BHARAT ELECTRONICS LTD (NSE: BEL) Q3 2026 Earnings Call dated Jan. 28, 2026
Corporate Participants:
Manoj Jain — Chairman & Managing Director
Damodar Bhattad — Director (Finance) & Chief Financial Officer
Analysts:
Teena Virmani — Analyst
Umesh Raut — Analyst
Jyoti Gupta — Analyst
Amit Anwani — Analyst
Amit Dixit — Analyst
Harshit Patel — Analyst
Hardik Rawat — Analyst
Kavish Parekh — Analyst
Mohit Pandey — Analyst
Dipen Vakil — Analyst
Atul Tiwari — Analyst
Sumit Kishore — Analyst
Vikash Singh — Analyst
Prathamesh Rane — Analyst
Bhalchandra Vasant Shinde — Analyst
Balasubramanian A — Analyst
Presentation:
operator
Ladies and gentlemen, Good day and welcome to Bharat Electronics Limited Q3FY26 earnings conference call hosted by Motilal Oswal Financial Services Limited. As a reminder, all participants line will be in listen only mode. And there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during this conference call, please signal an operator by pressing Star then zero on your touch tone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Ms. Tina Virmani from Motilal Oswal Financial Services Limited. Thank you. And over to you Ms.
Virmani.
Teena Virmani — Analyst
Good evening everyone. Thanks Ikra. On behalf of Motilal Oswal Financial Services I welcome you all for Bharat Electronics Q3 FY26 results conference call. I would like to thank the management for giving us the opportunity to host the call from the management side. We have with us Mr. Manoj Jain, Chairman and Managing Director, Mr. Damodarbhattar, Director Finance and CFO Mr. Srinivas, Company Secretary. Without taking much time I hand over the call to Mr. Manoj for his opening remarks. And after that we will open the floor for Q and A. Over to you sir.
Manoj Jain — Chairman & Managing Director
Thank you madam. Good afternoon everybody. So I will just briefly summarize the financial highlights up to Q3 for the financial year 2526. So till Q3 we have achieved revenue from operations of rupees 17,302 crore as compared to 14,538 crore which was up to Q3 of last year. With the overall growth of 19%. The profit before tax increased to rupees 5171 crore up to Q3 as compared to rupees 4242 crore up to Q3 last year with a growth of 22%. The profit after tax also increased to Rs. 3845 crore as compared to rupees 3183 crore up to Q3 last year, with a growth of 21%.
The EBITDA has increased to 30% up to Q3 as compared to 28% up to Q3 last year. The earning per share also increased to rupees 5.26 up to Q3 as compared to rupees 4.36 last year. Same time and order book position as on 1st January 2026 is rupees seventy three thousand and fifteen crore. And as on 28012026 as on today is rupees seventy three thousand four hundred fifty crore an order acquired till 1st January 2026 is Rupees eighteen thousand one hundred crore. Until today is rupees nineteen thousand three hundred crore. This is a brief highlights of our financial performance up to Q3.
So now the floor is open for question and answers.
Questions and Answers:
operator
Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touch tone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you you may press star and two participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Mr. Umesh Raut from Nomura, India. Please go ahead.
Umesh Raut
Thank you so much for this opportunity. Good evening and congratulations for very good set of results. My first question is pertaining to the guidance for FY26. Now given that we have received reported about 19% sales growth in first nine months and we have received closer to 19,300 crores of orders. So are we revising our sales growth number upwards and considering that there is also a finalization of NGC order which is remaining with shipbuilders. So are we anticipating any spillover of order from NGC from this year to FY27 which we was assuming earlier during Q2 call?
Manoj Jain
Yeah. So regarding guidance, as we told we are consistent about our guidance. So whatsoever guidance we gave at the start of the year, we are maintaining that and we are confident that we will achieve or exceed this guidance regarding NGC. Yes, we told after Q2 also that there is a chance of spilling over order to next financial year. Now also we are quite hopeful that maybe around 3 to 5,000 crore deal we may get by before March end and the remaining leads or remaining orders may come in Q1 and some of them may be Q2 of next year.
But by definitely by next year Q2, all the orders of NGC order because it is split across multiple line items and a separate order we are expecting for those line items. So that’s why that is our final call right now. That around 20 to 25% of the orders we may get before March and remaining orders in Q1 and Q2 of next year.
Umesh Raut
Understood. So are we including this NGC orders in our guided number of 27,000 crore for FY26?
Manoj Jain
Yes sir. Around 3 to 4,000 crore is included in that for 2526. Because we expected this conclusion. Because mostly at this level, GRSC level, GRSC and GSL level, it is already concluded with government. So they are now in the stage of final negotiation. And other things for these line items including specs finalization, some of these type of technicalities only are going on. So we are confident that before March we will get 2 to 3,000 crore minimum this year. And that is included in this 27,000 crore guidance which we have given.
Umesh Raut
Understood. Second question is on the margin side. If I look at this quarter margin it was closer to 30% at a EBITDA level. I think other expenses are down by about 15% vis a vis our 24% top line growth. So any one off in other expenses that we had in third quarter and for nine months our EBITDA margin is closer to 29% which is much higher than guided number of 27%. So are we expecting major outperformance in terms of EBITDA margin for full year 26?
Damodar Bhattad
No. As of now we maintain the ebitda margin of 27%. What you have guided for the current year because it’s a composition of products which we sell. So up to December what you have sold and from January to March the composition will be slightly different. So we maintain the ebitda margin of 27% only for the current financial year.
Umesh Raut
And and pertaining to specific third quarter about other expenses declining by 15% year on year.
Damodar Bhattad
Other expenses declining. Just a minute. I’ll just look into it and then we can move on to the next question. I’ll just give you on that.
