Jindal Saw Limited (NSE: JINDALSAW) Q2 2025 Earnings Call dated Oct. 21, 2024
Corporate Participants:
Neeraj Kumar — Group Chief Executive Officer & Whole Time Director
Analysts:
Vikash Singh — Analyst
Ajay Sharma — Analyst
Sunil Kothari — Analyst
Deepak Lalwani — Analyst
Riya Mehta — Analyst
Radha Agarwalla — Analyst
Presentation:
Operator
Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to Jindal Saw Limited Q2 FY ’25 Earnings Conference Call, hosted by Phillip Capital India Private Limited. [Operator Instructions]
I now hand the conference over to Mr. Vikash Singh from Phillip Capital India Private Limited. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Vikash Singh — Analyst
Thank you, Steve. Good morning, everyone, on Jindal Saw 2Q FY ’25 earnings con-call. From the management side, today, we have with us Mr. Neeraj Kumar, Group CEO and Whole Time Director; Mr. Vinay Gupta, President and Head, Treasury; Mr. Narendra Mantri, President, Head, Commercial and CFO; and Mr. Rajeev Goyal, Vice President, Group Corporate Finance and Treasury.
Without taking any much time, I hand over the call to Mr. Neeraj Kumar for his opening remarks. Over to you, sir.
Neeraj Kumar — Group Chief Executive Officer & Whole Time Director
Good morning, investors. Good morning, friends, and other stakeholders who have dialed-in to this conference.
Last week, towards the end, we had our Board meeting. We have announced our September ending results. On a stand-alone, we have INR4,790 crores as a top-line as opposed to INR4,417 crores trailing quarter last year; same second quarter September end was INR4,611 crores. Now, if we look like this, it looks like we have hit our plateau, where more or less between INR4,500 crores and INR4,700 crores of top-line quarter-on-quarter is what is indicating here. But if you compare half-year to half-year, this half year and the last half year, then the growth trend continues. Going forward, we definitely expect that the turnover would be in this range, maybe a little modest growth, but will be in this range.
Now, turning our attention to EBITDA. For this quarter, we have declared INR875 crores as opposed to INR842 crores trailing quarter, INR751 corresponding quarter last year. Half-year basis, INR1,717 crores for this half year; last half year was INR1,364 crores. So, if we compare the quarter-on-quarter results, you will see a marginal dip in the EBITDA percentage, even though there is a modest increase in the top-line. The primary contributor being higher steel prices. The coal price is stable, it is moving in a band. But the steel prices have shown a certain increase. Also, when we look at the mix of the revenue, earlier, we had achieved higher percentage of exports as compared to this quarter. So, the combined impact of this is that, on an aggregate basis, the EBITDA has grown. But in percentage terms, you will see a slight dip. Going forward, we expect this trend to continue. We are hoping that the steel prices will stabilize. And if that happens, then we may see that we may go back to the original close to 19% EBITDA margin.
One thing that seems to be very clear from this result that in the last two years, there is a clear break from the EBITDA percentage, which used to be around 12% to 14%. Now, we are in the range of 18% to 19%. We are likely to continue there for at least a few quarters. Then, depending on the new product that is being developed, the new industry segment that we are trying to enter, we may see a higher percentage margin.
Otherwise, if you look at the other important factors, the financial expenses are well within control. There has been a reduction in debt after the declaration of the 30 September results. We have also repaid a large tranche of the term loan. So, in the next quarter, you would see a further reduction in debt. As I have always been saying, working capital debt is also a function of the turnover. So, we expect the working capital debt to be in the same region. But in term loan, you will definitely see a reduction, because we have paid a large tranche of term loan after September, that’s already paid.
Going further down, PBT, again, INR625 crores for this quarter, INR601 crores for the trailing and INR478 crores for the last. Half-year, the gap is larger, because, as I said, now we appear to be on a very stable high plateau, which we hope to maintain for the next quarter or two. But this has come after many quarters of very healthy growth. PAT is a function of how the tax is behaving, so INR477 crores, INR446 crores and INR351 crores, correspondingly for this quarter, trailing quarter and the corresponding quarter last year. Half-year, we are at INR923 crores. Last year half-year, we were at INR630 crores. So, there is a definite improvement in the financial statement, if you look at the debt side, if you look at the profitability side, except for the factor of increase in steel prices, which has got the EBITDA percentage to sales marginally down.
