JSW Infrastructure Limited (NSE: JSWINFRA) Q3 2025 Earnings Call dated Jan. 28, 2025
Corporate Participants:
Rinkesh Roy — Joint Managing Director and Chief Executive Officer
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi — Whole Time Director and Chief Financial Officer
Unidentified Speaker
Arun Sharma — Chief Executive Officer
Analysts:
Mohit Kumar — Analyst
Achal Lohade — Analyst
Lokesh Maru — Analyst
Priyankar Biswas — Analyst
Alok Deora — Analyst
Aditya Mongia — Analyst
Arpit Shah — Analyst
Kunal Shah — Analyst
Ankita Shah — Analyst
Koundinya Nimmagadda — Analyst
Nidhi Shah — Analyst
Eshwar Arumugam — Analyst
Vaibhav Shah — Analyst
Presentation:
Operator
Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the Q3 FY ’25 Earnings Conference Call of GSW JSW Infrastructure Limited and Navgar Corporation Limited hosted by ICICI Securities. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen-only mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes, should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star on your touchstone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr Mohit Kumar from ICICI Securities. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Mohit Kumar — Analyst
Thank you, Alarik. Good evening. On behalf of ICICI Securities, I’d like to welcome you all to the Q3 FY ’25 earnings call of JSW Infrastructure Limited. To discuss the results today, we have with us Mr Roy, Joint Managing Director and CEO; Mr Lali Singhvi, Whole-Time Director and CFO; and Mr Arun Sharma, CEO of Corporation Limited; and Mr Vishyesh, Head of Investor Relations. Without much delay, I’ll now hand over the call to the management to start with brief opening remarks, which will be followed by Q&A. Over to you, sir.
Rinkesh Roy — Joint Managing Director and Chief Executive Officer
Thank you, Mohit. Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to our quarterly earnings call for the period ending, 31, 2024. As this is my inaugural interaction with you all as Joint Managing Director and Chief Executive Officer on this platform, I’m quite enthusiastic about the future growth prospects of JSW Infra. I’d like to outline my top three priorities.
Number-one, to ensure the advancement and successful completion of our expansion plan to 400 million tonnes per annum by FY 2030 or before. In comparison greenfield, brownfield and other growth projects within the stipulated time and budget.
Number two, to significantly scale-up the logistics business segment, targeting a top-line of INR8,000 crores by FY ’30 and an EBITDA margin approaching 25%. The objective is to expand the business on an asset-light model to achieve an industry-leading ROC. Number three, to continuously seek out value-accretive inorganic opportunities.
Now moving on to the operational and financial performance. For the period April 24 to December ’24, the total cargo handle stood at 85.7 million tons, registering an 11% year-on-year growth. Our third-party cargo mix grew by 45% year-on-year to 41.7 million tonnes and the share of third-party increased to 49% in the overall mix, up from 37% a year-ago. Total revenue for the nine months ending December ’24 stood at INR3,457 crores, reflecting a growth of 22% year-on-year. The total EBITDA for the period stood at INR1,885 crores, which is 22% year-on-year growth and net profit for the period was INR1,006 crores, a growth of 21%.
Now specifically on the developments during the quarter, at JNPA, we have obtained approval from the relevant authorities to commence interim operations and we handled nearly 90,000 tonnes of liquid edible oil this quarter. Similar efforts are in-progress at Terminal and we anticipate receiving clearances to begin interim operations soon. The cargo handling capacity at the Mangalore coal terminal has been increased to 8.1 million tonnes per annum, up from 6.7 million tonnes per annum.
At port, the capacity increased to 8 million tonnes per annum from 5 on the back of dredging activities, while the environmental clearance is in-place for 19 million tonnes per annum, thus, the total capacity of the company increased to 174 million tonnes per annum, up from 170 million tonnes per annum. I’m pleased to share that the global ESG risk rating agency, Morningstar Sustain Analytics has rated JSW Infrastructure Limited as low-risk on ESG. This rating from a globally reputed agency confirms our belief, ability and commitment to manage ESG risk as part of our overall business strategy.
With this, let me hand over to Mr Lalit Singhi, our CFO, to take us through the financials and other details.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi — Whole Time Director and Chief Financial Officer
Thank you,, and good evening, everyone. Let me first talk about our core business. In Q3 FY ’25, the company handled cargo volumes of 29.4 million tons as compared to 28.1 million tons in the quarter ended December ’23. This 5% increase was driven by the increased capacity utilization in the coal terminal at Paradi. The contribution from port and liquid storage terminal in UAE. The growth was partially offset by the lower cargo volumes in the iron-ore terminal at. Third-party cargoes increased to 14.3 million tons from 10.9 million tons, representing 31% growth and share of third-party volume stood at 49% versus 39% a year-ago. The growth in cargo volume and change in volume mix resulted in 13% increase in operational revenue for the quarter from INR1,063 crores.
