Ksolves India Limited (NSE: KSOLVES) Q2 2025 Earnings Call dated Oct. 21, 2024
Corporate Participants:
Ratan Srivastava — Chairman & Managing Director
Umang Soni — Chief Financial Officer
Manish Gurnani — Chief Technology Officer
Unidentified Speaker
Analysts:
Ravi Kumar Naredi — Analyst
Vijay Chauhan — Analyst
Anil Kumar — Analyst
Raghav Agarwal — Analyst
Karan Kapooria — Analyst
Ayush Agarwal — Analyst
Aman Agrawal — Analyst
Lovneet Puri — Analyst
Unidentified Participant
Darshil Pandya — Analyst
Arman Patel — Analyst
Presentation:
Operator
Ladies and gentlemen, I welcome you all to the Q2 and H1 FY ’25 post earnings conference call of Ksolves India Limited. Today on the call from the management team, we have with us Mr. Ratan Srivastava, Chairman and Managing Director; Mr. Manish Gurnani, Chief Technology Officer; and Mr. Umang Soni, Chief Financial Officer. As a disclaimer, I would like to inform all of you that this call may contain forward-looking statements which may involve risk and uncertainties.
Also, a reminder that this call is being recorded. I would now request the management to detail us about the business, performance highlights for the quarter, their growth plans and visions for the coming year post which we will open the floor for Q&A. Over to the management team.
Ratan Srivastava — Chairman & Managing Director
Thank you. Thank you, Vinayji. Good afternoon, everyone. Thank you for joining us today for our Q2 earnings calls. I am Ratan Kumar Srivastava and CEO and founder of the KSOS. With me, I have today Manish, CTO; and Umang CFO. Today, we will be discussing the result of this quarter, key highlights of our performance and the strategic direction moving forward. After our prepared remarks, we will be open the floor for your questions.
Now I will hand over this call to Umang. He will present you the PPT and after that Manish will give you the brief explanation about the technologies and what we are doing in the technologies, what we have done, what is our plan and then we will have a question-answer. So over to Umang.
Umang Soni — Chief Financial Officer
Thank you, Ratan. Good day, everyone, and a very warm welcome. We appreciate you all taking the time to join us for the Q2 FY ’25 earnings call. Now, let me walk you through our financial performance for the quarter ended 30th September 2024. Manish, can we have the next slide? Yes.
So our consolidated revenue for the quarter stood at INR34.82 crores, reflecting quarter on quarter growth of 10.3% and year on year growth of 34%. On the profitability front, profit after tax stood at INR9.19 crores, reflecting 11.7% year on year growth and 2.7% sequential increase over the previous quarter. During the quarter, we made few strategic investments in global tech events and sponsorships that position ourselves for the future growth.
And we have also granted stock options to our key workforce as a strategic initiative to align their personal goals with the long-term growth of the organization. This approach will enhance — help enhance our talent retention and motivation within our team. We also invested in premier talent in latest technologies, as well as we invested in senior lateral hires to reinforce our leadership team and strategically position ourselves for the future growth.
Now coming to EBITDA margins. Our EBITDA margins stood at 38% for the quarter to FY ’25, reflecting a year-on-year growth of 10%. The earning per share stood for the quarter at INR7.75 per share. Now these figures highlight the strength of our underlying business model. Next slide. This has been split over the graph. Next.
Yeah, so in line with our commitment to returning value to the shareholders, we have declared total interim dividend of INR16 per share this year, which includes INR8 declared this quarter. This move underscores our confidence in the business and debt-free asset-light model, which consistently helps us in delivering strong return ratios, including ROI and ROC. Additionally, our zero-debt status provides us ample financial flexibility to meet our future capital needs. One important point here that the finance cost reported this period pertains to the interest recognized on lease liabilities associated with our right-to-use assets.
Next. So this is a brief overview of the company as a whole as displayed over the screen and a key highlight would be our success that continues to be the trust which we have built with our clients. So more than 80% of our revenue comes from the repeat customers. In HY — half year one, our top five clients contributed 38% of the total revenue and our top 10 clients contributed 52% of the total revenue. And we have 150 plus happy clients and we are serving in 30 plus countries.
Next. Okay, so from a geographical perspective, we continue to maintain a strong international focus with 80% of our revenues coming from the overseas markets. North America remains our largest overseas market with 79% share followed by Europe 9% and rest of the world 12%. And domestic business contributes 20% of our total revenue. Next slide. Before it, I think, before it — by technology.
So revenue by technology. So from technology perspective, Salesforce, Big Data and Odoo continue to be the leading technology contributors. Open Source followed by then AI/ML, which contributes over 11% of the total revenue. And development and consulting services represent 98% of our core total business revenue.
Now, revenue by industry in the next slide. So we have maintained a diverse industry mix in our revenue streams with technology remains our largest segment. We continue to serve a broad spectrum of industries, including services, telecom, marketing, retail, manufacturing, Edu Tech and BFSI.
So these are all the financial updates for the quarter. In summary, this financial results reflect our consistent focus on operational excellence, strategic growth initiatives and long-term value creation. So with that, I will now hand the call over to Manish to provide insights on the technological capabilities. Thank you, everyone, for the continued interest in Ksolves.
Manish Gurnani — Chief Technology Officer
All right. I hope everybody can hear me. Thank you, Umang.
Umang Soni — Chief Financial Officer
Yeah, thank you.
Manish Gurnani — Chief Technology Officer
Okay, great. So these are some of the awards and accreditations that Ksolves have received. I’ll quickly move over to the future. Okay. So what makes Ksolves grow where we are today, right? Number one, our growth drivers, our strategies, we focus very strongly on efficiency. When I say efficiency, it could be in terms of technology. It is also in terms of resources, right? We also do a lot of investment in upskilling our resources as well as participation
In events, as well as building our own infrastructures.
Infrastructure by which I mean, our technological infrastructure. What this also helps us in is we are able to attract good talent because we are working on those technologies which are niche and which are considered high end. Then some of our recent initiatives. So we are a Salesforce Summit Partner. We have participated in a couple of international as well as domestic events. There are details about them also over here. These participation helps us get recognition at international level as well as it motivates the team also when they participate and get an experience and exposure from such events.
Next, we have done — we are focusing strongly on certification this year. We have received almost a good number of our developers are certified today on Cassandra. They are certified on your NiFi. And these are like some of our core technologies in big data. Then we have people who are certified on AI/ML also today.
Just one more important point that I want to highlight is that we have set up a completely separate division for looking into AI and ML. This is because we have seen that AI/ML, including generative AI, has been a strong area for growth and most of our customers are interested and they are asking for our — some products or some services related to generative AI. Keeping all of that in mind, we have a separate division today and we have also hired a senior VP of engineering, Nishant Agrawal, who’s again a very senior guy to lead that division.
Right. So, like I just explained, I’ll just quickly skip it. So, some of our, again business strategies. So, one of the things that I will focus on to over here is. And again, it will be mentioned in a later slide. Also that we have been focusing on strategic partnerships. So, we have been trying to sort of force partnerships with big tech giants. For example, we are in talks with Oracle, we are in talks with Red Hat, we are in talks with IBM, we are in talks with Dell.
And not only India, outside of India also. This is helping us get a partnership, sort of a collaboration with them, right. And this is all tied to that partition that we are doing now at international level. Okay. So, this is our regular software development service process, right. It is a normal SDLC that we follow. We go to — we basically, we gather all the requirements from client. Then based on that requirements, we do design and then we propose a solution, which getting — once it’s approved, then we do the implementation. And finally, the product goes into support and maintenance.
