nandwani — Analyst
Nirmal Gore — Analyst
Yogesh Patil — Analyst
Kirtan Mehta — Analyst
Maulik Patel — Analyst
Mayank Maheshwari — Analyst
Hardik Solanki — Analyst
Nitin Tiwari — Analyst
Kartik — Analyst
S. Ramesh — Analyst
Presentation:
operator
The conference is now being recorded. Foreign. Ladies and gentlemen, Good day and welcome to the Q4 and FY25 earnings conference call of Mahanagar Gas Limited hosted by Nirmal Bank Institutional Equities Private Limited. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen only mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing Star then zero on your touchstone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. S. Ramesh from Nirmal Bank Institutional Equities. Thank you. And over to you sir.
Ramesh Sankaranarayanan — Analyst
Good evening ladies and gentlemen. On behalf of Nalbang Institutional Equities I have great pleasure in inviting all of you to join the fourth quarter FY25 earnings conference call with the management of Mahanar Gas. Representing the management, we are Mr. Anshu Singhal, Managing Director Sanjay Chande, Deputy Managing Director Mr. Rajesh Patel, Chief Financial Officer and Mr. Rajesh Baghle, Senior Vice President Marketing. So before we begin I’d like to mention that some of the statements made in today’s discussion may be forward looking in nature and believe that expectations containing the statement are reasonable. However, these statements involve a number of risks and uncertainty that may lead to different results.
We urge you to consider that quarterly numbers are not a reflection of long term trends or indication of full year results. With that said, let me hand over the call to the management. Over to you Mr. Singhal.
Ashu Shinghal — Managing Director
Thank you Ramesh. On behalf of MGL, a very good afternoon to you and welcome to the earnings call of Manheva Gas Ltd. For the fourth quarter of the financial year. I would like to thank all of you for attending the call today. MGL continues to create CGD infrastructure across its business segments in the licensed area. During this quarter 15142 domestic households are connected and thus we have established connectivity for nearly 2.83 million households. We have laid 236.07 km of steel and PE pipelines taking the total length to over 7459 km. We also added 24 stations during this quarter and with this we have overall 385 stations as on 31st March 25th.
We have also added 164 Inc. Industrial and Commercial customers during this quarter and Therefore as on 31st March 25th we have 5105 industrial and commercial customers. During the year 40 CNG stations were added taking total to 385 numbers. As on 31st March we added 343,000 domestic households and therefore have established connectivity for nearly 2.83 million households. PE pipeline laid during the year is in excess of 491 km taking the total length to 7459 km. Addition of 98,215 CNG vehicles which is the highest numbers of CNG vehicle addition in our areas of operation since inception and now we have more than 11 million CNG vehicles running in our geographies as of 31st March.
In respect of our geographical area Liger up to March 25th we have connected 95714 domestic households and 65 CNG stations which are currently under operation. During the quarter we have laid 21.27km of pipeline in Ryaga, therefore taking the total length to 466.94 kilometer coming to MGL’s overall operation quarter on quarter Comparison Average sales volume for Q4 there was some disturbance coming back to the average Sales volume of Q4 25 is 4.194 mm HGMD as compared to the previous quarter of 4.116. Such average sales volume of 4.194 consists of CNG of 2.934, domestic PNG of 0.59, an industrial and commercial volume of 0.67 MMsc MD.
Average sales volume for the year ending 31st March 25th is 4.0452 MMscMD whereas it was 3.609 in the corresponding period last year. Thus there is an increase of 12.27% in the overall sales volume compared to the previous year. Average sales volume for the year ending 31st 25 is 4.052 mm FCMD consisting of CNG volume of 2.878 mm FCMD, domestic PNG of 0.554 and industrial and commercial volume of 0.621 compared to the previous year. Sales volume in the case of CNG has increased from 2.591 to 2.878 which is an increase of 11.08%. Domestic PNG has increased to 0.554 MMSTMD which is an increase of 6.53 and the Inc sales have gone up to 0.621 which is an increase of 24.46.
EBITDA from operations for the quarter is 378 crore as compared to the previous year quarter EBITDA of 314 crore which is an increase of 20%. Net profit after tax for the quarter is 252 crore as compared to the previous PAT of 225 crore which is an increase of 12%. EBITDA from operations for the financial year is 1510. Previous to financial year EBITDA of 1843 crore. The reduction is mainly due to reduction in APM allocation and increase in gas cost impacting margins adversely. Net profit after tax for the whole financial year is 1045 crore compared to net pad for the previous year of 1289cr.
