Krystal Integrated Services Ltd (NSE: KRYSTAL) Q4 2025 Earnings Call dated May. 05, 2025
Corporate Participants:
Unidentified Speaker
Sanjay Dighe — Chief Executive Officer
Barun Dey — Chief Financial Officer
Analysts:
Unidentified Participant
Deepak Poddar — Analyst
Rochel — Analyst
Kunal Lakhani — Analyst
Aakash Javeri — Analyst
Pankaj Motwani — Analyst
Prachi Badade — Analyst
Presentation:
operator
Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to Crystal Integrated Services Limited Q4 and FY25 earnings conference call host as hosted by Add Factors prior. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen only mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during this conference call please signal an operator by pressing Star then zero on your touchtone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded.
This conference may contain forward looking statements about the company which are based on the beliefs or opinions and expectations of the company as on the date of this call. The statements are not the guarantee of future performance and involves risk and uncertainties that are difficult to predict.
I now hand the conference over to Mr. Sanjay Dighe, CEO and whole time Director of the company for Crystal Integrated Services Limited. Thank you and over to you Mr. Sir.
Sanjay Dighe — Chief Executive Officer
Good afternoon everyone. I would like to wish all of you a warm welcome to Crystal Integrated Services Limited earning conference call for the fourth quarter and full year ended 31 March 2025. I would like to begin this session by expressing my gratitude to all of you for taking time out to join us today. We have on call with us my colleague Mr. Barun De who is our Chief Financial Officer and Ad factors and the team led by Saagi. It gives me great pleasure to address you all today as we stand at the cusp of a spectacular growth journey.
Since this is only our third conference call, I would like to share a brief overview of Crystal before we get into the recent developments and business and financial performance. A brief background for the people who are new or otherwise. Also because it’s been quite some time, Crystal is among the leading and the fastest growing, well diversified services provider in the integrated facility management space. Predominantly the services offered are staffing solutions, security services, catering services and staffing catering services. So these are the four verticals that we’ve been operating all these years. Over the years we have also strived to become a one stop shop for all our services which reflects in our diversified service offerings.
This was complemented by our endeavor to develop a nationwide footprint in terms of our customers, our offices and the locations that we service for our customers. Over the years we have built a very strong team of skilled workforce, a robust and marquee customer base and obviously a very good quality of line one and line two managers which are a senior team and their team leaders. So today we are in four key domains that I explained in the earlier Integrated Facility Management which encompasses housekeeping, sanitization, washroom hygiene, gardening, pest control, facade cleaning and various other services that any infrastructure requires to keep it up and running.
The second portfolio is private security and vanguarding. The third is staffing solutions and payroll management. And the fourth is catering which comprises us providing food and beverage services through our corporate kitchen in Mumbai and servicing some of the good corporates here in Mumbai. Now touching upon some key developments, the year gone by has been particularly very very eventful for marked with several major milestones. Recently we forayed into the rapidly growing wastewater management and effluent treatment segment. The company has prior experience in executing Turkey projects way back in 2016 and had built a very good team since then.
But this year the company is focused independently on growing this segment because there is a huge scope here for growth. We have already hired a team of 20 talented members who understand the technology and the engineering part of it. Also some are specialized into the general D process which is zero liquid discharge. Today the team comprises of professionals from various industrial development corporations and other private sectors as well which work in this domain. We already had embarked on the solid waste management services where we have been doing solid waste management for Khane and Siebel Corporation.
But here as a completing our portfolio as a whole as a waste management, we have now pushed the pedal on water waste management as well. So in totality our waste management division has over 200 experienced people in field and we are very very upbeat on growing this portfolio in this coming financial year. Two other new avenues that we have diversified along with this wastewater management is Technical Facility management. Technical facility management used to be one odd service that we used to offer in our integrated facility management portfolio. But because of the demand for the services, because of the market that these services have, we have carved out this vertical as an independent technical facility management vertical.
And the way we are very very upbeat on the wastewater management, we have a very planned growth strategy for the technical facility management vertical also. The second new vertical that we have set as a hundred percent subsidiary is our B2C line of work. Taskmasters is what is the name of this subsidiary and we will be offering this B2C services which I will delve upon a little later and explain to you. Technical facility management will encompass specialized services requiring very higher skill sets and is expected to be more profitable in the long run. This also aligns with our strategy to upscale our services portfolio.
Services here in encompass MEP which is mechanical, electrical plumbing, H VAC and EHU maintenance, DG set maintenance and various other equipment that is put and installed in any infrastructure which requires maintenance. Taskmaster is what I just touched upon. Taskmaster Private Limited this is a hundred percent subsidiary as I explained to you, which is going to provide deep cleaning services and everything and all other services that are required by the restoration sector. Homes, bungalows, villas and other residential structures. This is our B2C offering. We’ve been thinking about doing this for quite some time and we think this year it’s a good year for us to push this B2C product in the market today.