All right. So, this is the meet, I would say, what is that we are doing for technology, right? So, over here, like I said, AI, including generative AI has been one of our most coveted technologies and we are looking into it for future very strongly. Second, big data. We have seen tremendous growth in big data, specifically to technology that we work on big data, which are like your ETLs, your LIFI, your Kafka, and your Cassandra.
Then third, Salesforce. Like I said, we are a Salesforce submit partner. We participated in a couple of Salesforce events over this year and Salesforce has been definitely giving us very good growth. Number four, we have added today, overhead now is we have DevOps, we have ML Ops and we have LLM Ops. Now, what these Ops means, these are — some of these are tied to AI and ML. So, one is the DevOps, which is the regular normal operations work.
The LLM Ops and machine learning Ops, they tie to your AI and generative AI based solutions. And they require a certain level of knowledge as well as expertise on to operation side of AI and ML. Most of the companies which work on to AI and generative AI, they are — they may be doing good modeling, but they do not have expertise on how to deploy that model.
And all generative AI based, all AI based projects, they need a very thorough knowledge of big data because without understanding of how do you ingest that amount of terabytes of data, you cannot build a good pipeline onto AI and ML. So, that is where ML Ops and LLM Ops help us. We have people who are certified with these technologies, right?
The next is data analytics. Data analytics is again one of our — we have seen that a lot of clients are coming with this. So, this includes your Power BI, your Tableau, right? Analysis using big data to give insights which can help stakeholders take intuitive decisions. That’s all data analytics concerns about, right.
Products, we already there. Odoo, Salesforce, I have some details about some of those products that we have done in Odoo as well as in GenAI in future slides. And then, yes, digital transformation. Digital transformation essentially means that whenever any company which wants to move from old infrastructure, old technology to new technology, when I say old technology, it could be that they may be doing, let’s say, legacy based technologies, right? And they want to now shift to modern technologies, right?
Could be — so that they can run, your — these analytics, they can run your more AI based systems, right? There’s a significant technology shift that is needed. And we are helping our customers achieve that shift. All right. So, these are a quick overview of some of the new technologies that we have included in the past quarter, almost half a year, right? So, one is data streaming. In data streaming, we are now working with Streamset, Red Panda, and ActiveMQ.
We already had certain technologies. These are the new ones that we have added to our capabilities this year. And these are some of the talked about technologies on the edge. Similarly, for data engineering and AI, we are working with Databricks. We have people who are certified with Databricks. We are working with Data Factory, which is an Azure product, very, very useful for building your ETLs. We are working with Power BI. We have people who have delivered projects on Power BI, converting almost 400 dashboards from a legacy system into Power BI.
Tremendous success. The client was also very happy with that. LangChain, again, it’s due for generative AI. Then another technology that we have been focusing on is now Data Lake. So a lot of customers are coming to us. They have this need of storing all of this huge data. And this data could be in forms of PDFs, could be in forms of documents, and generative AI needs all of that data.
So, how do you sort of arrange and make sure that this all data gets stored in a way that it can be retrieved, it can be audited, it can be analyzed very well. So, there’s a concept of data lake. Within data lake, there are certain technologies, which are the market leader. One of them is Snowflake. So, we have people who are now working with Snowflake and we are — they are building their expertise onto Snowflake now.
Similarly, other technologies, Hive, Hadoop, and then another very important one on the edge is StarRocks. StarRocks allows you to process terabytes of data and run analytics on top of that. Yeah. All right. So, then moving to some of the major, I would say, deliveries and case studies that we have done in the past quarter. So, one of the major initiatives that we have taken is we have built — we are working on a GenAI based private GPT product.
So, what the concept is, we all know about ChatGPT and its capabilities, right, but the challenge with ChatGPT OpenAI is that your data has to be sent over to OpenAI. A lot of our customers, because of the compliance requirements, they want that data to be kept within their own infrastructure. They do not want to share that data, but they want to use the GPT. So, how do you do that? So, we have built a private GPT for them. It’s like a product and once it get — everything gets installed within the customer’s own systems. There is no data which is going to go out of their infrastructure.
All data will be kept within customer’s infrastructure. They have using — and then using this Ksolves Gen-AI product, they can train their private GPTs on that data. Now, imagine if you have — as a customer who’s coming from finance, you know, it’s a financial institution, right? And they have their own, let’s say, a loans based system and they want to query something on that for that — for one of their clients, right? They needed to go and search into different documents and policies, right?
With this system, they can do all of that using this Ksolves product. Secondly, imagine for customer support, you have to have an agent who could take a call and then who could reply to that, right? With this solution, they can now type in their questions and this private — sort of, this private GPT will go and search within the document that are shared and prepare an appropriate response and reply back to that customer, right. So you get a completely white labeled solution deployed on the customer’s premises, which is completely secure, no data going out. And it’s like your own private GPT, right?
Okay. We have built integrations for this. So, let’s say some customers were having data in different, what could I say, data sources. Some were having data, let’s say, stored in shared drives. Some were having data stored in Teams. Some were having shared data stored in Google Drive. So, this system, this product can integrate with different type of these data sources and train itself from there, right?
Next. So, this is another — this is again one of our major big data related products related to NiFi. So, Apache NiFi is an open-source technology, which is being used by any, I would say almost all Fortune 500 companies use that technology in one or the other way. Now, what happens is with the Open Source Apache NiFi, there are certain limitations. It is very difficult to deploy or you take solution from let’s say one server to another server. There is no out of box capability built in that, right?
Second is there is no proper security mechanisms. So, because of all these, some of these limitations, a lot of customers had to do manual stuff. So, what we felt was that this is a major gap. And if we could fulfill that, we could build a very unique product, which can help our customers manage their Apache NiFi solutions very well.
Keeping that in mind, we have built what we call a data flow manager. This is a NiFi automation solution. What it allows you is, it gives you all the benefits of Open Source Apache NiFi. And on top of that, it allows you to do certain things which are very critical for any deployments, but which were missing. We have fulfilled that gap and we have given certain — we have built those capabilities inhouse for this product, right?
I’ll then move on to the next. So, moving on to now Salesforce, right? So, for Salesforce, we have built a product which we call as Rollup Magic. This is deployed on Salesforce AppExchange also. What it allows is, when you have to do aggregations over certain columns, Salesforce does not have a very good solution for that. When I say aggregation, it is like parent-child relations and you want to aggregate from those childs. Very simple use case, you have, let’s say, invoices, that invoices may have, let’s say, 10 items in the — in that, and you want to sort of sum of those — those individual — those — this way you may have, let’s say, 10 invoices and you want to sum up those invoices from those line items.
Salesforce does not have a very good solution for this. You have to do a lot of things manually. We’ve built a product called Rollup Magic, which allows you to do all of this with only button clicks. All you have to do is you have to take this product and it is available to you in your Salesforce domain. You just customize it, you sort of just drag and drop the columns that you want to aggregate and it’ll start giving you those results in real-time. This has been very useful for many of our customers.
All right. So next, this is another Salesforce product that we did. So, Salesforce — this is for analytics. Now Salesforce provides a lot of tools to do analytics, right? But many of our customers are dependent on Google Analytics because Google Analytics is of all the website, which run on — which we see, right? Most of them use Google Analytics for their — for analyzing data. Now Salesforce data was limited within Salesforce portal only. How do we sort of use — and if I want to push that data to Google’s system and do analysis over there, how do I do that?
