Huhtamaki India Ltd (NSE: HUHTAMAKI) Q3 2026 Earnings Call dated Feb. 13, 2026
Corporate Participants:
Kamal Taneja — Managing Director
Analysts:
Mohit Mishra — Analyst
. Ritesh Poladia — Analyst
Rajakumar Vaidyanathan — Analyst
Vipul Shah — Analyst
Sunil Jain — Analyst
Vikram Kotak — Analyst
Mehul — Analyst
Zaki Abbas — Analyst
Sheetal Shah — Analyst
Presentation:
operator
Foreign. Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to Hutamaki India Limited Q4 CY25 earnings conference call hosted by ICICI Securities Limited. As a reminder, all participants line will be in the listen only mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during this conference call, please signal an operator by pressing Star then zero on your touchstone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Mohit Mishra from ICICI Securities. Thank you and over to you sir.
Mohit Mishra — Analyst
Good afternoon everyone. Thank you for joining on Bhutamaki India. Limited Q4 CY25 results conference call. We have Bhutamaki India Management on call. Represented by Mr. Kamal Taneja, Managing Director. I would now like to invite Kamal sir to initiate with opening remarks post which we will have a Q and A session. Thank you and over to you sir.
Kamal Taneja — Managing Director
Thank you Mohit and thank you Iqra. I hope everyone can hear me. First of all, good afternoon everyone. Since this is also our first call for the year, let me start by wishing everyone on the call a happy and prosperous New Year. I hope this year brings you good health, happiness and success to you as well as your loved ones.
As Moin said, I think before we get into financials I also wanted to take some time to introduce myself. I joined this company on 15th of January, so very fast completing one month in the role. My background is that I’m an engineer. I have a dual degree from Bitspilani. I’m also an MBA from Wharton USA and a Six Sigma Black belt. In the past three decades that I’ve been working, I’ve been fortunate to have served in many senior positions across the global packaging and industrial companies. For example Johnson Controls, Ingersoll, Rand, Emcor, Accentra and most recently Lemonix Australia.
When I say the 15th of January was my first day at work, it’s not entirely true because I also spent good amount of last six working with Huttamaki India as an external consultant where my focus has been to improve profitability through operational efficiency and cost structure reduction. I’m also very fortunate to have contributed to strong performance in many global and regional businesses. I worked in uk, Australia, India and Singapore. I look forward to bringing this international perspective to our company and to working with all of you as we embark on our next phase of growth.
Kamal Taneja — Managing Director
As is the customary on these calls, I will walk you through the company’s financial performance for the quarter that just ended and also year two 2025 along with some insights into how we fared over the last 12 months and after I finish I’ll be happy to take calls from all of you. So I’m going to begin with describing to you our operational and financial highlights for the quarter four as well as the full year 2025. As you would have seen from the announcements that we recently posted, our volumes were largely steady or flat compared to previous quarter, but they decreased slightly year on year.
This is also reflected in our twelve months ended December 2025 with volumes lower than the same period in 2024. Net sales in quarter four were at rupees six billion which were more or less flat versus previous quarter and year on year. For the full year December 2025 our net sales were at 23.9 billion which actually represent around 2.5% decline from 24.5 billion we did in the same period last year. However, as you would have noticed our profit before tax or PBT for the quarter was significantly higher. So we had 410 million profit in Q4 versus 152 million that we did in the previous year.
In the same quarter compared to quarter three we were down by 16% but then quarter three for us was very exceptional quarter as well. For the year ended 2025 PBT before the exceptional items reached 1.57 billion which reflects a strong 83% growth over 860 million we did in the corresponding period of 2024. So if I can summarize all this for 2025 in terms of financial performance, our overall volumes were lower compared to last year. However we had significant profit increase and that is due to our strategic decisions where we focused on where we played. We optimized our product and customer mix and we showed strong results.