Manoj Jain
Somebody else can ask the question. By the time we are just getting the data we will reply. While replying to his answer we will reply on this also.
operator
Thank you. Umesh. The next question is from the line of Jyoti Gupta from Nirmal Bhang. Please go ahead.
Jyoti Gupta
Good evening sir. Thank you so much. And great set of numbers. I think on a similar line. I just wanted to know emitter margin improved sequentially. What’s your outlook for margin stability through FY26 and into FY27? Are there any headwinds from input cost or manpower expenses that we should expect for FY27? And also can you elaborate on the key drivers behind this margin expansion? Was the product mix, cost efficiencies or prices?
Damodar Bhattad
FY26 as we told we are maintaining the margin of 27% EBITDA margin of 27% for the current year. As far as the next financial is concerned, we will be giving our guidance when we meet next time. So we’ll be giving the guidance for 26.7 later on. Presently we maintain the EBITDA margin of 27% for the current financial year. As regards composition, it says different product mix is there. That’s how it leads to this slightly higher EBITDA margin in the up to December. But overall for the current financial year still we maintain the ebitda margin of 27%.
Yes.
Manoj Jain
And regarding this manpower expenses, as you have told, we are not anticipating much change in the manpower expenses which is around 14% typically of our turnover. We will have more or less similar figures only. And as told earlier also it is pay revision or these labor codes etc are not going to affect us too much because we are more or less aligned with this labor codes also. So that as well as the pay revision which may affect for three months something extra. But because of our increased turnover and other parameters, we are not seeing much change in our manpower cost as a percentage of turnover.
And the key driver for better EBITDA margin typically is product mix. But definitely the indigenization which we are keep on increasing. Our value addition is becoming more and more we are. Our material cost in our overall turnover is reducing, although marginally slightly, but it is in the reduction side only. And that is mainly because of more and more indigenization, more and more involving our MSME friends. So because of that little bit more push on positive side for the EBITDA margins are there.
Jyoti Gupta
So one more question. In terms of execution pay which is key in the defense electronics, are there any delays in project deliveries due to supply chain constraints or approvals? And if so, how is bell mitigating those in case there is anything for future products that you see or anything currently which is there?
Manoj Jain
Supply chain management is the real job of companies like us. Definitely. We are closely watching it, closely monitoring it at various levels. And overall what we had seen last year, last year to this year was much more comfortable for us. And next year to follow, it will be much more better. Definitely. So this year, although we are targeting around 95% of our items, we will deliver on time. That is our internal target. And next year we wanted to make it 100%. There are some supply chain related constraints because of some of the items, especially semiconductors and some rotary joints or some other critical items which are not manufactured in India.
So there are some supply chain management related challenges, but we are forcing them a bit before and trying to mitigate that a bit early so that overall delivery to our customers is not affected.
Jyoti Gupta
Okay, thank you so much, sir.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Amit Anwani from Prabhudas Leeladhar Capital. Please go ahead.
Amit Anwani
Thank You I’m audible.
Manoj Jain
Yeah.
Amit Anwani
Yes. My first questions are with respect to the order. So this year since 9M is quite strong, it will definitely be doing more than 27,000 crore top line. And even on order inflow we have guided 27,000 crore. So just wanted to understand you have been of course highlighting about at least 13, 15% growth even for next 2, 3 years. Just wanted to understand apart from QRSEM which is expected to sustain growth, you will be needing more than 30,000, 35,000 kind of intake. So does that give you confidence that we are going to have this kind of intake? And are there any medium to large orders which you are expecting in next 12 to 18 months which you know kind of ensures that you win more than 30, 35,000 next financial year to sustain growth?
Manoj Jain
Certainly once we have committed to you that we are going to have a growth of more than 15% year on year so that we have taken care of for next three to four years at least. What are the expected orders in pipeline based on that and their convergence timelines based on that? Only we have given this confidence or this commitment to you. So there are so many projects in pipeline for next financial year other than qrfam and we are closely watching that. And definitely it will be more than 25,000 crore which we are seeing minimum other than QRSAM.
So QRSM itself we are hopeful that we may get by this year itself means by Q4 itself. Still we are more than 90% confident of getting that now itself one per some few percent chance only to spill over to Q1 of next year. But we are putting all our efforts to see that QRFM also comes this year itself. So that will give me around 30,32,000 crore additional orders in my kitty. But in addition to that minimum 25,000 plus crore additional are already pipelined in next financial year. So we are confident that we’ll have a steady growth of more than 15% in years to come.
Damodar Bhattad
As regards, somebody has asked the query on other expenses from quarter to quarter and from what is a result for them in reason for decrease. Actually cumulatively the other expenses have increased only for quarter on quarter. Last year the provisions were slightly more because of which the other expenses are decreased. Now it’s due to provisions decrease current year Qatar. On Qatar there’s a provision decrease overall. Cumulatively for nine months its total or total order expenses have increased only.
Amit Anwani
Yeah right sir. So one clarification on NGC you said we are account accounting for 3 to 4000 which is roughly about 25% so that 10 to 12,000 will be probably coming in H1 the remaining portion. Right? Is that the right understanding for ngc?
Manoj Jain
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Correct, correct. We will try to get it in Q1 of next year but it may spill over to Q2 maximum. So in H1 of next year we are hopeful to get remaining around 10 to 12,000 crore in next year.
Amit Anwani
Right. And lastly, since we had very strong margins and even the utilizations must be going up. So what stops us to revise the guidance? Because the ask rate for guidance at 27% for 4Q is only 25%. So are we expecting the product mix to be not favorable in 4Q or maybe next year as well? Because I think comfortably we can do more than 28, 29%. So what is stopping us to not revise that? Since we have already completed nine to 10 months of the financial year.