So we have built a Google Analytics Connector, again, very simple installation, one-click installation. You configure it into your own Salesforce domain and once it is there, you may have to do some simple customizations. Once they are done, all the data that you need to push for your analysis will now sync to Google Analytics also. Very useful. Customers — almost all the customers who have bought it, they are loving it. All right.
We have some case studies also. So this is again one of very major achievements that we did for Apache NiFi. So this customer was — it’s a US-based customer, and they were running NiFi using single servers. Now with single — so with single server, there were a lot of challenges that they’re facing. They were not able to scale it. They were not — they were — there was a chances of failures that server went down, then their whole system will go down. Then there was, like I said because Apache NiFi does not come out of the box with very strong security and access control, they were missing that.
Then they also wanted integration with other systems. So for example, they were using Zabbix for monitoring. They also needed to have it sort of a VPN connection through a system called Jumpcloud. So, these were a lot of challenges that they were running into, and they came to us with this system. So, we looked into their requirements. We gave them a complete road map. How will we achieve, whatever their requirements were? And as a result, today, that customer is running multi-node clusters instead of a single cluster. So, their single point of failure, which was a single server of Apache NiFi is no longer there. Now they have a full cluster of Apache NiFi managing their system. Second, it is integrated with LDAP, which was running on Jumpcloud. What it also gives them capabilities that access mechanism.
So now, that security is more enhanced. So, all the users that they were — that who are accessing now NiFi are secured via their standard security mechanism, which is their LDAP, which is deployed on Jumpcloud. Then, we integrated it with their Zabbix monitoring also. So now they seen real-time, which of these servers are up and running, how many services requests are these processing in real-time. And then — so, what this gives to them is —
Ratan Srivastava — Chairman & Managing Director
Manish, we request you that to keep it short.
Manish Gurnani — Chief Technology Officer
Okay. Okay. Okay. I’ll probably be a little bit faster. All right. Okay. So maybe I’ve got six case studies, but I’ll quickly then walk through them, right? Secondly, again, this is for a very large, I would say, telecom player in Africa side. They have — we are engaged with them. They were working on Hadoop and Hive for their Big Data processing and also using NiFi. Again, they have certain major challenges in NiFi in terms of latency. We are working with them and bringing all of that huge pipeline into a major NiFi cluster that we are setting up for them, right?
We are also working with them over Apache Spark. And believe me, this whole process is able — this whole system is used to process almost billions of records in a single day, which is being fed through the system. I’ll — this is again for another very, which is a company which is based in — which is into Fintech domain. They process stock transactions. They process a lot of your financial data beside stock — including stock transactions. So, they were looking for Apache NiFi-based solutions, and we are working with them to build a system, which can talk with SQL as well as Apache NiFi. This is for Salesforce.
We have worked with — this is a client who is into energy sector. They were looking for sort of shifting from the legacy systems to a modern system over Salesforce. We helped them build their entire B2B platform on Salesforce. We have integrated that platform with some of their existing solutions, so that they get real-time information about the product pricing and the availability in the inventory, right?
Another Salesforce in power sector, I’ll — this is — I’ll quickly again skip this. This is a GenAI-based — this is AI-based solution that we have done for a US customer, who’s into refrigeration and energy. This is — this solution is running live. The customer has patented this also. And this solution is giving an accuracy of almost 97%, which was a huge success for the customer. So very quick overview about our Odoo deliveries. So, we have worked with Odoo for a very major product, which allows our — the customers into retail domain. And using our solution, we have helped them achieve a reduction of almost 80% packaging time that they were earlier doing. Second, it was almost — you can imagine from 20 days to two days without this system they were doing. With the implementation of Odoo and the optimization that we have done for them on Odoo, that time is now reduced from 20 days to two days. Then we are working with some of your customers for Odoo migrations, Odoo implementations. 250 GB of data transferred from one system to another Odoo system, right? And these are not easy things. All right.
Quick run-through of event updates. So, we participated in Dreamforce 2024. Now Dreamforce is one of the biggest Salesforce events in the world over — across the world. This was in New York, and Ksolves had a booth also over there where we demonstrated our Odoo product, our Salesforce products as well as our capabilities. Second, we participated in Odoo Experience 2024, which is again equivalent to Dreamforce, but for Odoo, this is the biggest Odoo event. This was held in Belgium of what — you can see from the pictures, right, nice pictures. Ksolves team has had — we had two booths at this place, significantly, tactically placed, and again, a very huge success for us.
Two more events for Odoo in USA as well as another in India. The India event, we participated as a keynote speaker also. So, we had a booth as well as a keynote session also over there. All right. That’s it from my side. Thank you.
Ratan Srivastava — Chairman & Managing Director
Thank you, Manish. Thank you.
Questions and Answers:
Operator
Thanks, Manish. If you could stop the sharing. We’ll open the floor for Q&A. All those who wish to ask a question may use the option of raise hand. We already have some questions in the chat. I’ll invite Ravi Kumar Naredi to ask his first question. Ravi, you can go ahead, please.
We’ll take the next question from Vijay Chauhan.
Ravi Kumar Naredi
Hello, hello, hello, hello.
Operator
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Go ahead, sir.
Ravi Kumar Naredi
Yes. Our net profit margin down drastically in this quarter two. So, what are the reasons? And second, we have 531 employees on the role. So how many we plan to add in current six months or next year? These are my questions.
Ratan Srivastava
Okay. So, Raviji, thank you. Thank you for your question. So first, I will talk about the drastic change in the margin. So, if you will see that, Manish has already explained in the sheet that we have attended two to three events. So, I will talk only about one event, Salesforce — Dreamforce.
First time, we went there and we had a booth also there. Okay? And I will first discuss with you that what is the advantage of having booth there. So, advantage of booth is having there that we got a exposure. People were coming to us to know that what we do, who we are. And we were easily able to explain them, and we got some leads also.
Second thing is that what was the expense, okay? So total expense was INR1 Cr. INR1 Cr we have spent to attend this event. So if we have — suppose if we don’t go there to attend that event INR1 Cr, then you could have easily seen the result in the margin. So, INR1 Cr, we have spent for the Salesforce, okay? And it has impacted on the margin.
In future, we will again go because for the next year, I have booked in advance so that we can get booth at better place, okay? The booth which we had this time, it was not a very, I can say that, because we have done the booking at the last — at very last, so we have not — we could not get the right place. But now I have done the advanced booking for the next year. So, I have given you the answer that why the margin is down, okay? But if you will see the sales, sales is exactly double-digit after five quarters. After five quarters, it is double-digit, okay?
In future, again, I will more focus on the sales, and I will spend my money — my means Ksolves money on branding, attending the events, attending events as a keynote speaker so that brands can know us — know about us. What I feel that right now Manish has — Manish tried very well to explain how complex work we are doing, what kind of technologies we are doing, what kind of projects we are doing for our customer. But still, I feel that market or means people are not aware exactly what we are doing. What I will do, I will create a separate video where we will explain technology wise that how complex we are doing — how complex work we are doing.
I hope, I have given the answer of the first part. And second part is that the employee strength that we are not focusing on hiring huge employees, we are focusing on utilization, increasing the huge number of employees is not a solution for increasing the sales better. Definitely, we will have to hire the people, but we need to focus on the utilisation of the resources, okay? So, my main focus will be on the utilization, not hiring in a huge number. Thank you.