Kamal Taneja — Managing Director
Also because of steady improvement we did in the operational efficiencies and cost structure. We are focusing on building high quality business and refining our product and customer portfolio to support profitable growth. On the manufacturing front, our long term strategy to implement world class operations are paying off. We are seeing real improvements across our sites with better efficiency, reduced waste and tighter control of overheads. We have also benefited from global expertise of Putama Keys plants helping us to enhance our process further. The results speak for themselves and this process is thanks to dedication also due to our excellent team that work with us day in and day out.
On the regulatory front, you would have seen notification on Labor Code which came out on 21st of November last year which is actually a very important development. I’m actually pleased to tell you that we actually took some proactive actions in recent past particularly in relation to employee liabilities, so we expect not a very significant impact to our business moving forward. Moving to other financial aspects, financial costs remain stable through 2025 which are consistent with underlying debt levels. There is a provision made to interest towards indirect tax matters, but we are pretty happy to say that they are in line with what we expected.
Surplus cash was deployed into bank deposit and mutual funds generating an average yield which exceeded 6% during the year, while the net profit for the quarter after exceptional income and tax to that 303 million rupees compared to 117 million in quarter 4, 2024 and 360 million in quarter 3, 2025 EPS for the quarter was at 4 rupees and 2 paisa. For the year ended 2025 our net profit after exceptional income and tax was 1.182 billion or 1182 million which was up from 880 million in the same period, which I also made a remark earlier that we had a pretty significant increase in profit for the year.
It is also important to note that 2024 figures included exceptional income from the sale of two land parcels in Thane which itself amounted to 237 million rupees. So our increase was even more significant if you took those exceptional items away. Regarding the debt and liquidity position, the ratio remains stable with the external commercial borrowings or ECB of 1 billion rupees being the only debt we have on the books. Liquidity continues to be strong and we are also supported by substantial unutilized credit lines and minimal exposure. The working capital position remains strong and actually shows improvement over prior year.
Kamal Taneja — Managing Director
Regarding the sustainability, we made some significant progress there as well. So not just on profit but also on sustainability. Starting with safety, you would have seen we made significant reduction in our recordable incidents and lost time injuries, both approximately 50% decrease over prior year. In fact we had close to five months throughout our operation where we had zero accident or accident free months which was actually in itself a major milestone in our workplace safety commitment. We will continue to work more on that and our aim is to have zero accidents in all our sites. On the climate front, our targets for scope one and two were verified by science based Targets Initiative aligned with our 1.5 degrees C goal and our scope 3 target remains well below 2 degrees C target.
We have a renewal electricity project undergoing at the moment which is progressing steadily and we hope that we have the energy generation from this project in the second quarter of this year. We are putting much more effort into our water management efforts sites including Kapoli Rudrapur and Silvassa have achieved zero liquid discharge which itself is very significant. Again eliminating liquid waste which we are doing through on site treatment and reuse. Again underlying our Covid bed to sustainable water practices. Finally, our work on product sustainability continues. In quarter four last year we reduced solvent consumption across all our sites which made improvement on our worker environment safety while also reducing the emissions.
Again demonstrating our dedication to both people and the environment. Before I close, I want to sincerely thank all our stakeholders on this call and in general for the trust and support you have shown to Utamaki and its leadership over the years. I’m honored to take on responsibility of leading Utamaki India into its next phase of growth and I’m committed to building on strong foundation which is already in place, which is demonstrated in our results for the prior year. Thank you very much.
Questions and Answers:
operator
Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press Star and one on their touchstone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and 2. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question and you are also requested to limit your questions to two per participants. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. Participants who wish to ask a question may press Star and one at this time. To ask a question, please press Star and one now.
Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press Star and one on their touchstone telephone. The first question is from the line of Ritesh Poladia from Giri Capital. Please go ahead.
. Ritesh Poladia
Yeah, hi. Thanks for the opportunity. So I just wanted to know about what sort of capacity utilization we are working on. And I believe since few years there. Is no volume growth. So if you can give some idea how it would be for next two, three years.