Damodar Bhattad
See, overall guidance for the current year has been given at 15%. Okay, so quarter on quarter we are not given. There are some quarters where. 27. Yes, it will be around because see again as we told, it’s about the product mix only. So product mix has been more favorable up to December and maybe slightly lesser favorable from this time on. We feel that the EBITDA margin will be maintained around 27%.
Manoj Jain
It will not go below 27. That much we are ensuring. I can assure you it will not below 27 which we started our year with and we are continuously going towards that. Only there should not be any doubt in the minds of you that it will be below 27. That much we are.
Amit Anwani
Yeah. So last question on the EU deal, there has been a talk about defense cooperation in that document and you know, kind of synergy between the Indian players and export to Europe. So any assessment you have done that leads you to some kind of product exports in Europe.
Manoj Jain
It is too early to tell that right now. But definitely it is opening up a new market for us. And there is one more thing, a new research, joint research opportunities. Also because I think they have told that there is a big research fund also available with EU where they want to have some joint development. So there are definitely companies like Bell who are R and D focused and technology focused company. We will have good tie ups for good joint research and where we may expect some fund flow also from research point of view and research which definitely generated some more business.
So we are expecting more and more business from them. But today we have not quantified that. Maybe when we meet in April, by the time we will quantify how much more is there and based on that only, we will give you the better guidance for next year.
Amit Anwani
Understood? Thank you so much sir and all the best.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Amit Dixit from Goldman Sachs. Please go ahead.
Amit Dixit
Yeah, good evening sir and congratulations for a good set of numbers. A couple of questions from my side. The first one is essentially on recently we have been hearing a lot of shortage with respect to semiconductor chips. As a result of which the prices have gone up significantly in the market. So are you also seeing any impact of that in your bill of materials? And can you quantify for us, you know, what percentage of cogs would the semiconductor chips comprise?
Manoj Jain
Semiconductor chips are very important component of Bell designs, no doubt on that. But knowing this shortage of chips and especially sometimes one particular type of chips are in shortage, we are already made design efforts to make alternate designs. So based on that, today we are not feeling that hit on because of shortage of chips. So our designs are now much more generic. I should say like that. So we are not forcing any major challenge for us because of availability of chips or chips shortage. And overall I think the chips we are having almost total type of semiconductors are around 2000 plus type of different type of semiconductor.
Other chips are there in our total project portfolios. And of course we are there indigenizing a few of them and few more. We are expecting government to come out with some plans with the help of other startups and others. And overall we see that chips should not become a bottleneck for us in years to come. So we are coming out with that type of a plan of indigenizing those chips. So firstly we want to start with some critical chips. We have already done some investment for microwave related important chips. So we have designed our own chips to avoid these type of shortages and these type of dependencies.
A few of digital chips, also fabless designs we have done and all the fabs which are coming in India, we have signed an MoU with them and early engagement already started with them to leverage on the strength of them manufacturing in India. So with these type of things we are confident that chip related issues or surprises should not affect Bell that much. That much only I can tell you at this point of time, sir, as.
Amit Dixit
A percentage of cogs, how much would this chip cost be? Just a broad estimate.
Manoj Jain
Out of the BOM bill of material, let us say bill of material is 100. So in that 100 around 20 to 30% typically will be semiconductor chips. Typically because remaining are some assembly, some other components, mechanical components, testing all other Things put together are there but semiconductor chips, specialized semiconductor chips are of the order of this percentage.
Amit Dixit
Okay, Wonderful sir. Second question is with respect to the execution this quarter. So what would be. I mean if you can break down the revenue broadly into the execution, execution by platform that would be great.
Manoj Jain
Previous quarter means Q3 or you are asking about Q4. Q3, Q3, Q3 major orders we have executed in Q3 up to Q3 is mainly. Up to Q3 we have executed mainly LR SAM project him Shakti project battlefield surveillance Project Lynx Fire Control Solution Akash Army LRUs for LCA Mark 1A all the digital LRUs and Shakti EW system. These are the major orders which we have executed up to Q3 and which the 7 project itself would have accounted for around 5000 plus crore rupees.
Amit Dixit
Okay. And for Q4 what are the major platforms for execution?
Manoj Jain
Plans for execution in Q4 are again lrfem kash army him shakti arudra MPR will be added in the kitty D29AW system we will supply a bit more because last time it was Q3 it was a bit less number. Now around 500 plus crore we may supply in Q4 BMP2 upgrade also now we will supply big numbers and LRUs for LCA definitely will continue. So this is around 4 to 5000 crore comes from these six seven major projects in Q4.
Amit Dixit
Understood sir. Thank you so much and all the best.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Harshit Patel from Icarus Securities. Please go ahead.
Harshit Patel
Thank you very much for the opportunity sir. So my first question is on the Akash missile program while it is under execution wherein Bharat Dynamics is the lead integrator and we apply to them why you haven’t included Akash next generation in your near term or the next one year pipeline. What would be the size and probable timeline for this large project?
Manoj Jain
Okay, so as we have rightly told the Akash project which we are executing right now is called Akash Prime. Lead bidder was BDL and we are doing production of that items and some testing and other integration, some other trials etc were done. We are hopeful of executing more than 90% of that order before this financial year itself. Akash Ng per se is the next generation Akash for which trials are already completed. Now the process of AON approval will be put up and that’s why we are not that much confident that by next year end we may get it may spill over to next to next year.
So in 2627 we may not get the confirmed order of that. But definitely 2728. We have planned that if we are lucky we may get in the Q4 of next year. But we know the process takes its own time also. So AON and then approval then RFP issuing to Bell. This one will be issued to bell only not BDL. So hoping maybe Q4 of 2627. Else it will be in 2728 only we may get the order for this.
Harshit Patel
Understood. Just a small clarification. You said we will be the lead integrator for Akash NP and not bdl. Right?