Ravi Kumar Naredi
Sir, other expenses rising by INR6 crore. INR1 crore, it is okay, you have done for booth occupying. What about other expenses rises by INR6 crore?
Ratan Srivastava
Umang, can you explain?
Umang Soni
Other expenses, INR1 crore is for the Salesforce event, and another INR25 lakhs, INR30 lakhs relates to our Odoo event that we attended. And around INR60 lakhs includes for the travel and stay of our employees. So altogether, a INR2 crores portion that increases in other expenses. And rest are normally in our software subscriptions and all these financial and professional expenses that increased. And we have bring out ESOP also so that few charges related to ESOPs and for exchanges and all these things in principle approval.
Ravi Kumar Naredi
Okay. Thank you very much.
Ratan Srivastava
You can tell the number, Umang. Means for ESOP, you have spent approximately INR40 lakhs, INR50 lakhs, right? And Raviji, Manish, who is our CTO and Delivery Head, who is our — Delivery Head, Ramesh, okay, they traveled to U.S. for 15 days — more than 15 days and they have attended — they have visited at least 10 to 12 cities, okay, to meet customers. To know their pain problems and also to meet the new customers. So, it is helping us. So that’s why you can see that, we are getting enquiries from the customers like Dell, Oracle kind of customers. And there are so many multi-billionaire companies, okay, I can tell you. Okay? So, this is something because now they are knowing us, now they know as that who we are, okay? So branding is now most important thing for Ksolves, if we want to go in that league.
Ravi Kumar Naredi
Okay thank you very much and all the best.
Ratan Srivastava
Thank you.
Operator
We’ll take the next question from Vijay Chauhan. Vijay, you can go ahead, please.
Vijay Chauhan
Thank you for the opportunity. So, my first question is on the — basically, the margin side. So, you have in detail explain, like, why the margin was at 38% on EBITDA side. So that is understood. I just had one — like long-term guidance for how you would like to run a business going ahead. So, what will be the sustainable margin? Because we have been tracking your company for almost like more than two, three years now. And because we were running at a lower operating cost and now we are spending behind branding because we need to grow our sale. And we have also reached a certain scale, which requires investment in the branding and promotion activity, which you are already doing, so that is very good. But just to understand, how do you see in next two, three years like will this 38% be again go to 35%? Or what do you think which will be sustainable? So that is the first question.
Ratan Srivastava
Okay. So, see, first of all, what I feel that our margins — our margin is still high as compared to all — most of the companies in the market, okay. Our margins are still high as compared to other companies in the market, okay, at our level or maybe bigger companies with us or smaller companies with us or at companies who are on our level, okay. So, we are still beating them, if we are talking about the margins, okay? So, we have enough — I can say that area where we can compromise with the margin to have a better sales growth. Better sales growth. How?
See one year before, our base was not like this. Right now, we are sitting on the base 34.80 something. It means if we are looking for 8%, 7%, it means — or 10%, I will have to raise INR3.5 crore in a quarter. It is not possible if I will have a 5,000, 10,000 like customers, okay, who are paying $10,000 in a month, $5,000 in a month, okay. We have a limited time, limited bandwidth, limited team — sales team — limited size of the sales team. So what we will have to go, we will have to increase the ticket size. And increasing the ticket size, we will have to show people that who we are. So, again, if we are talking about the margin, I — what I feel that it will be in the range of 35% margin, okay, but not 38%, 40% what we were doing earlier. Because money is now — is going, or I can say that we are going to spend money for traveling, for events, for hiring good people.
For example, we have hired — recently, we have hired a very senior business analyst, BA person, who has started his career, who’s a CA, who has started his career from TCS, then E&Y, and then KPMG, and he was involved in requirement gathering of the famous project — Indian government project, income tax. He was the main person. We have hired that person also. We have hired a Director of Operations also. He is going to join on 19th of November. He is passed out from the IIT Delhi, and he has around 20-year experience. So, we are hiring very qualified people. So, it means I’m looking for what Ksolves will be after five years, okay? I’m not looking for next quarter that what will be the margin in the next quarter? So, what will be — what Ksolves will be after five years? I’m targeting for that thing.
Vijay Chauhan
Understood. Yeah. My question was only from the long-term perspective only. So, we don’t have like short-term view like where the margins will be, but the 35% is the margin that you will be likely to protect.
Ratan Srivastava
Yeah, it’s right.
Vijay Chauhan
And whatever you will spend is for the growth. That we understand to hire new employees, which are more qualified to further scale up the business. That is good. Only one thing, like you have done these activities, which is very good in our opinion as well. So, is there any way like, can you talk about like are these activities in your opinion, like how you are measuring success, whether it’s a new order that you are receiving or right now, you are just trying to build up the — like the branding or like you are trying to get the eyeballs of the clients that we are targeting. So, any success measure or criteria or whatever way you are measuring your internal, that’s what for the information purpose, I would like to know.
Ratan Srivastava
Okay. So, first of all, it is a parallel activity. It is not something that one thing will be done, then second thing will be start, okay? So, it is a parallel activity, means branding and talking to the new customers. So, as I said that right now, I’m talking to customers like a Dell, Oracle Dubai, not in India. Dell, Oracle — sorry, Dell Dubai, Oracle Dubai. As you know that, we have started our office in Dubai, okay? One of the largest privately owned company in the US worth $100 plus billion. I cannot disclose the name. Morocco-based big telecom giant. New York-listed company, which is 100-years-old insurance company. Fortune 200 telecom giant based in Finland.
These companies are now giving us time. Means these companies are — and the top management people are talking to us, and they are trying to know our capabilities, especially in Big Data and AI/ML. Because in Big Data and AI/ML is still I think that we are niche. As Manish explained that most of the people in the market, they are working on the OpenAI and all. But right now, what we are doing — we are trying to enable companies to have in premises LLM, okay? So that data can be private. So these kind of — because of these kinds of capabilities, the companies, which I have just explained you, they are entertaining us. They are giving us time. So, this is just a beginning. And I tell you, this is the good news. This is a good thing for our people for us that we are getting chance to sit with them in a conference room — in their conference room, physically, to interact with them for their future plan, okay?
Vijay Chauhan
Right. Right. And the —
Ratan Srivastava
And one more thing, Vijayji. I told — I just explained that we are spending money for branding and all. Apart of this, we are spending, we are planning to have a governance department. Governance means what kind of code we are delivering, okay? How much secure our code is? Because the customer size is now bigger, means customers are bigger. They have enough money to shew us, okay? So, it means we should have all the securities. We should have all the departments which can ensure us that our delivery is enough secured. We are not ignoring anything, which can hurt their business, okay? So, now brands which we — the brands which are working with us, they are very big, okay? So now we need to spend money on legal side, governance side, okay? We should have a department for that. So, I’m thinking in that direction. So, Vijayji, again, I’m telling you, I’m not concerned about the next quarter, okay? I’m just planning for the next three years what Ksolves will be after three years.
Vijay Chauhan
Got it. Got it. And is it possible to disclose the quantum of order book? Or if it’s not possible so, can you like only highlight like what is the order book ratio versus the FY ’24 sales? If it’s possible only?
