Clean Science and Technology Limited (NSE: CLEAN) Q4 2025 Earnings Call dated May. 22, 2025
Corporate Participants:
Unidentified Speaker
Siddharth Sikchi — Promoter, Executive Director
Pratik Bora — Vice President, Corporate Finance
Analysts:
Unidentified Participant
Ankur Periwal — Analyst
Abhijit Akella — Analyst
Naushad Chaudhary — Analyst
Prasad Vadnere — Analyst
Rohit Nagraj — Analyst
Krishan Parwani — Analyst
Abhigyan Srivastav — Analyst
Jason Soans — Analyst
Presentation:
operator
Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to Q4 and FY25 earnings conference call of Clean Science and Technology Limited. We have with us on the call Mr. Siddharth Sikchi, Executive Director and Promoter, Mr. Sanjay Parneekar, CFO and Mr. Pratik Bora, Vice President. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen only mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during this conference call, please signal an operator by pressing Star then zero on your touchstone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded.
I now hand the conference over to Mr. Siddharth Sikhji for opening remarks. Thank you. And over to you sir.
Siddharth Sikchi — Promoter, Executive Director
Thank you so much. Good evening everyone. I am extremely happy to connect with you all to discuss the business performance for the company for quarter four FY25. So let me first start with the business performance. FY25 has been a milestone year in the company’s history with extensive business transformation which let me highlight number one. Company recorded highest sales volume across its key products. Led by superior R and D capabilities. Company developed highest number of products during the financial year. These include the entire HAL series, DHDT which is a Pharma intermediate and BHT along with two new products in the performance chemicals segment which are slated for commercialization in FY26.
The addressable market is set to increase by over 1.5 billion US underpinned by commercialization of new products which will position the company on a strong growth Runway in the coming years. Company developed entirely new value chain and complex chemistry capabilities to launch these new products. Some of the key chemistries which the company developed include triphasic catalytic ring formations which is also called condensation reactions, hydrogenation, esterification, polymerization, hydroamination and chlorination. Let me talk on standalone financial performance starting with Q on Q comparison.
On sequential basis, revenues increased by modest 4.5% to rupees 238 crores. EBITDA and PAT increased to Rs. 105 crores and rupees 79 crores respectively implying an EBITDA margin of 43.8. And. On yoy basis, the sales increased by 7% during the quarter. And the revenue growth is primarily led by increase in sales volume. Let me speak on the consolidated financial performance, company recorded rupees 256 crore sales for quarter four which is 14% higher on annual basis and 8% higher on sequential basis. The consolidated EBITDA is rupees 105 crore implying 41% EBITDA margin. Let me speak of the newer HAL’s segment performance for the quarter. HAL’s sales value is broadly in line with the last quarter and blended realization is approximately 425 per kg. While the RLC portfolio is around 65% level.
For the entire full year FY25 the HAL sales volume was roughly 1900 ton which gave us a sale of roughly 80 crores. Successful validation by key customers based in Middle east success, Southeast Asia and Europe are lead indicators pointing to sales momentum acceleration going forward. Sales profile the revenue contribution from performance to Pharma and agro and FMCG remain at 69%, 19% and 12% respectively during the quarter. Performance sector Performance Chemical sector has been the key revenue driver followed by Pharma and agro segment on Capex cycle. Clean Science invested 215 crores during FY25 in our subsidiary Clean Phenocam construction.
For the new Performance Chemical product which is expected to commercialize by Q3, FY26 is on track. Capex for performance Chemical 2 has started and we expect the plant to commercialize by Q4. FY26 on ESG we are pleased to report that the board has recommended final dividend of rupees four per share. Total payout ratio is higher at 22% but for FY25 compared to previous year. Led by strong focus towards cash conversion, the cash balance continues to be meaningful at 400 crores despite increased payout ratio and sizable Capex in the new subsidiary.
With this I conclude my opening remarks and look forward to the Q and A session. Thank you so much guys.