Now coming to the Unison Enviro Private Limited operations which is a wholly owned subsidiary, the company has added during the quarter 15 CNG station, connected 4,997 domestic households and added three industrial and commercial customers and has laid 61.34 km of steel and PE pipeline. UPL has added 26 stations during this year which has taken its total number to 82. The company has also added 12,002 domestic households and established connectivity for nearly 39,000 households and added nine industrial and commercial customer. During the whole financial year UPL has laid 95.63 km of steel and PE pipeline taking the total length to over 361km.
There was addition of 13,678 vehicles in the UEPL area and also now UEPL has total 54,000 CNG vehicles in the geographical areas as on 31st March 25th. During this quarter UEPL has achieved an overall average sale of 0.208 mmscmd as against 0.192 in the previous quarter which is an increase of 8%. Current quarter volume consists of CNG volume of 0.189 and PNG volume of 0.0186 mmscmd. During this year UEPL has achieved an overall average sale volume of 0.182 against a 0.129 mmscmd in the previous year which is an increase of 41%. In the year ending this the financial year 31st March 25th.
MGL as a consolidated entity has achieved total sales volume of 4.235 mmhcmd. I’m happy to announce that the Board of Directors Directors have approved a total financial dividend final dividend of rupees 18 per equity share for this financial year. The total dividend for the year including interim dividend already paid is rupees 30 per share, that is 300% on the face value of rupees 10 per equity share. With this I conclude and would like now like to open the floor for the question. Thank you very much for your Patient hearing.
Questions and Answers:
operator
Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touch tone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue you may press star and two participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Yash Nandwani from iifl. Please go ahead. Hello Yash, you are unmuted. Can you.
Ashu Shinghal
Hello?
Yash Nandwani
Am I audible?
operator
Yes sir.
Ashu Shinghal
Yeah.
Yash Nandwani
Thanks for the opportunity sir. Firstly, on the sharp increase in OPEX per SEM this quarter I understand there was some marketing scheme for CNG in fourth quarter and also CSR expenditure typically gets booked in the last quarter. So could you please share the amount. Spent on marketing and CSR in fourth quarter?
Rajesh Patel
In the fourth quarter marketing is around 11 crores spent and as far as CSR is concerned roughly 10 crore is the expenditure on CSR in the last quarter. Apart from that I think the increase is mainly attributable to generally maintenance activities are taken up higher in the fourth quarter compared to all other quarters. So balance is attributable to that. Somewhat attributable to consultancy and maybe one or two pipeline rents we have added in the last quarter.
Yash Nandwani
Okay, and secondly sir, could you please provide the volume growth separately for each of the geography, Mumbai, Thane and Rigad.
Ashu Shinghal
Okay, we can separately share it with you because there are some details involved in it Sir.
Yash Nandwani
Answer last question was mixed breakdown of 4.2 mm cmd. How much came from APM, NWZ, RLNG and spot if any
Rajesh Patel
out of 4.2. Roughly you know million is APM. That is I’m talking about average because there was some increase in January, February and it kept on changing. So on an average for the quarter it is 2 million around half a million is HPHT around 1.35 to 1.4 is term contracts which includes Brent Link as well as Henry Hub and balances through igx. Majority of IGX is HPHT available on a short term basis and some small amount of spot that is a breakup for the quarter roughly 2.4.2.
Yash Nandwani
Sure sir. And how do you expect this link to evolve in the upcoming quarters?
Rajesh Patel
So right now I think the allocation of APM has come down to around 1.67 mmscmd. But correspondingly there is an increase in the NWG available which is around 0.65. Okay, so bearings, you know replacement of APM with NWG more or less things should remain same and whatever is the incremental volumes that should be initially sourced through IGX on a short term basis. And once it stabilizes we will enter into further term contracts which could be either HH Brent or available HPHT in the market as and when it comes up.
Yash Nandwani
Okay, thanks a lot sir.
Ashu Shinghal
Thank you.
operator
Thank you sir. We will take our next question from the line of Nirmal Gore from Aditya Birla Sun Life. Please go ahead.
Nirmal Gore
Thank you for the opportunity. Sir, I just wanted to ask you. Transition.
Ashu Shinghal
Yeah, I think discussions are going on. There were four, five meetings already held and we can’t disclose much of it. But yes, positive discussions are happening about the directions given by the High Court which is that how to curb the pollution primarily and also to promote CNG and EV adoption in the whole area. So the committee was formed two months back, several meetings have held and we will submit our report maybe in a month’s time to the High Court and then it will be further disclosed to the public.
Nirmal Gore
Okay sir, thank you sir.
Ashu Shinghal
Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Yogesh Patel from Dalat Capital. Please go ahead.