We thank to our diversified Today, thanks to our diversified range of services, not only are we able to cater to almost all the major industries, but more importantly strengthen our business model and offerings. Broadly speaking, some of the key sectors where we are present include Healthcare, education, city infrastructure which covers airports, railways, metros, manufacturing units, retail outlets, entertainment hubs and so on and so forth. We are present in almost all verticals through either a standalone service offering or bundled services. Our clientele is spread across government organizations as well as corporates across the length and breadth of the nation.
It is heartening to say that Crystal’s brand value is backed by our most valuable asset, our people on the field. We have 43,300 plus on site workforce who are our brand ambassadors. Through our Pan India footprint of 26 branches, the number of customers and locations that we cater to have increased to 461 customers and 3,209 locations across the country during this year. Our quality and consistency of service delivery has one of the trust and faith of our clients which reflects in an industry level of contract renewals. In fact, our top three customers have been with us since over a decade.
We were also awarded by the Economic Times this year as the best service delivery company of the Year for financial year 2425. So I am very happy to share this news with you. Coming to some Key Recent Orders Contracts these are indeed exciting times for us at Crystal. Throughout the last financial year we were able to grow our order book and acquire new club customers at a much higher rate than the previous year. In financial year 2025 we acqu we acquired 139 new customers which is a very very good performance on a national level and I’m very happy that our sales team and business acquisitions team are engaged on a daily basis, on a weekly basis to make these things happen.
This was vis a vis the 76 new clients we acquired in financial year 2024. So we have nearly doubled our rate of customer acquisition this year. The contracts we won during this year cover a wide range of sectors from airports and Metro stations to hospitals, retail establishments and other manufacturing sites including pharma companies. Thereby expanding our portfolio of clients both in the government and the private sector. To just name a few recent noteworthy contracts win over the last quarter we secured a rupees 349 crore facility management contract from Tamil Nadu Medical, a security services contract from SEC Cooperative bank which is a Shamra vital cooperative bank for managing their Pan India security security requirements.
We we got the staffing contract for Mumbai monorail stations and rupees 84 crore worth of Sanitization Service Order SPGI which is one of the very prominent hospitals in Chandigarh. We further expanded our presence in airports providing bundled services at the Chandigarh Airport, Chennai International Airport and Trivendram airports. So these are very very noteworthy achievements that we’ve done in the last quarter of the financial year gone by. As I mentioned earlier a significant milestone achievement was our entry into the wastewater and effluent treatment space which was through our contract with TPPA which is based in which is a industrial zone in Chennai which is called as Tindivaram Industrial area.
This contract marked our foray into wastewater management and effluent treatment which is an exciting new vertical for us. We see tremendous growth opportunities here and Crystal is well position to capitalize on these by leveraging its strengths. This comes as a natural follow up to our previous foray into waste management as I told you and I mentioned already the Thane Municipal Corporation. So these are strategic in nature such that we get pre qualification in this space so that in the future we are ready for larger projects or projects which are mid sized but have a national presence and are very very marquee in terms of its margin profile.
Further we secured the 3 year rupees 167 crore facility management contract and a 5 year rupees 134 crore staffing and payroll management contract from the Directorate of Medical Education and Research Center Maharashtra. Other wins during the earlier half of this fiscal include one with BRFL Textiles, a contract extension in Chennai by the Directorate of Medical Education and Research for Housekeeping and Security and staffing for Nicomag Taikisha Hyderabad plants. On another note, our participation with the Vishnu Prasad Research center earlier in the year marks a new chapter in innovation. We will be commercializing this patented bioenzyme technology for solid waste management which is a high margin eco friendly service in our portfolio.
All these developments demonstrate our ability to scale across diverse verticals and we see immense opportunities in all of them going ahead. An important aspect of our strategy is to harness innovation, science and technology and diversify and evolve into an end to end service provider offering technologically innovative services. While doing so, our focus shall always remain on delivering sustainable value for our stakeholders.
I think now I would like to hand over to Mr. Barun, our CFO to take us through our financial performance. Thank you very much.
Barun Dey — Chief Financial Officer
Good afternoon. Now I will first tell you the fourth quarter Q4FY25 results. We reported 413.10 Cr in revenue during Q4FY25 41.39% year on year rise growth was primarily driven by several new contracts owned and executed during the period coupled with an increase in our average billing per contract. Our EBITDA excluding the other income for the quarter stands 26.75, growing 42.28% year on year. EBITDA margin improved by four basic points to 6.48%. Cost efficiency in terms of material cost helped offset higher investment in skilled talent thereby befitting the margins. Our PAT during This quarter is 16.91 cr as against 15.74 cr in the fourth quarter of FY24.
PAT margin stood at 4.09%. Earning per share for the quarter is 12.12. Coming to our annual FY25 numbers. Our revenue for FY25 came at 1212.78 crs and 18.11% year on year growth. The new order across our service portfolio and higher average billing helped increase top line. Our EBITDA excluding other income for the year stood at 77.71 cross up by 13.15% year on year. EBITDA margin is 6.41%. Investment made towards strengthening our talent pool coupled with investments in new ventures had a bearing on the margin. Our path during the period is 62.33 cr as against 49.03 seer in FY24 up by 27%.