The other major item of the balance sheet, debt, is well within control. If you look at the debt in correspondence with the level of activity, the level of top-line and others, it shows a further improvement. And this is likely to continue.
Turning our attention to the consolidated, it shows a similar trend and it gives us comfort that even the subsidiaries have now stabilized in their performance. They all are contributing at all levels, right from EBITDA down to PBT level. PAT, there is a marginal difference, because the tax incidence in those countries is a little more. So, till, PBT, the subsidiaries have also contributed. Looking at the current order book, looking at the current market scenario, is likely to continue one caveat, Middle East. If Middle East goes out of control because of Israel-Iran, Israel-Yemen, then we may see some disruption in the transportation through the channels. But we hope that we don’t get to see that situation, but that is out of our control. And if that happens, then we will have to definitely bear the consequences as the entire world would bear.
Looking at the order book, stable position, $1.6 billion. As I have already said, the export as a percentage of total revenue has come down. There are a lot of international transactions which are in the pipeline. International contracts are in the pipeline, and we hope to catch on the export percentage, because the sweet-spot for our export, domestic mix, is above 20%, 25%. And we are happy if it goes up to 35% to 40%. So, that’s a sweet-spot. Currently, we are below that sweet-spot, because, a, the export market, lot of projects have just been completed, new projects are in the pipeline. Domestic, we have seen a lot of growth on the infrastructures in India, leading to a lot of contracts — profitable contracts in the domestic market.
The debt, just to go over the figures, currently, it stands at, long-term debt, INR1,185 crores; working capital, INR2,226 crores, which is total, INR3,411 crores, as compared to INR3,992 crores of the June quarter. This trend is likely to continue. Working capital would be dependent on how the working capital is utilized. One reason that we are seeing a decline in the working capital is also because now the export orders have been finished. So, export orders typically tend to have higher working capital cycle, and therefore, the working capital utilization is typically higher when you compare it with the domestic orders. On the consolidated basis also, the trend continues, but it’s a much sharper trend as opposed to INR4,585 crores for this quarter. Last quarter, it was INR5,475 crores. So, there, you see the gap is higher, primarily because the overall debt scenario is improving, both on the long-term side as well as on the working capital side.
So, to sum up our first segment on the financial results, Jindal Saw, along with its subsidiaries, has reached a stable platform, which is high after our quarters of — few quarters of high growth. We expect it to stay there for the next quarter or two. Then, we definitely see a spurt [Phonetic], because our export basket will improve. Some new products are getting introduced, higher margin products are getting introduced. And definitely, after one or two quarters of stable performance or a modest growth performance, we will definitely see a further growth. That is what our expectation is. That is how we see our performance going forward.
Now, changing our focus to [Phonetic] the other factors which impact our business. The business environment is good, both in the export segment as well as in the domestic segment. Demand is good, stable, because of the continuity of the government among projects are continuing. Even though we are seeing a little plateauing in the Jal Jeevan Mission, the state level projects, which are also being funded by the multilateral agencies, that is on an increase. So, that more or less compensates the water segment, whereas the Jal Jeevan Mission is seeing a little plateauing. The state level projects are seeing an upward trend. Most of the states are now catching up on this water infra focus.
Oil and gas continues to be robust. India’s focus on oil and gas is improving. Now, the East Coast is also catching up. Earlier, it was more in an exploratory stage. Now, they have reached a stage, where they would start getting into the production stage. That has given rise to deep-sea drilling and deep-sea development of wells, which is good news for our higher-grade pipes and tubes, also premium connections. Because typically, the deep-sea drilling, the deep-sea well development needs premium connection, coupled with higher-grade of pipes and tubes. So, oil and gas is good. Pellet, we continue to be stable, we continue to run at a very high capacity. And that trend is continuing.
Industrial sector is showing a robust growth, where now, with our seamless and stainless, we are addressing that, and we are entering new segments. We are also focused on defense, nuclear, atomic and other segments, which typically tend to be of higher margin. Internationally also, we are seeing, in all sectors, industry, oil and gas, and water, the demand is robust and is growing. We may enter the U.S. market with our new products in the seamless and stainless. That would be an area of growth in the export market, which, in tonnage, may appear to be modest, but in margins, it is likely to be high margin business.