Yogesh Patil
Thanks for an opportunity, sir. Sir, as you just mentioned 1.3 mms cmd is LNG gas sourcing. Can you break it down in how much is crude link and Henry Hub?
Rajesh Patel
If possible around 1.27 is Henry Hub link and point one is Brent linked.
Yogesh Patil
Okay sir, my second question is related to the current environment. Considering the crude prices at a $62 per barrel and majority of your gas basket is linked to the crude then the question is can you guide us on the revised EBITDA margins for the FY26?
Ashu Shinghal
We are not directly linked to crude. As Rajesh just mentioned, our majority of term contracts are linked to Henria. HPHT is an index which is based on three basket of three indices and the lower of the three is taken. So we can’t say that our majority of term contracts are linked to crude basket. Coming to the other part that the crude has come down but Henry AIRB has remained stable more or less.
Rajesh Patel
So maybe you know you are referring to IBC also linked to in a way indirectly to the crude. Yes, if that comes down. But Indian crude, Indian crude basket.
Ashu Shinghal
Yeah, yeah. That may give us a saving because almost. Yeah, new well gas is linked to the Indian crude basket which is at 12%. also APM and APM also. So if $62 is the current rate and every month average is taken. So again the ceiling is there. So Currently the ceiling is 6.$75 per mmbtu. So if the crude remains below 67.$5 per barrel then the APM prices will come down and similarly the 12% to IBC will also be on a lower side because earlier the crude was ranging trading in the range of $75 or $80. So this benefit will lower the procurement cost on the average procurement basis for the total portfolio and that will be reflected into our better EBITDA margins.
Coming to your EBITDA margins this year this quarter we have earned around 10 rupees but and on the whole for the year is again 10 rupees. So it depends what is the procurement cost and how much of it we can sustain and how much we can pass on. Depending on that we can have a guidance of around 9 to 11 rupees as EBITDA margin for the whole year coming 2526. But you will appreciate that the things are very dynamic in nature. Also there are geopolitical things which again may result into wide fluctuation in either crude or gas prices.
So let us see how the things roll out and then we’ll take a call on the EBITDA margins because EBITDA margins depend on the alternate fuel price, the procurement cost, our margins and how much we can absorb, how much we can pass on to bring more stability into CNG prices.
Yogesh Patil
Let me quickly add on the same side Sir Henry Hub gas prices which is the major portion of your LNG link, gas sourcing that has also come down, I will not say sharply, but that has declined by 25 to 30% in last one and a half two months period kind of a time. So will it help you to improvise your EBITDA margin guidance for FY26 yogesh?
Rajesh Patel
I think if you look at Henry Hub whatever $3 plus or three and a half nearly was in last few months, four to five months of last year but if you take the average it was still lower. So we’ll have to watch out for the full year because we will be comparing the average which prevailed in 2425 with the average which will prevail in 2526. So I think we’ll have to wait and watch and then have a EBITDA margins.
Ashu Shinghal
I see we are better performing than our competitor peer company. So I think 9 to 11 is a very healthy margin. Previously we were having a margin of around 7.8rupees. So it’s not very unhealthy I would say. Okay.
Yogesh Patil
And lastly, sir PNG industrial and the commercial is growing at a 20% on volume side year on year basis. So the same pace of growth can be expected from this segment in the coming quarters. And if you could elaborate on the major growth areas of this segment.
Rajesh Patel
Largest. Chunk of that growth has come from large industries managed to connect reach a few new areas and connect a few very large industries who had not been taking gas for a long time. I mean this rate of growth of 20 plus percent, I mean has been unprecedented and sustaining it at this rate may not be possible for too long. However, our current Inc sale which is about between 0 point to 0.7 mms cmd we can foresee that going up to about 0.9 or 1 mms cmd in the next couple of years or so. Beyond that, as things stand today, we will have to find some ways to break into the solid fuel market because the addressable potential which we see in the FO and other addressable liquid fuel industry is about 1.1.1 million.
Yogesh Patil
Thanks. Thanks a lot sir. I’ll come back in a 10 questions.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Kirtan Mehta from Baroda BNP Paribus Mutual Fund. Please go ahead.
Kirtan Mehta
Thank you sir for the opportunity. In terms of the CNG promotion scheme that we have run through SY25, how was the sort of take up by the consumers, how much we spent and how much vehicles get added under different categories during the FY25.