Ratan Srivastava
See, first of all, I have never done this, and this time, again, I will not do this, okay? But one thing I can assure you that we are doing good. We are putting our 100%. And if you see our 15 quarters past, never sales got declined. Sales never got declined since IPO we have launched. And we have always given good results, okay? But I would like to be conservative. I don’t want to give any number, okay? I want to show you — I will show you the result, but I will not give you the exact number that what kind of order book I have. No, sorry for that. But, yes, you have requested to know, you asked that what kind of margin I will maintain. I said that 35% I would like to maintain the margin. And sales, you did not ask, but I will tell you 30% plus minus 2, I would like to maintain the sales growth in future.
Vijay Chauhan
Okay. Okay. Got it. And the last thing, like, your colleague was mentioning, like, we had some ESOP cost, and it was some INR45 lakhs to INR50 lakhs. Is it correct for this quarter or is it for the annual?
Unidentified Speaker
See ESOP cost that relates to some professional fees and the listing in-principle approval, so that is around INR35 lakhs something — INR35 lakhs to INR40 lakhs.
Ratan Srivastava
It is one time because we had to hire merchant banker. We had to hire a merchant banker to finalize everything. It is one time. Now we know each and everything about the ESOP.
Vijay Chauhan
Okay. Okay. So, in essence, this was spent in this quarter. So, it was one-time that is INR30 lakhs. So, it could have been added to your EBITDA directly because it won’t be — yeah.
Ratan Srivastava
You could have added INR30 lakhs this EBITDA, INR1 Cr Salesforce, okay. So, you can imagine that what could have the EBITDA number.
Vijay Chauhan
Yeah. Yeah. That is — that we understand. But branding is essential to the business operation. This is more of a one-time.
Ratan Srivastava
Right. We are talking about the long-term.
Vijay Chauhan
Yeah. Yeah. So that is why I asked like this INR30 lakh, INR35 lakh won’t be recurring. And is there any recurring ESOP expense that we are going to charge for next two years or three years if you can highlight?
Unidentified Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. That would be, there. I think the ESOP cost would be there, and it would be reducing our EBITDA by, say around 2%. So and as we grant more in the next year, then it might increase as well.
Vijay Chauhan
Okay. So, what our suggestion would be, if you can put the EBITDA number, it’s because it will be non-cash, right, expense, ESOP?
Unidentified Speaker
Correct. Correct.
Vijay Chauhan
Yeah. So, if you can just, like, what we have seen, like, lot of our companies which award the ESOP. So, it’s just a request. If you can — if you think it’s doable, so we can do it. Like, they, separately show the reported EBITDA versus the adjusted EBITDA.
Unidentified Speaker
Adjusted EBITDA. Yeah, which is what I would request. What I would say that ESOP cost that you’re talking about the non-cash component will start from the quarter, this quarter only.
Vijay Chauhan
Quarter two?
Umang Soni
Yeah. From quarter three, it will start. The expense that we have done, that relates to the in principal approval in merchant banking side. So that is a cash expense. This is a non-cash expense. So adjusted EBITDA, let’s start from here quarter three.
Vijay Chauhan
Okay. Okay. So, it’s a reportable — so, it would be very easy for us to understand.
Umang Soni
Definitely, definitely.
Vijay Chauhan
Okay. That was all from my side and thank you for a very detailed explanation. So thank you once again. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. We’ll take the next question from Anil Kumar. Anil, you can go ahead, please.
Anil Kumar
Yeah. Good afternoon, everyone. Thank you for giving me the opportunity to ask the questions. So, first of all, I wanted to know, like, what is the — like, employee efficiency as of now? And with the, I mean, what do you call the expenses that we are incurring for, like, showcasing our business in various forums? What is the revenue outcome out of that that we are expecting, I mean, times — number of times? So, say, for example, like, we have to spend something like INR2 Cr this year. So how much would be the impact from the — on the revenue side? And, also, Ratan, sir, you just mentioned, like you are seeing or we are seeing this company or working towards a five-year plan. So something that, give us a glimpse of what the company could look like five year down the line or three year down the line, that will be helpful.
Ratan Srivastava
Umang, can you cover the number side?
Umang Soni
Okay. So, on number side, say, we are —
Ratan Srivastava
One thing, AnilJi, I will tell you that we have just spent. We have just attended the event, okay?
Anil Kumar
Yeah.
Ratan Srivastava
And it is not something that immediate we will start getting the result. It is a long-term. We need to continue it. We need to continue this investment, okay? So, it is not something that immediate, it will reflect in.
Anil Kumar
I understand, sir. So that’s very much there. And basically, whatever probably would be the spend say, for example, in coming three years, that would certainly would turn around into the revenue form. So what is that you are envisioning? So basically, every promoter or every business have their own goals. Whatever they are investing, they are looking out for some outcome out of it. So, what is the outcome that you are looking out of it, probably three years down the line. So, recurring probably every quarter-on-quarter or something would be a spend. So, like, INR2 Cr this year. This quarter, probably INR2.5 crore something like that. It will be incurred over three years or five years down the line, whatever is the spend. Say, I’m just putting a ballpark number, Like, INR50 crore is the total spend over, like five years. Then what is the — in terms of revenue that you are looking out from this?
Ratan Srivastava
See, for in terms of revenue, I have already told that 30% plus-minus 2 sales growth. So, you can imagine that what will be the revenue, okay? And to meet this, we are doing all this investment. It is not something that 30% is fixed. And apart of this, we will get more if we are doing this investment, okay? Because 30% means right now I’m sitting on 34.81%. So, if I want to have a 10%, 3.48 — approximately INR3.50 crore, I need in this quarter, okay? So, it is not possible if I will have a 10,000 customer, 350 customers. One customer will be managed by one person. It is not logical, okay. So, I need large ticket size. And large ticket size is not something that they will come directly without knowing us, who we are.
Anil Kumar
Absolutely.
Ratan Srivastava
We will have to go for Six Sigma certification also. We will have to go for a few more certifications so that they can identify that, okay, we are following this kind of governance, okay? So, if we are pitching — if we are planning to pitch that kind of customers, so we will have to have these kind of certifications, people, okay, and definitely brand.
Processes, earlier we were not doing any — we didn’t have any RFP process. Right now, we have a team who are working on the RFPs, professional RFPs, okay. First time, we have submitted at least three to four RFPs, okay. And that was — we could not crack it, but at least we have done it. We learned lot of things, okay. And so that kind of things we are doing. And one RFP win means, if one RFP I’m winning, the cost of that RFP will be minimum $500,000. So, means, $0.5 million. Rather than pitching 10,000 customers, work on big things, work on big projects, RFPs, big contracts, okay. So that we can have a long-term commitment. We can have a long-term project. We can have a long-term customer. So, this is only possible when they will know us, when they will know that, okay, we have that kind of certifications, processes, team.
Anil Kumar
Okay. The other question was related to employee efficiency. Like, what is the percentage?
Ratan Srivastava
Employee efficiency, if you will see that as compared to other companies, our employee efficiencies is still higher. If you will see the employee expenses on the website, the Screener, and whatever the sites are available. It is lower as compared to other companies. So, it means, your utilization is already high.
Anil Kumar
Okay. And with the current utilization and current employees — I mean, not current utilization, but the current employees, I mean, how much revenue growth can we achieve for like without organic growth, basically in the employee number?
Ratan Srivastava
That I have not calculated because I’m looking for a growth with adding few more employees because the existing employees are almost occupied. So, we need more employees for more business, right? So we — every quarter, we are creating the business — sorry bench. Right now, I have some bench also who are ready to start new projects. At the same time, I’m creating bench for the next quarter. But everything is calculated. I’m not doing — I’m not hiring in rush without knowing that what or when they will get the project.