Debt, we have already spoken. Rest, more or less, things are all as expected. Capex has been modest as per the trend, normal capex. We are carrying out certain improvements in terms of the coke oven battery is getting renewed. The Haresamudram is getting debottlenecked. And there are a few other — Nashik is in the middle of implementing a project, where its capacity is going to have a significant increase. The capacity might increase by 40% to 50%. Those are areas, where once we debottleneck the Haresamudram, once the new capacity comes up for in Nashik, once the coke oven battery, etc., in Mundra, they all become stable, they all become operational. That would help us in the next phase of growth.
At present, do we have any large fund requirements? The answer is, we haven’t announced any new project as yet. But we definitely have a few things on the drawing board. We are examining those possibilities very closely, because as with the current capacity, with the current performance, we have got a nice platform. Definitely, we would like to build on that. So, few things are on the drawing board, few things are being examined. But once we have zeroed in something, definitely, you will get to hear from me in my subsequent investor call, which happens every quarter.
Looking at all of these, if you see the overall parameters of ROCE, etc., they are showing an improving trend. The EPS has gone up. The ROCE and those parameters are also under a big control. We continue to remain focused on pipe business, an unrelated business, although it’s not a part of Jindal Saw or the — this — Jindal Saw or its subsidiaries, but we have, in the last quarter, monetized our rail business, which is helping us focus our management bandwidth and the group wide resources, because this rail wagon business, which we were incubating for some time, we have monetized it. It was 100% equity deal in one stroke. And that has given the group some resources to redeploy and also has given an opportunity for the management to focus on its core businesses.
So, all in all, we are going along well. We will continue to go well. We have a visibility for the next two quarters, and the good performance will continue. Let me stop here and take some questions. My request to our investors, as have been, if you have some very specific question about one specific element, I would request you, we may not have all the details on the table at present. The right forum for that is, send a mail and that would be properly responded with facts and figures. So, with that caveat, let me request — take some few questions. Thank you.
Questions and Answers:
Operator
Thank you very much. We will now begin the question-and-answer session. [Operator Instructions]
First question is from the line of Ajay Sharma from Maybank. Please go ahead.
Ajay Sharma
Yeah. Hi. Thanks for the detailed update. So, can I check for — can you talk in detail about this Nashik and the coke oven and the debottlenecking as to what will be the impact in terms of capacity and also in terms of cost?
Neeraj Kumar
Okay. Let’s start with the coke oven, which is in Mundra. In Mundra, in Paragpar, we already have coke oven batteries. One of the battery had lived its life, and therefore, we are putting up a new facility, which is now close to getting fully commissioned. It could be a new technology, vertical push based coke oven, which is more environment-friendly, will give us higher generation of electricity and will also improve the coke productivity, which will help us support our blast furnace even in Haresamudram. It is very close to getting commissioned. The total expenditure over the next few years on the coke oven battery has been in the range of INR300 crores to INR350 crores. This will, as I said, be more environment-friendly, new technology, longer life, self sufficiency in coke and higher heat recovery, so higher electricity.
Nashik, as you know, Jindal Saw Nashik plant, which is co-located with the joint venture with Hunting for the premium connection, is focused on seamless pipes and tubes. There, we had, after piercing, two lines. One was for seven inches and below. The other one was going up to 16, upward of seven. But our piercer was one. So, one piercer was feeding both lines. Now, we are making both lines independent. So, we are putting up a new piercer. We are putting up a new rotary furnace. So, now, the line for smaller diameter, seven inches, eight inches and below, pipes and tubes will have its own dedicated rotary hearth furnace piercer. A new rotary hearth furnace and a piercer is being planned for the line which is higher diameter, eight inches and above, going up to 16. We are trying to enhance the diameter also and try and make up to 18 inches Here, the total expenditure would be in the vicinity of INR200 crores spread over to two years, 2.5 years, three years. We expect to commission the project sometime next year.
Once this happens, then the capacity of Nashik plant in terms of pipes and tubes, both line put together, would be in the vicinity of 3.5 lakh to 4.0 lakh tons, depending on the sizes and the product mix thickness, which will be a 40% to 50% jump of the existing capacity. This, I would say, marginal investment would give a significant rise in the capacity, would also help us in the production planning and control, where the feeding of billets down to finishing can be planned much better, and the plant can run continuously for larger number of days in a year. This is being done on the hope and on the business environment, the demand that is coming up, plus the JV is now almost running full capacity. And the JV has the capability of threading all sizes and also above, which is not produced by way of a pipe. There, we have the connector, which goes on to, so the JV can do threading up to 36 inches. So, this entire effort is to increase the capacity, to improve our presence in the premium segment, which is already very strong. We are the pioneers and currently the only one in this kind of a format in India and would definitely yield in higher margin business, plus entry into some good segments.