Rajesh Patel
In the current year, the scheme which we ran from October 24 to March 25 A total of 624 vehicles were added through the scheme which were primarily medium and large commercial vehicles with a gross vehicle weight of more than three and a half tons and about 30 odd buses. And the spend which was there was about 2 to 3 lakh rupees per vehicle. And overall in this we have spent around 32 to 34 crores on the promotional schemes for vehicles and for the quarter it was 11 crore. Considering that these are, you know the per capita CNG consumption of these vehicle classes are slightly on the higher side, we get a pretty good payback. And since the method of incentive is through a CNG sales card which can only be used at our CNG stations, you know we are ensuring that we get all the associated volume out also from these vehicles at our stations.
Ashu Shinghal
And if you see overall conversion for the year this is highest in the in the history of MGL that is 98,215 number of conversions happened during the year against around 77,000 the last year. So this is a result of all these things. The scale, the consistency in the CNG prices and the infrastructure improvement which is happening in our geographical areas.
Kirtan Mehta
Do you plan to continue this in FY26 as well?
Rajesh Patel
We are keeping a close eye on the market and also in constant discussion with the oes. Look, we ran this last year, we ran this this year again we need to make sure that it is a marketing scheme which gives a push to the volumes and not something which is customers anyway will wait and say okay, every year is going to come or something. So we will watch the market and time our schemes accordingly. And especially the schemes where the paybacks are relatively high. Like for these large commercial vehicles, we will incentivize them. Similarly we are also looking at incentivizing any customer or anybody who comes as a bulk customer to us.
You know, first fleet operators, first fleet. Operator or a very large transporter. Then we can do one on one mous with them. Also to incentivize them to nudge them towards cng.
Kirtan Mehta
Right? Could you also give us a breakup of the 98,000 vehicle that has been added during the year?
Ashu Shinghal
Around 55,000 is private car, 7,000 is taxis, 25,000 is three wheelers, small commercial and other commercial vehicle is around 7,000 and balance is 3,000 is two wheeler also and around 350 is the buses or 450 is around the buses for both MSRTC and some NMT buses are there.
Kirtan Mehta
Thank you. Just last question from my side. We have been entered into two J. Basically we invested into two companies, three EV and the battery. JV, could you give us the progress on them?
Ashu Shinghal
Yeah. Three EV we have already. We have committed for 32% equity and with a capital of around crore. So that was linked with certain progress to be made. So we have paid 3 transient and around 23 crore is balance. So they have started making progress. It is a startup company so it takes some time for the company to pick up. But the signs are good. Their market is now getting established. They have produced around 850 vehicles during this financial year. With respect to the Indian International Battery Company IBC, we are committed for 1 gigawatt in the first two phases and following it up to scale up to maximum 5 gigawatt.
Currently the company has been formed. We have got the land and the site work has started. So maybe within 12 to 14 15, 12 to 14, 15 months the plant should be in place. We have already given them the initial equity and 40% commitment of equity is there from our side. 60% will be contributed from IBC USA.
Rajesh Patel
In terms of the marketing efforts, IBC has already started seeding the market by importing the battery cells and making battery packs in India from South Korea. So we have a line of customers which is getting built up and the response is quite good in terms of, you know, vehicle performance using the battery packs manufactured by IDC.
Kirtan Mehta
Right. And in terms of 3 EV what would be sort of the milestone that we’ll be looking for in FY26?
Rajesh Patel
Currently they are producing around 200 vehicles a month. Okay. So on an average 2,400 vehicles maybe that will be ramped up by few hundred more vehicles. There is another plot which has been taken to add the capacity. So once that starts we will be in a better position to tell you their annual capacity on vehicle production.
Kirtan Mehta
Thank you sir. I will get back in with you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Molik Patel from Equis Securities. Please go ahead.
Maulik Patel
Hi, thanks for the opportunity. Just one question. You mentioned that you have almost 1.27 MMFCMB of angry hub link volume. I mean that number has gone up over the last two quarter. That’s if you look at from your basket of close to 4mms CMB that’s more than almost 30% of the volume which come from Henry. And so do you have any strategy that you want to have both mixture of Henry hub and oil given that oil link or the spot is very low in the current supply mix or are you comfortable with this kind of ratio and as the volume increases you will keep increasing the Henry up volume?
Rajesh Patel
I think you’re right in terms of proportion of Henry up currently in our total portfolio of term contract is higher. I think in the further needs we will evaluate and definitely we will be inducting BREND link if it is available at good index for next 5 to 6 years term contract and we are open to that. Certainly it’s not that only we will be. We will balance out in next term contract whenever we tie up.
Ashu Shinghal
But overall portfolio if you see there is, I mean Henry is there but we have HPHT of around 0.6 MMSTMD which primarily indirectly is linked to crude and NWG is again crude Indian crude basket and even APM is Indian crude basket. So it is not that we are overly depend. I mean our portfolio is inclined to Henry up. It is a balanced portfolio I would say.