Anil Kumar
Sure. Got it. Okay. That’s it from my side. Thank you. Thank you all. Great.
Operator
Thank you, Anil. We’ll move to the next participant, Raghav Agarwal. Raghav, you can go ahead, please.
Raghav Agarwal
Hello. Hi. Good afternoon, sir. My question is to Mr. Gurnani. I just wanted to understand more about the Gen-AI Private GPT that you were talking about. I wanted to understand if it’s a niche product, unless, how many companies are into similar products? And what are we doing to scale it up, and how can we make ourselves more viable into this particular offering?
Manish Gurnani
All right. Okay. So, I’ll take it one by one. So, what that product has? See, the biggest selling point for that product is, if you want to use ChatGPT today, right? You go to Open AI or you use that ChatGPT, right? The information that you need to send to it, it goes outside of your systems. That is the biggest risk. Now imagine any financial institution and banks, right? They cannot do that, even some retail companies, right? They are not willing to share the data to a third-party irrespective of whatever OpenAI may be saying. That’s the biggest risk. They cannot — they may say that we’ll not share your data, but you still are giving your data. It is going over the network to them, right? With this solution, what happens is it is an open source based large language model, which has been sort of trained, which will be trained on the data for the customer and it will be deployed within the customer’s own infrastructure.
So, you do not send any data outside of my network. That is what the key selling point, one of the key selling points for business. Number one. Right? Your data does not go out. All datas remains with you, within your systems, within your infrastructure. And at the same time, it gives you same capability that you get, let’s say, from any ChatGPT or OpenAI. You can ask questions. It behaves like your own personal assistant, right?
Second, what — with this, what you will get is you can sort of train it and hone it only onto your data, right. So, let’s say, I’m not interested in what — or let’s say, I’m into retail. I only want to look into retail. I don’t want to look into other businesses, right? Travel, luxury, all those things. It is of no use to me, right? So, I’ll customise and I’ll train this and I’ll feed data to this model of my own company only, so that it becomes very accurate compared to what an open model or OpenAI model will be giving it.
So, I’ll train it, and I’ll sort of make it specific to my organization, right? Second benefit, right? Now within that also, we have built the product in a way that keeping future in mind. So, what will happen is, let’s say, I’m an enterprise. I may have different departments. So, let’s say one is sales, one is finance, right. Let’s say one is HR. They may all like to use this model. Now their requirements will be different.
I don’t want to give the same trained model to each of these departments. I want to give them the capability, right, that finance can train the model on things that it needs most. Sales can train the model on things that it needs most. So, there can be separate GPTs, separate Private GPTs for each individual department. That is the second sort of — which you will not get from outside, right?
Then third is, this is going more into details, right. But there are what we call as embeddings and vectors, which any LLM uses, right. We have given the capability within product to choose which type of embeddings do you want to use, which type of vectors do you want to use. That in turn enhances the efficiency with which the model predicts or it gives the responses, right? So that is something which is again not available outside, right?
Then I think, this gives — I believe this will give you more detail and what is that we are trying to bring out, right? Obviously, this is something that others can also do. I’m not denying that. Others can also do this. No issues with that, right. And there are already others which people are doing that.
The benefit that Ksolves bring to table is because, see, AI cannot work without huge data. AI needs data to be more accurate. Now when you train your models, you have to have some solution of ingesting that data, cleaning that data. You cannot just give raw data to AI models, right. It will be, like, garbage for model. You have to ingest that data. You have to store that data. Then you have to clean that data. You have what we call as pre-processing of that data before you give it to the models.
All of that requires a very different capabilities outside of AI. Now we work with Big Data, so we understand those things also. We are able to build the whole cycle for data ingestion also. Then that cycle needs to integrate with your AI system. That also we know. And then — so this is, again, outside of AI again, right. Once your model is, let’s say, deployed, — your model — you have to deploy your model. That is again outside of AI, right. How do you deploy these models? How do you sort of, what do you call, monitor these models? How do you improve these models again in future, right, based on those feedbacks, right?
Ratan Srivastava
Manish [Foreign Speech]
Manish Gurnani
So very brief, right? One part is Gen AI. One part is the Big Data side. Because Ksolves works on both of these, right, it gives us a very good edge compared to any other AI only company.
Raghav Agarwal
But, sir, any estimate, new potential that you see in the next five years that from there because this is something which can be very big both in India and as well outside. Any potential estimation that you have in mind from this particular?
Manish Gurnani
See, I’ll again quote, Ratan, we are very conservative. So, I’ll not give you direct number, right? But we are seeing lot of clients. Almost all of our clients are coming to us asking for this. Almost all our clients are coming back to us asking for this. That’s all I have.
Raghav Agarwal
And, sir, just one last quick question. That is, with respect to your revenues split between domestic and exports, you’re heavily dependent on exports. Are you planning to also — what’s your take on that? Because 20% in India is, it can also be increased.
Manish Gurnani
So again, we are — again, I don’t think that we will shift tremendously towards India, we are seeing good margins. We are seeing good growth in the international market, right? We like to focus on that. I mean, [Speech Overlap] if I speak in very plain words, right, [Foreign Speech]. If International is giving me good results, good margins, I will like to focus on international. In India, we focus only to couple of things. Number one is, let’s say, it’s a government project, right. For example, that income tax department, right, that was a huge success for us. Second is if it’s a brand, right, that we want to work with, right? So, there are certain banks that you want to work with, right? So then third could be, let’s say, the technology-wise, it is in line with our strategy. And that is, obviously, at the rates also. When these things match, we’ll definitely learn to work for India also. We don’t have — I mean, obviously, we would like to work, right? Just that, where business grows.
Raghav Agarwal
Right. Thank you, sir. Thank you for the detailed answers. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. We’ll take the next question from Karan Kapooria. Karan, you can go ahead, please.
Karan Kapooria
Thanks for the opportunity. I have only one question. So most of — so our revenue is coming from international business also, right? So do we have any hedging policy to mitigate the foreign currency fluctuation risks? If yes, so what are we following? What steps are we following for that?
Umang Soni
So, yeah, Karan, actually, currently, we don’t have any hedging policy. Simply the reason being the USD tailwind because the dollar rates are increasing and rupee is depreciating. So, currently, we also had a few discussions to hedge it, but that would be more of a backside to the company then. So, certainly, if you grow a business in multiple currencies, say USD, CAD, and Singapore dollar, AED, all these things, then we might look for it. But currently, mostly 80% is from North America, right? So that’s why currently there is no hedging policy that we’re looking for.
Karan Kapooria
So, there can be a kind of risk to our profit margins, right? So, suppose, if there are any huge fluctuations in the currency happens.
Umang Soni
No. See, again, we are very proactive on that part that we are considering the hedging policy, but we are not considering that due to the scenario that is currently going on.
Karan Kapooria
Okay. Thanks.
Umang Soni
So as and when the requirement arises, then we would be the first one to — means like the first task would be to do that only.
Karan Kapooria
Okay. Thanks.
Umang Soni
Yeah.
Operator
Thank you. We’ll take one question from the chat from Ayush Agarwal. Ayush, you can go ahead, please.
Ayush Agarwal
Hi, thank you for the opportunity. Just, one quick question. Wanted to understand management’s view on the product strategy for the company. So, for example, management has been hinting on 30% plus growth. And how much of the 30% growth will come from products like Private GPT?