Manoj Jain
Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. It is not. We will be. We want to be. Okay. Because it is Air Force. So this. Sorry, sorry. We will be. Sorry. No no no. Air Force is. We take army is by bdl. So Akash Air Force. This is Akash Ng is right. Now the requirement is from Air Force. So that’s why we are the lead bidder for this for Army. So we want to be. But as of now Army Akash is handled by bdl. Army Akash Air Force is led by Bell. Of course for QRM program Army and Air Force both we are the lead bidder.
So that’s why there is some small confusion happens sometimes. But Akash Ng we are the lead bidder. And that’s why it will be handled by Bell. And back to back we will have arrangement with video for the missile portions.
Harshit Patel
Any size of the program you can indicate.
Manoj Jain
As of now. Because again once AON is done then only the exact configuration will be finalized. Because the configuration or the requirement keeps changing. So how much quantity they want based on that. But based on the present discussion it is of the order of 2500-3000 crore as of now. But when Aon will be done before then that they will have their own internal assessment about exact quantities which are required. So it may vary maybe generally on the plus side only typically. So right now the estimate is between 2500-3000 crore.
Harshit Patel
Understood. Secondly, there seems to be a lot of delay in the order placement for Chatrugad and Samgat electronic warfare systems. Since these two have been in the development stage for a long time now. Any particular reason for the slow movement in these two programs? And when do you think this will finally get? I mean when we’ll finally get this order?
Manoj Jain
Okay, let me tell you. Satrugat and Samagat both projects there were small delays because of the rigorous trials etc. But that phase is over. Trials were over. Trials were successfully concluded with the lead person is DRDO and well supported. By bell. After that RFP was issued to Bell. We have given RFP response also. So case is moving very very fast. Cost audit also is done. So we are hoping out of the two programs maybe one of the program we may get this year itself by Q4. Otherwise definitely they are in H1 of the next year both the programs.
But we are still trying because things are moving in a really positive way very very fast way right now. So we are expecting one of the program Satrugat. We may get order by Q4 of this year itself. Otherwise of course both the programs definitely by H1 we are going to get. That much I can assure you.
Harshit Patel
Thank you very much for answering my questions and all the variables.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Hardik Rawat from IIFL Capital. Please go ahead.
Hardik Rawat
Thanks for the opportunity and congratulations team on another solid quarter. Sir, I wanted to get an understanding of, you know based on our guidance of roughly 27,000 odd crores and this was prior to the EP getting approved. What now? Now we’re looking at a balance of around 8,000 of crores of inflows that are to flow. Which systems you know in our expectations what programs are going to constitute this 8,000 crores of balance inflows.
Manoj Jain
Mainly to LCA order from HAL. We are expecting very soon anytime because we have done conclusion of price also. So we may get that. That is our biggest order in this quarter for us. As I told you NGC and the Chatrugat, these two we are hoping to get by this year itself. And remaining orders are there 2, 3 more bigger order of around thousand plus crore. We are confident we will cross 27,000 crores without QRFM. Definitely.
Hardik Rawat
Got it sir. Any, any if you could indicate the size of these three major orders that you mentioned. I understand that for MVC you mentioned 2 to 3,000 crores in this current year. But for Shatrugat and the LCA lrus that you spoke about any indication as to the size of these orders.
Manoj Jain
Will be around 3,000 crore and LCA order also will be around 2,400 crore plus roughly.
Hardik Rawat
Got it sir. My second question was with regards to you know the provision write backs that you mentioned in this, in this quarter what would be the size of these provision write backs that you’ve done and.
Damodar Bhattad
Provisions write back. What you have done is overall 256 crores. 256 cross.
Hardik Rawat
I have more questions. I’ll get back into queue. Thank you so much.
Manoj Jain
Okay, thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the Line of Kavish Parekh from BNK securities. Please go ahead.
Kavish Parekh
Hi, good evening. Thanks for the opportunity and congratulations on a great set of numbers. My question with respect to the QRSAM project, so could you please break down the total project cost into key components and who will be the key suppliers for the same. For instance NISHA is going to be. It would be great if you could quantify the same and also mention what would be the order values for vehicles, launches, etc. And how much of the content will be handled by BEL in house.
Manoj Jain
QRFM is a very complex project consisting of various big big subsystems and Missile is of course the largest subsystem and missile will go to BDL from Bell. So Bell will place an order. Once we receive the order, we will place an order to BDL about the missile and missile order itself will be around roughly around 30% of the total order value. Roughly I’m telling you so that will be there and we will see what else we can share with you. But remaining orders will be executed by Bell and definitely we have our large ecosystem of industry partners for QRFM program.
So we jointly with them definitely will execute the remaining portion which is around 70% you can say will be executed by Bell with the other industry partners of Bell. And definitely BDL is our of course the largest partner in that way because the missile comes from him. Of course in missile also some of the subsystems we will jointly make, some of the electronic subsystems also we will jointly make. That is the agreement between Bell and bdl. So overall this program will definitely give a boost not only to Bell and bdl, it will give a major boost to all the major industries in India.
Kavish Parekh
But within that 70% could you quantify how much would be handled by in house.
Manoj Jain
As such we have. We are don’t want to quantify that at this stage because once we receive the confirmed order with exact quantities then only we can say this much portion is going to LNT or this much portion is going to other vendor etc. Like that today we cannot tell you that but definitely it is based on the approved vendor list of DRDO because it is a DRDO developed project where sub vendors for some line items also are defined by DRDO and as per the configuration list given by them, only the orders will be placed among those approved vendors which DRDO has finalized.