Maulik Patel
Okay, and how much of the NWG you have regarding Q4 and currency you are getting? How much is how much NWG volume you got in the Q4
Rajesh Patel
in the. Q4 roughly 0.1 of NWG was available and currently we have around 0.65 of NWG in the month of April. I am referring to.
Maulik Patel
And just another question. The industrial growth has been very strong. I think in the last couple of quarters we have been reporting almost 20% kind of volume growth on industrial side and what’s driving this growth and in your assessment will this kind of growth profile will continue in this new FY26 or what should we want that side.
Ashu Shinghal
Partially answered this question some time back. However, just to repeat there are two main drivers to this growth. One is the call which we took that we will guarantee a customer a 3 or 10% discount on his alternate fuel without any floor that has helped many customers to get onboarded. Second is we have managed to physically reach out to quite a lot of large customers and lay our pipelines right up to their premises which has also led to this increase in volume. So we made our terms and conditions more favorable and we backed that up by physical connectivity which has led to this growth in volume.
We’re expecting this a similar growth to continue for some time but not very long of course. I mean last point is if there is any environmental related upside in terms of you know, air quality and something happening to solid fuel etc. Then this can grow exponentially.
Maulik Patel
The last question on the regulatory side there’s a high powered committee has been set up by the NGRB to look at the open access in the CGD network. Open access. What’s your view on that side? And let’s say it’s come that the network is getting open for third party to access. Why do you see NGL in terms of either benefiting from that particular policy or going to see some competition in your key areas.
Ashu Shinghal
The committee is still to give their recommendation. It’s an internal committee constituted by pngrb. Further you must appreciate that the matter is subjugates the under Delhi High Court and the discussions are going on. So PNGRB when they constituted this committee they all and when they mentioned about infrastructure exclusivity they have categorically mentioned that this all is consultation is being done and this will be subject to the final decision taken by the Delhi High Court. Now having said that if the exclusivity has to end there are two parts to it. Infrastructure exclusivity and marketing exclusivity. The infrastructure exclusivity there is a provision in the regulation itself itself to increase by 10 years in the bracket of 10 years after completion of 25 years.
So in 2 of our areas we have already applied and it can get. I mean PNGRB is considering for extension of that. And word over what we have found is that infrastructure exclusivity is generally available to the regulate to the entity which is working in that area. Coming to the marketing exclusivity, it has a mixed thing because we will be getting paid for the utilization of our assets as and when the areas get opened up. And we can also go to other geographies and other entities to trade our volumes. So it’s a mixed thing. We will be getting returns on our investments and we will have an opportunity to work in other places also.
And others will also have an opportunity to work in our. But all that is subject to Delhi High Court decision, High Power committee as you mentioned and the way PNGRB opens up this sector and the way the whole thing rolls up because there are a lot of finer details about how the things will be rolled out. The regulations, the mechanism and the way who will be allowed to come in different areas and so on and so forth. So we have to watch because it will be a mixed bag for us. It will be an opportunity for us also to go in other geographies and at the same time other people to come in our geography.
So it’s either win win or loss loss for both the parties. But we think it is a step in the right direction as far as the marketing exclusivity is concerned. But let us wait for the Delhi High Court decision before coming to any conclusion on this.
Maulik Patel
Great. Thanks for such an elevated answer. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. We’ll take our next question from the line of Mayank Maheshwari from Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead.
Mayank Maheshwari
Hi sir. Thank you for doing the call. My question was related to LNG and how has LNG trucking kind of picked up in the gas for you and what are you seeing in terms of trends or any incentives that you’re kind of giving around the entire LNG market for trucking. Thank you.
Ashu Shinghal
Man. We already in case of MGL we have our running station at Savroli which presently is around selling around 4 tons of energy every day. Our JV company MLPL has already started months station in Aurangabad and the second station at Sydney in MP near Nagpur was commissioned in this year. Mechanically we should start selling the LNG by end of the quarter. One two more stations. One in Amravati and one in Jain. Amravati is already started construction and JNPT station will also be completed in this financial year. Probably by Q3 of this year we see a very good potential as we keep on adding the stations, we are getting the customers.
Presently we have three main customers. One is Concord and Greenline as well as some other companies. And going forward we see that at least another 10 to 12 stations in Maharashtra itself will be required to cater to the demand from trucking. On the supply side, not only Ashok Lilian but Volo Aisha is also very committed on providing the various models of LNG and we see the demand coming from that side also.
Mayank Maheshwari
Thank you.
operator
Thank you sir. The next question is from the line of Hardik Solanki from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.