Operational EBITDA for the core segment stood at INR570 crores, up from INR480 crores, an increase of 19% strong EBITDA growth was largely driven by the increased revenue. We have consolidated Navgar Corporation Financials with effect from October 11, ’24 as a result of total revenue of the company stood at INR1,265 crores and the total EBITDA stood at INR670 crores, reflecting a year-on-year growth of 24% and 20% respectively. Consolidated depreciation was INR138 crores and finance cost was INR97 crores in the current quarter as compared to INR108 crores and INR67 crores, respectively in the quarter ended December ’23.
Given the sharp depreciation in the INR and change in the yield curve, we have recognized mark-to-market unrealized loss of INR156 crores. This is essentially a non-cash charge and in-line with guidelines of India 109 on hedge accounting. As a result, profit before-tax for the quarter ended December ’24 stood at INR276 crores as compared to INR307 crores in the quarter ended December ’23. PAT for the current quarter grew by 32% at INR336 crores as compared to INR254 crores in the same-period last year.
As mentioned by, we are scaling up our logistics segment based on the foundation of business. Hence we have allocated close to INR9,000 crores of capex till FY ’30 and aspire to achieve 25% EBITDA on a top-line of INR8,000 crores. The expansion aims to build-on the acquisition to develop a robust pan-India logistics network for last mile connectivity. As of December ’24, we have net-debt of INR827 crores and our net-debt to EBITDA is 0.4x and one of the strongest balance sheet in the sector. This coupled with the increasing annual cash flows from the current asset-base, we are well-positioned to pursue a growth plan to enhance our present cargo handling capacity to 400 million ton and parallel growth of our logistics business with a top-line of INR8,000 crores by FY 2030.
With this, I request the operator to open the line for questions. Thank you.
Questions and Answers:
Operator
Thank you. We will now begin with the question-and-answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on the touchstone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star N2. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Mr Archal Nohade from Nuvama Institutional — Institutional Equities. Please go-ahead.
Achal Lohade
Yeah, good evening, sir. Thank you for the opportunity. Sir, first on the volume part, if you could help us understand, a, how do you see the volumes playing out given our Twin ports in combined have been seeing a muted growth given the — given the JSW steel capacity utilization. How do you see that evolving in 4Q as well as FY ’26 and maybe over next couple of years. And then I’ll ask a follow-up question, sir.
Rinkesh Roy
We — as you are aware, the and ports, we primarily are serving steel plant and steel plant is currently expanding from 10 million tonnes per annum capacity to 15 million tonnes. So this lumpy growth will come once — when this plant gets commissioned, which will be in around ’26 end or 27 mid ’27. I think that would be the place where we will see a lumpy growth coming. So till then, I would like to add that we will continue to have our regular growth based on our capacity, which is at 66% utilization, we can go to 75%, 80%. So this will be largely coming from third-party growth. So this year also you can see that we have reached up to 49%, which was earlier 39%. So this growth of — they say we have given a guidance of 10%, this will continue to be there till we have this other expansions coming into the picture..
Achal Lohade
Understood. So essentially what you’re saying is that the current volume momentum should continue till the new capacity gets added in and at the company-level, we are maintaining 10% volume growth for FY ’25. Have I understood right, sir?
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Yeah. So if you are looking at the quantity side, it will continue as per our guidance, but our revenue and EBITDA will certainly grow much faster because we have other businesses also now into the play, take it for or any other acquisitions or possibilities also is there, which we are working upon. So this would be a different than our regular growth in the cargo.
Achal Lohade
Understood. The second question I had, if you could highlight excellent scale-up on Fujira, 2 million tonnes for the quarter. Is that — is that a new run-rate we should work with? And how are the margins, if you could give some sense on in terms of the EBITDA for from annual run-rate perspective.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Yeah, this should continue because the market is good for the tank punk business. So we expect this to continue and EBITDA margins for these type of business is typically high at 85% plus. So this is a very good acquisition for us and we are further pursuing such possibilities in the times to come.
Achal Lohade
Understood. Understood. If I may ask a follow-up question, in terms of the capex in terms of the logistics capex guidance, can you can you help us understand you know, how do you look at this particular aspect of the business. You’ve said you will expand of car or business. If you can throw some more light, even the capex seems to be fairly large one. And when you say asset-light, I’m just bit lost here. You’re saying you will spend INR9,000 crore for INR8,000 crore revenue with a 25% margin that comes to about 20% 22% ROCE. So if you could just tie these points.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
So partly — I’ll answer and partly will further elaborate on the logistics business. So what I’m saying that on this side, the — what will come to, will continue to grow and as we are building a parallel network or an alternate network pan-India basis, so will certainly get benefit to fit. So you know that we have made a platform about, which is JSW port logistics Company. So there will be a lot of growth coming through this platform. Navkar balance sheet, whatever it can take, it will go to and rest of this will go to the port logistic company. So spending of this INR9,000 crores what we have planned for FY — till FY ’30 will be partly at Navkar and partly at other levels at this platform which we have created. So as regards the ROCE and all that, that 20% or 22% ROC, this is basically we are going for low-cost options, which will further explain to you.
