Genus Power Infrastructures Limited (NSE: GENUSPOWER) Q4 2025 Earnings Call dated Jun. 02, 2025
Corporate Participants:
Unidentified Speaker
Kailash Agarwal — Non-Executive Non-Independent Vice Chairman of the Board
Jitendra Agarwal — Joint Managing Director
Analysts:
Unidentified Participant
Abhijeet Mukesh Purohit — Analyst
Aditya Welekar — Analyst
Darshil Pandya — Analyst
Nikhil Jain — Analyst
Bhavin Chheda — Analyst
Mahesh Patil — Analyst
Abhilasha — Analyst
Bhavin Chheda — Analyst
Nikhil Abhyankar — Analyst
Ashwani Sharma — Analyst
Smita Mohta — Analyst
Presentation:
operator
Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to Q4FY25 earnings conference call of Genus Power Infrastructures Limited hosted by Kaviraj Securities Private Limited. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen only mode. And there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call please signal an operator by pressing Star then zero on your touchtone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. Please note this conference call may contain forward looking statements about the company which are based on the beliefs, opinions and expectations of the company as on date of this call.
These statements are not the guarantees of future performance and involve risk and uncertainties that are difficult to predict. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Abhijit Mukesh Purowit from Kaviraj securities Private Limited. Thank you. And over to you sir.
Abhijeet Mukesh Purohit — Analyst
Thank you. Good evening everyone. Kaviraj securities Private Limited welcomes you all for Q4 and FY25 earnings conference call. Of Zenus Power Infrastructures Limited. Today on the call we have with us Mr. Kailash Agarwal Ji Vice Chairman and Mr. Jitender Agarwal Ji, Joint Managing Director. I now hand over the call to Mr. Kailash Agarwal Ji post which we can open the floor for Q and A session. Thank you. And over to you sir.
Kailash Agarwal — Non-Executive Non-Independent Vice Chairman of the Board
Thank you, Abhijit. Good evening ladies and gentlemen. A very warm welcome to the Q4FY25 running calls of Genus Power Infrastructures Limited. The result and press release are uploaded on the stock exchange and company website. I hope everybody has a chance to look at it. FY25 has truly been a landmark year for Genus Power Year that showcased our strategic execution strength, significant scale up and robust financial performance.
It was a period marked by record breaking growth across key operating and financial metrics driven by strong tailwinds from the nationwide smart picking rollout under the RDSF scheme and our focused efforts to maximize through output operational efficiency and customer engagement. Despite a dynamically evolving policy and operational environment we have delivered a performance that has firmly solidified our leadership in India’s smart metering transformation. Let me begin with an overview of our performance for the quarter ended March 31st, 2025. In Q4FY25 we achieved standalone revenue of 937 crores representing a strong growth of 123% over Q4FY24 and a 55% on a sequential basis.
This sharp upstick was driven by accelerated execution across ongoing smart metering project and improved offtake of smart meters from various utilities. Our EBITDA came at rupees 208 crores, rising sharply by 276% year on year with margins expanding by 905 basis points to 22.3%. This expansion was driven by improved operating leverage, disciplined cost controls and a favorable product mix. Profit after tax for the quarter stood at rupees 129, more than four times higher than true for FY24. Coming to our full year standalone performance for FY25 to rupees 470 crores with EBITDA margin improving 797 basis point to 19.2%.
PAD grew nearly four times to Rs 298 crores. These results underscore the strength of our end to end model from in house manufacturing to software integration and validate the foresight of our early investment in capacity, technology and backward integration. It also highlights the sharp operating leverage embedded in our business model as on 1st March 2025 our order books stood at rupees 30,110 crores net of taxes covering project across multiple SUV’s and the GIC platform. These concessions span 8 to 10 years offering clear multi year revenue visibility while new tender activity has moderated temporary we will believe this is a natural pause as utilities absorb earlier orders and we expect activity to resume over the medium term, particularly from the southern states.
Our working capital position saw temporary elongation during the ramp up phase, a trend we had foreseen and communicated earlier. However, with more projects moving into their stable operational phase, we expect gradual normalization over the coming quarters. We are also pleased to share that the Hon. NCLT Labad bank has sanctioned the scheme of arrangement of the demerger of our strategic investment business into genus crime infiltrated. The strategic move enhances focus, improves capital allocation and unlocks value for the shareholders. As we step into FY26, we are entering the year with enhanced visibility, strong momentum and a sharper focus on operational delivery.
For FY26 we are targeting a top line of 4000 crores which would translate into a year on year growth of almost 60% and EBITDA margins of 18%. This reflects our confidence in the robustness of our execution pipeline and the operational maturity of key projects moving into OPEX phase As a forward integrated technology enabled AMISP with software solutions such as head end systems and metadata management, Genus Power is uniquely positioned to lead India’s smart meter grid revolution. Our continued investment in innovation, people and infrastructure are creating a robust platform for sustained Long term valuation. We thank all of our stakeholders, customers, partners, investors, employees for their unwavering trust and support.
We look forward to building on this momentum in FY26 and beyond. I now request to open the line for Q and A.
Questions and Answers:
operator
Thank you very much, sir. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touchstone telephone. If you wish to withdraw yourself from the question queue, you may press. And two participants are requested to use handset while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Aditya villager from Access Securities. Please go ahead.
Aditya Welekar
Yeah, thanks a lot and congrats for the great set of numbers. Sir, my question is with respect to new tendering or order pipeline. So you mentioned in your prepared remarks that you expect that to pick up in the medium term especially from southern states. So can we expect this pipeline to increase by FY26 and are you seeing any tailwinds emerging in southern states that they will go ahead with the tendering? Any color on this? Sir.