Hardik Solanki
Yes sir. As you mentioned the allocation. Just want to check what was your location you know or the APM location and new guest location for the Q4 and what is in April so far. Can you break down that
Ashu Shinghal
APM allocation. For Q4 is asking.
Rajesh Patel
As I said APM was Q4 was 2 million and very small quantity of NWG around 0.1.
Hardik Solanki
And what is for the appraisal so far APM and new business Right now.
Rajesh Patel
We are getting APM of around 1.67 and 0.65 of new.
Hardik Solanki
Well okay, whatever the additional growth we come up or whatever the additional requirement would be there for the CNG segment that will be fulfilled by the new vessel, right? What is that understanding correct?
Rajesh Patel
Yeah. So APM after using for domestic whatever is remaining then NWG then we have HPHT contracts and if there is any shortfall that gets catered through Henry Hubbub or we buy it from IGX on a spot basis also hphd.
Hardik Solanki
Sorry, just just getting confused. Your the new guest valve of 0.65 mm same D that will be a constant for certain time frame or it will get increased as the volume get increased.
Ashu Shinghal
So let me just clarify. The APM quality quantity is not getting reduced. What is happening is the APM overall kitty is same. Some of the APM which is getting reduced is reclassified as new well gas. In fact the APM reduction was lower and the new well gas addition was more. But overall if we see the quantity of gas remains the same. Except that the reclassification of APM which is at ceiling of 6.75 will be sold at a higher price. But the quantity of gas remains the same. So as Rajesh was mentioning that if we have to increase CNG volume 10% growth so maybe we have to source gas from other sources also like or HPHD depending on because the overall CGD consumption in the country is Growing whereas APM is stagnant or may increase slightly.
So whatever the growth is happening the shortfall needs to be met through other sources. Be it HPHT or term contract. The same will be situation for MGL also that APM kitty either NWG and APM put together. If the requirement is more for the industry then we have to source it to other sources.
Hardik Solanki
Okay, that’s really helpful. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. Sir, the next question is from the line of Nitin Tiwari from Philip Capital. Please go ahead.
Nitin Tiwari
I say good evening. Thanks for the opportunity. Just bookkeeping once from my end. So what was the CNG sales in KG in this quarter? And also if you can update the industrial and commercial volumes down.
Ashu Shinghal
Q4 1 second.
Rajesh Patel
In terms of kgs it was 2.934 million kgs per day.
Nitin Tiwari
2.94 per day I.e.
Rajesh Patel
Scmd, MMSCMD and 2.16 kgs million kgs per day in terms of kgs 2.161.
Nitin Tiwari
Understood sir. And the breakup of industrial commercial volumes in respective industrial and commercial segments out.
Rajesh Patel
Of total inc volume around 0.14 is the commercial volume.
Nitin Tiwari
0.14 per day?
Rajesh Patel
Yeah, 0.14 mms, cmd and rest is industry.
Nitin Tiwari
Thank you. So that is all comments.
operator
Thank you. We’ll take our next question from the line of Karthik from clsa. Please go ahead.
Kartik
Hello sir. Thank you for taking my question. I just wanted to ask about the opex. So I can see that OPEX on a year on year basis has gone up 22% to 8.1 billion which is roughly 18 crores. And gross profit has been down 6%. So just wanted to get a sense on how we should be thinking about OPEX from here on.
Rajesh Patel
As far as you know OPEX linked to volume is concerned mainly CNG volume. Certainly it will go up because most of the expenses apart even gas is linked then power and fuel, the dispensing charges, the LCV transportation in case of transportation of gas to non online station or daughter booster station from mother session. So all those expenses are volume linked and certainly they have gone up. Okay. And apart from that some of the one time expenses like sales promotion we have taken up in this Q4 mainly the drive to do lot of maintenance of the old pipeline, old equipment et cetera. And as I earlier said in Q4 this year CSR expenditure on yearly basis also more because average profit of last three years was up. So what we were spending around 1617 crore has gone up to around 20 to 23 crore. Okay. And sales promotion is another addition which is added in the OPEX to push the CNG volume or CNG vehicle adoption.
Kartik
So could you please give a breakdown. So like 22 crores is the CSR expense, 32 crore is the marketing expense. So beyond that everything else is CNG like volume linked expenses or is there anything else in that mix?
Rajesh Patel
Yeah, no, no other than that. Mostly volume link things are there and as I said some part of it’s mainly Q4 numbers you referred to. There is some increase in maintenance of around 15 to 17 crores in the quarter four mainly.
Kartik
So how do you think of this as in terms of guidance for FY26 and 27 on an annual basis?
