Kirloskar Brothers Limited (NSE: KIRLOSBROS) Q3 2025 Earnings Call dated Feb. 13, 2025
Corporate Participants:
Sanjay Kirloskar — Chairman and Managing Director
Ravish Mittal — Chief Financial Officer
Alok Kirloskar — Managing Director
Rama Kirloska — Joint Managing Director,
Analysts:
Pratik Kothari — Analyst
Sani Vishe — Analyst
Unidentified Participant
Manish Goyal — Analyst
Abhishek Jain — Analyst
Mayank Bandari — Analyst
Rabindra Nath Nayak — Analyst
Presentation:
Operator
Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the Q3 FY ’25 Kirloskar Brothers Limited Conference Call. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen-only mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on your touchstone phone. Please note that this call is being recorded. Please note this conference call may contain forward-looking statements about the company, which are based on the belief, opinions and expectations of the company as on-date of this call. These statements are not the guarantees of future performance and involve risks and uncertainties that are difficult to predict.
Sanjay Kirloskar — Chairman and Managing Director
I now hand the conference over to Mr Sanjay Kirloskar, Chairman and Managing Director from Kirloskar Brothers Limited. Thank you, and over to you, sir. Thank you. Good evening, everyone. On behalf of Kirlosuar Brothers Limited, I extend a very warm welcome to everyone for joining us on our call today. I hope you’ve had an opportunity to go through the financial results and the investor presentation, which have been uploaded on the stock exchanges and the company’s website. On this call, I have with me Alok Kirloska, Managing Director, KBI DV; Ramon Kirloskar, Joint Managing Director, KBL and MD Bhara Pumps Limited; and Mr Ravish Mittal, our CFO, as well as Mr Devang, our Company Secretary. As in addition, we have Strategic Growth Advisors, our Investor Relations Advisors on this call. Let me begin my remarks by giving some business highlights. I’m pleased to report that during the quarter, consolidated revenues grew by 19% to INR1,144 crores on year-on-year basis and for nine months FY ’25, consolidated revenues grew by 16% to INR3,211 crores. This increase underscores the strong demand for our products and services across various segments, both domestically and internationally. EBITDA for the quarter grew by 32% on Y-o-Y year-on-year basis to INR183 crores with EBITDA margin of 16.0%, an increase of 170 basis-points year-on-year.
EBITDA for nine months FY ’25 grew by 33% to INR466 crores with EBITDA margin of 14.5%, an increase of 190 — approximately 190 basis-points. I’d like to highlight that EBITDA margin expansion was on the back of our constant efforts to create operational efficiencies and good performance in the international business. During the quarter, we witnessed strong order receipts in both domestic and overseas order book, which witnessed growth of 19% on year-on-year basis. On standalone domestic business performance, for Q3 FY ’25, we’ve achieved a year-on-year growth of 3% with revenue from operations reaching INR661 crores. In addition, our subsidiaries KCPL, KCPL has registered a growth of 75% plus in the quarter, driven by new orders and Karad Projects Motors has registered a growth of 23% plus in a quarter driven by increase in exports business.
During the quarter, 50 new models were launched by the small pumps business. A strong order book and strategic focus on business opportunities positions us well for continued success. We are maintaining our guidance for double-digit revenue growth in FY ’25 compared to FY ’24 for our standalone business. As of December ’24, our standalone pending orders amount to about INR1,874 crores, which as usual excludes the small pumps order book, reflecting a strong pipeline. Furthermore, we are seeing sequential growth across several key segments, including building and construction and the industrial sectors. On the international business, we’ve registered growth of 46% during the quarter and 23% during the nine months of this year. This growth is driven by growth in SCP UK and the Dutch entities on account of robust order book execution. SPP Incorporated, our US business has seen good traction in data centers, fire and HVAC packages. With a keen focus on our business prospects supported by a robust order book, we are optimistic regarding our future growth prospects. Our overseas spending order book stood at INR1,127 crores.
With this, let me invite Mr Ravish Mittal, our CFO, to discuss the financial performance highlights.