Overall integration definitely will be done by Bell and overall offering as integrated system will be done by Bell. So that is as per the agreed philosophy between Bell and drdo. It is as per the LAT document which is signed between Bell and drdo, that type of arrangement is there and that is common to all DRDO projects. So in every DRDO projects in the LAT document they will quantify the total configuration list of major subsystems and those subsystems we have to take from those vendor in QRFM program. Because it is a very large program. DRDO and Bell jointly have developed not only single vendor in most of the line items we have developed alternate vendors also.
So because of that we hope that any surge capacity which is required for this program will be sufficiently handled. So this is done as per the configuration list which is finally given by DRDO to us. Based on that only, we will give this individual line item or sub modules related orders to different stakeholders.
Kavish Parekh
Understood? Understood. And following up on the QR on QR Sam, once the project enters execution in FY28 or 29, I understand that execution will be spread over four to six years. What sort of a margin impact do you anticipate here? Considering a large part of the program sort of gets outsourced.
Manoj Jain
No, no, no. It will be more or less similar like Akash which we are handling. Something like that only outsourcing will be more or less similar in QRFM program. So we are not making a. We cannot. We are anticipating what type of margins will be there in this program definitely. And when we will come out with year on year guidance at that time we will see how much QRSM which contribute to that. And based on that only we will give you the overall guidance in the that year projection.
Kavish Parekh
Understood? Understood. Lastly, sir, on exports, any key export opportunities that you see over the next 12 to 18 months?
Manoj Jain
Definitely export opportunities are there in all the areas of Bell’s operation. And we are doing a focused attempt to increase our export turnover from presently 3 to 4% to 5% in near future and overall 10% in a long term. So that is our plan or vision. Some few orders which we are expecting in Q4 are related to satellite communication equipment. Communication equipment, the TR modules which we are regularly getting from France, the data link projects and operationalization of our coastal surveillance systems for various countries. So these are some of the major leads which will convert into a reality in Q4.
Kavish Parekh
Understood sir. On the non defense side, I think the medium to longer term guidance or aspiration is to have the mix split in say 1090 between non defence and defense. Any key incremental opportunities that you see on the non defense side to be materialized over the next again 12 to 18 months.
Manoj Jain
Certainly as you also told right now our non defense is around 6%, 7% type of thing only which we want to definitely cross 10% plus in near future and long term our aim is to make it 15 and beyond. So for that continuous efforts are being done especially in railway and metro segment we have got good leads. Kavach program is going in right direction. We our CBDC program also is coming to almost a finishing touch. And PSD platform screen doors we have got some orders and some more good leads are there for us. So that is related to rail and metro.
In addition we have got very good leads and very good orders related to airport authority means aviation sector From HAL we received the order from airport authority we have received orders and many more orders are in pipeline related to airport authority related to radars related to our air traffic management system and other related subjects. So these two itself will give us a very good lead in non defense. And space will be partially defense, partially non defense for us. So that also will give some contribution for non defense segment for us. So these three are the main sector where we are aiming right now.
Big, big leads. And of course our cyber security business, data center type of business also will give us reasonably good non defense elite. So put together these we are confident that in near future we will try to cross 10% of our turnover through these non defense leads.
Kavish Parekh
Got it sir. All the very best. Thank you so much. Appreciate it.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Mohit Pandey from Citi. Please go ahead.
Mohit Pandey
Yeah. Good evening sir. So first question is on the data center opportunity. So if you can elaborate on what exactly is our offering here. I understand earlier this year an order has also been one, right? Yeah, yeah yeah.
Manoj Jain
Orders. What we have one is a few hundred crores which is not our aim. Our aim is to quickly get a few thousands of crores in this data center business. And main aim is that we wanted to give a secure data center solution and combined not only as a data center, as a combined value added solution with the AI, cybersecurity and other components built in to these digital platforms. So we wanted to give a comprehensive package around data centers. So that is our aim and we have done some good beginning right now. But it’s still a long way to go to reach a sizable portion around.
Our aim is minimum thousand plus crore next year onwards from data center type of business. So that is our aim and few hundred kilowatts is not sufficient for us. So we are working out a unique solution. Because data center you know there Are so many private players, so many other OEMs are there who are directly selling this solution. Our solution should be unique so we are working on how to make it unique. We are working out with some startups also in this domain who are having some unique ideas in this solution. Especially AI related some unique ideas are there which can be exploited through the data centers.
So we are working out various combinations with them and hopeful to get unique solutions in this domain for Bell to sustain.
Mohit Pandey
Understood sir. And who are the target customers here? Are these government data centers or. Yeah, yeah.
Manoj Jain
Mostly government only state government, central government related activities only. We don’t want to go to the general public. We are having good leads in various state governments also.
Mohit Pandey
Sure sir. The second question is on margins. So I wanted to understand if commodity cost movements around copper, aluminum, silver etc what kind of impact they may have on our margins in the coming quarters if at all.
Manoj Jain
We are not anticipating much because of these metals because firstly now our semiconductor or electronics material these variety doesn’t impact us that much. Maybe overall in our materials, maybe 5% or so maybe of coming from so called materials for us. So I don’t see any major change for us as a company, Midani or some other company. Definitely it may affect but not Bell. Bell is more affected by semiconductor and that I already explained now semiconductor we have come out with our own plans to mitigate the risks.
Mohit Pandey
Understood sir. Also with regards to semiconductors and overall are there price. What kind of price variation clauses Are you able to pass on any unexpected increases to end customers? Is that possible in in our business?
Manoj Jain
Yes, we are having this ERV clauses so exchange rate variation clauses in most of our orders with our defense forces and that indirectly covers all the semiconductors also.
Mohit Pandey
Understood sir, understood. And the last question again is on margins. So I understand most of the defense orders are currently on nomination basis and my understanding was for most orders margin profile would be similar. But so just wanted to understand how product mix impact. Is it because indigenization levels are at different levels across different products? Or how should one understand that yes.