Questions and Answers:
operator
Thank you. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press Star and one on their touchstone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and 2. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles.
The first question is from the line of Ankur Perival from Access Capital. Please go ahead.
Ankur Periwal
Yeah, hi to that. Congratulations for good set of number and thanks for the opportunity. First on the HALS bit. So you mentioned revenues were largely flattish 2 and 2 but at the same time, you know, seeing new product approvals coming in. Yeah. Am I audible?
Pratik Bora
Yes.
Siddharth Sikchi
Yeah. Please repeat.
Ankur Periwal
Yeah, sorry. So I was just you know saying on the has bit. So while the quarterly revenues were flattish, there has been Sort of, you know, new product approvals as you highlighted from multiple geographies. So two questions one. Two questions. One, you know the distribution network tie up that we had done earlier. How has been the progress there? And are you satisfied with that? And secondly, from a ramp up perspective, what timelines are we looking at?
Siddharth Sikchi
Perfect. So with respect to the distribution setup model we set up some distributors over the last two quarters. However, out of some of those distributors we realized that some of them are not effective as we had expected. So in those geographies we are relooking and refinding some of the distributors. So this is part of the business cycle. So you appoint few distributors but you realize at a later date that they are not as effective as you would have wanted them. They were also keen to partner. But eventually for whatever reason for resource problem they also decided that maybe they are not able to allocate enough time.
And hence that process in some of the geographies have restarted. However, some of the distributors have become very active and are trying and have also got approvals in some of the large accounts globally in their particular area. To give you a little flavor, in FY24 we did about 600 ton of HAL sales. Whereas in FY25 we did roughly 2000 tons of HAL sales. So this is approximately 3x. And going forward in FY26 our target is to touch 4500 tons of sales. When I’m talking it’s incumulative with Al together. So from 25 crores of FY24 revenue we came to roughly 80 crores and we end in FY26.
operator
Sorry to interrupt sir, but your voice drop in the middle if you want. To repeat just the last.
Siddharth Sikchi
Okay Ankur.
Ankur Periwal
Yeah, just the last sentence. So from 25 crores we went to 80 crores. In 25 on 26 image number.
Siddharth Sikchi
And for 26 we should. We are expecting closer to 210 crores.
Ankur Periwal
Okay, that’s helpful. And the our earlier target of you know, full ramp up in hals. So give us a run rate. We are broadly looking at FY27, 28 for that at the current capacity.
Siddharth Sikchi
FY28. So the capacity 10,000 tonnes.
Ankur Periwal
Correct. And when do we decide to go for let’s say the phase two of HALS expansion? Will you wait for more approvals coming in or a ramp up actual sales happening? Maybe 26 cent. What’s the thought there?
Siddharth Sikchi
See once we start getting majority of approvals globally, once we start seeing decent ramp up, when we start seeing that okay, we are, we are seeing about 60%, 65% capacity utilization scenario. That is the time we should go for phase two. Phase two will be far more pointed because we will not get into products which are lower margin accretive compared to the higher series. So phase two will.
Pratik Bora
Be a little more optimized.
Ankur Periwal
Sure. Your voice got cut in the end, but I understood. So focus will be on the high margin products there.
Siddharth Sikchi
Absolutely.
Ankur Periwal
Sure. When we look at the international markets, especially the ones wherein the distributors are working well, what is the typical product approval, you know, cycle that we are seeing? Obviously it will vary from product to product but on an average three to six.
Siddharth Sikchi
Product to product, three to six months.
Ankur Periwal
Okay. And, and just, just lastly on this, the breakup of 600 tons in 24, 2000 tons in 25. What will be the export breakup here. For both the years?
Siddharth Sikchi
The export is not as large, domestic is large. But going forward there will be more export coming into it.
Ankur Periwal
Okay. Okay, fair enough. That’s helpful. Secondly, you know if I do your console minus standalone numbers, Q4 looks like a positive EBITDA versus you know, negative EBITDA for the last whatever, you know, quarters. So am I looking at the right that we are breaking even and this is largely health, right?