Rajesh Patel
I think the expenses will remain except one time expenses like sales promotion. Depending on how much we roll out next year, maybe in the similar quarter or something. It should remain some amount of, you know, variable expenses like transportation of gas from mother session to daughter booster going forward will reduce in a way because today we have only one CGS in our rigor ga. We are already in the process of setting up other ga. So once you have a GA CGS there, the transportation which is happening from little far will reduce and that will reduce the cost.
Okay. And even in GA2 I have you know, lot of daughter booster stations. So if those stations get slowly connected through pipeline that will also save on the transportation costs etc.
Kartik
Okay, so one last thing. Do you still have the similar guidance for on volume and margin for FY 2627 which is like 10% volume growth and 10 to 12 rupees of unit EBITDA.
Ashu Shinghal
Yeah, I think volume growth will be in the range of 10% plus minus one. Maybe it can be more than 10% also because you see the momentum has come on CNG part as well as industrial commercial. This year also we have some scope to increase dpng. We have been steadily growing and again 7,8% dpng growth can come up the volume side. Similar numbers are expected this financial year also with respect to the margins we have just discussed. Maybe nine to eleven rupees is the right guidance for the next financial year. This year we have been, we have got ten rupees but one correction is there.
So we may come down to nine and a half rupees if that correction is taken into place. Otherwise nine and a half to ten, ten and a half, eleven rupees. That range would be our expectations.
Kartik
Thank you sir.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Falguni Dutta from Mansarovar Financials Please go ahead. Sorry to interrupt ma’am. Your voice is low so can you. Hello. Hello ma’am.
Unidentified Participant
Hello.
operator
Yes, now it’s audible. Yes, ma’am. Yes.
Ashu Shinghal
Yeah.
Unidentified Participant
My question has been answered. Thank you so much.
Ashu Shinghal
Thank you.
operator
All right, ma’am. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Kirtan Mehta from Baroda BNP Paribus Mutual fund. Please go ahead.
Kirtan Mehta
Thank you sir. For one more opportunity in terms of the CapEx, what’s our guidance for FY26 and what will be the broad breakthrough.
Ashu Shinghal
We are expecting around 1300 crore capex for FY26 and again around 150cr will be in UEPL. And we are also in the process of merging uepl back to MGL. So collectively putting together 1300 cr will be the number expected this financial year.
Kirtan Mehta
Broad breakup between CNG and pipeline. If it’s possible to share.
Rajesh Patel
CNG should be in the range of you know 200 crores odd in Mumbai. I mean sorry NGL and maybe 50 to 75 crore depending on how many stations and sites you get. In case of UEPL as well.
Ashu Shinghal
Balance is both a mix of PNG steel pipeline, PE pipeline and operational capex. So as Rajesh mentioned around 300 crore will be in the for CNG around 500 crore will be in for PNG including pipelines the pipelines will be around 200 and opex will be around 100k replacement capex replacement around that number broadly.
Kirtan Mehta
Thank you sir. And in terms of the. There has been a sort of clarity on that. We will have 2 quarter clarity on the allocation of APM. So has it already been implemented or when is it likely to get implemented?
Ashu Shinghal
No, the allocation of APM happens from time to time but typically based on certain triggers. This gas is being produced locally by ONGC and mainly by ONGC and Gale does the balancing act. So there are certain minor adjustments. But some trigger points do happen like year on year reduction of APM and reclassification NWG as per committee and DGS recommendation is done by ministry and implemented by gate. So those things happen on inter in a regular interval basis.
Kirtan Mehta
But also to just reply to what you are that committee, the government recommendation that we will get a guidance 2 2/4 ahead that is not yet formulated.
Ashu Shinghal
Okay. Yeah, we get some notice but not two quarter notice if that was your question.
Kirtan Mehta
Sure sir. Thank you.
Ashu Shinghal
Thank you.
Rajesh Patel
There was a question earlier on GA’s volume breakup. 1.93 mms cmd was sale for GA1 1.88 is the volume for GA2 and balance around 0.25 or 2 50,000 scmd is for GA3.
operator
Okay, thank you sir. Before we take the next question we would like to remind the participants that you may press Star and one to ask a question. The next question is from the line of Hardik Solanki from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead sir.
Hardik Solanki
As you said that you know the the CAPEX guidance would be around 1300 crore. So can you just break down these GA wise, you know how much would be to the new GA and you know basically in three GA3 and how much would be in the GA1 and GA2.
Rajesh Patel
The very very strict breakdown cannot be given because depending on you know availability of site the CAPEX will be done but broadly around 30% could go to GA3. Rest I think almost 60, 65% will be in GA1 and GA2.
Ashu Shinghal
And 1300 also include around 15, 20%.