PAC margin stood at 5.14%, up by 37 basic points. Earning per share for the period is 44.61. The board of Directors has recommended a final dividend of rupees 1.50 per equity share of face value of 10 rupees for the financial year 25 subject to approval of shareholders. This is all from our side.
We can now open the floor for Question.
Questions and Answers:
Unidentified Participant
Hello. Hope I’m audible.
Sanjay Dighe
Hello.
Unidentified Participant
Yes, I hope I’m audible.
Sanjay Dighe
Yeah. Yeah. You are audible. Yeah.
Unidentified Participant
Good morning. So regarding this contract, I think could. You please clarify on that? So earlier also we are having contact over there. I think there was some retailing and it is awarded to some other player. And we then we challenged that in the court and I think we lost that one, something like that. So. So this is 380 core, 348 core contract. Is this extension to that one or it is new area? And can we expect any further orders from this Tamil Nadu medical service profession?
Sanjay Dighe
Yeah, no, this is a. This is a new. This is a new contract. This is not an extension. And this is a new contract for three years.
Unidentified Participant
But earlier also we are doing work over there and the contract was extended December. So I think it is of the same area or it is new geography. And what happened to that contract?
Sanjay Dighe
No, no. So that contract, it is the same contract. It is the retainering of the same contract. It is the same geography. For the Tamil Nadu district hospitals across the four zones. There was a re reading which was done because the earlier bids were the government of Tamil Nadu decided to in the contract and rebid it. So there are different companies which have submitted the bid across the four zones. It was a competitive bidding. But as we all know by now, Crystal is very, very focused on the. On the margins. And now that we are listed, we are more responsible.
Our responsibility is to give good returns to our stakeholders as well. So we will. We as a policy do not bid for tenders just for the sake of it unless and until we see value. So here though it is the same tender and earlier we were billing higher values we have submitted. We had bid in our own way, in our own prudence for all four sectors. Keeping in mind our responsibilities. We got one sector here based on our rates. So therefore the contract is the same. But we now will be servicing one zone. Earlier that we were servicing three zones.
And we are happy here that we have got this opportunity to participate in this tender with the Tamil Nadu government. We are very, very experienced here in the Tamil Nadu government and we’ve been servicing this contract for many years of earlier tenure also. So we are very happy to be keeping our association going for the next three year tenure as well.
Unidentified Participant
I think. But I think there is no further scope to grab anything from Tamil Nadu, right?
Sanjay Dighe
No, no, there is. See, Tamil Nadu is a very, very good state. It also has good programs and they are also very forward thinking state. We have a very good presence in terms of our office and infrastructure in Tamil Nadu. And our tender team also is Distributed zone wise. So we have a very active tender team focused on various other business opportunities in Tamil Nadu. So yes, we have our eyes open there, our evaluation there. So whenever we feel there is a good opportunity where we are able to add value to the government through a proper financial assessment of these tenders, we will be happy to submit our bids.
So it is a very good market and we have a good presence there. We will always keep our eyes open and see what is there in store for us.
Unidentified Participant
Regarding this contract means from Airport Authority of India. I think airports which are almost are managed by Airport India only. So do we see that we have scope and any discussion with the private airports which are large airports like Hyderabad, Mumbai, Delhi. So do you see any scope and what could be the margins in this segment as compared to other segments?
Sanjay Dighe
Mr. Bala, our presence in airport has been there since the year 2006, 2007. So we are one of the most experienced players when it comes to managing of airport terminals. And we are participating. We are anyway doing work. We have the experience of working with gmr, GVK also and now the Adani Adani Airport also. We are anyway offering our services at the Mumbai International Airport, the international terminal. But at the why we are pursuing our business with the private players. We are also not forgetting the Airport Authority of India terminals because they have more than 100 terminals nationally.
And that is also a good footprint that we plan to have in our portfolio. So therefore we bid for both the private airport business as well as the government airport business.
Unidentified Participant
Could you comment on that? How big the margin?
Sanjay Dighe
I will not be able to comment on the margin because it’s a little price sensitive issue. But as you know, we get into businesses to ensure that we add value to the organization and to our investors as well. And at the same side we are very prudent as to when we acquire business what kind of qualification criteria it will build for us in the long run. So these are two areas that we are very mindful. So I will not be able to disclose specifically. But please be rest assured that when we are entering into businesses, it is keeping at the end of the day the the entire value proposition in mind.
operator
Sorry to interrupt, ladies and gentlemen. In order to ensure that the management is able to address all parties.
Unidentified Participant
Hello.
Sanjay Dighe
Hello.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah. Congratulations.
Sanjay Dighe
Hello. Hello.
Unidentified Participant
Hello. Yeah.