Ravish Mittal — Chief Financial Officer
Thank you, CMD, sir, for the warm welcome. Good evening, everyone. Let me share the consolidated financial results for the quarter and for nine months. So on a revenue front, our net revenue from operations for the quarter has grown by 8.6% on year-on-year basis to INR1,144 crores. And for the nine months basis, the net revenue from operations grew by 15.6% to INR3,211 crores. Now on the EBITDA front, our quarter three revenue grew by 32.3% on a year-on-year basis for — to INR183 crores. While our EBITDA margin for quarter three FY ’25 stood at 16%, which is essentially an increase of 170 basis-points from the last year of quarter three. For nine-month basis, our EBITDA grew by 32.9%, which is on year-on-year growth to INR466 crores. And our EBITDA margin for the nine months stood at 14.5% as a revenue — as a percentage to revenue and which has an increase of 190 basis-points from the last year of nine months. In terms of our profit-after-tax, our PAT for the quarter three grew by 43.9% on year-on-year basis to INR119 crores and our nine months PAT has grown by 42.7% 7% year-on-year basis to INR281 crores.
Now with this, I would like to open the session for question-answers.
Questions and Answers:
Operator
Thank you very much. We will now begin the question-and-answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press R&1 on the touchstone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press R&2. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles.We’ll take our first question from the line of Pratik Kothari from Unique PMS. Please go-ahead.
Pratik Kothari
Yes, hi, good evening and thank you, sir. Sir, first on the international side, I mean, we are seeing the revenue, order inflow, all of them doing really well. So if you can just highlight maybe the geography-wise, anything specific that I believe this quarter would be this past supply-chain issues which are getting solved. But other than that That, even our order inflow is very, very strong. So just what is happening there and situation on-ground, please?
Alok Kirloskar
Thank you, Mr speaking. Can you hear me?
Pratik Kothari
Yes, sir.
Alok Kirloskar
Yeah. So, yes, I think a lot of the growth has come out-of-the UK and then a little bit from the US and also the Dutch entities. I would say like we said before, yes, there is some unwinding of some of the supply-chain. But at the same time, we see the framework contracts holding the base of the business, while we see resurgence on water, which is a focus for us, data centers, which is another focus for us. And the third is in new sectors, including areas like green steel, with the carbon border adjustment mechanism coming into effect from next year, a lot of steel companies in Europe are also looking to invest in green steel, which is based on hydrogen, which is where we have a good reference also in Sweden.
So I would say these are few areas that have picked-up. In addition to this, I think slowly you also see oil and gas is picking-up in terms of exploration side. In the Middle-East, with large expansions from Qatar Energy, Adnoc, especially those two. And I would say that’s an area that’s interesting. We have good traction there as well as an uptick on the LNG projects in America, where again there is there was clearance then in the middle, it was blocked by the Biden administration, but it looks like it’s again opened up after Mr Trump’s coming par. So I would say those are the few areas that have sort of supported the order book as well as the general execution of projects. Does that answer your question?
Pratik Kothari
Yes, yes. We had this but in terms of profitability at — I mean, we used to track this at the PBT level. Earlier we had targets of 5%, 10%, 7%. I mean, I believe we achieved that this year and also last year, but I mean, how much more is left in terms of the efficiencies or either by increasing service share on the profitability part for the international business.
Alok Kirloskar
So I think when you look at the international business on a — at a whole level, you would see that our Thai business is still not doing very well. So I would say that’s an opportunity for us to enhance the numbers. Our Dutch business also, while it is better, obviously, this year it’s profitable as you can see from the numbers, it is just marginally profitable. So I would say there is still opportunity there to do better. There are some other areas like maybe in the US where we’ve done a good level of optimization. So really now the additional margins can only come from operating leverage, which is growing the business now from where we are and that’s what we’re focused on in that geography. In the UK, I think we still have a good amount of possibilities with the growth of service business. And so in the UK, we are really driving hard on the service business because that will change the margin profile. As you know, the margin for us is really all about the mix of products, products and services, let you put it that way because the more products we sell, the margins start deteriorating. So we have to manage that mix carefully.
Pratik Kothari
Correct. And sir, last one on the domestic side, our standalone business, if a similar comment on that, I mean, we didn’t see much execution growth this quarter and even our order inflow has been range-bound for a while. So just if on things — on-ground, how are things?
Sanjay Kirloskar
As far as the domestic market is concerned, I’ve always said, don’t look at us quarter-to-quarter because we are made to stock, made-to-order and engineer to order. So it is going to go up-and-down quarter-to-quarter we — like I said earlier in my speech, we are still committed to double-digit revenue growth.
Ravish Mittal
And in terms of order book, I mean, if you really see in-quarter three, we have almost 12% increase in the domestic order booking as well. So which is likely to be executed in the 4th-quarter?
Pratik Kothari
Yeah. Correct. But, some more color, I mean, industry-wise on-ground beet, water irrigation, power just — I mean we do year of some pickup anecdotally here and there of the — I mean the customized or the engineered products. But how is it for us?