Siddharth Sikchi
Yes, yes, yes. This largely has the new other products have to ramp up.
Ankur Periwal
Okay. And lastly on the balance sheet side, so working capital, you know, has inched up a bit for the full year. Is it largely because of, you know, your product mix changing or higher contribution from hals versus earlier years, especially the receivable bots?
Siddharth Sikchi
What is happening is we are started producing hals on larger scale. So the stocks are higher but the sales are comparatively lower.
Ankur Periwal
Okay.
Siddharth Sikchi
Produce a minimum quantum.
Ankur Periwal
Fair enough. So, so fair to say that once we see a ramp up in, in our volumes, let’s say Wi Fi $0.26. We the working capital should come back to the the range 22, 23 range. Okay, great. Sounds good. Thanks Siddharth and congratulations once again. Thank you.
Siddharth Sikchi
Thanks man. Thanks a lot.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Arun from Avendus Park. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Thanks for the opportunity. First is
Siddharth Sikchi
louder. Louder.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah, sure. Hopefully you know it’s clear.
Pratik Bora
Yeah.
Unidentified Participant
So, so in when we said majority of the 2019, hundred tons volume that we sold is in domestic and does it mean that we have largely saturated the domestic demand and from here, okay.
Siddharth Sikchi
We have still got I think only 50% of domestic market. There is still 50% domestic market left. Of course, we are not envisaging that we will get all the domestic market. But there is still quite a bit of room to capture in domestic market itself.
Unidentified Participant
So reasonable share that we can expect from the domestic market.
Siddharth Sikchi
65 odd percent.
Unidentified Participant
All right. So. So basically around another 300, 400 tons we can hope to saturate. And of course that also grows at certain.
Siddharth Sikchi
Yes, that is also growing at a certain rate. Yes, absolutely.
Unidentified Participant
And specifically on Q4 when we said sales is almost same between the Q3 on a sequential basis. But why is that subsidiary revenue is higher than almost double of December quarter. Any particular reason?
Pratik Bora
Crore. Going to 20 crore. 770. We sold from subsidiary that. We took that other person. That subsidiary revenue. Right. Has gone up from 10 crore Q3 to 21 crores in Q4. But I mean at a group level that sales is in that range of 22 odd crores. That’s just because we have a facility for 770 in the parent and the subsidiary company both. Right. So we produce more from the subsidiary company. And that has led to higher sales from the subsidiary company for hands. But at a group level.
Unidentified Participant
So less volume sales in the parent level. That’s a reason.
Pratik Bora
Yeah, that’s correct.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, but we thought we have saturated the capacities in the unit four. Sorry, unit three. So does it mean that it’s not. Is there any reason for such rebalancing?
Pratik Bora
We are taking certain products in the parent company in the Unit 3 for the HAL’s facility where the hydrogenation chemistry is available. So that’s why we moved 770 in the subsidiary company. We are pivoting to some new products. We are just trying it.
Unidentified Participant
Right. Okay, understood. On the export market is. I think we are. We are focusing more on the distributors. But Siddharth, what about the direct sales to the big enterprises?
Siddharth Sikchi
No, no, I meant distributor is important business for larger accounts. Big companies in Israel, some big accounts in Greece, some big accounts in Europe or in other parts like Middle East. We are talking directly to them. So there is again same network, larger accounts plus the. Plus all these larger account also wants to deal directly with the manufacturer. So in that case we are talking direct but also trying to set up distribution network. Because that is very important in these businesses. Because there are even small customers in quite a part of the world which has to be catered only by distribution network. I mean by stock and sale.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. This is mainly because of the being export. Because in domestic if you are. If I’m right, we have done largely a direct sales, right. This we can’t replicate in the export markets.
Siddharth Sikchi
Not possible, boss. Because different Languages, different geographies, different time zones. People want just in time. In India it is possible. I mean we can ship material anywhere within four day window. But that we cannot do in some part of America or some part of Europe or any other location. Right.