Rinkesh Roy
You see you have to look at as a stepping stone into the logistics industry. And from here, as Mr Singhy said, the logistics part of the network. The network planning is more important than anything else in logistics. So what we have planned is setting up close to, 15 20 terminals across India, so that also gets access to these terminals and its cargo also increases as part of a bigger network, that is number-one. Number two, we’re trying to leverage the group’s cargo into this Navkar and the pan-India logistics platform that we have. So we will create a base cargo for further movement.
Number three, the current structure of creating an ICD or an asset is quite expensive. So what we are looking at is that apart from greenfield — greenfield projects, we’ll be also looking at Gati terminals of the railways in which we don’t have to buy the land. We get land on lease from the railways and you can set-up a similar terminal and also leverage our own sidings, group sidings as well as have strategic tie-ups with major importers and exporters. So in this strategy, we will be creating the same assets at a much lower-cost. So this is on the terminal part.
Secondly, a large part of our capex will also go into either easing of rates or purchasing of rigs, a mix of which an ideal mix will be a calculating and moving ahead. So this will be broadly the strategy that will be followed.
Achal Lohade
Perfect. Thank you for that elaborate answer, sir. I’m follow-up. I have follow-up questions, but I’ll fall-back in the queue. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Rokesh Maru from Neppon India Mutual Funds. Please go-ahead.
Lokesh Maru
Hi, sir, good evening. Just one question. So our revenue is obviously growing faster than volume growth within the core ports business, right, let’s say 8% volume growth was 13% top-line growth. So could you please help me understand the realization part where are we seeing this hike in realization? Thanks.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
See, this year, if you see in this quarter, one is Navar 1/4 almost has come 11th October to this, where the cargo is not included because in is the logistics business, only revenue or EBITDA come. So that has come, which is not linked to the — that port cargo. And this oil sink terminal, which we have in UAE, so that has come into the picture where the margins are 85% plus. So this has enabled that revenue and EBITDA are much higher compared to our port cargo where we — where EBITDA margins are say, 50%, 52%, 3%, but here it has 85% revenue business has come in. So this has made us that revenue and EBITDA are much higher than the throughput.
Lokesh Maru
Understood. Understood. Just one more thing, sir, this 50 terminals plan on logistics side this is something new right mentioned last-time on the call. Could you please elaborate what is what is the plan maybe in some bit more details.
[Technical Issue]
Operator
Ladies and gentlemen, the management seems to have disconnected. I request you to stay on the line while I reconnect them. Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen we are reconnected and are good to go.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Priyankar Biswas from BNP Paribas. Please go-ahead.
Priyankar Biswas
Good evening, sir. This is Priyankar from BNP. So sir, my first question actually going on to the previous question that was asked. While I understand that the realizations have been kind of similar at the four ends of the business. But what I see is that the EBITDA per ton has improved significantly. So can you tell me like is this number sustainable or should it improve from here even more? Can you please throw some color on that, let’s say, in the subsequent quarters.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
It is a question of mix. So this will, you know, continue if we go in the same way. The core business EBITDA will remain the same. But if you — as this business gets added and you know that Nerv car and logistics business typically is a much lesser percentage and combined one would definitely be a bit lower than what we have been reporting for the port business and that is why we are going for now segment-wise reporting. So we’ll be giving logistics separately and port business separately. And as I said earlier, port has shown a higher number because last year that oil tank business was not there and this year oil tank business has come. This is included into the port business and that is why the EBITDA margin is higher.
Priyankar Biswas
Okay. And sir, what I see is that there has been sharp falls in the iron-ore volumes, which you had also highlighted in your media releases. So can you elaborate on the reasons why it is so? And when exactly can we expect this volumes to come back?
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
The iron-ore prices are cyclical and right now the prices are a little lower. So it has affected a bit on the export side. So this — as and when we have seen in last few years that this — in a year also there is a cycle. Sometimes it is good then tech ports are higher. So some people have in-between stop and some large players have again restarting those things. So we feel that in the next quarter, it should come back. So at Para Deep and the old infrastructure, there were some stop and start with major — two major customers stopping in the last quarter for various reasons. So they are all — they have all restarted now. So we — and these are part of the iron-ore market. So they generally you understand that if the prices are good, then people start moving more. So this is one thing which will be facing and will be overcome.
Priyankar Biswas
Thanks, sir. And just adding on. So just like you had highlighted that with the EUR90 billion capex for logistics, you should get something from EBITDA of something like EUR20 billion by FY ’30. Similarly, can you tell for the EUR300 billion capex originally that you had planned for the ports particularly, what sort of EBITDA that CapEx should lead to by FY ’30, like a comparable number?
Rinkesh Roy
So are most of our project that we do are based at a minimum of at least 16%. So that you can take as a sure short guidance that it will never be below those numbers.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
And I said earlier also that since greenfield projects are more where there is no revenue-sharing, so I’m looking at EBITDA margins going from, say, current level of 50% to 53% operational EBITDA margins, they are going to, 58%, 59% — and that is mainly because the share of greenfield is more unless we are able to get more terminal from the government privatization, which we don’t know today, how much will come because that only decreases because there is a revenue-sharing there. So more or less this — based on this guidance, you can estimate the number.