Sanjay Kirloskar
No, we are getting orders. We’ve got orders for power stations and water and irrigation, the orders are coming in.
Ravish Mittal
And please bear in mind, when you look at the order book, there is another part of the business, which is a small pump business, which is not forming part of the order book. So that is also doing really well and that is off-the-shelf business, so we don’t add it on the pending order board.
Pratik Kothari
Thank you and all the best.
Operator
Thank you. Before we take the next question, we’d like to remind participants to press RN1 to ask a question. Next question is from the line of Sani Vishay from Axis Securities. Please go-ahead.
Sani Vishe
Congratulations on the good results, sir. And thanks for taking my question. I just want to understand what is the capex number for the nine months and where do we expect to enter by FY ’25? And what are your plans at a broader level for FY ’26?
Sanjay Kirloskar
The capex up to now is about INR40 crores. Yeah. We’ve always maintained that year-on-year, we will invest something equal to our depreciation because most of what we are doing is some modernization, some debottlenecking, so it normally reaches around INR100 crores by the year end?
Sani Vishe
Understood. And any additional expansion initiatives or something new that you are planning for FY ’26?
Sanjay Kirloskar
Any expansion initiatives?
Sani Vishe
Yeah. So not exactly expansion, but I’m trying to understand whether we are planning to spend some significant amount on some new initiatives or something that will drive the growth further in FY ’26?
Sanjay Kirloskar
No, not at the moment.
Sani Vishe
Okay. Okay. Great. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, to ask a question, please press R&1 on your phone. We’ll take our next question from the line of Ravi Shah from VRS Capital. Please go-ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Hi, sir. Am I audible?
Sanjay Kirloskar
Yeah.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah. Thank you, sir for the opportunity. Sir, my first question would be on our EBITDA margin. So we have performed quite well over here. So are these margins sustainable or what kind of range should we look in the margin range going-forward for this
Sanjay Kirloskar
— I think, you know, what we have said is, we will continue to improve all-the-time. So some quarters, like I gave the answer for the previous question will be very-high, some quarters may not be as high, but we will continue to expand on our EBITDA margin.
Ravish Mittal
So there is a continuous drive on the operating efficiency, we will see those impacting the EBITDA margins improvement that will continue.
Unidentified Participant
Understood, sir. Thank you so much. Sir, my next question will be on our domestic business. So it continues to face a bit of challenges and it’s raising a few concerns. So could you provide some further insight or what are the factors contributing to the sluggishness within our domestic business, so any trends, anything there? Thank you.
Ravish Mittal
We believe that it’s in-line with the rest of the market. And you know, I think you need to look at the company as a whole, not look at it from quarter-to-quarter because we are diversified across segments. So there is a hedge. There’s not going to be a point where every segment and every geography is going to be doing well. But overall, we will ensure that we do have those double-digit growth. I think you need to see it as in its entirety. That’s really the advantage of being diversified.
Unidentified Participant
Understood. Thank you. Thank you so much and all the best. Thank you.
Sanjay Kirloskar
Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, to ask a question, please press on your phone. We’ll take our next question from the line of Rajvi Shah from Bright Securities. Please go-ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Thank you for the opportunity. I just had two questions. The first one is, which sectors does the company anticipate will drive future growth and which sectors could potentially impact the performance
Sanjay Kirloskar
The sectors that could drive growth, I mean, we mentioned last-time building and construction that continues to boom, where we are participating with our HVAC, HYPN firefighting equipment. Industry, like we’ve always said, has different cycles for different segments. But there also, as far as we can see, our hit ratio is going up. Water and irrigation, earlier we used to be in the project business. Now we supply large pumps and the order inflow continues. Then power is something that we are looking at. We have received orders in the last few months for thermal power stations, some very large pumps for thermal power stations which are being installed and oil and gas, marine and defense oil and gas for KBL and for marine and defense they tend to be lumpy because they get orders from time-to-time but with the investment that our government is making in defense I’m looking-forward to good business in the future. And of course, retail continues to be having strong growth as Mr Mittal said.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah. Okay. And sir, any plans to get into solar pumps?
Rama Kirloska
We do supply solar pumps to its integrators. We don’t work directly with the government. The terms and conditions are not conducive for doing business because not in-line with how we would like to do this.
Operator
Ma’am, I’m sorry, can you come closer to the microphone, please?
Rama Kirloska
Participate, but we supply to integrators. We don’t work directly with the government.