Kamal Taneja
Thank you Ritesh for the question. I think. I think why you’re asking capacity utilization question is to ascertain whether we have capacity for growth. Yeah. So I think I can tell you definitely a couple of things that we have done recently when I talked about operational efficiency. Obviously when you are more efficient you make more room for growth. So that plus inherent capacity we have in the system means that we have enough room to grow. As you know, we also did optimization exercise a couple of years ago and we are pretty certain that for next few years we’ll be okay in terms of capacity utilization.
Yeah. Reason for my asking about the capacity utilization is though there is an improvement on P and L side. But if I see on balance sheet your Return ratios remain quite inferior.
. Ritesh Poladia
It’s still in single digit. So what are your thoughts about it. And where do we see that going forward?
Kamal Taneja
Yeah, I won’t say our return are inferior. I think if you compare what I’ve seen in the market and my experience from other places that I worked, I think the return is pretty okay. And in fact if I compare with some of our competitors in the industry, they’re pretty good. Having said that, we can always improve and that would be our definitely focus as we move forward. Forward.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Raja Kumar Vaidyanathan from RK Investments. Please go ahead.
Rajakumar Vaidyanathan
Yeah, good evening, can you hear me?
Kamal Taneja
Yes, I can. Yes.
Rajakumar Vaidyanathan
Yeah, thanks for the opportunity sir. Sorry about the background noise. Please bear with me sir. Just a few questions. So the first one is I just want to know how sustainable are your margins? And that is my first question. And second thing, when do you think your top line growth will start playing out? And third one is on the US India trade deal. So any upsides for Uttamachi? These are the three questions.
Kamal Taneja
Okay, so firstly Rajamhan, I thought you were allowed only two questions. But I’ll answer your three questions. So how many. What was the how. How our margins will play out in the future, right?
. Ritesh Poladia
Yeah, that’s correct. And you talked about top line growth. Right. And the third one was. Third one was on the US India trade deal, how much upside?
Kamal Taneja
Yeah. Okay. Okay, great. Okay, so how sustainable are margins moving forward? So I think what I can say is because I personally worked on this last year, we made changes to the way we work both in the factories and in our go to customer strategies which are not one time these are sustainable. And the idea goes that any changes we do are going to be worth it in the future. Now one thing we do not know is there are a lot of things that happen which are not under our control. For example political taxation you mentioned and volume in the market, etc.
So that varies and that actually affects the way you do your business as well. So all I can say is from our side we feel the changes we have made operationally and in terms of going to market are quite sustainable. And we’ll see how we go. And I’ll be happy to report that again in our next call on the top line growth. Again my answer would be similar because there are so many things that we are dependent on. For example market growth, where which segments grow and which don’t, how our competitors move, etc, etc and also regulation sometimes because there are restrictions or Otherwise on where and how we can play.
So that’s something we’re going to watch out for. But I can tell you number one priority that we have in our business, not just in Hotamaki India, but also Hotamaki globally, is to drive profitable growth in future. Your third question on US India trade, a tax deal that you mentioned, I don’t know, fortunately or unfortunately, our, our pie of that, you know, our total impact is only 1% of our sales. So if we say our 2400 crore, our top line, only 1% of that business is through us. We hope we can increase it with this trade deal, but we’ll see how it goes.
But I think for us it’s a very small impact, if I can say that.
. Ritesh Poladia
Okay, thank you so much. Just on this margin part, there are no one offs in this quarter, right, That I mean we can expect these margins to sustain go forward?
Kamal Taneja
No, not at all. We had a significant one off last year as I mentioned earlier, but not this year.
Rajakumar Vaidyanathan
Okay, thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Vipul Shah from Ripple Wave Equity. Please go ahead.
Vipul Shah
Thank you for this opportunity and you know. Hi Kamal, first call. So very nice talking on the platform to you. Thank you.