Unidentified Participant
Okay, understood. And. And in your presentation you have been. Even in your opening remarks you mentioned that record sales. Does it mean even in MHQ and bha, in our. In our traditional products also it’s a record sales.
Siddharth Sikchi
Yeah. All our traditional products is what we. Yeah, traditional. All our products other than health. So is also highest actually. So yeah, all segments.
Unidentified Participant
So how much room we have in MHQ and BHA to further increase sales.
Siddharth Sikchi
In E26, 70, 72% capacity utilization. So we still have window there.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. And any market share gain which is possible in this year given that competition has also said that they will also be placing their volumes in the market. Export metal markets.
Siddharth Sikchi
We have not seen the competitor product. But I think it’s still premature to say. I think. Let us wait for another quarter to decide what’s going on actually.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. All right. And that’s it from me. Thanks, Sujar.
Siddharth Sikchi
Thank you so much.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Abhijit Akela from Kotak Securities. Please go ahead.
Abhijit Akella
Yeah, good afternoon. Thank you so much for taking my questions. First one, just clarification on the opening remark regarding the, you know, expansion of addressable market by $1.5 billion, you know, that you alluded to earlier on. This is exclusive of hals, right? Just to understand.
Siddharth Sikchi
No, no, no, no, no. Inclusive of hals and inclusive of the performance chemical which are about to commercialize in this financial year. Both of them. Including. Inclusive of both of them.
Abhijit Akella
Okay. Okay. So this is the total global addressable market. 1 billion out of that. Right? Okay. Okay.
Siddharth Sikchi
Yeah, closer to that.
Abhijit Akella
Got it. For Hal. So the average realization of 425 rupees that we are making at this point, should we expect that to you know, improve significantly in the next couple of years as the business ramps up
Siddharth Sikchi
100%? Of course it has to improve because the. Because the higher range products which have now commercialized will start being sold in the market.
Abhijit Akella
Right. So what would be a good number to work with for full. At full utilization,
Siddharth Sikchi
you can assume about 500 rupees. 495. 526 for FY26.
Pratik Bora
Yeah, there is scope for further improvement.
Abhijit Akella
Yeah. So at peak, I mean still looking at say 700, 800 crores from Hals overall. Or is that bit on the higher.
Siddharth Sikchi
Side bit on the higher side we are looking at about 560, 570odd crores.
Abhijit Akella
Got it. Thank you. And did DHDT contribute much in this past quarter?
Siddharth Sikchi
00. We still are facing some teething issues. The product, the chemistry which was done in lab and P is behaving very differently on plant scale every day. We are learning a lot of new things about it. So probably it will take at least four weeks more to set right the process before we get into commercial scales.
Abhijit Akella
Fair enough. And just lasting from my side on the two new projects, performance chemicals I guess one is coming up in 3Q and then the other one.
Siddharth Sikchi
Yes. About August you can expect that we’ll start by August this year so about three months from now. And other we are expecting to start by February 26th. So additional six months from that day from August. So this is a very exciting year. I mean a lot of new products are coming online.
Abhijit Akella
Yeah. And just wondering if it’s possible to share a little more detail on you know these two. Especially though there was one product that was catering to water treatment. So any sense of the capacity over there, the addressable market.
Siddharth Sikchi
They Both are around 10,000 ton capacities closer to commercialization. I think in the next con call we’ll give a little bit more picture on the performance chemical products.
Abhijit Akella
Okay, great. What sort of market share will we be targeting?
Siddharth Sikchi
Once we. I think next con call we’ll have far more better clarity on commercialization. Actual dates, volumes and also what markets. So we will give more detail during that period of time.
Abhijit Akella
All right, we’ll wait for that. Thank you so much Siddharth. All the best.