Ratan Srivastava
Ayush, we are completely into services, and product we are developing, it is not something that we are expecting any drastic change, okay. So, we are still dependent on the services, but products we are developing in the last previous calls also I explained, products are something which shows them our capability and which is the — you can see that, which opens a door to enter into their business.
Ayush Agarwal
Understood. Thank you.
Operator
Thanks. We’ll take the next question from Aman Agrawal. Aman, you can go ahead.
Aman Agrawal
Hi, hi everyone. Hello. Very good morning to all. Hello, Ratan, sir.
Ratan Srivastava
Hello.
Aman Agrawal
Sir, first of all, congratulations to you. You are performing consistently, are giving very good results, actually. And another is congratulation for Dubai expansion. And another thing is what I’m seeing, your company is performing very well, giving very good results. You have very good guidance. Everything is fine. The market is not acknowledging, I think, what the company is doing right now.
But only one thing, like, at the stage level, you are [Indecipherable] company right now, like, the Wipro and Persistent also have the same time earlier in their life. So, they used to give a better corporate action at that time regarding mostly in the case of, we can say split, bonus, which give the confidence in the market usually. But if it’s a — or any course of business day-to-day, you know very well what decision you need to take in Gen AI, how to get the growth, and that is fine. You are already giving all the things. But I think is there any plan regarding to — do you have any?
Because it gives the confidence when we go with the corporate actions, which we didn’t see from last one year date side. And still you are giving the consistently the dividend that is a very good thing. We know, we understand that thing also. This is the only thing just — because we see the Wipro’s and Precision also at date time, they used to give a better call for protections at date time.
Ratan Srivastava
See, corporate action bonus and splits, we will do in future, but I do not have the exact date, okay, right? Second thing is that market is not appreciating us. So, market knows that why they are not appreciating us, okay. Because we are since consistently giving good result, okay? But maybe market is focusing on immediate something, okay?
But as I said that I’m focusing on long term, okay? So, in long-term, as you took the name of the few companies, you can see that in the long-term they are winner, okay? They have gone through the same stages as we are going, giving good results, but no appreciation. It’s okay. But I will keep continuing the good results. Someday, definitely, we will get the appreciation from the market, okay? So, market — about market, I don’t know.
Aman Agrawal
No. That’s why I’m saying. We saw you. You give a [Indecipherable] its fantastic results in the time.
Ratan Srivastava
You can see that I think this is 15th or 16th quarter result and we never declined sales. Sales never got declined, okay, which is a — I don’t see that any company at our level, small cap, okay, we are a small cap, okay? Or if you to see any SME, you don’t — you will not find any company which is never declined the sales. So, we are the only company. So, what market thinks market knows, okay. I’m a core technology person doing business and doing a clean business, okay? And employees are happy for me.
Employees are very happy because I have people who are working with me since last 10 years, 12 years. I have people — 80 people among 500 team. I have 80 people who are working with me before Corona. So, this is an achievement for me. My team is working with me. They like to work with me. They are growing in terms of salary, in terms of technology, in terms of skill, in terms of happiness, okay. And when market will appreciate, market knows. I do not have idea about the market. But one thing I can assure you that company will keep giving, keep growing.
Aman Agrawal
No. Ratan, sir, that’s okay. I’m attending from last almost 10 quarters this year investor presentation and I have fully confidence on you. Every time you presented, you come with a very good results, very good performance. I’m just giving my perception regarding the same. And it’s okay, fine. So that’s fine. Best of luck for you.
Ratan Srivastava
This is a big achievement for Ksolves that I have more than 100 people who are working with us more than four years. And there’s at least 50 people who are working more than seven years. So, employee retention you can see. The culture you can see, okay. How connected I am, how connected people are with each other. So, culture is fantastic. Everything is fantastic. We are working on excellent advanced technologies. So, company is going in the right direction. So, let’s see what.
Aman Agrawal
Yeah, we have seen that you perform very well and fantastically in case of industry averages we can see from your even peers also. So that’s phenomenal. But that’s the thing. And best of luck for you for the next quarters.
Ratan Srivastava
Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. We’ll take the next question from Lovneet Puri. Lovneet, you can go ahead.
Lovneet Puri
Good afternoon. I’m audible?
Operator
Yes.
Lovneet Puri
Yeah. So my question is that what is the revenue breakup? Is it coming more from existing customers or new customer acquisition? And what is the plan going forward on this front?
Ratan Srivastava
Revenue breakup, Umang can tell you, but the plan is that acquiring new customer, big customer, okay, and larger ticket size where I can get a long-term commitment, okay. So, this is the plan, but for the current revenue breakup, Umang can tell you.
Umang Soni
Yeah. We have already covered in that. But, again, I would say it’s more than 80%. Around 82%, is the ratio that we are repeating the customers, right? Revenue generated from the repeat customers.
Lovneet Puri
My second part of the question is, do you see any threat in terms of new technology which is like AGI and all and other further version? Because I feel that this technology will be obsolete after maybe one or two years and your existing customers can then switch to new vendors also.
Ratan Srivastava
See, I don’t think that they will switch to new vendor. However, it depends on them. But the new — as we said, always that we are also — we also love to work on evolving technologies. So whatever technologies they will switch, we will have already. So, for example, few customers were working in PHP, right. So now they are working on Node.js and React. So, they are completely changing their framework technologies. So, they are choosing us for the new work also. So this is not something that what — if they are looking for new technology, we don’t have that. Even — we are always moving to the new technologies. As customers are moving, we are.
Lovneet Puri
All right. So, if you are evolving, then it’s fine.
Ratan Srivastava
Manish has already explained in the slides that how advanced technologies we are working and how advanced technologies we have started. So, these technologies are replacement of the old technologies. It is not something that this is totally new. These technologies are replacement of the old technologies.
Manish Gurnani
And just to add, right, Gen AI was something new, let’s say, in the little two years back, right? [Foreign Speech] So, we are also working on them. So we are always aligned with the market.
Ratan Srivastava
Thank you.
Lovneet Puri
Why is new customer acquisition slow then?
Ratan Srivastava
I don’t think it is slow. Numbers are less. The ticket sizes are higher.
Lovneet Puri
We got a perception that new client acquisition is low. There’s a reason now you are spending crores of rupees in these boot camps, et cetera.
Ratan Srivastava
No, I do not agree with you honestly speaking, and I’m really sorry with this, okay. Customer acquisition — new customer acquisition is high. Brand names are improving, okay. And, yes, without spending this money, it is not possible.
Umang Soni
And to add like, we have acquired around more than 25, 30 customers in this quarter, quarter two. And since the ticket size that we — starting the ticket size used to be low, then significantly it increases at latter point of time for all other projects that we enter into.
Lovneet Puri
That’s great.
Operator
Can we move to the next participant?
Ratan Srivastava
Yes.
Operator
We’ll take the next participant on the chat window, Mr. Abhishek [Phonetics]. Abhishek, you can go ahead, please.
Unidentified Participant
Thank you for that. Hi, Ratan. Everyone has already asked the question. So, I just have one question that are you looking for acquisition that will enhance your technical capabilities or the innovation pipelines? And if so, what are the areas, right, that you are more interested in?
Ratan Srivastava
Before this call, I always said no. But in last three months, I have done so many calls. I have signed the NDA with some merchant bankers, okay. They are connecting us with the companies who are into Salesforce or Big Data or AI even. Unfortunately, we could not find a good company. One or two are in the second level, but still, I can say that, I will take a step very carefully. But, yes, now this is the right time where I need to look for acquisition also, okay. And we are looking for that. We are talking to the companies. We are talking to the merchant bankers. We have signed the merchant bankers — we have signed the agreement with the merchant bankers.