Jitendra Agarwal
Currently if you see already the tenders have started floating as on date when we are talking there’s a tender value worth 27,300 crores is already open up. So which will be quoted in next three to four months. So yes, tender pipeline is improving majorly right now. Madhya Pradesh, Tamil Nadu, Haryana is coming out with large tenders in future. We also expect a lot of tenders from West Bengal and Kerala, Karnataka, all states would be coming up. So that since the program of ID has taken a very good shape now and it is moving in a very thick space, these people will also cover up in the times to come.
So next three to four months you will see a good pipeline of tenders coming out and it will take. Tenders will come out. You code. It takes three to six months for them to convert into waters. Okay, Understood sir. Second question. Sir, with respect to guidance, last in the last time you said that we expect margins in the range of 15 to 16%. So. But you are now confident of 18%. So what has changed? What means, what are the drivers for improving our margins? From previous guidance to now the major drivers have been our cost control and what we envisioned three years back we could see the results clearly with our backward integration of the software and forward integration of providing end to end solution that is helping us in the margin and of course with the volume increasing.
So both combined together we are giving big guidance.
Aditya Welekar
Understood. That’s it from my side. Thank you. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Ashwini. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah sir, good afternoon and congratulations for stellar performance. My first question is on the. Yeah. Sir, if you could share us with the number of meters that we installed in FY25 and in Q4. But will be helpful, sir.
Jitendra Agarwal
For the whole industry or for Gina?
Unidentified Participant
Gina sir.
Jitendra Agarwal
Exact number, I don’t remember. But it will be approximately 1.5 million.
Unidentified Participant
1.5. And when you say 4000 crore of top line in terms of volume, how much it would be sir.
Jitendra Agarwal
So in terms of volume it will be significant increase in the installation of meters. Because the pace has picked up significantly. I expect at least 7 to 8 million meters to be installed.
Unidentified Participant
Okay sir. And sir, in terms of working capital, where do you see? I mean if you can just give us some idea in which state we have achieved the go live status. And in the near term, which I’ll say you will achieve that. Just to get in some fair understanding on the working capital how it is panning out.
Jitendra Agarwal
So all the projects, as you see the last year all the projects were same almost at the same time. They all decided almost at the same time. So that is why there were not suddenly a lot of backlog. Now on the operational go live most of the states are either done or will be done in maximum next two to three months. Rajasthan being the last one to get into the order. So it will take 2 to 3 months. But otherwise already on the go live is CH is already go live. Maharashtra is go live. Assam.
All the projects are go live. All the projects are go live. And further it will be very soon Go live will be utilized and record the dish. So almost every project will be operational go live in maximum next three months.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. Third is on the margin front. So our exit margin for FY25 very was very strong. Upwards of 22%. So and we are guiding 18%. Why? Why? We are you know, guiding for a lower margin for the entire year. Is it a conservatism or you think that you know things will kind of. You see some increase in the cost going ahead.
Jitendra Agarwal
So we want to maintain this 18. We want to. We want to commit what we are shown off.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. So lastly you know our contribution on the platform. So if you can just. Is there any update on our investment in the. In the platform.
Jitendra Agarwal
So. Exact numbers. The total is not available with me right now. We can provide you those numbers and otherwise you can. You can find all the things on the website of the Platform also where it is always updated. What are the numbers that has come from GIC and what is, what is the contribution of Venus power also. But still we’ll get back to that with the exact numbers that what our contribution is going. Thank you very much and all the very best.
operator
Darshil Pandya from Finterest CapitalThank you. The next question is from the line of Darshan Pandya from Pinterest Capital. Please go ahead.
Darshil Pandya
Hello.
operator
Yeah, we can hear you. Please go ahead.
Darshil Pandya
Yeah, yeah. Thank you. Sir, congratulations firstly on a very great set of numbers. Congratulations to the whole team. The first question would be in the line of, you know, what kind of order inflow are we expecting for this year?
Jitendra Agarwal
So as I just answered the same thing to the previous gentleman that currently few states have come out with the large changes which will be decided in next three, three to six months. We are confident that we will be having our own share in these tenders. So all the order pipeline, order booking I would expect will happen in next three to six months. It will take some time. You know the tenders will be quoted. It takes minimum six months for them to have a final.
Darshil Pandya
But any, any ballpark number or something that you know, this kind of order inflow or something that we’ll be expecting. Okay, fine, got you. The second point will be on the interest and the debt cost for this financial year. What are we expecting? Will the debt, you know, we will be increasing our debt or what position it will be in this financial year? Historically, whatever the market share we have been maintaining from so many years, we try our best to continue to maintain. Yeah, there will be, there will be certainly some increase in the debt but not in the ratio of increase in revenue.
Kailash Agarwal
Yeah, there will be, there will be certainly some increase in the debt but not in the ratio of increase in revenue.o revenue will increase by another 60 but that debt will not increase in that ratio.
Darshil Pandya
Any figure do you have sir? In.
Kailash Agarwal
Exactly figures. I don’t want to give right now because we are expecting a good number of improvement in the working capital as in coming quarters, say next one or two quarters. We are expecting a good improvement in our data debtors day and, and, and an improvement in working cycles and inventories and all. So we are working on that. That’s one or after one or two quarters we will be very clear that. Okay, what position or what, what, what where we’ll be standing in the terms of that. But absolutely we can say right now that it will be.