Haresamudram, similar effort. We are trying to optimize whatever is the possible output from the blast furnace. In blast furnace also, we have made an improvement of putting PCI, which is injecting pulverized coal into the blast furnace, which gives us higher hot metal. And now, additional spinning and finishing capabilities are being produced, are being planned and being put, so that the overall capacity of Haresamudram will also go up. Once everything is stable, all the machines are in place, all the finishing lines are in place, then the capacity of Haresamudram will go up to 3 lakh tons. That will make us among the top DI producing company in the country, with a large capacity in South and even larger capacity in West, which are the primary markets. The total capital expenditure, which is being planned over the maybe next two years to three years would be around in the vicinity of INR200 crores.
But the way all three projects have been timed, that there is no bunching of capex. And therefore, you are seeing that on all these fronts, there is an improvement in capacity efficiency and there is a certain amount of capex that is being spent, but they all are spread in such a manner that we are still able to contain our term loan to around INR1,000 crores. Now, in fact, we have come down to less than INR1,000 crores of term loan, where our net worth is upward of INR6,000 crores, INR7,000 crores.
Ajay Sharma
Okay. So, that’s very detailed. Thanks for that. And just a quick follow-up. So, I mean, I’m seeing, so your focus is more on margin rather than volume growth. Is it because your volume growth has been a bit modest on the — in the last few quarters, pretty flattish actually? So, I’m just wondering, is the focus going to be more on improving EBITDA per ton rather than on volume growth?
Neeraj Kumar
See, overall, the focus definitely is continued to be more on the margins. And that is how we could break away from the 13%, 14% range, where we were there for some time. Now, we are in the 17%, 18% range. The idea is to maintain and even take it higher. But now, with all these that I have just now spoken about, the capacity also is going to go up, and that is — would be necessary for the next phase of growth, top-line growth, which you should start seeing after maybe one or two quarters.
Ajay Sharma
Okay. Excellent. Thank you very much.
Operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Sunil Kothari from Unique PMS. Please go ahead.
Sunil Kothari
Thanks, sir, for opportunity, and really very well explained on so many things. Just very broad understanding from you, what I want to understand is, sir, what has changed from this margin trajectory of, say, 12%, 14% to now 16%, 18% range? And on what basis, it gives you confidence to maintain this, will be really helpful.
Neeraj Kumar
Okay. Why we could break away from the 13%, 14%, and now, we are in the 18%, 19% and we feel confident that we’ll stay there? A, better capacity utilization. Just go back one quarter, we were very happy with an order book of around $1 billion. Now, we need $1.6 billion. Also, if you see quarter-on-quarter, now we are around $1.6 billion, and we remain around $1.6 billion. So, the run rate has gone up, so better capacity utilization.
B, higher capacity utilization means lower cost of production, better allocation of the overheads, better allocation of all the fixed costs. C, higher demand means now the demand-supply situation is also kind of balancing, so it’s not a bloodbath in the competition — in a competitive market. D, there is a conscious effort to move more towards high value-add products, higher grades. And all this is possible, because the business environment is conducive. It is allowing us to do all this that I have spoken about. The net result is moving into 18%, 19%, and hoping to go even further.
Sunil Kothari
Great, sir. And sir, the second point is, you’ve spoken about so many efforts to reduce costs, improve value-added products and new products, new market segment where we are entering. Do you have any number in mind over, say, next three years from current, say, some percentage to what range you want to reach? Any indicative figure will be helpful.
Neeraj Kumar
See, we would be very happy if we are able to achieve a 15%, 20% of our revenue from value-added products, but that’s a little far away. All efforts are being put in that direction, because in the pipe and tube segment, where we are the established market leader, market acceptance takes some time. You have to go through a lot of tests, a lot of trials, vendor approval, accreditations, API has to see it, ISO has to see it. So, you are being watched from every side. Only then, the market is going to accept you, and only then, you’ll start earning. So, we definitely are focused on all these, but it will take us a few years, maybe a year, 1.5 years, where we get all the vendor qualifications that we are hopeful of.
I’ve already hinted to you, we are wanting to enter a new segment in U.S. with a new product. Currently, we are in the process of getting ourselves qualified by those vendors. So, it takes time. But once you are there, then you have to just continue to perform, service your client well, deliver the right quality on time and then you can have a stable performance.