Siddharth Sikchi
Absolutely. Thank you so much.
operator
Thank you. Before we take the next question we would like to remind the participants to press star and one to ask a question. The next question is from the line of Naushat Chaudhary from Aditya Birla amc. Please go ahead.
Naushad Chaudhary
Hi. Thanks for the opportunity. A few clarification on the R D side if you can. If you can share how much we have spent in in this financial year on R and D. The recurring five and a half crore. Five and a half. And we have roughly 90 staffs in R&D, right?
Siddharth Sikchi
Yes sir.
Naushad Chaudhary
Okay. Five and a half. This entire is a recurring expenditure, right?
Pratik Bora
Three. Three. Around three and a half is the revenue expenditure and balance is capital expenditure.
Siddharth Sikchi
Which is one time.
Naushad Chaudhary
Okay so with this the rough calculation suggests roughly 4.4-½ lakh rupees average cost per staff in R and D. Is this the in the industry standard? Because if we look at the other companies like srf, PI. Even at very very large scale their R D cost per staff is substantially higher versus our number. How. How should we read this?
Siddharth Sikchi
You should be happy. We are saving more money.
Naushad Chaudhary
Despite 9 PhDs we have and smaller size of RD team. Shouldn’t this be at least at power of industry? Because in terms of percentage of PhDs also looks 10% of the R and D staff which is quite.
Siddharth Sikchi
I think important is output rather than quantitative. I think you should focus more on qualitative rather than quantitative.
Naushad Chaudhary
I’m just trying to understand how are we be. Are we able to manage it at subs essentially low cost versus
Pratik Bora
this number which you calculated. This is an average number. However there are resources which are, I mean cost wise at much higher number than what you have calculated. Because this is an average number.
Siddharth Sikchi
So there are chemists. So basic chemists.
Pratik Bora
Yeah. Who are freshers just passed out of from college. So that is also getting included in your nine tick account and that is also pulling down the average.
Naushad Chaudhary
Okay. I was talking about the average cost of the peers as well. But anyways we’ll take this offline. Thank you.
Siddharth Sikchi
Sure. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Prasad Vadnere from HDFC Securities. Please go ahead sir.
Prasad Vadnere
Thank you so much for opportunity. Sir. Wanted to get more understanding about which type of files we are looking to we can to push in domestic market apart from health. 770
Siddharth Sikchi
or 622-944-119783. All of them have domestic market as well. Right.
Prasad Vadnere
Okay. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Rohit Nagaraj from BNK Securities. Please go ahead.
Rohit Nagraj
Thanks for the opportunity. So on the HALS front we’ve said that we touched about 2000 metric ton and domestic demand will be about two and a half thousand metric tons. So which and all are the key markets for exports that we are looking at? And in terms of competition, how is the strategy placed for the sink?
Siddharth Sikchi
So Europe, us, Middle East, South Africa. So these are some of the markets which we are aggressively getting into. Apart from India of course. India is a home ground. Yeah.
Rohit Nagraj
And there in terms of competition, what are we looking at? Because I think the competitor would already be present there. So. Okay. Okay.
Siddharth Sikchi
Europe, non Chinese.
Rohit Nagraj
Right. Got it. Got it. The second question is now next year you alluded that we are expecting about 210 crores from health. What is the kind of EBITDA margins that we are looking at? And in FY27 when we further scale up what is the kind of EBITDA margin we probably will be based on the operating leverage.
Pratik Bora
So at company level we look for 40% EBITDA margin because it’s not only HALS, the pharma intermediate and performance chemical one which are more margin accretive compared to HALS, which will lead to better margin at the company level. So we look forward to around 40% EBITDA margin at console level.
Rohit Nagraj
Right. That’s for FY26, 27 as well.
Pratik Bora
That’s for FY26.
Rohit Nagraj
Okay. And consolidated.
Pratik Bora
Yeah, that’s, that’s on consolidated basis.
Rohit Nagraj
Right. And on console level. And next year FY26, what kind of growth we are looking at.