Priyankar Biswas
And sir, just one more if I can squeeze in. This is regarding to particularly on JSW Steel. So in each of the quarters, in the past 3/4, we are seeing some sort of maintenance or some things around there. So should we expect such a thing to also occur in, let’s say, 4Q or FY ’26 or should we have more of a normalized run-rates for, let’s say.
Rinkesh Roy
You see that steel generally, they have been meeting and they have been targeting also the peak capacity. So the maintenance schedules, they will all be a normal part of a process. So I don’t think we should be reading too much into that. The only thing we should be looking at is whether Steel is meeting its target.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
There is a past track-record of team running the capacity at quite high-level. So based on that, we expect that capacity utilization should continue.
Priyankar Biswas
Sure. Okay. And sir, on the JSW logistics side of thing, so can you give us some idea like how will the capex be spread-out? So for example, during your billion capex, you had given that INR130 million would be till FY ’27 and the rest would be from FY ’27 to 30. So what should be the spread-out of the 90 million capex that you plan for JSW Logistics?
Rinkesh Roy
Only if you see on this 9,000 already 1,100 has gone into acquisition, okay. And then on-top of that, we will be adding — usually, these are the approx numbers and currently at a very, very ideal stage. These are not being fleshed out into real exact numbers. But broadly GCT and terminal development should give us — we should be spending another INR3,000 crores, another INR3,000 crores on the rate acquisitions or leasing. And for containers, it would be that for specialized containers to — and other types of containers that will be developed, we are looking at a capex of around INR1,500 CR and on other activities would be under INR500 crores. So this would be broadly the numbers that as give or take, it will vary, but this would be the broad press.
Priyankar Biswas
Okay. Thank you, sir. I will follow back into the queue.
Operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Alok from Motilal Oswal. Please go-ahead.
Alok Deora
Sir, good evening. I just had couple of questions. First is on the — on this logistics revenue target. So we are targeting INR8,000 crore revenue by FY ’30. And if I just look at the ports number, if we just take a growth rate on the current run-rate, so that would again be the current INR4,000 crore annual revenue could, you know, double in the next five years. So would it be a situation where we are almost at 50%, 50% in terms of ports and logistics?
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Yeah. It looks like based on this current plan of going into big way in the logistics network. So this would be around this. So you are right that INR400 crore to INR5,000 crores will be spending on the port sector and INR15,000 to 200,000 on the this logistics sectors.
Alok Deora
Yeah. No, no, I meant the size of the business by FY ’30 or so your revenue from logistics will be INR8,000 crore by that time your revenue from ports will be around a similar amount.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
No, that should be much higher, not INR8,000 crores.
Alok Deora
Okay.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
By FY ’30, it will be much, much higher actually.
Alok Deora
Sure, sure. And this — the capex, so you broadly mentioned some of the areas, but how do we see — how are we looking at this business because we are talking about here a 25% sort of a margin here, which is similar to, say, what Adani Logistics is doing, for example, but do we see this business to operate as a standalone business or we — it would be kind of provided as a blended service to ports, if you could just throw some light on that?
Rinkesh Roy
You see if you were — if you see all major port or terminal operators, they gradually move into the logistics part of the area because this is a core adjacency to the port or terminal business. It — number-one, what it does, it ensures stickiness of the customer.
Number two, you are looking at not being a standalone port or a standalone terminal operator, but being in a larger play of the logistics business in which the last mile connectivity up to the hinterland or the ICD plays a very big role.
And number three, apart from synergizing with our ports — greenfield ports that we are coming up with, along with the other opportunities in the major port terminals that we’ll be looking at, we are also synergizing with our group cargo. So to just give you an example, JSW’s team have a humongous spend on logistics. So even if we capture and synergize with them for a smaller percentage at least 15% to 20%, that itself will be around 40%, 50% of the revenues and EBITDA that we are projecting.
So this synergy of group cargo of the port terminal as well as having the pan-India logical presence and logistics, this will be a natural progression from ports and terminals into logistics.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
So just to add that the model, they continue to be the same life of port. So base cargo here again will come from the anchor customer because they have a lot of you know that outbound cargo which goes from all part of the country, say from South or from west also from till Delhi and North. So our base cargo for this logistics will also come from that basis and then we’ll top it up with the third-party customers. So that works very well for our sport also and that will work very well for our logistics play also.
Alok Deora
Got it, sir. And the — just if you mentioned about a sharp jump-in margins going ahead where operating EBITDA moved from 53% to 58%. Just a couple of minutes, if you can spend how that would happen because that’s a big jump which we are talking about without a significant change in the — or the portfolio of cargo handled. So just a minute if you can spend that would be helpful.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Sure, sure. So as I said that if you look at my 174 million to 400 million ton journey, so most of the investment is going into the greenfie pools, okay. So whether it’s a Kenny or Murbay or, they all are greenfield or wherever we are expanding take or and all that, where the EBITDA margins are 65% to 70% because there is no revenue-sharing with the government. Today, my ratio is around 50-50 between the terminals and the major ports — I mean private ports. So the margin profile is 52% 53%. But my composition of cargo from the private ports is going to increase as we reach towards 400. So that itself will give me my EBITDA margins to go to 58%.