If there will be any increase or it will be increase, there won’t be in the same ratio what we will increase in the revenues.
Darshil Pandya
Got it. And sir, final question for Kailash. Sir. Sir, just wanted, I just wanted to Understand the opportunity right now as compared to what it was last year. What kind of opportunities are we seeing with regards to smart metering?
Kailash Agarwal
JK will answer that.
Jitendra Agarwal
Expecting the same opportunity because if you see the overall program of the RDSS only 50% is not even complete. 50% is yet deducted. So there is a long opportunity available in the market for all of us.
Darshil Pandya
I’ll fall back in with you sir. Thank you so much for taking my questions. Thank you.
operator
The next question is from the line of Nikhil Jain from Galaxy International. Please go ahead.
Nikhil Jain
Yeah, thank you for the opportunity and. Congratulations on a great set of number couple of questions. So what do you think would be. The peak debt that we would be kind of looking. So would 2026 be the year of. Peak debt or going forward also there. Would be further increase against the execution.
Kailash Agarwal
So so very very difficult to say that for sure because we from 2627 will be certainly better in the revenue in terms of revenue seeing the order books and all. And we just as I told in the last answer also that this is the only one year, this was the only 25 was the only first year where we are, we have started doing execution of the smart meters and all and we are just exploring and working that where our working cycle or working capital debtors will land up. So next we three months to six months we will be very very clear that where our working cycle days will end up and and according to that we will have a plan of going for a debt and all.
We expect a very good improvement in our working capital cycle because in next six months our most of the projects will be go live. All the projects will be started or all the payment. We will see how the payments are coming with the utilities and all. So basically everything will there will be a clear clarity on our mind. So then, then it will be good for us to give a clear picture that what will be the best or the highest rate at which our debt will land up. Surely we we personally expect that it will be in terms of percentage.
It will be to the total revenue. It will be coming down but in absolute numbers it can go up.
Nikhil Jain
Okay, thank you for that. Just another question on this. So projects where we have already done the go live. So how has been the experience in terms of receiving the payment from the utilities? So whatever was earlier thought or let’s. Say anticipated, is that happening the payments are coming on time or is there any gap or the initial let’s say hiccups that are actually happening.
Jitendra Agarwal
There are initial hiccups in some of the. But in general they are as per the expected timeline. RDFS is a central government scheme so research utility is following it up and even central government is also reviewing it very very immediately. So I don’t see initial touch but in the longer run I don’t see any problem.
Nikhil Jain
Okay. And third and final question sir, any update on the. On the ed rage that actually happened last year. So besides whatever notes that have the. Whatever has been published in the notes.
Kailash Agarwal
The information we have provided we are still with the same information what we have provided to the exchange exchanges and to our investors after after that search and all we haven’t received any communication from either from the department or from the Any. Any quote or any. Any comments and all so we. We are at the status quo. Any. Any information or anything comes to us we will be first to inform to our investors and to the exchanges.
Nikhil Jain
Okay, thank you. I would also like to clarify one thing on this. That that has not affected anything on the company’s working that you can see with the fourth quarter results and all and whatever the numbers we are expecting in coming years. Okay, that’s great.
Kailash Agarwal
Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Bhavan Chaddha from Enam Holdings. Please go ahead.
Bhavin Chheda
Yes, congratulations on excellent number. A few questions.
operator
I’m sorry to interrupt Mr. Bhavan, your voice is coming very low. Can you please.
Bhavin Chheda
Yeah.
operator
Now it is clear.
Bhavin Chheda
Yeah, yeah yeah. So congratulations on excellent number and a strong guidance and a strong order book. If you can give two three numbers which what was the execution of a smart meter production as well as installation in fiscal FY25. And if you can give the last quarter also.
Kailash Agarwal
So last quarter as I said we installed a Z list. We did around own 1.5 million meters and overall in the country as on date around 22 million smart meters has been sold. I’m not saying. And that brings any ballpark numbers. There have been multiple programs in the past also I’m talking and different programs have different data. I’m talking about the.
Bhavin Chheda
These are genus power numbers, right Sir?
Kailash Agarwal
Yeah. Last quarter we have installed 1.5 million.
Bhavin Chheda
1.5 million roughly 15 lakh. And for here it would be fiscal.
Jitendra Agarwal
In the last complete financial year. Yes. Exact number I don’t have. I don’t want to give any approximate I can. I can let you know. Okay.
Bhavin Chheda
And second sir, if I see debtors has gone up sharply and also indicated. You also indicated that overall working capital will come down. But if you can write some numbers there because inventory is roughly 850 crores status as more than double to 1365 crores. So what are the steps? I think after the installation process, after the approval, this receivable starts coming down. And inventory also what was the inventory like and when the additional meters would be installed and this number starts coming down. And how should we model the overall working capital capital requirement going forward? Because if I’m seeing a number it was roughly 1800 crores which was roughly 75% of Nuri sales.
So what should, what number should we model as we go forward?
Kailash Agarwal
So basically you one thing you have to understand that total what the total number you are saying is 1350 or 1800 course, which is 75% of the total order book. When we talk about inventory, only inventory will remain almost at these levels or maybe a little higher or maybe a little lower. Because you have to understand that basically Almost there are 25, 26 projects that that will be working in different areas and every different area we have to keep the metering the inventory for installation of meters and all. And then the raw material and the manufacturing, the manufacturing has also increased sharply.