Sanjay Dighe
Hello. Good afternoon.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah, good afternoon, sir. Congratulations on a good set of numbers. Just two questions from my end. So just wanted to understand the potential of the new businesses that you started. Water Waste Management. What are the kind of contracts we can probably bid for and the task manager, how many cities have we kind of launched in and by when do we expect some kind of revenue to start coming in from here as well?
Sanjay Dighe
Good questions to both. I’ll answer the first question now. The waste water management, this is a very, very big opportunity. It is a big, big area. And also this has a combination of both the angles. A lot of MIDCs which have set up their plants even under the make in India or which were existing. They are. There are the effluent treatment plants or catp. They are somewhere they are owned by the government and somewhere they are. They are proposing that the manufacturing units themselves put that to meet with the green and environment friendly requirements set by the global and government centers.
Now if you see today the manufacturing, manufacturing this thing in India has lot of multinational also Indian companies. So there are a lot of environmental compulsions. So therefore this CETP ETP managing the wastewater is very very crucial. There are other players who may be doing that. We are focusing on a sector wherein we will do two to five mld kind of projects which are mid sized projects, small projects, but market projects. And also the turnaround of project completion cycle is going to be faster. So we are very specifically got into this kind of segment and we have put up a very good team.
That I said in my opening remark here also because it is project based. It also has a built in operations and maintenance for the two to three year tenure. So you have a pipeline also of business. And importantly also it has a much better margin profile than our existing business that we are doing. So in combination it is a good sector to be in. Anyway we have offices nationally, 26 offices. So our reach in these MIDCs is already there. We are not doing anything new to go and approach that. We also have our industrial corridor offices where we are anyway giving services and various type of services to our IFMA staffing payroll.
So you know, it is the same geography. We already have the team, we already have the have our establishments there. So there is no cost for us of going and entering and acquiring this kind of business. It is just a very wise thing for us to extend this nationally. And we have tasted success in Tamil Nadu which is the first one. And then nationally we are already our sales team which is independent for this vertical is already in talks to several mitc’s while we are talking. Secondly, the taskmaster private limited is a B2C. We have.
We have put a team for this B2C. Anyway we used to do a couple of high rises in terms of buildings or Townships. But we never extended our services inside the home. It used to be always outside the home in a public area. But now we have consciously set up a new team. This is a good market. There are other players which all of us know who are already doing that. But they are doing everything. We are just focusing on the business that we know well which is infrastructure management. All our competencies, we are extending it to the residential sector.
Two upside here is we have our own training academy at Washi. We have a national training program, we have training curriculums, we have. Our training division is led by some prominent defense personnel. So when somebody goes to apartment there are two things. One is a backup of a 25 year old company which is into this and not just an aggregator. Second is the training can be guaranteed. And because we have a mechanism of evaluation of the hiring people which is a very standard norm. While we are providing our services to our customers, the resident can be very sure that they are already security check done when they are coming into your house.
So very focused approach expectation from a resident or family is a much superior quality of services security check done of the people who are deployed there in their homes. And thirdly, well trained, well quality and knowledge backup cleaning of a 25 year old company. So all our experience we want to bundle and get it through to your residence. We are doing it through. We have small e rickshaws that we have and we will. They are custom made to carry our vacuum cleaners and other machines and they will. They will come over to your desk doorstep and do this.
You asked me in terms of geography. Currently we have started this in Mumbai itself. We plan to expand this into Mumbai in the various suburbs, in the western suburb, in the town side etc. And then slowly move towards Alibaba. We have some customers there who have very, very good villas and open that holiday home and villa and luxury villa space there. And then in Goa this year we want to establish this in these three sectors. And then obviously because we have a Pan India metro present we aspire to offer these services in all the metros.
But this year we will be in these three geographies. You asked me if the billing is started coming in. Yes, I am very happy to say that the billing is already happening now on a daily basis. And we are doing other things like digital and all those things are under construction and you can. People can book our services and start gpaying us. It’s a cash business. So you know it’s a cash on delivery kind of a business. So we are very Very bullish on this vertical as well as our 100% subsidiary. This will add very good value to our consolidated numbers going forward.
Unidentified Participant
Sure, that’s very helpful. So just one last question from my end. Receivers have seen a sharp increase. Any particular reason there?
Sanjay Dighe
I didn’t, I didn’t get it. Can you ask me?
Unidentified Participant
I. Trade receivables have gone up quite sharply. Any particular reason?
Sanjay Dighe
Yeah, because we’ve, we’ve gotten into many new business, new contracts in the last year, also in the last quarter three and quarter four. So while these businesses, we start this business, the entire process of documentation, billing takes a little time and one has to give that for both parties to understand. So therefore you have, you are seeing a little variance in these numbers, but over the quarter they get streamlined because the entire process gets streamlined. So on quarter, because every quarter we will add new business. So if you add one or two very big businesses or maybe added the hospital here and all those things, so therefore you see this kind of variance, but over the quarter these numbers get streamlined once we understand the processes.