Sanjay Kirloskar
I think if I can expand on that. As you know, we’ve had issues working with state governments, especially in this — earlier when we did our projects business. And when we looked at the risk factors for solar pump sets, we see that there are quite a few risks which extend for almost a decade, where the company that gets the order has to supply the complete system, but the warranty also has to cover the entire system in its repairs for five years under component B of PM to soon. The earnest money deposit is also to be placed for about 3% and that has to be replaced with Performance bank guarantee, which is valid for five years. Installation and commissioning joint survey to be conducted, survey report to be given on a nightly basis, operations and maintenance, the built-in cost for O&M has to be there and you have to provide compulsory maintenance — comprehensive maintenance compulsory for a period of five years from the date of commissioning of the individual system at the site, which could be anywhere in the state.
Payment is also released month-wise based on you complying with various conditions, part of which is not in your hands and — or most of which is not in your hands and 10% is to be given after completion of entire projects. So there are delays in collection of funds, very-high debtor levels that you may see with companies that participate in this program. And on the other side, a lot of the vendors are small and medium scale, so you have to pay them as per the government’s norms. They can also be liquidated damages on the value of delayed installation up to 10% of the letter of award. So we’ve looked at this entire business and we felt that it’s better to supply pumps for which you get paid immediately by the integrator rather than get involved in projects which go on for years. Does that answer the question?
Unidentified Participant
Yes, sir. Yeah. That was really helpful. And sir, just one more last question, if I can.
Sanjay Kirloskar
Yeah, go-ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Sir, was on the international business, the consolidated revenue growth was well-received, driven by SPP UK performance. Could you share some insights on how it expects SPP UK to perform going-forward?
Ravish Mittal
I think that as I mentioned earlier, some of the growth came a little later in the year because of supply-chain points that were there earlier in the year. But that said, I think in-line with the overall double-digit — double-digit growth targets that the company has taken. I think both international as well as domestic are looking at similar targets in terms of growth. Does that answer your question?
Unidentified Participant
Yes, sir, that was really helpful. Thank you very much.
Operator
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, to ask a question, please press R&1 on your phone. We’ll take our next question from the line of Payal Shah from Billion Securities. Please go-ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah. Thank you so much for the opportunity. I have few questions. First, it was a very good consol performance. Can you highlight what segment internationally helped this growth?
Sanjay Kirloskar
Yeah, outside we had mainly growth from UK, some from USA and also from European entities. The growth, I mean, if I divide it into segments probably came from services, commercial building services, which is data centers and buildings and things like that. And the third area would be power, mainly power plants coming up in Eastern Europe and in Turkey would be probably the overall segment that I would outline does that answer your question?
Unidentified Participant
Okay. Yeah, my next question is, can you explain how does AP OEM works?
Sanjay Kirloskar
So AP OEM is focused on a few things. It basically takes our — the objective was to see how to get our made-to-order business as close as possible to. And in-line with that, a strategy was drawn up with each AP OEM based on the geography they’re located in and the types of industries in those geographies to have stock. And so generally our APOs, as we’ve said before, carry between 10,000 and 12,000 large pumps, which are our industrial pumps in-stock at any point in time. And these large pumps, as you know, don’t — are not sold just as pumps, companies can’t buy them just as pumps as us in terms of end-users because these pumps need something to drive them. So usually a motor or an engine, these have to be installed on a base plate, which is a fabrication as well as many other accessories. So when you add all these accessories together, usually, you know on the usually about 60% to about usually 60% is traded material. So what we did was over-time, we moved that to the dealers where they add those — those motors and other things, the trailed items basically.
And from our point-of-view, that ensures that our working capital requirements are reduced. Our RMSP ratios on-sales are far better because we are only selling our own product and the dealers are paying us upfront on all these transactions. So our cash balance is obviously a lot better because normally, as you would imagine, if we sold to a company directly, the payment terms could be anywhere from 60 to 90 days. So I would say those are the few factors that are changed. So what happens usually is that our revenue obviously goes down a little bit because we are not selling all the traded items, but the margins obviously should be better and the working capital utilization is far better in this — in this model. And on the customer side, what normally is a product that takes between 16 and 24 weeks to deliver, today we are able to deliver in the market between three days to one-week.
So it’s a big game-changer from the way how we — how a customer sees it because he doesn’t have to wait that long anymore for these kinds of products. So I think that’s in a nutshell how an AP OEM works. Does it answer your question?
Unidentified Participant
Yes. Thank you so much, sir, for the elaborate answer. My last question is, has — have we faced any duties from USA? And if yes, then how are we mitigating the same?