The production lines have also increased the sharply. So basically inventory I don’t think there will be any major improvements in the inventory. There’s a little here and there, but there will be certainly an improvement in the debtors days because basically last year only all, all the projects were started and they were initial. They were initial hiccups were there for OGLs and SATs and everything. And now the things are improving. So basically we are in a very good position. In next three to six months we will be in a very clear position or very good position where we will see that where our debtors days are going for sure there will be improvement.
And when we say 75% there may be an improvement of 10, 15% of this in next. And it will happen on quarter to quarter it will not. It is not going to happen that next quarter you will see a tremendous number or next two quarters you will see a tremendous number. But every quarter from this quarter you will start seeing even for quarter June quarter, first quarter of this financial year, second quarter of this financial. You every quarter you will see some improvement. Improvement is happening.
Bhavin Chheda
Last one on FY26, what will be your equity infusion into the GIC platform?
Kailash Agarwal
So that exactly calculation don’t have right now. But the broader broad numbers I I can. The broad numbers I can give you is around. You can say 30, 45 to 30 million USD. 30 to 35 million will be your. Contribution 25 to 30 million 25 to 30 million. Your contribution from genus for standalone balance sheet into the platform. Into the platform. Yeah. And this year if I see the balance sheet this number was just roughly around 25 crores till date. You know, infused. 25 crores.
Bhavin Chheda
Yes. Yes. That’s the right number, right?
Kailash Agarwal
And which that exactly right number or not, I haven’t seen that. But it will be approximately like that only.
Bhavin Chheda
Okay, thank you sir.
operator
Thank you. Our next question is from the line of Chandrash Malpani from Nivesha Investments. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Hello. Hello. Am I audible?
operator
Oh yes sir. Please go. Yeah, you are audible.
Unidentified Participant
Thank you for the opportunity, sir. So basically like you mentioned like 1.5 million number of meters that was DNS supplied in Q4. So just trying to understand our average selling price per meter and you know the component breakup. If you can provide like out of this are we you know booking revenue on the meter headend system communication and also on the installation.
Kailash Agarwal
In terms of supply we have supplied much larger number of vendors. And when we. So there are two ways of recognizing the revenue. One is what we supply to the platform which is supply and installation. It can what we send otherwise to the different amif. These are the two different areas from where we recognize the. Okay.
Unidentified Participant
And sir, it would be right to understand like this sale component includes like three to four components like meter, head, end system, communication also.
Jitendra Agarwal
So when. When we are supplying to the platform it includes everything the meter dip from different options. And when we do installation, installation is also included to the platform. It includes all this.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, got it sir. And so secondly you mentioned about the working capital to improve further. So just I want to understand on like 1300 odd products of trade receivable how much would be you know like outstanding from the platform.
Jitendra Agarwal
The exact numbers will provide you exact numbers. Not right now. It will be I think almost 60s to 70% will be the to the platform only. But exact numbers we can provide you throughout sg.
Unidentified Participant
Okay sir. And lastly on the other expenses, right like last quarter it went up because of some notional loss. So this quarter, you know there was some improvement. So can we like was it on account of this notional loss not there or how should we see this other expenses going forward?
Kailash Agarwal
It’s almost. It is almost at the same level. There is no big difference in that. In absolute numbers. If you will see whatever is the benefit that is in the terms of percentage only because of the revenue increase. Otherwise in absolute number is it is. It is almost at the same levels. Okay. Okay. So lastly depreciation also increased during this quarter. So was it related to in your commercialization of the. Yeah, absolutely. We have whatever the capex the company has made in the Guati and other plants.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, got it. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Dipanshu from Haim securities. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Good afternoon sir. First of all congratulations for great set of numbers. My first question is can you help us understand this industry scenario as of now like out of 25cr meters how much meters has been installed and what has been awarded and what are yet to be awarded.
Kailash Agarwal
So out of 25 crore mitters, around 12 crores has been awarded. And so there’s almost 50, 55% of the number. And this 25 crores were decided in 2016 17. So that number is also increasing as a country is growing. And with every growth there’s an electricity meter connection required. So overall the number has increased in the country. If you talk of the old number only 50% has been decided. And out of that around 12 crores, around 2 crores has been installed.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, like 2 crores has been installed and 12 crores has already been awarded.
Kailash Agarwal
Yes. Right. And like the remaining 13, 14 crores has not been awarded yet. Yeah, many states they have not allotted.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, okay, okay. And next time my second question is what is the exhibition cycle of current order book? Like our current order book is 30,000 crores. So what’s the execution cycle?
Jitendra Agarwal
So it is basically eight to 10 years. In all our guidance orders I saw eight to 10 years. Because you have to supply new time to installation service then maintain them for 10 weeks 8 to 10 years. Broadly. Broadly you have to understand 60% of the revenue, 55 to 60% of the revenue will be coming in next next three years and remaining will last till 8 to 10 years.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, so like that out of 30,000 order book how much is from AMISP platform?
Kailash Agarwal
Primarily it is from the. Primary like I think 80%. I don’t want to number it.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, okay, sure. And lastly the current capacity is 10 million meters. So are there any plans to increase this capacity in FY26?
Kailash Agarwal
I could not get your question. Can you repeat like current capacity is. 10 million meters per annum. So is there any plans to reduce this capacity? As on like in our our last Hong Kong we told to increase its capacity to 15 million meter in FY26. So are the plans intent? Plans are intent and already we are producing more than 10 million. Our annual capacity is already increased on whatever the capex we have done in last 12 month. And further also as and when needed we’ll keep preventing the capacity as required and we are adding some of the capacity. What are the Capex company is making is only not the capacity enhancement. It is the CAPEX that is being made in the automization of the systems also. So number one, number two in the technology also where the software or heading systems or mdm they are there for that also a CAPEX is being made. So when you see a CAPEX figure whether for financially at 25 or you will see a capex figure of 20 or a 26 also that is not purely for the enhancement of the capacities. So capacities already we have reached to a level of 15 million and if required and when required we will be putting a money on that.