Unidentified Participant
Sure, sir, that’s very helpful. Thank you. And all the best.
Sanjay Dighe
Thank you so much.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Deepak Podar from Sapphire Capital. Please go ahead.
Deepak Poddar
Yeah. Am I audible, sir?
Sanjay Dighe
Yeah.
Deepak Poddar
Thank you very much, sir, for this opportunity. Sir. Just wanted to understand first up on what sort of growth we are looking at for this year, FY26. And something on the sustainability of this fourth quarter performance. I mean, how do you see that?
Sanjay Dighe
Yes, I mean the way that even I have explained to you in a very transparent manner, we are very, very well geared to continue the same growth trajectory the way that we have. So we will definitely maintain our growth because we have that kind of, we have that kind of team. We have a very healthy pipeline and our prospects look very, very good. So we will continue this and the Q4 performance also. We will obviously keep on performing quarter on quarter because our work goes on on a daily basis. So the process of business acquisition, evaluation, it just doesn’t stop.
So we will continue the growth, Deepak, the way that we have grown and we will also continue the growth in the last quarter that we have done.
Deepak Poddar
So any range we are looking at, I mean in terms of for this year as a whole, FY26, I mean, I think in fourth quarter we grew about 40%. Right. But on an annual basis we grew about 18, 19%. So what is the growth range one should look at?
Sanjay Dighe
You should expect us to be somewhere in that zone only. I mean, the aspiration for any company is to do better only. So there is nothing stopping us from being better. But to be very realistic on the call that I am doing to you and, and the expectations we. We will continue the way that we have works.
Deepak Poddar
I mean 18, 20% is what we are targeting.
Sanjay Dighe
We will continue the way we.
Deepak Poddar
Okay, we’ll continue the way. And any fundraise also we are planning.
Sanjay Dighe
We’ve already taken board. Board’s approval in the last board meeting for. For fundraise for 300 crores for our various projects. But of course in the current scenario we are not able to do that. So we have now we’ve just finished our Q4 and we are into this call. So we have already an approval which we have got. Once we finish the formalities of closure of this financial year then we will sit and we will figure out how we are going to go about. And obviously everybody will come to me.
Deepak Poddar
Okay? Okay. Okay. That would be from my side. All the best.
Sanjay Dighe
Thank you. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Rochel from Pink Wealth. Please go ahead.
Rochel
Hello.
Sanjay Dighe
Hello.
Rochel
Hello.
Sanjay Dighe
Hello.
Rochel
Yes, sir? Yeah. Am I audible?
Sanjay Dighe
Yeah. Good afternoon.
Rochel
Yeah, good afternoon sir. Congratulations for the great set of numbers.
Sanjay Dighe
Thank you so much.
Rochel
So my question is that you know, just wanted to understand the pricing environment for the new contract has been better or compared to last year.
Sanjay Dighe
That is a good question. The pricing, pricing environment is in the corporate side is definitely looking a little better for two reasons. We have been acquiring customers which are, which are very good and who value good service, who value good quality service. So I will say that the pricing environment is a little better than what we’ve been seeing post pandemic. There’s a lot of noise.
Rochel
Now. Is it audible, sir?
Sanjay Dighe
Yeah.
Rochel
My second question is that you know, since you said that, you know this bio enfant secondary technology which we have is going to be commercialized soon. So when can we expect to be commercialized and how big opportunity in terms of revenue we can make over there?
Sanjay Dighe
See this is a very big opportunity and for us commercializing this is the next step that we’ve already been doing. As you know, we are already doing the collection, the waste collection and disposal of solid waste for a municipal corporation. Now we are just taking the decision in terms of usability of this bioenzymes to reduce the legacy waste which is there. So once we have qualified for one municipality, we obviously get qualified for all municipalities across the country. So there are 28 states and union territories. You can imagine the municipal corporation and you can imagine the potential of this business.
It is huge. And the bioenzymes are there legacy waste is there in every city, every town, every state. So it is just a matter of time to play ties with the government system there. And. And it is a long term business. So once you are in just keeps on going. Because waste is created on a daily basis at your home, my home in plants and offices. So you know it is a business in perpetual. And we are very competent to do that because we are doing. We are a very large organization with a large footprint and our reach out is tremendous over the period of time that we get.
It’s a very, very good opportunity. All the opportunities. Whether it is waste, whether it is ifms, whether it is the vanguarding staffing, payroll, technical FM and even this sustainability we need to be. We are extremely bullish on the diverse portfolio that we have created.
Rochel
Sir. And can we expect the approval from the Tanya Multifunct corporation for this bioenzy? Anything can be visible from your side.
Sanjay Dighe
The discussions are going on not only with many municipal corporations. So the moment we get an approval, you all will be the first people who will come.