Sanjay Kirloskar
Could you repeat that.
Unidentified Participant
Sir, my last question is, have we faced any duties from USA? And if yes, how are we mitigating them?
Sanjay Kirloskar
No, no, we don’t — we have not faced any duties in the USA because we add enough value in the USA for all our all our products to be certified as made in USA. So we are just hoping the duties go higher and higher.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. That’s it from my side.
Operator
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, to ask a question, please press RN1 on your phone. Next question is from the line of Manish Goyal from ThinkWise Wealth Managers. Please go-ahead.
Manish Goyal
Yeah. Thank you so much and congratulations on very good set of numbers on an overall basis. A couple of questions, sir. First on the outlook specific to you on international execution. So with a strong performance in this quarter, no doubt it’s a seasonally best quarter. But now can we expect that we have a fair degree of normalization on supply-chain and with the — with a good order book on-hand, the execution would get better . That was the first question. And on second question on services that you mentioned that we have built a baseline business. So then should we understand that probably the revenue-share in services business is improving on a steady-state basis and it will probably continue the momentum and probably help to balance out on the margin side as what we saw for the first-nine months. And appreciate if you can share like what is the services revenue improvement we have seen in recent past. I know largely it is driven by UK and South America, but maybe if you can give some more perspective. I have a third question on a smaller reactors nuclear on nuclear side where this budget had a announcement on large investments on development to the tune of INR20,000 crores. And so would we also actively look for some kind of a specific product development, any initiatives we can probably take to take a lead over here? And my fourth question is for Rama on Abara, Q3 did report a small profit. I believe there was some delayed executions, which would have happened in Q3. But if you can give us what is the outlook and probably what is the revenue size we probably see in the current year and next year. Thank you.
Sanjay Kirloskar
Manish, can you hear me?
Manish Goyal
Yeah. Yes, sir. I just wanted to clarify one thing. Alok is not Elon Musk, who tells Mr Trump what to do and what not to do. So normalization of supply-chain, I don’t think we can guarantee.
Sanjay Kirloskar
Yeah. No, but like probably the issues what we were facing in recent past, probably if execution has picked-up in current quarter and if we believe that there is a fair degree of — you see a normalization, then we probably see a lesser spike in the quarterly revenue bookings. That was the whole idea to get a perspective.
Alok Kirloskar
Yeah. Manish, I’ll just answer your two questions that you wanted for international. On the revenues, yes, I mean, like you said, we did have — one is that this is the 4th-quarter for international. So as you mentioned, yes, tends normally be a little bit stronger than the other quarters. And so a lot of the execution has taken — a decent amount of execution that we have not gone in a previous quarter would have gone in this quarter. But also at the same time, I would say that those delays that were happening on execution were relevant to oil and gas and large projects, which involved very large engine, normally between 3,500 RPM, 3,500 horsepower to 5,000 horsepower. So they are very large engine and there are very few suppliers. Actually, there are only two American and one German supplier that needs them. And because there is less of a focus on oil and gas than everyone till now at least, I mean, of course, now oil companies have made a complete U-turn and they’re going back into oil and gas. But until now, everyone was focusing on projecting themselves as green.
So they have not made capex investments, which are the engine companies in these large engines. But at the same time, as you would be aware, there are big expansions like I mentioned North Steel project in Qatar Energy and the project and Gasha project in Adnoc amongst many other projects coming up now in the Midwest and the Gulf states in America like Louisiana and all those states. So I don’t know whether that supply-chain will normalize until these — until these engine companies make the capex because as of now, there’s still only three of them and only two of them are operating normal out-of-the three, which is one American and one German company. So that’s one of the issues I would say over there.
So I cannot yet say that we won’t have this up-and-down movement because that supply-chain issue still remains on that — on those particular engines which are required for these large kinds of projects. So I would say that — I hope I’ve answered your first question. If I’ll move on to the second. Yeah, sure. So the second was, was you said services. So yes, I mean services as we’ve discussed also on last previous analyst call, they are multi-year contracts, either three or Five-Year and the idea is just to keep getting more-and-more of them so that we keep building year-on-year and they can build a good base of these contracts in terms of like a — almost like annuity model. So that’s really what we’re doing and that is to stabilize the base or absorb all the costs which are our fixed-cost. And then we get with operating leverage on the products, we are able to sell all the products, which as you know, historically have been tighter on margins. So that’s really the method that we operate in.