Pratik Bora
So at console level for the parent company it’s existing products which are growing at industry growth rate of 5 to 6%. And for the new product launches there’ll be a significant growth in terms of sales value which will absorb these overheads and depreciation cost. So I mean the growth rate could be in line with what we have recorded this year which is in the range of 18 to 20%.
Rohit Nagraj
Now that’s on the consolidated level you’re talking about.
Pratik Bora
Yes, yes, yes.
Rohit Nagraj
Okay. Right. All right, fair enough. That’s all from myself. Thank you so much.
Siddharth Sikchi
Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Chris Krishan Pavani from GM Financial. Please go ahead.
Krishan Parwani
Yes, hi sir, Congress on outside of numbers and breaking even in the subsidiary. So just couple of points from my side first, have you started production of Barbary Castle?
Siddharth Sikchi
We will start by August month of August. Okay.
Krishan Parwani
And on the dht, have you seen any contribution or not yet?
Siddharth Sikchi
We have already sold some quantities in the US and you will see progressively the volumes are increasing over the next few quarters.
Krishan Parwani
Okay, that’s great. And coming to health. So I wanted to understand at this. Point of time which grade do you think could go in phase two?
Siddharth Sikchi
Sorry, go again.
Krishan Parwani
I’m just saying at this point of time in the health, which grades do you think you could go for expansion in phase two?
Siddharth Sikchi
It could be the higher one like 944119 and the newer ones which we are trying to make which are two. I mean these are all high polymericals.
Krishan Parwani
Okay. So basically targeting like the 8 $9 per kg kind of products, right?
Siddharth Sikchi
Absolutely.
Krishan Parwani
Okay. And just one clarification on health. I think I missed your earlier comment. So you highlighted 10,000 tons of sales with probably about a 570,580 rupees a kg realization. So that comes out about 580 crore sales is that the peak for health by FY28 from the 300 crores capex that we did?
Siddharth Sikchi
Yes. More or less current realization. At current realization. Of course, if the realization increases over the period of time then this realization will also improve.
Krishan Parwani
Got it. And. And plus whatever capacity that we had probably 30, 40 crores of health capacity in unit three. So that. That’s. That’s all correct.
Siddharth Sikchi
Yeah. Yeah.
Krishan Parwani
Okay. Okay. Got it. Sir, thank you for answering my questions. I wish you all the best.
Siddharth Sikchi
Thank you so much, Kirish.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Shivani from Monarch Network Capital. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Hi Siddharth and good evening. Congrats on good set of numbers. Most of my questions are asked but a couple of them is one, could you give us split between flies and volume growth in FY25.
Pratik Bora
Around 17%. Around 25% was the volume impact and realization. And low realization offsetted that impact by around 8%. So that’s how you see around 17% growth in the sales for full year FY25.
Unidentified Participant
Sure. And I just wanted to reconfirm that for the three new product which is dhbt, BHD and Barburic acid. We haven’t had any significant contribution in FY25. Am I correct?
Siddharth Sikchi
Barbituric acid is in clean science which we expect to start in August. Bhd. Yes, it’s small product. I mean a small contribution this quarter. And dhdt, as I mentioned, we still are facing some teething issues in the facility. So hopefully in the next couple of weeks we expect the plan to start commercial production.
Unidentified Participant
Sure, that is helpful. Thank you so much. All the best.
Siddharth Sikchi
Thanks.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Abigyan Srivastava for Marcellus investment managers. Please go ahead.
Abhigyan Srivastav
Hi sir. Congratulations on the good set of numbers. I have two questions. The first question is why has Cox gone up this quarters?
Pratik Bora
The reason is the product mix that has led to a higher RMC as a percentage of sales during this quarter. So if you note there has been a meaningful growth in pharma segment which where the margin contribution is lower than the performance segment. So that has led to a slight increase in the RMC as a percentage of sales.
Abhigyan Srivastav
And the second question is what are the key cost items that are driving up the other expenses and are these cost items recurring?