Kamal Taneja
First question is, I believe, just wanted a confirmation, you know, per the annual report of 2024, the 100 crore CCB from the parent was supposed to be repaid by 7th of February this year. So I suppose that transaction would have gone through which would significantly, you know, decrease the balance sheet.
Vipul Shah
Yeah. So while this is before my time. Can you hear me okay people?
Kamal Taneja
Yeah, I can hear you loud and clear.
Kamal Taneja
Okay, so we had ECB of so hundred crores, like you say, 1000 million in quarter three last year. The balance of that is actually scheduled to be paid in 2027, June 2027. Because that’s in line with the regulation I believe. Right, so that’s what we are following at the moment.
Vipul Shah
So hopefully no, I thought the annual report mentioned it was scheduled to be repaid in February of 2026.
Kamal Taneja
There’s some confusion probably Q3, 2024 is when it was supposed to be.
Vipul Shah
The annual report mentions that. So I’m just picking up from the annual report.
Kamal Taneja
Okay, Vipul, why don’t I check that and maybe you can contact our investor relations. You know, at the end of the day it’s pretty insignificant. You know, it’s not, it’s not really material in terms of the business size of business we have here.
Vipul Shah
Fair enough, fair enough. Second question, you know, on a net Cash basis, you know, we have now significant cash lying with the company and obviously it continues to be accretive, you know, as the years and the quarters go by. Utamaki India, you know, has been historically been an acquisitive company in terms of M and A is concerned. Just was curious to understand your thoughts, you know, on, on this piece.
Kamal Taneja
Yeah, yeah. I mean, well, firstly, thank you for noticing that. I mean it’s, it’s, it’s much better to be cash rich than otherwise, isn’t it? So I think we would assess that. I mean I’ve been only on the job for two minutes, I mean one month or so, so I haven’t assessed that. We will take a view on that as we go. At this moment our focus is organic and that’s what we are focusing on. If some opportunities come, we’ll never say no. But at the moment that’s not our focus. Now that also means what we do with this cash moving forward.
Right. We will assess as we go through the year. We are also assessing things like what kind of investments we need to do on our operations at the moment, although I don’t see any significant capex for this year. But we’ll see. And if the opportunity comes we’ll do either organic or inorganic investment. But there are no, I think it’s too early for us to commit on anything.
Vipul Shah
Fair enough. One last piece. You know, although you just mentioned, and I appreciate the fact that you are just new into the job but last year, you know, on one of the calls, you know, I had made the specific reference and also in the agm I had put that before the independent director as well. If you compare the flexible packaging margins which your parent reports vis a vis, you know, what we report here, you know, because in India it’s, the listed company is only flexible packaging. Our margins are pretty, pretty lower than what the parent reports.
And probably one of the reasons for that was the high, very high, I would say information technology cost which, you know, which we, which we pay to the parent, you know. Yes, quite a dichotomy. India being a very high software services nation, we still have to bear, you know, such high information technology costs which, you know, which are as huge as our EBITDA sometimes, you know, in a particular quarter. So we appreciate, you know, you putting your, you know, hands on that as well and probably negotiate with the parents because ultimately, you know, time and again this will come up for the minority shareholders as well.
And we’ve been a shareholder for long, you know, in Hutamaki and we really like the company. We really excited by the space which it is in and the growth potential where you guys fit in. It’s just that, you know, the sheer number of amount of this which is to the parent and which hits our PNL obviously is, is impactful. So would appreciate if you can also, you know, probably next time around, you know, have some thoughts on that.
Vipul Shah
Sure. Actually, actually maybe I will elaborate on that as well because I, ever since I’ve joined I’m getting these questions as well. So I’ll. I’ll tell you a bit about my experience but also tell you a bit about the differences I see. Flexible market in India versus overseas. One thing I can tell you, the India market just for SMCG or packaging industry is so much more competitive compared to anywhere else in the world. I mean, you know what kind of products you see in the market from our customers, the price points they have, etc. So obviously when they are catering to those kind of consumers, there’s also pressure on us to kind of be very, very competitive.