Rochel
Second. Third question is that you know, since we are venture neural new business like wastewater and like taskmaster. So just wanted to understand that. Yeah, you said it. In terms of margin, your speed business will be accretive. But in terms of capital allocation. So once those business, you know get a growth are we going to see an improvement in rot
operator
interrupt you sir. But I would like to request you to rejoin the question queue. The next question is from the line of Kunal Lakhani from Inga Ventures. Please go ahead.
Kunal Lakhani
Hello sir. I’m audible.
Sanjay Dighe
Yeah, yeah,
Kunal Lakhani
yeah. Good afternoon sir. My question pertains to the tax expense. So in quarter four we can see there is a disproportionately higher tax order compared to previous quarters. So I want to know what is. The reason behind this is the one off adjustment? Any clarification on this?
Sanjay Dighe
I think I’ll leave Barun to answer.
Barun Dey
Can you repeat your question?
Kunal Lakhani
Yeah. Sir, in quarter four there has been a disproportionately higher tax outgo compared to the previous quarters. So is this a one off or if you can clarify on this.
Barun Dey
Yes, because quarter to quarter we have factored taxation part normal. But in the year end we are factoring all tax factors. All put together is the annualized impact and that’s why it is on higher side.
Kunal Lakhani
Okay, so the. Can we expect this on in every year? Each year?
Barun Dey
No, no, no. No. No.
Kunal Lakhani
Okay, thank you. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Rushal from Pink Wealth. Please go ahead.
Rochel
So my question is that since we are venturing into the new business wastewater and task management and the margin, there’s a margin accretive also. So just wanted to understand on the capital allocation side, will there be increase in ROT and ROE also over the long, long run?
Sanjay Dighe
No, I don’t think so.
Rochel
So ROC and ROE will be like maintaining the same what we are doing?
Sanjay Dighe
Yeah, absolutely.
Rochel
Okay. And so my last question is that just wanted to understand your thought process regarding the security persons management business. So since there’s been, you know, now we have been seeing a lot of automation or hardware like CCTV cameras and you know, automation has been applied. So going forward in the long run do we see that the requirement of security personnel will be less?
Sanjay Dighe
We have already made our assessment there and the cameras and the other technologies, they have been there since a couple of decades now. So which has not stopped the growth of manpower. It is a good complement. Both of the technology and manpower complement each other and there are so many areas even today nationally we do not have the Internet and wi fi. Also there are any many other pockets in the city, any infrastructure. So it is always now we are moving towards a combination of both. So the manpower will continue to. Requirement of manpower will continue to happen.
But also we will have a value add and value added proposal to combine the technology with it. So if you ask me, it will be a dual benefit for us. We will be able to deploy people and also be able to deploy various technologies and other technology driven services as an add on feature to our customers which will just add to our entire portfolio.
Rochel
Thank you sir. Thank you for answering your questions.
Sanjay Dighe
Thank you,
operator
thank you. Next question is from the line of Agastya. Dave, please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah, thank you very much for the opportunity. Sir. Congratulations. So great set of numbers. Sir, one question is on the on the way we are doing accounting. So in your standalone numbers and in your consolidated numbers I see a minority interest component. There is a non controlling interest which you are attributing to the parent company. So I want to understand first of all which is this parent company and which business is having a stake in some of your subsidies. I couldn’t figure it out when I went through the annual report. That’s why I’m asking this question.
Sanjay Dighe
This is, this is pertaining to a small GV that we did way back when we did our first CEDP project for Amaranth. So it is a jv, which is Aqua Chem. It is just one odd JV that we did. So sometimes we go for acquiring business, it is that way. So it is just a one or jv, which is it?
Unidentified Participant
So as the company grows, this, this amount will remain constant because that project itself is not great.
Sanjay Dighe
Yeah, that is. That project is also closed. I mean that’s all it is on a winn stage. So when that O M tenure gets over, it will get close.
Unidentified Participant
All right, so one suggestion, sir, just for the like following the proper practices and just to avoid this confusion, the ENL mentions this minority interest, but the balance sheet does not. And I check the schedules in that you are clubbing this as part of network. The general practice is there is nothing wrong about it, but the general practice is that it is shown below the net worth as a separate NCI or MI line item in the balance sheet consolidated in standalone books. Because technically this is not something I as a shareholder will have access to.
Right. This is not part of my earnings. This is your JV’s. Like it’s a minority interest. So it would be better if you show it separately.
Sanjay Dighe
Point taken away.
Unidentified Participant
Thank you, sir. Sir, my second question is
operator
Sorry to interrupt.
Unidentified Participant
. No, no, no. Hang on, hang on, hang on. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. You allowed the previous guy five, five questions. I have asked only one question. You have said two questions. I’ve asked one question.
Sanjay Dighe
You go ahead,
Unidentified Participant
please don’t like. You have. I. I put in the request link at the beginning of the call and I have not. Yeah, okay, thank you. So. So my next question is, I understand the base business and the trajectory that you will have in that. But in the new businesses that you are starting, so how quickly will they ramp up? So for example, this wastewater business next year, what kind of run rate can we, can we see from this business and will it break even next year or will we have in these two divisions, will we have some start starting up losses?