But a lot of, because a lot of manpower is also required. So a lot of money is also infused in the automization of the systems also.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, as of now capacity is 15 million m, right? Yes. Okay. Thank you so much sir. That’s it for myself.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Abhilasha from Quantum amc. Please go ahead.
Abhilasha
Yeah, thank you for taking the questions and congrats for the great set of numbers. Most of the questions are answered. I just have one question that when we will reach our peak execution efficient because when we are seeing that on the, you know, manufacturing side the large part of the order is from AMISP then next year if you are executing say 4000 crores then after that what is the roadmap? What is the peak execution? When we’ll reach the next calendar year we should be of the current order book.
Jitendra Agarwal
So let me, let me clarify on that, Let me clarify on that. For financial year 27 we will be able to give a numbers on say after six months of this, this particular year. But when we say peak peak numbers it all depends and how our order book will build up in next say six months or one year, one and a half years. Because almost half of the numbers that have still to come, it’s almost 13 crore meters that has to still to be tendered and to be awarded. So everything depends on that. With, with the, with the current order book we can reach to our top level maybe in 27 or maybe in 28.
So all that will be there will be a big clarity in next six months because we will come to know about the remaining orders also. So in 27 maybe you know we will reach that 6,000 to 6,500 kind of run rate to reach to the peak level. And then based on how the order book is panning out the future and rate will get decided. So there. There is a big possibility and chances of this but we’ll. We’ll give our guidance once we are very short in say one or two quarters.
Abhilasha
Sure. Thank you. And the last one is do you have any number for the. As you’re saying that you know working capital will improve so anything internally we are targeting in terms of a number of days say you know is it possible that we can reach below 200 or something over next three to six months.
Jitendra Agarwal
So inventories as I told that there won’t be any improvement in inventory rather there are. There might be some here and there in inventories. Debtors. Absolutely we are. We right now are standing on a 50. Almost 50% of our debtors with the total revenue where we. We see a good expectation of improvement and there we can see improvements for surely you can say coming to by another 20 days, 30 days and that even if more it will happen gradually is quarter to quarter.
Unidentified Participant
Sure. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Mahesh Patel from ICC Securities. Please go ahead.
Mahesh Patil
Yeah. Hi sir. So the question is on the capex just wanted to understand. You mentioned 15 million of capacity right. So just wanted to understand in FY25 what was the capex income and as you said that you will be installing 7 to 88 million this year. So then comparing that to the 15 million capacity. I mean considering the installation or the utilization of this capacity at close to around 60% we won’t be doing any capex in the near term. Right.
Kailash Agarwal
So 2025 when we. When we say a number of 7 to 8 million meters it is purely the meters where we will be doing the total work of etc and supplying meters to our own platform. Then many of the meters we are supplying to other MSV also and capacity you cannot always not depend on the hundred percent of the capacity. There cannot be 100 efficiency on that. So if we need to see the ramp up of the capacities we will be surely doing that if required. Regarding the CAPEX that has happened in last financial year is it is almost around 150 crores which.
Which consists of increasing capacity, increasing automation and lot of capex that has happened is of in house development of the software system. So you have to understand now genus is not a metering company, it’s a technology company. A lot of part of this the total business consists of of the technology. There are a lot of software that many other things are included. So basically a lot of money is be of the company. Is being invested in that area to ramp up or that to go ahead of the technology in that area. Also the same things is going to happen in 26 also.
Mahesh Patil
Sure, sir. Got it. 15 million capacity we have. So before this cap at the end of last year, what was the capacity? 10 million. Okay. Okay. And sir, you mentioned apart from the 7 million there is misp supply as well. So do we. Do you have any number in mind? Do you want to quantify?
Kailash Agarwal
Exactly. We don’t have those numbers. So we. We also don’t want to comment on those numbers.
Mahesh Patil
Okay, sir. Got it. Okay, sir. Thank you. Thank you so much.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Raj from Finn Masters. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Sir. Considerations on grit Revenue realization should further increase quarter on quarter. Because now installation has increased. In FY25, installation per day was 40,000 average. Now it is increasing first and second month to 85,000 per day. At industry level. How do you see our revenue? Quarter on quarter?
Jitendra Agarwal
We have given the guidance of the whole year. So every quarter on quarter giving guidance is very very difficult. There can be a quarter which like next quarter will have lot of rainfall. Installation may go down all across. So it is very difficult to give quarter in quarters.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. No, because the speed is increasing. So will it be with the increasing speed. Just asking that.
Jitendra Agarwal
Can you repeat? Because I’m not very clear on. What I understood is you wanted to know quarter on quarter guidance.
Unidentified Participant
No, sir. No, sir. No, not quarter on quarter guidance. I just wanted to ask that the speed of installation at industry level it was 40,000 per day. Now it has increased to 85,000 per day in FY26 in first and second month. How can we see our numbers going quarter by quarter? So should it be every quarter should we see like that? Or it should be like we should compare it year on year. What should be our benchmark?
Jitendra Agarwal
The benchmark is the month on month. What we do internally. But yes, for the investors world you should see maybe quarter on quarterly. That will be easier for you to. Definitely. With all the projects coming into Baranta phase, the numbers will increase all across.