So I think if you’re comparing margins India versus overseas, there’s a significant difference in what they do. Now obviously our company does more than flexible overseas. So, so I think it’s hard to compare product by product and because of geography, how that moves. Your second question on the charge from group etc. I think that’s what you are referring to. Yes, I think so. I’ll tell you by my experience in my previous company when I was in uk we actually looked at divesting part of our business business and we had a lot of these centralized costs which were actually given to different divisions after the divestment.
There was a huge issue when the independent company actually started running their own business independently because they realized that the cost structure, etc. They expected through divestment was much more than they expected. So I think a lot of times we actually underplay how much important these charges and these help support that we have. You know, in our company. You know, I talked about operational efficiency, improvement, IT systems that we change and just the innovation part that is so useful for us. And again, I’m not saying that there’s nothing we can do about that, but that is something very important to us and I really value that.
Kamal Taneja
Yeah, I mean I appreciate, you know, your comments on that. But you know, the fact is that if you, if you circle back on calendar year 2024, we paid 80 crores, you know, for the 2,000 crore, 2,400 crore company. There are so many multinational companies which Listed companies which are, which are there frankly haven’t seen this kind of number, Visa, which is in consonance with the margins which the company makes. So the point was that it seems a little too high and if someone, if your team can sort of look at that and probably renegotiate with the parent, you know, the kind it says it support, you know, one of the reasons why we are paying so high would really appreciate that the number itself is so huge.
I mean annual report for 25 hasn’t come through so can’t really comment on that. But for 24, you know, and the point which we made to the chair as well, I don’t know you know, what’s come out of that, but just thought let’s put that across to you as well. Yeah, thanks Kamal, appreciate your, appreciate your thoughts.
Vipul Shah
Noted. Yeah, thank you. Just I think, Sorry, previous question about the ECB payment. Right. So I’ve just got the note here which is in our annual report which says the first tranche was due for replacement or repayment in December 2025. However this was prepaid in September already and, and that’s where the confusion is coming from. So second one is due for June 27th. So that is where the difference is. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Sunil Jain from Nirmal Bank Securities. Please go ahead.
Sunil Jain
Yeah, thanks for this opportunity. So my question relate to, since you are new to the company but you were with the company for some time so you must have some strategy, planning for the growth and all. We are seeing this company or Turnover struggling around 2500 since last seven, eight years and definitely we are losing lot of market shares to the other player. So is there any goal plan or strategy where you want to at least grow with the market or outperform the market?
Kamal Taneja
Yeah. Thank you Suneev, very good question. Now I can’t comment on previous years but I know for 2025 we had a very clear strategy on where to go or where to play. Right. Which meant that there were some businesses that we were doing which were not profitable or low profitability or segments where we thought we were not well positioned. So we cautiously took a decision not to play with them. And probably that is one of the reflections which is in our top line, right. What I can say moving forward we have a very clear strategy, business strategy and the three priorities that we are looking for.
Number one is profitable growth. Number two is capital discipline. So it is good to grow but we out also have to make sure that we are disciplined in how and where we spend the money. And very third thing which I have been working on in the last few months that I’ve been associated with the company is on the accountability, which is how do we take the ownership of what we do, etc. So we hope with this thing now, you know, this is what we can do on our side, you know, how it impacts our top line, et cetera, we will see how it goes, but we can only control these three things and that’s what we are focused on.
Sunil Jain
Yeah, thanks for that. And second question, relate to your One of the product you introduced was Blue Loop. How is that performing and how you see the future for that and also any other new product which can be introduced from the basket of the parent to. So the growth can be accelerated.