Sanjay Dighe
I am very happy that you got the chance to ask me this question.
Unidentified Participant
So I put in the request at the beginning of the call. This, the moderator has allowed people follow up questions and he has not taken my first question and then I got dropped twice. It’s very, very irritating the way the monitor. And there was a previous guy, he asked you a question, this guy allowed him to ask the question, then interrupted him when you are about to give the answer. They moderate in such a idiotic way that it’s beyond. Sorry for the rant, but I apologize for that. So please go ahead, sir.
Sanjay Dighe
No, no, no. Thank you so much. And I’m very happy that we are talking here because you have asked a very good question. Wanted somebody to ask that because this is a new area that we’ve gotten into and we say it’s a new area. We have the expertise and we had put in a team way back in 2016, 2017 to do this. This is a very good space that we are into. And because these are project based businesses, the break, the break, the break even. There is nothing like break even because once the project is over we’ve already taken all our build money and revenues and the major.
We’ve already booked our profit after that 2 year, 3 years O and M which we are getting paid for on a monthly basis. So it is a very good business because it’s a, it’s a, it’s a cycle. We just did eight, nine months project. You do the project, you get the money and you’re out of the project. It’s a very good line to be.
Unidentified Participant
So we won’t have any sort of losses?
Sanjay Dighe
No, no, no, not at all.
Unidentified Participant
Great sir, thank you very much. Sir, kindly consider the changes to the minority interest on the balance sheet. Other than that sir, thank you very much for taking my questions. All the best.
Sanjay Dighe
I will do that. You have a nice day.
Unidentified Participant
Thank you sir.
operator
Thank you. Next question is from the line of Akash Javeri from Time and Tide Advisor. Please go ahead.
Aakash Javeri
Hello sir and thank you for the opportunity. So my first question is that you know we had mentioned that for the wastewater segment we have a thousand crore outlook for the company in the next 18 months. Are we on track for that? And apart from the 20 crore order that we had received for this division, have we got any more orders?
Sanjay Dighe
Yeah, there’s good questions. Yeah, we are all. We had a particular business plan. We had already evaluated pipelines, we had already evaluated which tenders that or projects that we will go ahead and evaluate bid for workaround. Only after that we have gone ahead and made the announcement that we will have order book position of thousand crores in the next 18 months. So when we did that announcement it was a very well studied announcement. Otherwise we definitely won’t have done such announcements in this domain. So we are. The team is there, it is working on a daily basis.
The evaluation is going on on a daily basis and there are some very good projects that have been worked on on a national level. Whether it is east, west, north, south. As I told earlier, the companies, the plants and the other government bodies are very mindful giving the environmental compulsions and the segment also that we are playing, this is very, very healthy for us. And so we are very optimistic that we will stick to our projections in this financial year.
Aakash Javeri
Sure, sir. And so in catering we’ve been growing at a, at a great pace. You know, we’ve gone from 30 crores to 74 crores in FY25. So can we continue this trajectory or. Because I know that we have only one kitchen in Kalina. So are we planning to put more kitchens or have we reached optimal utilization in this division?
operator
See, we still have space for manufacturing food in our current kitchen. We’ve not reached the optimum level of customers that we are servicing. So there is again, the nature of business is twofold. One is the production which happens in the kitchen and one is the production which happens on site. So because we are pushing for business in both the domains. So with the. The prospect of growing this business is also very high. And even if we reach the optimum level of our production in the kitchen, the business that gives us the leverage to manufacturing food at other locations which is away from the kitchen.
So totally I think it is a good, it is good potential. We have done very well this year and we aspire to continue that growth going forward.
Aakash Javeri
Sure, sir. That’s it. Thank you. For my. Sir, myself. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, because of less time we are taking only one question per participant. Request you to restrict your questions to one only. Next question is from the line of Pankaj Motwani from Equator Securities. Please go ahead.
Pankaj Motwani
Yeah, thank you for the opportunity. So my question is on the staffing and federal managing side. So like I just want to know like the. What is the typical nature of the contracts in this segment? Like are they primarily structured? This is on the fixed fee arrangement or based on percentage of feasibility? Because the intent behind my question is to understand the sensitivity of the margin in the segment because of the fluctuation entry cost. So that’s my question.
Sanjay Dighe
Yeah, Pankaj, good question. Like now we are, we are already doing staffing for, for a range of industries. Whether it is manufacturing units, whether or not Metro Rail or whatever. So it is all percentage of the. It is a management fee based percentage of the CTC and it is not per person based. So and these are all two years, three year contracts which we have. So. So it is a good business to be. And now that whether it is the Metro Rail or so many others other government bodies are also now outsourcing. So we are a little mindful of not Getting into per person, which kind of deal we only get into staffing, payroll, management work where it is a management fee base.