Manoj Jain
Indigenization levels also are different. Some of the products we have IC content of around 50 to 60%. In some of the projects it is 80%. Some of even it is touching 90% also. And secondly some of the projects we are doing value addition of the order of 30 to 40% means we are assembling a component card, assembling system, subsystem system and then making a system of system. In some of them we are system integrator only. So in the system integrator projects our own value addition will be less to our own margins will be less. So that’s why as told by Director Finance also our product mix is really big.
And it is a big AI algorithm which finally decides what should be our margins in this year based on the products which we are going to sell this year. It is a very very complex equation. Let me tell you. It is not very easy to comprehend. With 350 plus products and products of products or systems and systems of systems. Calculating exactly what will be the final margins for me is a really a tough exercise. And that we do typically every quarter only we can’t do every day. It is a very very complex. So based on that only we give you an indication about what will be my margins this year.
Mohit Pandey
Sure, sir. Sir, and last question is overall and on aggregate basis what would be the indigenization level now any ballpark number that is possible to share.
Manoj Jain
Again I told you now it is varying from 50% to almost 90% or 90 plus percent in some of the programs it is like that. So average you can say 50 into plus 90 divided by 2. So around 70 to 73% maybe the overall indigenization level.
Mohit Pandey
Thank you so much and congratulations again and wish you all the best. Thank you. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Dipen Vakil from Philip Capitals. Please go ahead.
Dipen Vakil
Hi sir. Thank you for this opportunity and congratulations on a great set of numbers. So my question is so first can you provide us with a breakup of your current order book? So you have an order book of close to around 73,000 crore. So what would be the major orders in that order book?
Manoj Jain
Yeah, certainly I will tell you as on 1st January 2026 the major order book consists of electronics uses because we got the order for 10 years requirement for them. Then LRFM, BMP2 upgrade, Akash Army Ashwini Radar, MPR Arudra Radar and EW suit for Mi17 V5. So these seven projects will constitute around 20,000 plus crores. So major projects are these. And out of that first project only is for eight more years. Now remaining projects like LRFM is hardly now one one and a half year more we have to execute BMP2. All other projects are typically for next two years we will execute also.
Dipen Vakil
Got it sir. So and for the smaller value orders, so the less than thousand crore orders that we get on a recurring basis, what is the likely execution period for those smaller orders? Like? Is it like within executed during the same year? Or what would be the general idea for that?
Manoj Jain
So those orders typically are 12 months to 18 months. Typically sometime only 24 months but less than 24 months definitely. These smaller orders typically are.
Dipen Vakil
So and so the 7,000 crore or 7 or 8,000 crore additional order inflow. So you gave us two, three names on the major acquisition that are pending. So are we confident, can we, is there a chance to surpass on the 27,000 with the help of emergency procurement and the smaller value orders or I think 27,000 crore is on the upper end side of a guidance.
Manoj Jain
No, no, no. That much again I can assure you 27,000 we are going to cross. How much more? That depends upon the last mill surprises and the Q4 whether we will get some more bigger order out of this in Q4 or they may spill over to H1. So that is the only suspense for us. But we are confident based on large orders movement as well as so many more small orders are in pipeline for us. So we are going to cross 27,000 crore. That much I can confidently tell you. How much more today I can’t tell you.
And if at all we don’t cross too much, it will be in the H1. That much will be there because the good progress is already done on these major leads for us.
Dipen Vakil
Got it sir. So and so. Okay, so I’ll get back on the queue. Thank you so much for answering my question and all the best. Yeah.
Manoj Jain
Okay, thank you.
operator
The next question is from the line of Atul Tiwari from JP Morgans. Please go ahead.
Atul Tiwari
Yeah, so thanks a lot and congrats on yet again very strong set of numbers. So my question is on your bid for AMCA project in consortium with lnt. So where we are in that process as of now and when can we expect some kind of definite movement and selection of the partner who will make product for amca.
Manoj Jain
As you may be knowing and I think the last time we told, I believe that we have partnered with LNT for that and LNT is the lead bidder. So right now it was only the EUI response. So EUI response we had submitted. All the UI responses are evaluated by a high powered committee in mod. We confident that we will be one of the selected bidder and soon we will get rfp. Hopefully my estimate is around mid of February we may get the RFP and then they may give us some reasonable time to respond to the rfp.
And as of now I am confident based on the strengths of Bell and LNT that we will be the strongest bidder. In that particular rfp, that much only I can tell you. But exact English or RFP also I don’t know. So what will come in rfp. But based on the strength of Bell and lnt, we are confident that we will be the strongest bidder for this program and we will get this program.
Atul Tiwari
And sir, my second question is on. Prospects for large orders. So QR SAM and NGC order we know. But except for these two, you know what are some of the larger orders that we can expect over next two, three years?
Manoj Jain
There are multiple such programs definitely are there for us for next two, three years. But the one of the largest program where we are working right now with good investment is that Kusha program which is the indigenous S400. So there we are working and we will expect something like QRFM type of order only when that project rectifies. It may take almost three years roughly to get that order. So maybe around 28, 29 or so we may get that big order. But in addition There are some 3,000 or 4,000 plus crore, some 8 to 10 big programs which we are expecting next year and next to next year.
So there is a long list of those programs and we are confident we may get a sizable portion of those programs in next next to next year. So we have our own plans of total type of elites for these programs to maintain this growth of 15 percent and good progress is there on all those programs. Many of the programs the R and D phase is already over. Now it is in the paper evaluation and processing related things only are going on. So we are having very good confidence to get them in next 1 or 12 years.
Atul Tiwari
Great sir, thank you. Thanks a lot.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Sumit Kishore from Access Capital. Please go ahead.