Sunil Kothari
Correct. Great, sir. Thanks a lot, and lots of good wishes.
Neeraj Kumar
Thank you.
Operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Deepak Lalwani from Unifi Capital. Please go ahead.
Deepak Lalwani
Hello, sir. Thank you for the opportunity. So, my question was on the order book and your commentary on the top-line that you made. See, basically, our order book is down sequentially, not by a big margin, by a — but slightly. So, can you just indicate where is — what is the reason for this, whether it is domestic market or whether it is export? If you can pin down where exactly the order inflows are lower today and your outlook for this going forward? Yeah.
Neeraj Kumar
Okay. If you look at now the order book, the order book in terms of quantity is actually high. The order book, at present, we are at 17.38 lakh tons as opposed to the overall order book of 16.17 lakh tons. If you look at the large dia [Phonetic], there, there is a slight dip overall in terms of value. June quarter, we had an order book of $1.64 billion. Now, we are at $1.61 billion.
The major shift that, if you see, we had a export basket of 32%, which in this quarter has come down to 12%. This is largely due to some of the big large export orders have been completed, have been fully executed, and some new export orders are in the pipeline. We hope to improve the export basket from our current 12% position back to the 20%, 25% and higher range. That is a broad break-up of order book. Let me assure you, it shows slight lower number in terms of value, but in terms of tonnage, in terms of range and in terms of our current pipeline, this is not a matter of concern for us. We will catch up very soon.
Deepak Lalwani
Right. Understood, sir. And this export opportunity that you’re talking about, your 12% share going to 25%, can you pin down which countries are you focusing on and which segment, whether it is water or oil and gas?
Neeraj Kumar
Largely, it is water. And the countries that we focus on are centered around Middle East. We are making a lot of efforts to break into Africa, but we haven’t achieved great success there. Egypt is one country where we have entered with a relatively large order, and we are trying to build in North America. So, basically, in the export market, our focus area is going to be MENA, which is Middle East, North Africa, because we have a freight advantage, we have a time advantage. From our Mundra plant, both the entire MENA region takes six days to seven days of sailing. The only caveat, the concern, is the geopolitical situation in the Middle East.
Deepak Lalwani
Understood. Got it. And sir, your — you had a comment on the domestic business, where the Jal Jeevan was sort of plateauing and the states doing well. So, how should we — how should one read this comment, whether is it — is it going to be stable and then pick-up as the central government funds in more projects? Or is it — are we at a very turbulent stage today, if you can give some idea.
Neeraj Kumar
No, I won’t say it’s a turbulent stage. As far as the stakeholders are concerned, again, since we always give you all the insights, this is an insight we have given you, but this should not be a matter of concern, because what is the plateauing of Jal Jeevan Mission is more than compensated by many states joining the bandwagon of their own irrigation, their own water grid. And the good part is many of these states have also been able to achieve multilateral funding. So, the overall scenario is stable to grow. This is an internal adjustment that is happening.
Now, it will be difficult for us to comment on the Government of India and state relationship. The plateauing of the Jal Jeevan Mission we are seeing, because Jal Jeevan Mission was supposed to be jointly funded by states and the center. In many states, we are seeing that they are falling a bit behind in providing their contribution. Probably, they are conserving their resources and focusing on the state level development or state level initiatives in a similar segment. That appears to be the macroeconomic scenario on Jal Jeevan. But is this a matter of concern? I don’t think so, because Jal Jeevan Mission continues to be a major initiative of Central Government, and they will continue to find ways and get the state around to contribute their funding as well. So, to conclude in one line, no matter of concern, demand to stay stable, a mix of Jal Jeevan or center related projects and the state related projects continue to grow together.
Deepak Lalwani
Understood. Okay. That was a great commentary. Sir, on the profitability side, if I look at all the DI pipe players in the entire market, right, so all the players have benefited from the lower raw material prices, and hence, they are able to make higher profit per — on a ton basis. So, should — and going forward, now, when we book the new orders, should we assume that this benefit of the lower prices have been passed on to the customer, and hence, a normalization of profit should happen? And if you can just give an outlook of how should this pan out, say, situation pan out?