So where we do the entire billing and based on the billing we charge the agreed management. So whenever the billing increases, obviously the management.
Pankaj Motwani
Remains same because of if there’s an increase in the employer cost because of the basic vision. So our margin remains sustainable.
Sanjay Dighe
Margins always remain sustainable.
Pankaj Motwani
And, and just a follow up on this question, like can you like provide the EBITDA margin of each of the segments?
Sanjay Dighe
We don’t work on each segment wise EBITDA margins because many a times we are. These are bundled, bundled service offerings that we give. Therefore it becomes very difficult.
Pankaj Motwani
got it. Yeah, thank you.
Sanjay Dighe
Thank you.
operator
Thank you. Next question is from the line of Prachi from Philip Capital. Please go ahead.
Prachi Badade
Hello sir. Congratulations on good setup numbers. Hello. Am I audible?
Sanjay Dighe
Yeah, yeah. Thank you.
Prachi Badade
Yeah. So current assets, loans and advances have been increased significantly the last quarter. You have said this was provided to the related fund. So are there any plans of reducing this?
Sanjay Dighe
Yes, we have plans of reducing this over a period of time.
Prachi Badade
Okay. Because we see if we compare FY24 25, it has been increasingly.
Sanjay Dighe
But we plan to reduce them as we go forward.
Prachi Badade
Okay, thank you.
operator
Thank you. Next question is from the line of Hemant Soni, an individual investor. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Thank you for providing me the opportunity. So I just wanted to ask you one thing. Like initially we had given a guidance. Of 20% to 25% year and year for the next two, three years. But if I take a look at. The FY25 numbers, I think we are close to side. I don’t remember that same number. I think it’s 14. Okay. What was the reason in the short call and I mean I also saw. The operating cash flows negative. So. Can we expect, I mean 20, 25% from 26 onwards?
Sanjay Dighe
Yeah. We’ve always remained that we will be in that zone. So this year also we are in that zone. We have I think 18, 18, 18% plus is what our growth. So we have said and for the benefit of our valued investors only like you are, that we will continue to grow in this scope. We evaluate businesses so that we are adding healthy margins and also maintaining the zone that of our growth of the top line. And so going forward also anybody can expect us to maintain the same trajectory.
Also by way of we adding these new two businesses in the portfolio which are better. They also have a better margin profile. So overall we see similar growth and very much numbers that will add value to our shareholders like you and in terms of your other question which was there, that is operating cash was negative. We have working capital which we have acquired very new businesses. So that is pertaining to that. You see that negative cash flow.
Unidentified Participant
But what was the reason behind the shortfall? In effect. We were targeting the. Even if I consider the lower end, it is 20%. Right.
Sanjay Dighe
So this I think the positivity you will see in the current contracts because the new contracts that we have, they will give you a better margin. You will see a better number this year.
Unidentified Participant
25% is doable in.
Sanjay Dighe
We will not be able to commit on that
Unidentified Participant
any, any range 2025.
Sanjay Dighe
We will not be able to give that range because we are talking always about a zone. But try and understand where I’m coming from and I’m sure you heard the call. With the kind of businesses that we are into, with the kind of now Pan India presence that we are into, aspirationally it is always better for any CEO. The aspiration is to better the numbers. Nobody would like to be stagnant.
Unidentified Participant
So we had already given a guidance earlier sir and during the time of.
Writeo I guess so what stops us from giving the identification we will always.
Sanjay Dighe
Try to achieve and give you the best numbers.
Unidentified Participant
You know that is fine. That I understand sir. But I mean what is stopping us? This is what I wanted to know because we had earlier given the guidance.
Sanjay Dighe
So I mean are you seeing things. Sort of similar guidance of 20 to 25% zone as a guidance that we, we have and we will keep on growing in that zone.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, so thanks a lot. Thanks a lot.
Sanjay Dighe
Thank you so much.
operator
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, we will take this as the last question for the day.
I would now like to hand the conference over to Mr. Sanjay Digi, CEO and whole time director for the closing comments. Over to you sir.
Sanjay Dighe
So I thank the entire and I thank everybody who have called and who have. Who have reported themselves to call and I thank people for asking questions. There are so many things that we learned from these questions as well. So absolutely delighted to answer all the questions and thank you finding out time to ask me these questions. Always happy to answer you. I thank the entire team of Crystal Integrated Services Ltd. Nationally, all departments for putting in their untiring efforts their hard work and dedication which drives the company forward through various market conditions and geographies.
I thank our the promoter family for bestowing all their trust in me and my senior team to take the company forward. Thank our bankers, thank my valued customers who have stood with me with all their loyalty and also I thank our IR company, Ad factor, Sauli and her team, the moderators. I hope they do a little better job next time. And. And that’s all. Thank you. Thank you very much and wish you all a very good day.
operator
Thank you. On behalf of Crystal Integrated Service Ltd. That concludes this conference. Thank you all for joining us. And you may now disconnect your lines.