Kamal Taneja
Yes, very good question again, Sunil. So Blue Loop. Yeah, we’ve been talking about this for a very long time. Well, personally I can tell you, and not personally, I think as a company we have very good faith, very strong faith in this product because it’s actually kind of a game changer in the industry because it’s sustainable, it’s recyclable, you know, it’s good for the environment, good for the our customers as well. Unfortunately, what’s happened over the last couple of years is that the expectation we had in terms of growth has not come through. You know, it is either a reflection of maybe a bit of slow adaptation, adaptation from our customers and also maybe, you know, regulations which have not been very strict and our customers have been kind of, you know, delaying those goalposts that they have over the years.
Having said that, you know, we have been holding steady on the asset utilization. At the moment we are still looking at 25, 30% which is not bad. But we are also in consultation with a lot of our customers which are going through trial phase prototyping, etc. Etc. As you know, these things take a while because it’s a core marketing function of our customers that they’re looking at and we are hopeful, if not soon in the long run, we’ll be very successful. Successful in this. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So actually, I mean again, you know, even the previous Kobe pool asked about the charge we pay for the group.
Actually there are so many products we transfer from overseas every year and there’s a lot of infrastructure, knowledge, resources required to do that. We maintain doing that. We keep on doing that every year. And again, although I can’t tell you specific before we launch them, but there’s always a pipeline of products that we are introducing Every year, especially support from overseas.
Sunil Jain
Great, sir, thank you very much and all the best.
Kamal Taneja
Thank you.
operator
Thank you. Next we have a follow up question from Raja Kumar Vaidyanathan from RK Investment. Please go ahead. You can go ahead.
Rajakumar Vaidyanathan
Yeah, yeah, thanks for the follow up. Just two more questions. So the first one is, Mr. Kamal, I want to know what are the current tailwinds and headwinds that you are facing and what would be your priorities of the 2026 to kind of address or make use of the tangents?
Kamal Taneja
Yeah, I’m just noting down your questions so I don’t forget them. Okay. I think tailwinds and headwinds. I think maybe I can say a bit about tailwinds first. I guess if you look at the market potential we have in India. Right. As you know now India is fourth largest economy in the world. There’s organic growth which is kind of in the business, in the market. So good thing for us is that there’s a big business to be aware. I guess the headwinds are always around regulations or political environment either taxation, government policies, labor codes, you know, all that kind of stuff which are not under control.
You know, I think there are also things like, you know, changing packaging requirements by customers. You know, one example, I gave the question on Blue Loop as well. Although we want to do a lot more work on Blue Loop, but we can only do as much as our customers pull from us and as much as we can educate them on the value of driving that. So I think those would be a couple of big items on my mind. Your second question on priorities, I think I’ve said that a couple of times already. There are only three priorities.
We want to keep it simple. Profitable growth, capital, discipline and accountability. And we’ll be driving that through 26 as well as in future, in near future. Okay.
Rajakumar Vaidyanathan
So if I can ask one more question. So these are recent senior level changes. I see the CEO, CFO and the sales head all have kind of left the organization in almost around the same time. So just want to know any specific reason why such a big exits are happening.
Kamal Taneja
Yeah, I don’t think there’s like a systematic approach on changing CEO, CFO, etc. Etc. I think these are. One thing I know is if that didn’t change, I won’t be here on the call today. So that’s a good thing. So I’m not complaining about that. I think one thing I know is no person is bigger than the company, right? So you know, we have a very strong base, very strong principles, operations in the company. I do not think it makes huge difference on how we perform in the market. And you know, those principles guide us.
Those visions, those missions that we have in the company, they guide us as we go go forward, but they will remain. And frankly for us, we do not know. And we don’t want to dwell on what happened in the past, but what we are focused on is how we do in the future. Again, what we say profitable growth capital, discipline and accountability is what we’re going to drive going forward. Okay, thank you sir.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Vikram Kotak from Crest Capital Investments llp. Please go ahead.
Vikram Kotak
Thank you so much for taking my question. Is I’m audible?
Kamal Taneja
Yes, absolutely.