Alok Deora
Got it. And just last question if I may. So when in FY ’28, 30, when you scale-up the logistics business as well, which should be more like a, 20% 25% margins and you also have the ports business scaling up with slightly higher margins. So blended margins could still be at around 53% 54%. Is that understanding correct? Because that logistics business will also.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Being higher. So my core business will have a much larger chunk of, you know, the share in the total business. So this will be much higher. Even if it is 15% 20%, that should be around 55%. It will not be less than that. As per the current arrangement of INR400 million, if I go further into the private terminals at the major, then composition may be different because there we have to share revenue. But as far as the plan which we have rolled-out of 400 million tonnes, it will be around 55%.
Alok Deora
Got it. Got it. That’s all from my side, sir. Thank you and all the best.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. Participants, please restrict yourselves to two questions. For any more questions, you may rejoin the queue. The next question is from the line of Aditya Mongya from Kotak Securities. Please go-ahead.
Aditya Mongia
I’ll specific all to my questions. Firstly, wanted to get a sense that on a Y-o-Y basis, could you tell us the movement of ESOP expenses booked inside employee cost?
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
So ESOP expenses mostly has been provided. I’ll just see use the exact this thing how much is left out one second and just give me FY ’25 is INR15 crore and FY ’26 is INR25 crores further to be done. That is all left now INR40 crores is total left.
Aditya Mongia
So what I was just trying to get a sense of was on a Y-o-Y basis, how much would have been the savings at an EBITDA level because of lower and how much are the operational kind of elements over here? So your EBIT has grown from INR370 crores to INR440 crores Y-o-Y from the ports operation. So that we have INR70 crore increase. I’m just trying to kind of decipher of this INR70 crores, how much came in because of lower ESOP expenses Y-o-Y?
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Just one second. I will just tell you the exact number, give me a second.
Unidentified Speaker
So Adity, let me come back to you after this call.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
So it will give you the exact number.
Unidentified Speaker
We’ll provide you this number.
Aditya Mongia
Sure. Again, just a clarification as in if I see your presentation and derived numbers for the logistics business, it seems to be a INR120 crore, INR130 crore kind of top-line from logistics and maybe, 11% 12% EBITDA margin kind of number. Are these broadly kind of stable numbers to project at least in the very near-term? Obviously, over-time, you will become a much larger margin company in logistics, but like 11% 12% is it a good starting point from a margin perspective? Okay, how do you think?
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Yeah, this will — we are looking at some improvement in the margin in the next year itself. We have some low-hanging fruits where we can improve the margins. There are some investments are required to increase the revenue the revenue and which will increase the margins also because you know that Morbi facility was just started a year back. So it has not reached to the breakeven utilized in itself. So fixed costs are quite heavy. So once we are able to utilize this capacity a bit more and this Navkar — this faculty in any case because of our requirements. So these are the low-hanging foods we expect next year itself to give a good result.
Aditya Mongia
Sure. Just last question. As in, if you’ve talked about FY ’25, but FY ’26, what could be a reasonable growth guidance to take into account the fact that there will be constraints may continue and a bulk of the inorganic elements are already captured inside FY ’25 being. Could we still think through a high single-digit growth or would it become challenging to go with that please?
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
See, that’s why I’m saying that we should look now revenue and EBITDA number for our growth and the normalized growth without an acquisition, we said it would be similar what we are seeing this year. That is assured. Beyond that may come from the — the cargo numbers may come, if we go for some accretion, but definitely with the improvement in and other things, the revenue and EBITDA profile would be much better than this number. We may come back during the March quarter further refinement on this.
Aditya Mongia
Well, I just probably kind of harp on this aspect. See, the problem at least with me as an analyst is that your organic trends on growth are suggesting a decline happening on a Y-o-Y basis in the past few quarters. And the growth has been driven more by the inorganic components and obviously components will continue to get those opportunities insight and more will come. So I’m just trying to get a sense that for the existing assets that you have, how do you see-through growth panning out? Because the number today appear to be kind of fairly soft on a growth perspective. That’s so where does the utan happen and from where? Just help us kind of build the numbers more precisely incrementally? Thank you.