Kailash Agarwal
Here. I would like to add that you have to understand that installation is a little typical thing. That depends on many things. That depends on whether. That depends on elections. That depends on festivals. So Metro, it cannot be compared from quarter to quarter. It’s always better to compare on year to year. Or at least for half yearly to half only. There may be a very good quarter. There may be a little slower quarter but most. But when you put on a six months basis you will find that. Okay, it is increasing every half.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, answer just one question more. Sir, we have installed 1.5 million meters in the Q4 now targeting almost five times a number of meters to be installed in the in this year current year. So now our revenue guidance is 4,000 crore. If I extrapolate it must be in line with the targeted numbers as per the meters installation and so do the data margin should sustain at the last quarter because the scale of operation is increasing. So am I missing something or are you being so competitive.
Kailash Agarwal
When you come with your question again, I could not exactly understand what you want to know.
Unidentified Participant
Our installation in the last quarter was 1.5 million meters and now we are for the full year 7 to 8 millions in FY26. That is 5 times installation which we have done in the last quarter. But we are targeting. But our revenue guidance is like 4,000 crore. It must be in line with the targeted numbers five times of the last quarter revenue numbers and the EBITDA margins were sustained at the Q4 level also. So are we being so conservative or am I using something?
Kailash Agarwal
Sir, so basically if you from the last quarter, if you compare we are giving a guidance of almost say 4.5 times. So and we want to stick on a particular guidance in the EBITDA levels. So you may say that it is a little conservative but we want to be on that.
Unidentified Participant
Thank you very much and consolations once again and wish you the best of luck for this current time. Thank you.
Kailash Agarwal
Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Dash Solanki from Access Securities. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Yes, thank you sir. Congratulations on a good set of numbers. So my first question is. So I know you mentioned that you would be increasing your capacity and doing CAPEX as on when required and it might also include the automation capex. I just wanted to check. Can we like put a number on this for FY26 and FY27. Like if it was 150 crore of FY25. Can we have an estimate of what the CAPEX numbers would be?
Kailash Agarwal
It. It will be. It will be around like 25 only almost a little. Maybe on a lower side, not on a higher side but. But it will be around last year’s CAPEX.
Unidentified Participant
Question. I just want to say not right now. I have given any top line guidance for FY27. Is it right?
Kailash Agarwal
I earlier told also that we will be giving. We will would like to give the top line guidance at 27. It will be surely better than 26 a good betterment in 20 from 26. But would like to give in say during the second quarter’s conference call.
Unidentified Participant
Understood. So my next question is. So we installed. But I just want to how many meters did they actually manufacture from the new plant in Assam?
Jitendra Agarwal
Your voice was breaking. But what I could understand how many meters you have put produced in last quarter?
Unidentified Participant
Correct. Correct. How much we produced in the last quarter? How much was from.
Jitendra Agarwal
Last quarter? We produced around 3 million meters. And when we say 3 million MET includes smart meters, conventional meters. There is not that much emission met completely being shut down. It’s not selling lot of utility. So it includes all types of lead.
Unidentified Participant
From this. How much was the contribution of the new plant of Assam? If you have that number. And so the last question is just I wanted to check your view and outlook for the water meters and the gas meter orders.
Jitendra Agarwal
So water meter and gas meter, as I said earlier also we have been working for last two years. Gas meter will be a very conventional meter kind of industry. Water meter. There are a lot of pilot projects we are currently doing on the gas meter. High end also compiler projects are going on. So their revenues will be very negligible in the current set of products. Their significant numbers will start seeing only after two to three years. That it will be some sizable numbers start seeing. So it is right now that a lot of work is going on in developing the products and developing the solutions.
So currently it’s on all on the private sector.
Unidentified Participant
Okay sir. Thank you sir. That’s it for myself. Thank you.
Jitendra Agarwal
Thank you.
operator
The next question is from the line of Bhavan Chiddar from Anam Holdings. Please go ahead.
Bhavin Chheda
Did you mention that you maintain quarter four margins which was around 22.
Kailash Agarwal
Your voice is little low. Mr. Chandam. Can you please.
Bhavin Chheda
Yeah. So did you mention that you will maintain quarter four margins of 22% in FY26 as well?
Kailash Agarwal
No, no, we haven’t mentioned. We said that we are giving a guidance of 18% for financial year 26. We might look little conservative but we want to keep a guidance of 18%.
Bhavin Chheda
Okay. Okay. Thank you sir.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Nikhil Abhayankar from UTI Mutual funds. Please go ahead.
Nikhil Abhyankar
Thanks sir. Sorry I have joined up all a bit late. The first question is regarding our gross margins in Q4 are significantly below our. The nine month average. So any specific one also are these purely related to execution?
Kailash Agarwal
Sorry, can you come again with your question?
Jitendra Agarwal
Yeah. Yeah.
Nikhil Abhyankar
So I wanted to understand the gross margins which have significantly below our nine month average and this year so it is around 40.6% whereas it was about 44% in the nine month. So just wanted to understand the reason for it. And also is this the reason for a lower EBITDA margin next year?
Kailash Agarwal
No, no, this is exactly not any, any particular reason for the gross margins. When we are talking about the nine month average or this last quarter average of all it all it all reflects on some of the key components or type of meters that has been supplied. So contribution comes from the what type of the meters has been supplied in that particular quarter. So it, it changes from quarter to quarter.