Sumit Kishore
Good evening and thanks for the opportunity. Two questions. The first one is again on other. Expenses for the 9 month FY26 and 9 month FY25 period. Could you please quantify what is the extent of nonlinear provisions in the other expenses? That’s my first question.
Damodar Bhattad
Expenses for the nine months has increased from 1158 to 1280. Okay. In that major reason is provision towards doubtful deaths which is around 110 crores is the increase. It was. It is 709 current year as against 598 last year. So 100 crores is the provisions increase on account of. I mean other expenses increased by 100 crores because of this provision. Major is that only okay.
Sumit Kishore
And that is for the provision for. Doubtful debt is the. Are there any other Large. What is the total provision?
Damodar Bhattad
Total provision is 709 for the nine months and the December.
Sumit Kishore
Okay. So actually then the other expenses have. Gone up even lesser than the 10.5%.
Damodar Bhattad
That mainly due to the provisions only. Whatever increase we are seeing is on account of provisions. It was 1158 last year. 1280 current year and 110 crores is on account of provision. So it’s all almost same.
Sumit Kishore
massive operating leverage which is playing out. Yeah, that’s quite good. The second one is on other income. The other income for the nine month. Period down about 16. So how your cash position and you know what element of treasury decline is there or so what is explaining the other income decline?
Damodar Bhattad
Other income decline. See interest income is slightly less as compared to last year. Interest income has decreased from around 472 crores to 416 crores. As you know generally there has been a decrease in interest rates. Also average yield has also decreased on the deposits. So that is one major point of that. So that is why the other income has slightly decreased. In addition to that last year there was some FE gain which is not there now because the rupee has depreciated current year.
Sumit Kishore
Got it. And what is your cash position at the end of cash and bank balance. As of nine months at 526 and.
Damodar Bhattad
Portion cash position is reasonably good at 7,000 plus crores.
Sumit Kishore
Okay, thank you so much.
Damodar Bhattad
Right.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Vikas Singh from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.
Vikash Singh
Hi sir. Good evening and thank you for the opportunity. So just wanted to understand our R D CAPEX which we are doing this year. And given we are participating in so many program how should we look at our R and D expenditure going forward as well because obviously this should go up. So if you could give us some insight into it.
Manoj Jain
Yeah. This R and D CAPEX means R and D expenditure. Total R and D expenditure has two components. One is revenue and one is capex. CAPEX requirement of the R D community means there’s a test instrument and other infrastructure. So put together itself we will call it as a total R D expenditure. For us that last year it was 1468 crore or so. This year our target is crossing 1700 plus crore. So and next year it will be more than 2000 crore. So overall now we wanted to have almost 20 plus percent increase year on year on our R and D expenses.
Because we know the overall requirement of indigenization is increasing. Overall requirement of new technology development is increasing. We are also diversifying into new and new areas and these new areas require more R and D resources. So we are keeping on increasing our R D budget as well as our R D manpower also. So today we are having more than 3200 plus RD engineers. In last one year itself we have added almost 700 to 1000RD engineers in our R D manpower. And we will continuously increase further for diverse R D areas where we are working. So overall we know you also may be knowing that the Bell is a R and D focused company with the three tier R and D.
So definitely we are going to increase our expenditure or technically it is an investment, not expenditure R and D investments. We are going to increase in a very, very sizable way. Minimum 20% year on year growth investment. We have committed now it will be more than 20 only, I can assure you.
Vikash Singh
Noted, sir. And so just one question, just a repeat of a previous participant. In terms of amca, I know we are usually three people who are there in case of whatever the order comes. If we are so what percentage would be supplied by us? So let’s say what is the percentage that probably would have already been settled between you three people who are bidding. For the anchor right now.
Manoj Jain
The thing is, let me tell you AMCA right now there are multiple consortiums. So five or six, six or seven consortiums have participated in eoi. Hopefully in RFP may be issued to three or four only because they cannot evaluate too many fellows. So I’m guessing that. But after RFP then there will be L1 discovery, technical evaluation and then L1 discovery. We are confident of qualifying technical and we are confident that we will be L1. Once we are L1 between Bell and LNT we have arrived at some work share arrangement between both of us. LNT has backend arrangement with the third partner so that his portion some of the execution will be done by the third partner, our portion.
As of now we are free to work with that third partner or not. But right now the commitment is between LNT and the third partner. Not directly between us and third partner. But seeing the project progress we seeing the strength at that point of time we may share some of our work share also to our third partner. I hope I have answered your question.
Vikash Singh
Yes, I just wanted to know the currently workshare percentages divided without the third partner is divided what percentage yours?
Manoj Jain
It is more or less 5050 because we told 5050 is the overall investment. 5050 will be the more or less work share between both the lead bidders. So LNT and Bell. It is more or less 5050 because investments and everything has to go together only you can’t have investment more and that work share less. So right now more everything is 5050 notice. That’s all for myself.
Vikash Singh
Thank you and all the best.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Bal Chandra Vasant Shinde from Motilal Mutual Funds. Please go ahead.
Bhalchandra Vasant Shinde
Good evening sir. Congrats for good set of results so far in overall scheme of things in larger programs post FY27 what is the visibility means? Like what kind of a pipeline we are working so that we’ll be able to maintain 25 30,000 current kind of inflows over next three to five years.
Manoj Jain
These all projects I can’t tell you today because some of the projects are multi vendor also. Many projects are definitely nomination basis because of our continuous efforts which we have done over last five plus years to develop the critical technology modules for those programs.
So we are confident overall there is a big list of projects for us. In that list of almost 30 plus items are there which are minimum thousand plus crore business for us in next few years. So that is a big list. And we have done reasonably good R and D already for them. And as I told Kusha is one such program where we have done very good investment further. And we are hoping it will be another QRFM for us. So these type of A two, three big programs definitely will take care of a big order book at the end of the year.