Yes, the UK has, as I mentioned before, we are inching up from the old 38% higher towards 40%, but — and so South Africa, as you know, has moved up to 50%. But the other area that we’re now focused on is Europe. So we started in. We’ve got our first contract with, which is a big water company in the Benelux region and we are targeting another three water companies in the Benelux region, like in the UK, we have a framework — exclusive framework contract with every water company except, which is non-exclusive. Similarly, we are trying for the same in Europe, in Benelux, Benezuch is Belgium, Luxembourg, in Netherlands along with some chemical companies that we’re trying to target now like we have in — we have, as you know, in the UK. So we’re targeting a few chemical companies also in Europe or specifically Beneluk region, where we should look to get more penetration in services revenue. Does that answer your second question?
Manish Goyal
Yeah.
Sanjay Kirloskar
Yes. And your third question was — could you just repeat that?
Manish Goyal
It was regarding the nuclear small modular reactors where there were lot of announcement in budget in terms of developments. So maybe if we are also willing to take any initiative for the relevant product development?
Sanjay Kirloskar
Yeah. So nuclear small modular reactors, they’ve been spoken about for the last two years, I believe, right from the G20 declaration and that seems to be the future going-forward. But that being said, other than marine small modular reactors which are used to power aircraft carriers and submarines, there are only two working modular reactors, one in Russia and one in China. And you hear a lot from America, you heard about NuScale, you heard about all these tech bros investing hugely into small modular reactors, but nothing is working yet. They’re making their investments. Each one, many people are trying different technologies and therefore, when they need money, they will make large announcements and ask for partners and ask for customers, et-cetera, etc. That being said, KBL has pumps for lightwater. These all tend to be lightwater reactors. KBL has delivered all types of pumps for lightwater reactors as well in addition to the pumps that we’ve delivered for fast reactors and pressurized heavy water reactors.
So the product-line is there. The product-line is proven. The only issue is what is going to be the size, right, because each size of nuclear reactor will need a certain size of pump and then that again will depend on how many pumps they want, whether it’s one pump, two pumps, five pumps, so that will finally decide the exact hydraulic performance of the pump. But otherwise, we are ready to deliver wherever small modular reactors need pump, we are ready to deliver such pumps. There are small modular reactor designs which don’t need pumps as well but I believe most people would want positive cooling to be done through lightwater. Okay. Does that answer your question?
Manish Goyal
Yes. Yes. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. And I’m sorry. Can you please press one again? Yeah. Ladies and gentlemen, to ask a question, please press RN1 on your phone. We’ll take our next question from the line of Abhishek Jain from Investwell. Please go-ahead.
Sanjay Kirloskar
We had four questions. I answered the third question.
Operator
Yeah, I’ll take him back-in the queue, sir.
Sanjay Kirloskar
No, we’ll answer the fourth question before we go to the next question.
Rama Kirloska
But is he on the line?
Sanjay Kirloskar
Yeah, he would be on the line. I think.
Operator
He is on-line sir.
Rama Kirloska
Yeah, good evening, Manish. Your question was about Ribara. So So we’ve been taking some very complex jobs and you have seen that the recent trend is that a lot of the sale happens in Q4. So we will be following the same trend even this year. And as you know, in the oil and gas business, there are only limited supply-chain partners. So because of the limited vendors, there is a capacity constraint and that continues to be the case. So I hope that answers your question.
Operator
Manish.
Manish Goyal
Yeah. Thank you so much. Yeah.
Operator
Thank you.
Rama Kirloska
Thank you.
Operator
We’ll take our next question from the line of Abhishek Jain from Investwell. Please go-ahead.
Abhishek Jain
Hello.
Sanjay Kirloskar
Yeah.
Abhishek Jain
Yeah, okay. Sir, I’ve got — I need some updates about the US operation, how it has performed this quarter as compared to last year as well as the previous quarter and during the year. Since we are basically more into fire perm, so how it has performed? And sir, with the being make in America, so how we are benefiting out of it? And is there any plan to introduce some other products other than fire pumps? And another one, the last one being right now, after a long-time, the company is into a — it seems like the company is in a sweet-spot, like once again, the thermal power plants are coming into picture and oil and gas is being you know being taken care of. Once again, it has been posed. So how you see going-forward for the next three years? How you see the company?