Nikhil Abhyankar
Okay. And how much has been your investment in the SPV till date?
Kailash Agarwal
Till date I don’t have the exact numbers. How much is the investment? We will let you know. I have to check the number.
Nikhil Abhyankar
Okay. And also on the working capital sector, I mean going forward I think you have guided for a 4,000 crore revenue. So do you, are you confident that we’ll make some operating cash flow in the coming years?
Kailash Agarwal
Yes, for sure. There will be a certain, certain reduction in our debtors dates. For sure. There is no doubt in that. Going from every quarter you will see there is a reduction in our debtors day. And that will surely make us move us towards a positive cash flows.
Nikhil Abhyankar
Understood. And will you be also publishing the SPV financials?
Kailash Agarwal
No, no, it will be there.
Nikhil Abhyankar
Okay, sure. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Rohit Lada from Intelligent Capital. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah, so my question was regarding you know one of the government portals which actually posts you know, installation numbers of various amisps. I was tracking that month on month and I could see that Genus powers numbers in April 25 and May 25 have seen significantly increased. At least the projects where Venus Power is partnered with. Maybe not purely as misp but again based on those numbers I could see that if those numbers sustains month on month then FY26 overall then the, you know the guidance can be much more than that. Just wanted to understand if you know the guidance is a bit conservative on 4000 crores and.
And you know if there’s any chance to go beyond that.
Jitendra Agarwal
There’s definitely a very good chance to go beyond that. So we want to be conservative and with the year passing on we have a more realistic numbers.
Kailash Agarwal
Please carry on.
Jitendra Agarwal
Yeah, and one thing you have to understand is whatever that’s operational, go live. That is what comes in the portal from the government. So there will be a lot of meters which are installed earlier maybe have come into operational Go live in the. So you can see a sudden spike in the numbers. So that also makes a big difference. So just that portal won’t give you an absolute picture. It will always keep confusing.
Unidentified Participant
You Got it. Because I actually was starting with some six months and I could see that the numbers that were there, the Q4 performance was more or less similar to what the growth was showing in those installation on that portal. So I was just trying to understand if that is how it is. And on the Q1FY 26 point only there was significant increase in revenue I could see from Q4. So beyond what you mentioned. So I will just trying to understand.
Jitendra Agarwal
Perfectly fine. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. Okay.
Unidentified Participant
So my second question is on the capacity, sir. So what was the capacity in maybe In a total FY24 if you can mention or maybe only in the Q4 of FY25 capacity are you know, business at capacity wise machinery. Hello? Hello Sir, Am I audible? Hello?
Kailash Agarwal
Yes sir, you’re audible.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah, sorry. Maybe. Maybe my question was incorrect. I was just trying to understand, you know, what are the percentage capacity which. Are for FY24 our capacity was 10 million meters. And at the end of FY25 it is 15 million meters. JK, are you there? Have you lost the connection?
Jitendra Agarwal
There was a problem in my connection. I was not getting any.
Jitendra Agarwal
Oh yeah, that’s what I thought you are. You are going to answer this. Okay. Anyways, we can take a next question now.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah, yeah. Okay. Just last question from my side is on the supply changes. I mean considering what’s happening on the geopolitical front. We also import maybe chips or some other parts in our smart meter. So is there any such risk that you guys foresee due to many, many things happening on the global level? So is there any risk on the supply chain front?
Jitendra Agarwal
Currently we are not seeing any risk and we are very well diversified when it comes to buying components. It’s not that we are particularly buying components. So there can be one large company which has multiple manufacturing units in different parts of the world. So because of that, as you know, because we control our own design, we always have multiple component suppliers. Not from Today, from last 15, 20 years we have maintained that always that we should have multiple suppliers. That is the reason during COVID also fees are impacted, but not very heavily impacted in terms of our supplies.
So we continue to maintain that at Gmails and we are not. We may have some challenges but nothing significant. And we don’t foresee something significant also.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, thank you so much sir. Thank you so Much. Sir, congratulations.
operator
The next question is from the line of Ashwini Sharma from MK Global. Please go ahead.
Ashwani Sharma
Yeah, thanks for the opportunity again. Just one question, sir. This 31,000 crore that we have in terms of order book, how much it would be Number of meters.
Jitendra Agarwal
30,000 crores have supply orders also installation order also. But in token as a bond part figure, you can take it as 30 million.
Ashwani Sharma
1 3. Right.
Jitendra Agarwal
30303 0.
Ashwani Sharma
I’m sorry. Yeah, sorry.
Jitendra Agarwal
Okay, thank you.
operator
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, you are requested to limit your questions to one per participant as there are several people waiting for their turn. The next question is from the line of Smita Muta from Credent Info Edge. Please go ahead.
Smita Mohta
Hello.
operator
Yes ma’ am. Please go ahead.
Smita Mohta
Hello.
Jitendra Agarwal
Yeah, we can hear you.
Smita Mohta
Yeah. Am I audible?
Jitendra Agarwal
Yes.
Smita Mohta
Hello? Yeah. Okay. Sir, direct four bookkeeping questions mainly. So earlier when we had attended Gina’s. Power call, you said that you also. Derive revenue from the maintenance of smart meters, right? So one question is that how much is that currently of the revenue percentage terms and at what debt to equity is Gina’s power comfortable? Second of all, do you see your. Pledge shares going down? So these are three of my questions, sir.
Jitendra Agarwal
I will ask for the first question that will be answered by the white student. So yes, you will have the revenue from the operations and maintenance. But currently it is very, very negligible. The meters are currently being installed and getting on, going on. Once they go online, then it becomes a permanent revenue cycle. So currently I don’t want to speak any percentage because it is absolutely negligible.