Hardik Solanki
That helpful sir. Thank you.
Ashu Shinghal
Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Karthi who is an investor. Please go ahead. Sir.
Unidentified Participant
With respect to the reduction in the apm. Yes already is there any discussion on a CGD basis, industry basis for either reduction of exercise or inclusion of MG in the GST regime with government? Because I seem to understand that at present the volume of APM is at 40% and gradually it may be phased out to zero. So considering the parameter, whether any discussion is there as a CGD industry as a whole to include either reduction in excess or maybe inclusion of MG in GST wherein it will promote more usage of MG and will align with the government vision also for increasing the gas volumes from 6% to 15%.
Is there any discussion going on? I just wanted to know on that.
Unidentified Speaker
A lot of discussion is going on. In fact our regulator PNGRB has also been following it up with ministry for one reduction, you know, elimination of excise duty on the CNG and CNG as well as LCNG also. And second is the inclusion of gas in the gst. So we were hoping that something positive should come out at least in next GST council meeting as well as in the next budget. But the discussions are going on for both these items. One is GST as well as excise duty.
Ashu Shinghal
Discussions always have happened within the industry also as a, as a industry association also the things are getting different discussed and they have been put up in right perspective to both MOP and G and regulator and other ministries because final decision will either come from GST council or from the Finance Ministry regarding excise duty. So Everything is not in control of the association or the CGD industries. But yes, we keep on pressing our views to the right forums.
Unidentified Participant
Sir. And my second question is related to the INC volumes. So if we see in Q4FY25 the volumes from Inc are at 0.59 mms. So with wherever areas where MDP and steel network is charged with connection of further prospective Inc customers, what is the outlook for the INC volumes over the next three years? Maybe medium term we can consider.
Unidentified Speaker
I think we answered this question sometime back. Currently our INC volume is between 0.6 and 0.7 mms cmd and we are looking to take it up to about 1.1.1 MMS CMD in a couple of years.
Unidentified Participant
Okay sir, thank you.
operator
Thank you. We will take our last question from the line of Mr. S. Ramesh from Nirmal Bank Institutional Equities. Please go ahead.
Ramesh Sankaranarayanan
Hello. So before we close the call I just had a couple of thoughts. One is if you look at the slowdown in the auto sector they are growing in that 2, 3%. What is the kind of run rate one can expect in terms of CNG vehicle additions? What are you seeing this month? And secondly if you look at the price increases you have taken between December and April and the kind of stabilization in the input gas cost, are we now there in terms of having passed on most of the gas cost changes and eventually will we see the volume growth and the price increase helping you improve the top line growth and margins? How do you read that situation over the next 12 years?
Ashu Shinghal
There are multiple questions Ramesh on this but going one by one see the procurement cost has gone up as APM has come down substantially for CNG. As far as EPNG is concerned we are getting 100% APM allocation. So there there’s no problem coming to CNG. Yes, it is a very dynamic situation. Currently we are getting around 36% APM and balance is sourced through multiple places HPHT, Nueville Gas, Henry Hub and a mix of plus some balancing space spot gas also. So since the crude has come down substantially in last few months so we think that we will be able to manage with the current prices.
But again it is very dynamic situation depending on the alternate fuel prices and our cost of procurement. How it looks like in next few months we will take a call on final whether to increase or decrease the prices with respect to margins. Yes we are comfortable. As has already been answered the volume growth again has been addressed that around 10% volume growth is expected with respect to CNG vehicle additions we are adding around 98,000 this year which is a huge number. As far as year on year growth is also concerned the auto sector, I mean again all the fuels are working closely like it cannot be said that CNG volumes over the country is going up.
If you see some of the report, CNG was the highest sale in terms of percentage growth around 46% year on year. Whereas EV has come down slightly. So it again keeps on changing year on year and also pushes there for promoting EV and CNG vehicles. Even in Mumbai and Delhi, even that Mumbai High Court Committee has been constituted. So we see that as an upside if pollution is to take into place into consideration. So we may get some upside from the High Court committee recommendations and acceptance by the High Court. So overall we see it is a mixed bag where we have some positive and some adverse things to deal, some challenges to deal with.
Ramesh Sankaranarayanan
Thank you very much. With that we shall close the call. We should thank all the investors and analysts for joining the call with some insightful questions. And we thank the NGL management for giving us opportunity to host the call and for answering all the questions patiently. Thank you very much sir. Have a good day. Thanks a lot.
Ashu Shinghal
Thank you everyone for joining for today’s investor call.
Rajesh Patel
Thank you.
operator
Thank you on behalf of Nirmalbank Institutional Equities Private Limited. That concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us. And you may now disconnect your lines.