Vikram Kotak
Thank you. Thank you. Kamala, question for you and all the best for your new stint. One question which I have on the consumer side company, the commentary which we are heading this quarter is that little bit of bit on the volume growth post GST and the and they’re saying that there’s going to be change in terms of demand side outlook and also looking to increase the headspace. That’s what we are seeing. The consumer company commentary recently. Do you see that? Is that kind of momentum you can also see because you cater to so many FMCG companies, so you see that kind of momentum you are visualizing last one hour and a half months?
Kamal Taneja
Yeah, absolutely. I mean firstly, I mean those reports are all over the place. So we definitely know how our customers are doing, especially the large and the regional customers. What you would also see Vikram, in that is that some of these larger FMCG players are actually growing a little bit lower than what we see from the regional customers. So smaller brands, they are probably doing much better in terms of growth than the larger brands. Right now our positioning in different customer segments are slightly different. Right. So we are looking at where our strengths lie, where our value of our product services meet them better or the other in terms of GST initiatives, etc.
I think in what we are seeing as our customers or our products positioning, we are not seeing any significant change at this stage and so for us it is not so material at the moment. Again, I think our focus is to position us even better as we go further and as long as we can focus on where the growth is coming from. And that would be our focus.
Vikram Kotak
Sure. And is it fair to assume, you mentioned an earlier question that the margins which you generated in this calendar year has been as no.1 off. So is it fair to assume that this near double digit EBITDA margin can Only see improvement if the demand on the consumption side recovers, improves. Is that. Is that correct to assume for the current year?
Kamal Taneja
Vikram, as you know we never make any forward looking statements. So I would not comment.
Vikram Kotak
But you said the current year margins are, you know, no one offs, right? So it means it can be. It can be.
Kamal Taneja
So the current, current year performance has no one offs. And I can’t comment on the future. But like I said those three focus areas are.
Vikram Kotak
And I have one confusion on the slide number seven, what you mentioned on the cash level. So you are saying 298nine million rupees in bank balance. And also I had to add mutual funding to that. So total comes around 480 for 4800 million. Or it’s total 298 times total. Or it includes the mutual funds or is it separate from mutual Fund on slide 7?
Kamal Taneja
So both are separate. Okay. So the total balance is close to 480 crore or 4800 million. Right? That’s right.
Vikram Kotak
Super. Thank you so much. All the best to all of you. Thanks.
operator
Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Mehul from NMV securities. Please go ahead.
Mehul
Good evening sir. Am I audible? Yes. So my first question is in line. With the previous caller only. So previously we have used to deliver the margins of 9 to 11%. So is it fair enough to assume. That we can do it in coming years?
Kamal Taneja
That’s a question. I would repeat the same answer. I can’t. I can’t comment on forward looking. Like I said before but. But then again all I can say is that we’re going to continue focusing on those three areas that I mentioned before. Okay. And sir, what. What would be currently market share of Uttamaki? So that’s. That’s a very complicated question. So I wish I had a clear answer. You know, as you know Mehul, we work in a very fragmented market, right? So if you look at our competitors, our customers, it’s so difficult to have a like to like comparison.
So if you look at for example some of our bigger competitors in the market, you know, they may say some numbers. So easy thing for us would be okay, you know, add them up and say what’s your market share etc. However, some segments, some spaces that they work, we don’t work, etc. Etc. So frankly speaking it would be very difficult for me to actually tell you what our market increase or decrease in future. Like I said before many times, only assume that we will focus on profitable growth in future.
Mehul
Okay? Okay sir. Thank you. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Zaki Abbas, an individual investor. Please go ahead.
Zaki Abbas
Am I audible, sir?
Kamal Taneja
Yes, definitely.
Mehul
I think congratulations on a very healthy year gone by, sir. Going back to the question of royalty, what would be the royalty paid this year to in terms of software charges as well as the other payment? That is my question number one. Number two is sir wouldn’t see a company the pedigree of Utamaki wouldn’t be it fairer on for the company on towards the minority shareholder that it take out money as dividends rather than these kind of payouts. And I would, I would request you and the independent directors to impress upon the board to take this forward, sir.