Kailash Agarwal
So if you see current debt to equity of the company, net debt to equity is hardly 0.6 or I say 0.5 to 0.6. When, when I talk net debt and Genus will surely will not go more than one to one with. With the net debt equity. And what was your second question?
Smita Mohta
Yeah, that.
Kailash Agarwal
Hello. Sorry. Yeah. Well, when we talk about the pledge shares there is a wrong reflection when. When you see that Venus there is a pledge of Genus promoter shares that is up to 66%. Venus has hardly any pledge of fears that I want to clarify. I clarified in earlier investors calls also there is hardly any any shares that has been pledged by Genus there. There is I. I what word I should use there There is a commitment to the GIC platform that below this level Genus promoters will not be going from a certain level. So that shows in pledge because of some exchange software and all.
I don’t know why that reflects as a pledge here, not as a commitment Given to the platform that the genus promoters will not be going to lesser than this level. So that. That is absolutely reflecting in the pledge. Otherwise Venus Promoters has no pledge. Right. It’s absolutely a negligible number which is under the pledge.
Smita Mohta
Okay, so as we understand sir, you. Were saying about revenue, you are seeing. It at 4,000 crores. So this is for FY26 or FY27. Okay, thank you sir. And your market share currently.
Jitendra Agarwal
So we have been. It’s around currently. The market share is very difficult to define because kmis completely changed the way of working. But you can say.
Smita Mohta
Okay. Okay. Thank you sir.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Nikhil Jain from Galaxy International. Please go ahead.
Nikhil Jain
Thank you for the opportunity. Again. I just wanted to ask one question. So the growth story is looking very good, at least for the next couple of years. What are the key constraints or risks that you are actually seeing that can. Potentially hinder or derail the story?
Jitendra Agarwal
One of the potential risk is you are directly dealing with the consumer. Electricity is a very insensitive subject. So there’s always a risk. And then we are already. And all your weather conditions, everything makes part of it. But if you see historically also electricity is a. Electricity meter is a very important subject where everybody has some interest from a common man to utilities to everybody. Beyond that I don’t see any smart meter has to happen. It’s a necessity for the country and not only for the country, for the world. But the amount of electricity being generated from so many different ways.
And electricity can never be stored in such a large number can at least for like not at least next two to three decades. So smart meter has to come to the picture for the predictability and managing the electricity. So it is very difficult for me to say great risk. Has to happen. But yes, the thing can get delayed if there’s something because of some geopolitical political reasons internally. But as such beyond that I cannot see anything.
Nikhil Jain
Okay. Okay. I would like to take.
Jitendra Agarwal
Yeah, sorry, please go ahead.
Nikhil Jain
Thank you. Operator, I would like to take the last question please. Yeah.
Nikhil Jain
Yes, I would request you to come back in the queue for further questions. I would like to request for the last question here please.
operator
Sir, there are people waiting in the queue. I would request you to come back. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Anurag Agarwal from Multifly Wealth. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Hi sir. Most of my questions have been answered earlier. I just wanted to understand are we doing anything to, you know, diversify our. Market and maybe enter into export market. To you know, improve the quality of our sustainability of our earnings in long term.
Jitendra Agarwal
So in the long term as said earlier also we have been working income, strategically important markets and any and the kind of business we are in it takes at least three to five years to start seeing some substantial revenues. And yes Zimos is already working on some strategically large market from last two to three years. And we are serious about it. We are already working on the products doing multiple pilot projects in multiple places. So you will start seeing very good results of the same in next after two to three years. So we are very serious about it.
Unidentified Participant
Can you throw some light on it sir? Like which countries are we targeting probably. Or where have we started our pilot projects? What could be that market size opportunity be like? Is it like a country which is transitioning from traditional meters to smart meters or is it just the replacement demand?
Jitendra Agarwal
So there are three type of markets. One is countries which are transitioning from smart meters to from conventional meters to smart meters. There are some developed countries which are going for the phase two, three of the. So they are going with the new technology with a very large numbers. So that is also opportunity. I don’t want to specifically name the countries we are working on. I don’t want to give that information. But yes we are working on both kind of markets. We are working on the market. We are converting from conventional to smart makers. And also with some of the countries where they already matured in its transmitters phase one and now they’re only two they’re working on to go to the phase two.
Unidentified Participant
When, when you’re saying phase two do you mean an upgradation of this technology to a further better technology.
Jitendra Agarwal
They have already reached the life cycle of the meters. There are countries just remain like Italy. They have already they started the smart meeting journey that created that journey long back in their all the meters has to be replaced now. That kind of case is also there.
Unidentified Participant
Thank you.
Jitendra Agarwal
Thank you.
operator
Thank you ladies and gentlemen. This was the last question for today’s conference call. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Kailash Agarwal for closing comments.
Kailash Agarwal
Thank you all for joining today’s call and we are continuing to engagement. FY25 has been transformational not just in terms of our financial performance but in the way Genus power has scaled its capability, strengthen its market position and laid down the foundation for sustained growth. I thank you all very much, all our investors for a continuous support. And I feel that we will get all your support and love like this in future also. Thank you very much. Have a great day. Have a great evening.
Jitendra Agarwal
Thank you, everybody. Have a great day. Thank you very much.
operator
Thank you. On behalf of Kaviraj Securities Private Limited. That concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us. And you may now disconnect your lines. Thank you.