Neeraj Kumar
At this point of time, the way we are positioned on ductile and pipes and our order book, all the prices have been locked in for close to a year. And definitely, if the prices are softening, subsequent orders would reflect, because now, many players have expanded their capacity. Also, there are new entrants in the DI market. So, the market trend, the demand-supply and the price trend, to some extent, getting correlated to the raw material would definitely happen. But for us, we are fully booked for the next few quarters, and that would not impact our profitability in the next few quarters, because we always do long-term planning. Once we have the order, we try and line-up the shipment for the coal, the iron ore, also we try and have a long-term purchase agreement, so that we achieve a natural hedge.
Deepak Lalwani
Understood. And sir, in your initial commentary, you were…
Operator
Sorry to interrupt, Mr. Deepak. Could you please fall back in the question queue for further questions?
Deepak Lalwani
Sure. Thanks.
Operator
Thank you. [Operator Instructions]
The next question is from the line of Riya Mehta from Aequitas Investment. Please go ahead.
Riya Mehta
Hello. Thank you for giving me the opportunity. Sir, my first question is in terms of, we’re doing amazing on [Phonetic] Hunting; and even our order book has grown by 20% on even a lower base. But what are our plans here? And are we going to be majorly job work business? Or how is it going to pan-out? So, could you elaborate more on the opportunity of Hunting? And what kind of orders are we seeing?
Neeraj Kumar
Madam, hold. Madam, you will have to repeat your question, maybe be a little slower and louder, because I could not get the whole question.
Riya Mehta
Sure, sir. Sir, I was just saying in terms of Hunting, our JV with Hunting, we are doing good there, and we are seeing order book increase almost by 20%. So, I was wondering what all initiatives are we taking there? And we’re — your commentary mentioned that it’s majorly job work business. So, are we doing this for other people or are we doing for Jindal Saw? And what kind of capacity additions are we seeing over there?
Neeraj Kumar
Okay. Hunting, this is the first full year of operation. And when I say Hunting, I mean the JV. For JV, this is a full year — a first full year of operation, and we are very happy to note as a shareholder that they have turned profitable right till bottom-line. So, the JV is doing well. They are almost operating at capacity.
Now, this business structure of job work versus working for own, going forward, you would see a slight shift, because first few months of the year, the JV was yet to get the API license after they got a license for premium threading. And that’s why Jindal Saw used to win the contract and then get Hunting to do it on a job work basis. Now, Hunting fully functional with all necessary accreditations, slowly, you will see that Hunting will also make its presence felt in the market, where Jindal Saw would be the supplier of pipes and coupling blanks to the JV, who would credit and will be responsible for selling it. So, that’s how it’s likely to move.
Now, since Hunting is already operating at very high capacity, also they are earning cash, they are building network, we are in discussion with our partners, Hunting, to see if there is scope and if both of us align to increase the capacity of premium connections, because, as I said, because of the higher drilling activity in East Coast, with more wells reaching a development stage, the demand for premium connections are likely to go up. But expanding the JV would be a joint decision taken by Jindal Saw and Hunting Singapore. As Jindal Saw is concerned, we will support this initiative, but it will have to be discussed in much greater detail. Hunting will have to take all its internal approvals, and then only it will come into being, then only it will come and get actualized. So, it’s on the drawing board, discussions are on. And once we have arrived at a decision, we will definitely get let you know.
Operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Radha from B&K Securities. Please go ahead.
Radha Agarwalla
Hello, am I audible?
Neeraj Kumar
Yeah.
Radha Agarwalla
Yes, sir. Sir, thank you for the opportunity and congratulations on good results. My question was you spoke about entering the U.S. market in seamless and stainless steel segment. So, currently, are we selling these products entirely in India or we also have exports in this? And also, could you talk a bit about the anti-dumping scenario in U.S. and our competitive edge, especially when compared to China in that market?
Neeraj Kumar
We have export order book even in those segments at this point of time, although it is much lesser and we would definitely want to improve. Now, the kind of segments that we want to enter U.S., it will be a higher grade, higher application. And there, since it is not a commodity product, we expect that we will not get caught into this anti-dumping, because so far, whatever is the export market is more on a normal grades, normal categories, normal applications. So, once we break into the U.S. market the way we are planning, then the anti-dumping will not impact us.
Operator
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, due to time constraints, that was the last question for today’s conference call. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Vikash Singh from Phillip Capital India Private Limited for their closing comments.
Vikash Singh
Thank you, Steve.
Neeraj Kumar
Thank you, investors, very much. Yeah, thank you, investors very much, and [Technical Issues] results. Hope to see you next quarter.
Operator
[Operator Closing Remarks]