Alok Kirloskar
So your first question was about SVP Inc. I think on Page 8, Inc. Numbers are listed both for the quarter and for nine months. So I won’t go into the numbers specifically. But I would say that few things that we are looking at for SVP Inc. Is mainly, as you said, is one aspect of it. The other part of SPP does — which is part of, which is a subsidiary of SVP, Inc. In Americas does the HVAC packages. I had mentioned also in our last call that we do HVAC packages for, of course cost buildings and various things, but also for data centers. And we do a lot of them with Amazon with whom we have a like a framework. So we have done quite a few with Amazon in America. We’ve also done with Meta in Singapore for the cooling of the data centers.
And we’ve also developed products which are containerized and plug-and-play for data center cooling. So that’s another area that we’re really focused on because we do see that apart from people like Amazon and Facebook and Google, which is Azure — Google and Microsoft, many other private equities are also putting up data centers because it’s — the cash-flow is like a utility business. And so there’s a lot of focus from them and so there are many new players coming. So I would say that’s another focus area for us. One is data center business, but another area is also municipal water. So we are also investing or rather picking-up the also municipal water and that’s a focus area for us in America. So these are the areas outside oil and gas. And I think we do see a good number of opportunities in that. Like I mentioned, last quarter was a little bit slower because of the elections. I think last quarter also when we had the analyst call, people asked about America because they’ve had two slow quarters.
But — but I think post-elections, things seem to seem a lot better in terms of people releasing orders again once they know now that many of those policies in the areas where we are at least are still remaining consistent after Trump has come into par.
Abhishek Jain
Okay, can you tell me how much is the service revenue, the percentage-wise and business?
Alok Kirloskar
Yeah, we never disclosed that entire KBI level. I think we only said the service revenue in the UK is normally 38% to 39%.
Abhishek Jain
Okay, sir. Thank you very much, sir.
Operator
Thank you. Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, to ask a question, please press RN1 on your phone. We’ll take our next question from the line of Mayank Bandari from Asian Market Securities. Please go-ahead.
Mayank Bandari
Yeah. Thanks for the opportunity, sir. Just in order to understand a few things more about the categorization of product mix. How would you categorize mid to stop cycle time and mid to order cycle time of our engineered order cycle time like in months or maybe in how would you categorize these
Sanjay Kirloskar
Stock is delivered during the month as far as our small pumps business is concerned, it might go to about a month and a half for the small and medium pumps, mid to order is about two to three months, 60 days to 90 days and engineered to order may take eight months-to 18 months depending on the complexity.
Mayank Bandari
So in the overseas market, we particularly — we have only focused on to order.
Sanjay Kirloskar
No. Retail — retail is actually about 45% of our businesses, which comes from both the small pump plants as well as the small and medium pumps plant or maybe closer to 50.
Mayank Bandari
Okay. Okay. And sir, on the services part, I mean just as you not disclosed the number that proportion of the revenue from services, but would it be — will you be able to give us a better understanding on which markets would be having higher services revenue going-forward, like in terms of there are — I mean, increased opportunity on the installed-base is increasing. So which end-market could be much more lucrative in terms of services
Sanjay Kirloskar
It is dependent on the customer, you know-how he treats his equipment. So most engineering companies, pumps lose 1 to 1.5 percentage points of efficiency every year. So a good company which wants to run its process efficiently, we probably run, you know, get service for their pumps within three to five years, because otherwise the energy efficiency goes down. And I’m not talking about our pumps, I’m talking about pumps in general. And I think earlier also I’ve mentioned that our LLC series of pumps, lowest life-cycle cost series of pumps actually maintains its efficiency for 10 years, whatever people lose in one year, our LLC pumps lose in 10 years. So then customers decide whether they want to buy lowest life-cycle cost pumps or standard pumps. The power sector basically would buy a lot of spare parts to keep the power stations, the private sector power stations, not so much with the electricity boards.
Similarly, like I said, industry does, retail pumps from small and medium pumps may want to replace the pump rather than ask for service because the pumps range from 2,000 to 5,000 to 20,000. So it depends on the attitude of the end-customer that he would ask for service. And some pumps like firefighting pumps may not need service because they run very little in a year than inspection or making sure that everything is working unless there is a fire people will not turn-on that fire pump at all.
Alok Kirloskar
Just to add a point, I think based on your question, you know when we today outside India at KBI, we have about 120 odd service contracts. These service contracts are divided between water companies, mining companies, chemical companies and petrochemical companies, which are — which are exploration of refineries, which include offshore — offshore assets. And our service contract is not just for our pump, it is for all the pumps on that particular site for which we have signed the contract. And we do repair, maintenance, upgradations, spare part management, everything for all the pumps, not just ours. So I just thought I’d make that point because you are making a correlation between our installed-base and the service revenue. There is not a correlation between those two.