Rinkesh Roy
Thank you. So if you look at our board profile in two terminals, that is JNPA and. While be commissioned, you know the JNPL, we are looking at the first-quarter of ’25 and later on, the biggest advantage that we are having is these terminals are allowed for interim operations. So a lot of the growth we expect to come even during the interim operations at these two terminals. Similarly, coal terminal, there were certain issues at the coal deals on major low-end order issues. So these have been all sorted-out. So on the coal sector itself, we are quite ugly that we’ll be able to increase our volumes there. Yeah, at least we’re looking at a double-digit growth which earlier our predecessor had also told you. So this would be the growth that we expect to see in ’25, 256.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
So you know that EQ terminal, we have a capacity of 30 million tons. We are still yet to utilize those capacities. We are less than 20 at the moment. So there is a scope there and a lot of no coal requirement. So there were some constraints and they are getting resolved. So there this particular terminal, we expect a good growth. And as we said, and JNPA interim operations have been initiated because the buds are already there. There and we need to parallelly, we will be doing all the investment which are required. So this will further add toward this thing. Cover shade of Goa would be ready by this March-end. So there again, you know, we have — we were earlier concerned by the pollution authorities. And as per their requirement, we have set-up the cover shape. So Goa will give us further additional cargo. So there are opportunities of these terminals, which will give additional cargo, even if we have a flat growth as yes.
Aditya Mongia
Understood. That helps. Thanks for the color. And those are my questions. All the very best to you.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Thanks.
Operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Arpit Shah from Asset. Please go-ahead.
Arpit Shah
Hello. Am I audible?
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Yeah, yeah.
Arpit Shah
Yeah, just wanted to understand, did we have any contribution from the GSW Group in the car business this quarter?
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Yeah, Narun will explain to you from car.
Arun Sharma
JSW has been our customer even before the takeover also. So right now, current 15% revenue comes from JSW Steel. So that is the contribution what we get from JSW Steel. And further it is we are in discussion with JSW Steel to further stop it up.
Arpit Shah
15% or 50%, 15 or 5, zero?
Arun Sharma
15%
Arpit Shah
I just missed the numbers on INR9,000 crore breakup which you did for the logistics business, how much was for the terminals, how much was for the? Let suit that number? Can you just list it down again please.
Operator
Hello, ladies and gentlemen, the management has got disconnected, request you to stay online while I get them connected. Thank you ladies. Ladies and gentlemen, we’ve got the management back.
Arpit Shah
I’ll just repeat my question. You all shared a INR9,000 crores breakup of capex in the logistics business. If you just can down that numbers again.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Yeah, yeah. So basically this includes whatever we have spent for Navta, which is around INR1,000 crores or so. And then we talked about that we’ll be setting up GCT terminals where it will be a low-cost where the land is given by the government. So we only have to pay the lease charges. So that would be another, say, one-third of this total will go there. And the other investment would be into the rigs, containers and other facilities to make the GCT work.
Arpit Shah
That will make that number INR6,000 crores, right?
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
INR9,000, INR9,000 crores. So we said the GCT itself would be around INR3,000 crores. Navgar is already INR1,000 crores, so INR4,000 crore is gone. Rest of the money will go into the containers and other facilities.
Arpit Shah
Got it. And just one last strategic question that I had. So why are we not making Navcar as the logistics arms for the Group? Like why — is it possible to keep the structure very clean instead of doing one-piece here, maybe the logistics piece and and another piece, let’s say the GHW port and logistics business. So is it possible to keep the structure clean where could be leading the logistics business for our group and the GHW Infra could be leading the port division for the group. Just wanted to understand, have any insights on that?
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Sure, sure. We’ll explain to you. So we have already created a platform, which is called JSW logistics — port logistics company below Jesu Intra and has been acquired by JSW Port Logistics company, not by Intra. So we are very clear that we are making a platform for logistics business under JSW port logistics Company because balance sheet is not that big which can take that load of INR8,000 INR9,000 crores. So it’s — we have made in this way that there will be many more companies we may further acquire GC, I mean ICDs or CFS or any other new acquisition under this platform. So all this put together, our idea is to strengthen that platform. But Navgar will continue to get benefit because of the network which we are creating. And as per their balance sheet, what they can take, that will go to.
Arpit Shah
Got it. But are there any fund inclusion plans from the Group to? Because there is a scope to improve the state from, let’s say, 70% to 75%. So there is a chance where you could probably increase stake and make the balance sheet a little healthier than what it is currently.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Yeah, at the moment, we are not contemplating any change in the shareholding structure of Navdar. They will definitely have good cash flows as we said that there will be a the benefit of anchor customers increasing their cargo with and that was the prime region also because their location is like that where the anchor customer will enhance their business. So once their cash flows are increasing and then we can always expand whatever possible within the.
Arpit Shah
Got it. Any guidance for FY ’26, ’27 on the EBITDA front for.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
See, that will come back by once March quarter, we will come back and give the guidance for.
Arpit Shah
But it will be definitely much, much better than what it is right now.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
No, no, that is there because we have already given that the triggers would be group cargo, low-hanging foods wherever lot of — a bit of whatever investment immediately needed will be done. So all this put together will give a good growth in their revenues and EBITDA.
Arpit Shah
And what kind of utilization we have on these assets as of now.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Arun will explain to you.