And then this smaller thousand two thousand, three thousand four thousand crore worth of orders definitely will take care of our overall growth of more than 15%.
Bhalchandra Vasant Shinde
And sir, whenever a new order like QR Sam Kusha program starts executing, is it fair to assume that our margins will have some dilution? Because there the indigenization component will be at the lowest level. And over a period of time you ramp up in the indigenization.
Manoj Jain
No, no. Let me tell you, these programs are hundred percent indigenous. The QRFM or Kusha programs are hundred percent indigenous except the ICs and other things semiconductors.
So overall indigenization level in this program is good. However because this program we will play slightly higher end role, the system integrator role. So the profit actually will be shared by large industry partners, MSME partners also. So we may have slightly lesser margins in this project. But overall projects will be very good profitable for company and for our MSME and other partners. So definitely that’s why we told we have a logical mix. Some projects we are working as a system integrator, some projects we are working from ground up like at Component level or subsystem level also.
So our value addition varies from I told you around 40 45% to something like 10 to 15% depending upon the type of program. So because of that our EBITDA margins etc that’s why I told it is a complex equation and with that fly average only we told last year there’s 27% and this year also we are sticking on to 27. Next year April we will come back to you with our guidance for next year based on that year product mix and what type of products are there and what type of value addition in each product which we are anticipating in those programs.
So based on that we will decide and let me tell you in these programs of qrfm, Kusha etc because they are hundred percent indigenous, definitely it will be much more cost effective for us as well as for our users.
Bhalchandra Vasant Shinde
Got it, Got it. Thanks.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Prathamesh Rane from Ilara Securities. Please go ahead.
Prathamesh Rane
Yeah. Hi. Am I audible?
Manoj Jain
Yeah, yeah.
Prathamesh Rane
So congratulations. A great set of numbers. Sir, just two questions from my side. What would be the UTTAM radar update for 97 numbers and of and. And when. When would be the. When would we be expect the order.
Manoj Jain
UTTAM radar right now as a radar is handled by HAL and only subsystem level the triple AU level only we are one of the vendor so but decision about how many of UTTAM radars will go or not. Whether in this 97 full 97 will be Uttam radar only that decision will is being taken by HAL in conjunction with our DRDO friends means ada. So ADA and HAL jointly are deciding how many of these 97 numbers order will be supplied with Uttam. How many will be with foreign radar or mix of these two. We are not a party to that.
Once HAL finalizes the configuration at the time only they will ask for a bid for this triple AU which is the most complicated subsystem or most costly subsystem of this and then only we will come to know and we will quantify as on today we have not added that in our kitty of this immediate market leads because we are not sure about configuration finalization by HL still. So the day they finalize and then they issue RFP after that only we can plan.
Prathamesh Rane
And and one Last question on 52 Military Satellite Order what would be Bell Scope in that.
Manoj Jain
As of now military satellite we are not in business so we are in the prototyping or coming out with some unique solutions. So we are tying up with some of the startups and some of the even foreign OEMs also we are tied up. So we are coming out with a unique proposition for this military satellites and then only we wanted to bid. So right now it is a bit early to tell how much of this share we will get. But we have done reasonably good progress in coming out with a unique solution for this jointly with our startup and other industry partners.
And once we offer that solution to our military friends, then only we can quantify how much of this share can come to us. Today it is a bit early to commit.
Prathamesh Rane
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you sir.
Manoj Jain
Madam, it is already 5, 5, 5
Damodar Bhattad
Maximum. One last question, madam.
operator
Okay, We’ll be taking one last question, sir.
Manoj Jain
Yes, yes. Yeah.
operator
Okay, so the next question is from the line of Bala Subrimanyam from Arihant Capital. Please go ahead.
Balasubramanian A
Good evening, sir. Thank you so much for the opportunity, sir. Indigenization is lowest in urban systems. What specific components are still imported and what is the roadmap for substitutions? And how we are. How we are leveraging DRDO partnerships to accelerate indigenous development in sensors, radars and EW systems. Thank you.
Manoj Jain
Yeah, DRDO is continuously developing sensors, EW systems, etc. But as you have told already, that airborne system, there is a challenge of testing, certification, etc. So it takes its own time. If some of the subsystems are already proven in some foreign platforms, then we are tempted to use them also till our own indigenous systems are matured. But I can tell you More than 70 to 80% of airborne sensors are now of indigenous origin. But definitely a few are still of foreign origin because they are already tested somewhere in some other platforms. So those particular systems which are already inducted there, which we are also taking there, we are going at module level indigenization.
So that activity is going on and definitely all airborne subsystems, we wanted finally to be only indigenous. We are maybe around 70% or more already indigenized. But there is still some gap which we are bridging either by efforts of our own hours plus drdo, ours plus DRDO plus other industry partners. So there is a slightly more complicated, slightly more complex problem in airborne segment and we are trying to attack it jointly. And various programs are going on at Bell, at DRDO and at our industry partners also.
Balasubramanian A
Thank you.
operator
Thank you. In the interest of time, that was the last question. I would now like to hand the conference over to the management for closing comments.
Manoj Jain
Thank you all. As you have seen till Q3, we have gone reasonably good and I hope we have met the expectation of you all. And as we started the year we want to see that year end will be with the figures which we had committed to you. Means revenue growth more than 15% EBITDA margin definitely more than 27% order inflow 27,000 crore plus R&D investment. Although we told 1600 crore but I am confident we may cross 1700 but at least 1600 plus definitely we are going to be there. Capex thousand crore and defense non defense business of 90 to 10.
So these are our guidance as future and we are hopeful to exceed that only. That is a brief summary of from my side.
operator
On behalf of Motilal OSWAL Financial Services Ltd. That concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us. And you may now disconnect your lines.
Manoj Jain
Thank you. Thank you all.