Pratik Bora
No. So actually if you see sequentially it’s CSR expense which has led to a higher other expense. That is the only item which has led to a increase in the other expense. Otherwise the other expenses are in Line with last quarter.
Abhigyan Srivastav
Okay. Okay. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Rohit Nagaraj from BNK Securities. Please go ahead.
Rohit Nagraj
Thanks. For the follow up for FY26. Given that the two performance chemicals projects will be capitalized what is the world capex number that we are looking at?
Siddharth Sikchi
300 crores overall and for FY26 could be between 200.
Pratik Bora
FY26300.
Siddharth Sikchi
FY26,300 crores.
Rohit Nagraj
Okay. And beyond that we don’t have currently any projects which are slated for FY27.
Siddharth Sikchi
No, no. We have. But we will announce once let these two big products come online and then we will announce the subsequent capexes.
Rohit Nagraj
And generally from announcement to the actual commissioning. Okay. Okay. That’s all. Thank you so much.
Siddharth Sikchi
Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Jason Sones from IDVI Capital. Please go ahead.
Jason Soans
Question.
operator
You are not audible. Could you please repeat your question?
Jason Soans
Yeah, I’m audible now. Yes, yes, yes, yes. Sure. So thanks for taking my question. Just wanted to understand. So you know before we started Hales, I mean we used to clock in margins of around 43, 44%. Okay. Now I understand with the new HALS and all our margins have taken a slight dip which is in line with our strategy. But now coming from 40 to 43% to 40% is that a fair enough? I mean going ahead 40% should be maintained. I was just under the impression that you know when you stop earlier Hals you have probably clocked targeting margin was 15 to 25%.
So I actually expected a sharper margin drop, you know on a console level. But seems like we are doing better than expected. So just any reasons for that? Same for the same.
Pratik Bora
So Jason, we have never alluded to any sharp dilution in the margin. We have always maintained that EBITDA margin could remain in that narrow range of 38 to 42 plus minus 1 or 2% 40%. And as these new performance chemical and pharma intermediates products scale up, expect margins to improve. Because these are more margin accretive compared to hals. HALS is important from a point of view. It will give us scale benefit.
Siddharth Sikchi
Tam. The TAM of HALS is the largest. So the ramp up is. I mean each block can give equivalent of 500 crores revenue whereas the other product are smaller.
Jason Soans
Sure.
Siddharth Sikchi
Plus has exposed us to a very different variety of customers, different chemistries which will, which will be useful. Like for instance non hydrogenation chemistry has been useful to getting into newer products.
Jason Soans
Sure, sure sir. Yeah. So I got that and just. Sir, I just missed the volume and the realization breakup for if you could give it for the year also if possible.
Pratik Bora
Yeah. So that’s what for full year. FY 2017 sales was led by volume. The 25% impact was volume while lower realization offset at the positive impact by around 8%. So that’s only come to a 17% increase in sales.
Jason Soans
Okay. Okay. Sure.
Pratik Bora
Yeah. Okay. Thank you.
Jason Soans
Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Those are all my questions. Thank you so much.
operator
Thank you. Participants who wish to ask a question may press star and one. Now the first question. The next question is from the line of Rohan Mehta from Fecom family office. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Hello. So thank you so much for the opportunity. Am I audible?
Pratik Bora
Yes, you are.
Unidentified Participant
Perfect. So firstly I wanted to. I wanted to understand what your outlook is for BHA and TBHQ from a global standpoint. And secondly, are you evaluating customized antioxidant blends for let’s say some key clients basically forward integrating into antioxidants and if so what is generally a margin profile under these blends?
Siddharth Sikchi
No, we are not getting into blends. That’s what our customers do. We don’t like getting into our customer shoe.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. Okay. And what is your outlook on TBHQ in bha?