Arun Sharma
So as far as business is concerned. Yeah, business is concerned at, at this facility, all three facilities put together, we are doing close to around 15,000 odd TEUs, which is if I see take the dwell time of a week, which is going on right now, week to 10 days, we are operating at 80% of — 80%, 85% of utilization with the domestic containers, domestic volume getting in and the volume of domestic content is going up that remaining utilization level of 20% is left out, we are taking care of from the domestic continent. As far as the capacity utilization is concerned, there is a good headroom which is available and we are — you can say we will be — we are operating at around 25% to 30% at Morpi.
Arpit Shah
Got it. Got it. Thank you so much, Mr.
Operator
Thank you. Participants, please restrict yourself to two questions. If you have any more questions, you may rejoin the queue. The next question is from the line of Kunal Shah from DAM Capital. Please go-ahead.
Kunal Shah
Yeah. Hi, good evening, team. Just a couple of things on the logistics spreads. So the INR8,000 crore revenue number for the logistics, right? So — and this is also built upon our assumption to capture the GSW Group domestic freight expense, which I mean, the wallet share, right? So could you just guide how much over-time could this be captive versus third-party over here as well? So I’m just trying to understand that the INR9,000 crore capex, how much is sort of earmarked for your group capex basically just to capture that of wallet share.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
So it’s not earmarked capex-wise. As per their requirements, we said 15 to 20 GCC centers, we may plan over a period of time. So obviously, since we will have a base cargo coming from anchor customers as per their requirement, we’ll be doing it, setting up those facilities and we’ll top it up with the third-party cargo. So as if you as a who see, overall, you can take a number of, say, INR15,000 crores to INR20,000 crores is the inbound and outbound logistic cost. So as we said, even we are able to take a part of that, even if a 25% also we are able to take. So that is a good number which this logistic arm can consider in this INR8,000 crores revenues.
Kunal Shah
Understood. And secondly, you briefly highlighted upon this with respect to the investments in Nakar Corp, but it’s quite strategically located to your Dolvi facility and your end consumers. Now is there a chance that — I mean, just trying to understand what could be the quantum of investment into this particular entity because it’s a separately listed entity. Could you give any sort of flavor over here? And in case if the balance sheet is not supportive for such a big capex, could there be ICDs from JSW Infra?
Rinkesh Roy
So here, let me put things in perspective, here the growth strategy that Navkar we are looking at is getting generating better efficiencies at the existing terminals. That is number-one. Number two is you know, kind of utilizing the space available and the land available to create more capacity and spread. And thirdly is leveraging the group cargo to generate new circuits. So where you can regain on the return flow capture new customers. So this is a part of a bigger strategy that we are looking at. And the investments are primarily in more of movable assets in — which can be leased also. So you may not have a capex of purchasing a rate, you can lease a rate also. So this would be broadly the strategy that we are following. And if you look at what we have done at Navta, earlier, used to have eight nine rates and eight rates and currently we have jumped it up to now 1,100 through leasing. So the capacity of Navkar is being increased through various strategies.
Kunal Shah
Understood. Understood. This is really helpful. Thanks a lot.
Operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Ankit Shah from Elara Capital. Please go-ahead.
Ankita Shah
Yeah. Hi, this is Ankita here. Just one question, sir. On this cost. So what is our total expenditure and if this has at the quarter-end date and this will be done every quarter?
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Exposure, you mean to say Ankita? So this is — we have one bond of $400 million, another $120 million is another loan which you have taken for funding our UAE terminal. So there, in any case, revenue and expenses are in dollar only. So for this $400 million, we have enough dollar income with that. So there is a natural hedge. If you look at our profile that VRC charges are paid-in dollar or 17% to 18% of our total revenue is in a dollar denomination. So we are dollar surplus. So we follow hedge accounting as per IFRS. And based on that, these the part of that will come to OCI and part comes to the P&L. So that is accounting which we follow and this is basically a non-cash entry.
Ankita Shah
Okay. So you do this on this $400 million of cash absolutely.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Absolutely, yes.
Ankita Shah
Okay. Okay. Got it, sir. That’s it from my side. Thank you so much and wish you all very much.
Operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Gundania from Jefferies. Please go-ahead.
Koundinya Nimmagadda
Yeah, hi, sir. Thanks for the opportunity, sir. Only one question, but for asking on the margin part. I mean, you spoke about roughly 25% kind of margin on the logistics side. And on that — and on that basis, if you still need a 50% plus kind of margins, logistics should not be more than maybe 25%, 30%, 20%, 25% of your business, which should warrant about 6 to 8 times rise in your ports revenue growth vis-a-vis about 2 times to 2.5 times rise in the capacity. So can you help me understand this math? How are you confident of you still maintaining this margin profile which at 50% plus?
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Yeah. So as I said that our margin profile is set to increase because all the investment what we are contemplating is towards greenfield port, where the margins are 65% to 70% and capacity has been increased from 174 million to 400 million. So one is your growth of the cargo itself. Second is the margin profile will go to 65% 70% tax in the port business. So this — and if you look at the revenue of port business, it will be much higher of what we send today. So even at INR8,000 crores of, say, say port terminal business, which will give 25% of our EBITDA, our margin profile of combined margin profile will still increase from the current level.