Unidentified Participant
Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. We’ll take the next question from Darshil Pandya. Darshil, you can go ahead.
Darshil Pandya
Thank you for this opportunity. Sir, just one question from my end. Sir, since I’ve been hearing you for last one and half hour mostly, I feel that we are right now on a group trajectory where the vision is big and things are maybe start — will start to change. So, this would be like, don’t the management think that we should be putting the dividends that we give back to the company and rather focus on that part. Because dividend as a part, if I just calculate by last two dividends, what we are given majorly INR19 crores or INR20 odd crores are given to the dividend — to the shareholders. So rather given that dividends, we should put that money back and focus on business. Don’t you think this should be an idea from the management side?
Ratan Srivastava
I can discuss with the management. I will discuss.
Darshil Pandya
Sure. That was one of the questions from my end.
Ratan Srivastava
Thank you.
Darshil Pandya
All right. Thank you.
Operator
I’ll take the next question from the chat window. The question has been sent by Mr. Anshul Sehgal. Since you will be investing for the long-term, what is the total opportunity size and where do you expect long-term five-year sales to be, which is revenues?
Ratan Srivastava
Sorry, can you come again, please?
Operator
What’s your five-year vision in terms of revenue? Where do you see yourself in five years?
Ratan Srivastava
First, I will try to reach my three-year target, which I have told you that 30% sales growth, plus minus two. And then we can sit again that, what will be the next plan for the three years, okay. Five years is not possible, because three years is the time where things will get completely changed, okay. And we will have to set, so we will have to sit together with the team, okay, that what should be the plan for the next three years. Five years is a too long, okay? Three years should be the time milestone. I can give you random — that took it 30% plus minus two. But it will not be logical. I think three year is the logical time range where I can see that what I will be, what company will be.
Operator
Sure. We’ll take the last question for the day from Mr. Arman Patel. Arman, you can go ahead, please.
Arman Patel
Hello?
Operator
Yes, Arman.
Arman Patel
Hello. Congratulations, Mr. Ratan for yet another great quarter. I would like to say that you and your team are doing great. Follow-up from Aman’s question. I also believe that marketing — the market is not realising the value of Ksolves and I think market is not giving the value Ksolves deserve, I think. And you said we are doing great on technology side and company side. And he also mentioned the name Persistent. And if you have seen in a recent year, Persistent had announced many meetings and stuff like that with big investors and mutual funds to grow their company’s value valuations and be in a limelight. And we see today where Persistent is, right? So, do we have any plan on that to be a limelight in a market?
Ratan Srivastava
See, right now, I don’t know that how me, Manish, or whoever is a technical person. We should allocate our time. We should give our time to acquiring the customers, putting time in business or whatever. Right now, what Persistent is doing because Persistent is now very big, and they have a dedicated team for the IR. And for the IR team, this is the roles, responsibility, and the KRA that they will have to bring this many of the mutual fund in investors. But what Persistent was doing five years before? They were doing — they were completely busy in the business. Mr. Anand Deshpande was — I don’t see that he was doing investor calls and all. Most of the time, he was presenting the technology in the seminars. He was talking most of the time for the technologies.
So right now, I think I should and Manish should give and to whoever the technology person, we should give time to build the technology pillar project. We should acquire the new business. And once we will be in that condition where Persistent is right now, we can develop a complete IR department with the KRA that this much for investor communication they should have organized.
Arman Patel
Okay. So we are on for that, right? We can plan about that in future.
Ratan Srivastava
We are on for that in future, but right now me, Manish, and re-pinging my technical heads, they will give total time to customers, businesses, travels, coding, technology, and that’s all.
Arman Patel
Yeah. Fair enough. And I’ve seen in past hour, there was a big discussion about that booth, and you are spending INR1 crore on booth. I think you should keep doing that. That’s a great thing. Ksolves should do that kind of stuff more in future. I said that before Persistent done that kind of things. I think if you can be in a limelight in market, that also can boost the image of Ksolves as a whole. Do you think that?
Ratan Srivastava
I have been — see ideally, we should not take the name of the Persistent, but as you are taking the name of the Persistent, I was employee of the Persistent in 2005. So, I know the culture and exactly I’m following that culture. They were completely busy till the Anand Deshpande. He was CEO. Company was doing — company was completely busy in the technology things, right? Now things are changed. They are spending time for the IR and all, but I don’t think that this is the platform where we should talk about the Persistent, Wipro and all. We have our own strategy.
We are not exactly following the Persistent. Yes, Persistent is the good company, but we have our own strategy, our own thoughts, our own plan. We will focus on the technology, acquiring new business, new customers and all. That’s why I’m here. If you will see that I do not get time to do so many investor calls, okay. Because most of the time, I’m busying in customer calls. And today, I will be here until everyone will not ask all the question. I will be here to answer all the questions. Once you will say that your questions are done, then I will leave. But after that, I will try to give my time to business again.
Arman Patel
Fair enough. Great. You should focus on technology. Thank you very much. That’s all from my side.
Operator
Thank you. So that was the last question for the day. And like you rightly said, you answered questions.
Ratan Srivastava
Vinayji. [Foreign Speech]
Operator
I think you answered all the questions, sir. I’ve just received one question on the chat from Mr. Shubham Jain. Considering how OpenAI and its products have changed the IT landscape and doing so as we speak, how do you think the industry will evolve from its current form when the dust settles?
Ratan Srivastava
Manish [Foreign Speech]
Manish Gurnani
See, so because of GenAI, right, obviously, there are certain things that will change, that are changing actually, right? But it is not that humans will start becoming irrelevant. The biggest supercomputer is just brain. Nobody can beat that, right. With the evolving of — with the evolvement of AI, GenAI, all these things, right, the skill sets that we need to work with, they will shift. So, for example, there’s a huge demand for now prompt engineering, which is coming because of GenAI. So how do you use GenAI, right?
At the back, you have these prompts. So now focus is shifting towards writing better prompt, becoming better prompt engineers. So, we are also learning that and we are also involved with that. It’s not that with GenAI, there is going to be a stark. I think it could hamper only where you are working with products. Only product companies might have some challenges, because their product would become irrelevant. They have to upgrade their product. If they do not, then they go out, right?
Similarly, for services also. We are also upskilling ourselves. We are providing better training, better new — those relevant skills to our employees, and they are doing well with that. I think that’s what I had to add.
Operator
Fair enough. So that brings us to the end of today’s question-and-answers. Would you like to give any closing comments?
Ratan Srivastava
Sure. So, first of all, thank you to everyone who has attended this call and who are — who have invested in Ksolves. One thing I can assure you that we are a core technology company and we are focusing on technology and to acquire more and more good customers who have a complex work on complex technologies, so that we can get better rates. And this is our winning factor because at our level, there are very few companies who are providing, who are working on these technologies. Maybe someone is working on Big Data spark, but they may not be working on the NiFi. Maybe someone is working on the AI/ML, but then may not be working on the Big Data.
So, we are one shop, and we are trying to stabilize our company as a core technology company where you can find people for all the complex technologies. And you can look, you can hire people from Ksolves on better rates as compared to big giants. So, this is my whole goal. Okay. That’s all. Thank you. Thank you, everyone.
Operator
[Operator Closing Remarks]