Kamal Taneja
Thank you.
Kamal Taneja
Thank you, Zaki. So first your question on royalty. Actually we do not pay any royalty. So it’s zero. I think that is very clear right.
Zaki Abbas
Now that royalty means whatever payments towards software expenses and cost for centralized services.
Kamal Taneja
Sir, I mean cost charge to the company for the services.
Zaki Abbas
That’s. That’s about like royalty kind of payment, sir.
Kamal Taneja
Okay, so for me royalty is slightly different. So that’s if you are a franchisee and you’re paying to your parent company etc. Anyway, I think there’s a charge and I told. Although we can’t tell you exactly what it is but I think this is pretty common when you have a large company you take on resources, you make use of resources which are available to you globally and actually I can even argue that there’s economy of scale and you actually benefit from that rather than other way. Now your second question on dividends for minorities. I feel we do pretty good dividends over the years and actually every time we have something special we actually do a better dividend than previously and we will continue doing that for the next couple of years.
Again we will reassess how we are doing and if you need to make any changes you. I’m sure Zaki you’ll be the first one to know.
Zaki Abbas
Yes, but sir, do put it forward that I mean it is a slightly largest kind of payment, whatever. I mean.
Kamal Taneja
Yeah.
Zaki Abbas
Expert or otherwise it is slightly largest to earn 80 crores up 80 crores. Yeah, I mean it’s. There would be fairer means to take out money sir. So just, just put it forward as a request from a minority shareholder. Thank you sir.
Kamal Taneja
Will do Zaki. Noted. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. Thank you. A reminder to all participants, if you wish to ask a question you may press Star and one now. To ask a question, please press Star and one now. The Next question is from the line of Sheetal Shah, an individual investor. Please go ahead. You can go ahead.
Sheetal Shah
Hello. Am I audible?
Kamal Taneja
Yes.
Sheetal Shah
Hello. Yes sir. I just have one question, sir. Sir, what external environment you aspire for our company to grow in volume and revenue, sir. Keeping the margin intact, sir.
Kamal Taneja
Oh, I aspire. I aspire for many things, Sheetal. I want our customers to double their volume, Double their profits etc. Etc. I think again, you know it’s a joke but I think. I think. I hope this growth that we are seeing in industry grows. I hope we have a fair, well regulated environment. I hope that we get more and more aligned with the sustainability targets that we see in other parts of the world. I hope our consumers who are consuming our products and our customers products, products. They get better and better products as they go.
I also hope that they have more buying power in future so we can sell more to them.
Sheetal Shah
But sir, that has not happened since last four, five years. Do you expect it to happen in the coming future?
Kamal Taneja
Sir, like I said, I just hope, right? I do not know. I think it’s unfair for me to do expectation otherwise. Sheetal, there are so many things which are not in under our control. Like I said before, all we can control or all we can manage is to make sure our priorities are right. And our priorities are definitely for future.
Sheetal Shah
Because full marks to the management on margin front, sir. You have achieved that. But to take the company to the next goal post now, sir, unless volume and revenue increase we will remain as we are there only. So that’s why I’m asking you sir.
Kamal Taneja
No, Sheetal, I noted your point again. Like I said, we want to grow and that’s our priority. Yep.
Sheetal Shah
Yes sir.
Kamal Taneja
We are investor since long time, sir. And we expect something to happen to for that, sir. All the best to you and your team, sir. Thank you.
Sheetal Shah
Thank you
operator
ladies and gentlemen. That was the last question for today. I would now like to hand the conference over to Mr. Kamal Taneja for closing comments. Over to you sir.
Kamal Taneja
Thank you Ikrat. Thank you everyone who joined the call today. I again wish you all the best and I look forward to talking to you again soon. Thank you very much. Bye Bye.
operator
On behalf of ICICI securities limited that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us and you may now disconnect your lines.