Siddharth Sikchi
So TBHQ is a decent. I mean both the products are decent products. I mean they are growing at about 4%, 5% industry standard. TBHQ is quite an edible oil business. So as edible oil production increases, TBHQ consumption increases. BHA is more about pet food consumption. So as that increases, BHA increases. BHA plus BHT go hand in hand. So yeah, there is a decent and good outlook for both the products. Both have different avenues, different markets but both are growing at 4 to 5% industry norms.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. Perfect. Thank you so much.
Siddharth Sikchi
Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Agam Shah, an individual investor. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
A quick question. Can you talk on the topics for this year as well as for FY27?
Siddharth Sikchi
So this year capex, we just mentioned two performance chemicals. One starting in August, one starting in February. FY27 we will announce probably six months later.
Unidentified Participant
So in terms of amount for this year would be 150 crores.
Siddharth Sikchi
300 crores.
Unidentified Participant
300 crores. Okay. Okay. And so all together this year keeping us FY24 and FY26. So when can we reach the infection burn and all the products start kicking in and the growth kind of shoots.
Siddharth Sikchi
Off all put together is what you are asking us?
Unidentified Participant
Yes. So all put together when we can, you know the growth really takes off.
Siddharth Sikchi
So it should be close. I mean in terms of revenue.
Unidentified Participant
Yeah. Revenue
Siddharth Sikchi
two and a half thousand tons or two and a half thousand to three thousand crores.
Unidentified Participant
And that. That should be reaching possible in next three years or how should we look at it?
Siddharth Sikchi
Too much forward statement. We are trying our best.
Unidentified Participant
Okay. And the margins can also increase at that time.
Siddharth Sikchi
No, no, no. I mean these are only. I mean if we are. We would want to maintain similar margins. It would be a one year at a time. I mean it will be great to hold such margins already in the business.
Unidentified Participant
Thanks a lot. Wish you the best.
Siddharth Sikchi
Thank you so much.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Jason Sones from IDBI Capital. Please go ahead.
Jason Soans
Thanks for taking the question again. I just wanted to know sir, I mean not of some time back, you know me hq we were seeing some, you know, weakness in demand. For me hq of course realizations were down. I believe they are still kind of soft and we are more of volume driven now. Just wanted to understand are there any tailwinds for MUHQ to grow ahead in. You know in conjunction more concerns of acrylic acid. Any. Any tailwinds. You see from that perspective. And again sometime back going. You know we had. Yeah.
Siddharth Sikchi
So we are based on volume. Based on. Opening remark that our volumes have been the highest in the history of the company. Okay. Prices have been the lowest.
Jason Soans
Yes.
Siddharth Sikchi
That is why you are seeing these numbers. But in terms of growth, I think for Mehu it should be around 4 to 5% on year. On year basis.
Jason Soans
And so. Yeah. And previously again in some few calls back we had alluded to those issues around goal due to the cost setups and etc. That’s. That’s all been ironed out.
Siddharth Sikchi
Right. All resolved, all result.
Jason Soans
Okay, great. Great. Those are all my questions. Thank you so much.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Shivani from Monarch Network Capital. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Thank you for taking my follow up question. So I just wanted to get sense of the two performance chemical which will be commercialized in FY26. So if what’s the asset turn we are expecting And I think in FY26 there won’t be any significant revenue contribution. So in FY27 how are we looking at contribution from these two performances?
Siddharth Sikchi
I think we will talk about these performance chemical closer to the date. So we’ll take one product at a time. So I think the first one as I said is going to start in August So in the next call, we will talk a little bit more on the product.
Unidentified Participant
Sure. Okay. Thank you.
Siddharth Sikchi
Thank you.
operator
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, as there are no further questions from the participants, I now hand the conference over to Mr. Siddharth Sikhchi for closing comments.
Siddharth Sikchi
So thank you so much, all of you, for your time to attend this phone call and understanding more about the company. I think with this, I close the meeting. Thank you all and have a great week ahead.
operator
Thank you. On behalf of Clean Science and Technology Ltd. That concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us. And you may now disconnect your lines.
Siddharth Sikchi
Thank you.