Koundinya Nimmagadda
Sir, let me ask it a different way. I mean, by FY ’30, where do you think you’ll confine your business revenue to as a percentage of total mix?
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Sorry, are you?
Koundinya Nimmagadda
So I was asking at INR8,000 crores revenue from your logistics business, I mean, what would that be as a percentage of total revenue that you’re targeting?
Arun Sharma
See the way we are looking at it is our core business is different, right? So we have given guidance of INR170 million to INR400 million, a little 2.4 times in cargo. So with this also 15% CAGR. If cargo is 15%, obviously the volume because the profile is also changing will be into liquids, we will be into containers. So the profile will also switch and hence the revenue CAGR would be north of 20% to 22%. Logistics is altogether a different doll game where we have given total revenue of INR8,000 crores and then EBITDA margin of 25%. So this has to be seen separately. And then A-plus 3
Koundinya Nimmagadda
Sure, sir. Maybe I will take it offline. Thank you and all the best.
Arun Sharma
Sure, sure, sir.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Okay. Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Nidhi Shah from ICICI Securities. Please go-ahead.
Nidhi Shah
Third-party Kamara, 4 third-party manufactured RA our capacity one.
Operator
MS. Shah, please go-ahead with your question.
Nidhi Shah
My question. Thank you. INR45 million ton please.
Operator
MR., are you there? Please unmute yourself.
Unidentified Speaker
Why don’t you take next question please.
Operator
Sure. The next question is from the line of Ishwar from PMS. Please go-ahead.
Eshwar Arumugam
Sir, thank you for taking my question. Most of my questions I have already been answered, but I do have two more. So from the synergistic benefits you see from the logistics business and the shipping business, how much do you expect the shipping growth to be more than the broader market growth of BSW.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
So you are talking about the port business in JSW Infra?
Eshwar Arumugam
Like we are projecting a 22% growth because of — we are projecting a 22% growth because of change in mix, like you’re getting into liquid and you’re getting into container. How much more growth can you expect because of gain in-market share?
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Market-share, we will always be a ahead of the growth in the poor sector. As we said, poor sector is much lower-growth of — it may be like GDP types of growth, but we will be growing much faster led by our own strength of the anchor customer, which is already growing by, say, 15% CAGR than from the privatization of the major terminals, which will further give us the growth to us because we’ll be very aggressive in securing those terminals as we are the largest concession holders in India and our regular natural growth. So all put together, cargo growth would be there. And secondly, our EBITDA margins are slated to go higher because we are going much, you know into our private schools where the EBITDA margins are much higher, 65%, 70%, then we are going into the liquid where the margins are like 85% type of things, which we are right now our UA terminal is giving that much of margin and then future we are looking at the container also that with Murphy coming in, we’ll go to container side also. Also together will give us a good revenue CAGR growth.
Eshwar Arumugam
So how much — how much would be the margins for the container business?
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
So container business will give the similar type of kind of growth which we are getting at our you know these ports, private portfolio.
Eshwar Arumugam
Okay. And is there any plans to merge into their circuits.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
No, at the moment, we are not contemplating any type of structure so as and when we have anything, we will come back to you.
Eshwar Arumugam
Thank you. And let’s just the promoter holding.
Operator
Sir, Mr Ishwar. If you have any further questions, please rejoin the queue.
Eshwar Arumugam
Sure. Thank you.
Operator
The last question is from the line of Shah from JM Financial Limited. Please go-ahead.
Vaibhav Shah
Yeah, thanks for the opportunity. Sir, what kind of kind of capex plans are we looking for the next three years, FY ’25, ’26 and ’27? And of that, what would be in the port business and what would be in the logistics business?
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
So port business for next three years, we are looking around INR15,000 crores of investment. And for logistics business, INR1,000 crores is already spent and we might invest, say, another INR3,000 crores or so during next three years.
Vaibhav Shah
So you mean 26 to 28 or 25 to 27?
Rinkesh Roy
If you see the figures, we have to spend around — we’re looking at spending around INR8,000 crores in the next five years, including the INR1,000 crores we had planned to pick-up. So broadly in-line with that, it would roughly translate to around crores per annum, but it will vary depending on the various needs and opportunities that come up.
Vaibhav Shah
So INR15,000 crores mentioned for the ports business that is over FY ’25 to ’27 or 26 to ’28.
Rinkesh Roy
So mostly the ports that we are doing here.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
FY ’28 we say by FY ’28, we’ll be spending this between INR100.
Vaibhav Shah
Okay. Okay. Thank you, sir. Those are my questions.
Operator
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, that brings us to the end-of-the question-and-answer session. I would now like to hand the conference over to the management for the closing remarks.
Rinkesh Roy
I wanted to thank you all for your very lively and active participation and we look-forward to regular interactions with you apart from these investor calls and I hope we’ll be, you know, coming out with more — better results in the years to come. Thank you.
Lalit Chandanmal Singhvi
Thank you all.
Operator
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, that brings us to the end-of-the conference on behalf of ICICI Securities Limited, you may now disconnect your lines. Thank you.