Mayank Bandari
Yeah. Okay, sir. Thank you very much.
Operator
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, to ask a question, please press on your phone. We’ll take our next question from the line of Rabin Ranad Nayak from Sunidhi Securities. Please go-ahead.
Rabindra Nath Nayak
Thank you, sir, and congratulations for a good set of numbers, particularly from the side. And so I thank Alok for that for the Initiatives which taking. So my question regarding this, sir, we have booked — whatever the revenue that which is coming in the standalone business is actually it is sticky, it is very constantly growing. It is not growing very fast as compared to the international revenue. So what is the short-cycle order we have booked in this quarter and nine months and what it was in the last year in the same-period? And particularly referring to this where you mentioned that and mid-to-order, these are the — I understand these are the short-cycle orders. So how much revenue has come from this sort of order in the revenue? So — and another thing, the margin has dip in this quarter. Is there any explanation to be met for this product mix due to short-cycle and long-cycle orders?
Sanjay Kirloskar
You know, one thing I’d like to caution everyone and I think Alok mentioned that, it was international Businesses 4th-quarter. Similarly, KBL’s historic performance as you see, I suggest that everyone look at KBL’s historic performance quarter-on-quarter because that would give you a better idea of what happens actually in our industry. So we can look at it in that manner rather than any other manner.
Ravish Mittal
And essentially our eight to stop business contribute both on S&P funds and retail pumps together around 45% to 50% and that’s seeing a trend
Rabindra Nath Nayak
Same trend last year.
Ravish Mittal
Yeah.
Rabindra Nath Nayak
Okay. So okay. So you meant to say this is likely to continue in the future also in the domestic market, particularly.
Sanjay Kirloskar
We are following a historical trend and so that’s what you should keep in mind. And the quarters are for the international business, the calendar year is January to December. And for the Indian business is April to March. So I think you should keep that in.
Rabindra Nath Nayak
And sir, while actually if I say the margin in this quarter, there is a drop-in the sequential basis. So I’m just asking of what is the explanation we can make from the product mix size and the revenue. First I was just a broad-base, a broad explanation.
Ravish Mittal
No, I think margins also vary quarter-on-quarter. And as we discussed earlier, I mean, we are also doing lot of operating efficiency activities. So that has a little bit impact. But essentially, it is not an indicator on a quarter-to-quarter basis, you have to look at holistically.
Rabindra Nath Nayak
Okay. No, I’m just asking whether short-cycle or is actually a high-margin, whether it will be a reduction.
Operator
Can you use your handset mode, please? Your voice is not very clear.
Rabindra Nath Nayak
Hello. I’m just asking whether the short-cycle order has actually reduced, that is where the market has peaked or the — how — what is the explanation that’s what I’m looking for?
Sanjay Kirloskar
Did you be — we couldn’t hear it properly.
Rabindra Nath Nayak
Yeah. So I’m just asking, hello.
Operator
Can I request you to use your handset mode, please?
Rabindra Nath Nayak
Just as you sir. Is it audible?
Operator
Yes, please go-ahead.
Rabindra Nath Nayak
So I’m just asking whether the product mix in the short-cycle and long-cycle order, is there an explanation for the margin dip in this quarter? So what should we — how should we look at it? Because if any — in-quarter the margin dips, then we should express that this could be the reason. I’m just asking. Very broad, I’m not going to details.
Ravish Mittal
So product mix is usually the same as being in earlier quarters. So this product mix has nothing specific in that manner to affect the margins. In fact, we’ve seen our — we have a better control over our material costs.
Rabindra Nath Nayak
Okay. Okay. And sir, in nuclear power sector, I think you mentioned that if at all, whether the same proportion in the infrastructure sector, but you have mentioned in the past that a percentage of revenue should be our target in a total market size for us, whether we should expect that similar thing for nuclear sector as well, that is 2% of the total project cost or it is more than that?
Sanjay Kirloskar
No, you should expect about the same.
Rabindra Nath Nayak
Okay.
Sanjay Kirloskar
Of the total project costs will be for pumps.
Ravish Mittal
Yeah.
Rabindra Nath Nayak
Okay. Okay. Okay, sir. Thank you and all the best, sir. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. Thank you. And as there are no further questions from the participants, I now hand the conference over to Mr for closing comments. Over to you.
Rama Kirloska
Thank you for joining the call. If you have any further inquiries, please get-in touch with Strategic Growth Advisors, our Investor Relations partner. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you, members of the management team. On behalf of Kirloskar Brothers Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us and you may now disconnect your lines