Bajaj Finserv Limited (NSE: BAJAJFINSV) Q4 2025 Earnings Call dated Apr. 30, 2025
Corporate Participants:
Unidentified Speaker
S. Sreenivasan — President, Insurance & Special Projects
Vipin Bansal — Chief Financial Officer, Bajaj Allianz, Life Insurance Company Limited
Anckur Anil Kanwar — Chief Financial Officer, Bajaj Allianz, General Insurance Company Limited
Ramandeep Singh Sahni — Group Chief Financial Officer
Ramandeep Singh Sahni — Group Chief Financial Officer
Tapan Singhel — Managing Director and Chief Executive Officer – Bajaj Allianz General Insurance Company Limited
Vipin Bansal — Chief Financial Officer, Bajaj Allianz Life Insurance Co. Limited
Tarun Chugh — Managing Director & Chief Executive Officer of Bajaj Allianz Life Insurance
Devang Mody — Whole Time Director and CEO, Bajaj Finserv Health Ltd.
Analysts:
Unidentified Participant
Ajit Kumar — Analyst
Rohan Mehta — Analyst
Avinash Singh — Analyst
Bhavesh Kanani — Analyst
Mayur Parkeria — Analyst
Sanketh Godha — Analyst
Umang Shah — Analyst
Manish Dhariwal — Analyst
Manish Dhariwal — Analyst
Madhukar Ladha — Analyst
Swarnabha Mukherjee — Analyst
Presentation:
operator
Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to Bajaj Finso Limited Q4FY25 earnings conference call hosted by JM Financial Institutional securities Limited. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen only mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing Star then zero on your touchstone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded.
operator
I now hand the conference over to Mr. Ajit Kumar from JM Financial. Thank you. And over to you.
Ajit Kumar — Analyst
Thank you.
Ajit Kumar — Analyst
Yashashvi. Good afternoon everyone and welcome to the conference call of Bajaj Prinsar Limited to discuss 4Q FY25 results. First I would like to thank the management of Bajaj Consul Limited for giving us the opportunity to host the call. As always we will have the opening comments from the management team post which we will open the floor for Q and A. From the management side Today we have Mr. Sri Devason, President Insurance and Special Projects, Bajaj Finsors Insurance. Mr. Ramandeep Singh Sani, CFO Bajaj Fincher Ltd. Mr. Tapan Singhal MD and CEO Bajaj Alliance General Insurance Co.
Ltd. Mr. Taran Choud MD and CE Bajaj Allianz Life Insurance Co. Ltd. Mr. Ankur Anil Kanwar, CFO Bajaj Alliance General Insurance Co. Ltd. Mr. Vipil Bansal, CFO Bajaj Alliance Life Insurance Co. Ltd. Mr. Ashish Panchal, Full Time Director and CEO Bajaj Finsav Direct Ltd. And Mr. Devang Modi, MD and CEO Bajaj Finslav Health Ltd. With that I would like to hand over the floor to Mr. Srivasan for his opening comments. Thank you. And over to you sir.
S. Sreenivasan — President, Insurance & Special Projects
Good morning everyone. Thank you. And this is the conference call to discuss the results of Bajaj Finserve Limited for Q4 FYI and the year end at FY25. I will now hand over to the group CFO Ramandeep who will take you through the highlights of the performance.
Ramandeep Singh Sahni — Group Chief Financial Officer
Thank you Srini. So good afternoon everybody. We welcome everyone to the conference call to discuss the results of Rajaj Finserve Limited for Quarter 4 FY25. As before in this call we will largely be concentrating on the consolidated results well as the results of our insurance operations through Bajaj Alian’s General Insurance and Bajaj Alian’s Life insurance ballot and where material the standalone results of Bajaj Finserve, Bajaj Finance, BFL and Bajaj Housing Finance our other material subsidiaries have already had their conference calls and hence we would pursue only high level questions on BFL and BHFL to start with some of the hygiene points.
As a word of caution we have firm that the statements that may look forward looking statements are just estimates and do not constitute any assurance or indication on any future performance result. Let me just start by giving an update on the basis of accounting first as required by the regulations, Bajaj Finserf prepares its financials on India’s basis. However the insurance companies are currently not covered under India so they prepare India’s financials only for the purpose of consolidations. Accordingly, the Bajic and Balik standalone numbers reported are basis non India’s accounting standards referred as Indian GAAP as applicable to insurance companies.
I also confirmed that our results press release accompanying the results and an investor deck have been uploaded on our website last night. Now let me start by giving a brief update on the status of the Allianz’s exit from the joint venture agreements. BFS and the insurance companies are currently in the process of getting regulatory approvals from both CCI and IIDI and there is no further update on the matter as we stand today. Let me now give a high level update on the consolidated financial results for quarter four which we have also put in a press release issued yesterday.
To start with, the consolidated total income for bfs grew at 14% to 36,596 crores up from 32,042 crores for the same period last year. Similarly, the consolidated pact has also grown by 14% to 2,417 crores up from 21119 crores for the same period last year. In terms of Bagic, the gross written Premium degrew by 13% to 4326 crores versus 4962 crores for the same period last year. Excluding the bulky crop and government health businesses, the GW fee for Bajig for the quarter was flat at close to 3800 crores. The profit after tax degrew by 4% to 363 crores versus 380 crores for the same period last year.
The ROE is at about 12.5% versus 14.5% for the same period last year. Combined ratio at about 104.8% versus 101.6% for the same period last year. Moving to Bilic, the gross written premium grew 13% to 9,237 crores up from 8,184 crores for the same period last year. For Ballic, the profit after tax degrew by 61% to 41 crores down from 106 crores last year. The value of new business registered however has grown 14% to 549 crores up from 480 crores for the same period last year. And finally on BFL the consolidated total income grew 23% to 11,917 crore up from 9,714 crore for the same period last year.
The Consolidated PAT grew 17% to 4480 crores from 3825 crores for the same period last year and the ROE is stable at close to 19%. So this was just a summary of the results which were published in the press yesterday. Now I’ll deep dive into each of the companies to give you further texture on the performance of each of the companies. To start with, on BAGIC effective 1st of October 24th, as was mandated by IIDA, the premium on long term products was to be accounted on one by N basis where N is considered to be the contract duration.
So as compared to the earlier philosophy of recognizing premium upfund from long term contracts perspective, the law required us to amortize the premium over the contract Duration and hence Quarter 4 and FY25 numbers are not comparable with prior years. The change in the accounting however has no bearing on the underwriting profits and PAT for the year, but it impacts the gross written premium and combined ratio for the period. As highlighted earlier, the GWP for Bajic decreased by 13% during the quarter to 4,326 crores, down from 4,962 crores for the same period last year. The degrowth is largely impacted by two elements, one being the timing variance on the booking of the bulky crop and government health business and the second one is what I referred earlier, the change in the accounting on long term products.
If we exclude the impact of volatility in the tender driven crop and government health business and the impact of one by N regulations, the growth in fact for magic is about 8% for the quarter as compared to the reported degrowth of 13%. Similarly, on a full year basis, the growth excluding crop and government health and the impact of one by N regulation for BAGIC is 12% which is about 3% higher than the industry growth of 9%. Again, industry compared both on ex crop, ex government and one by N basis. Further, it is heartening to see that the growth on core business lines of Bajic such as commercial lines including fire, marine engineering and liability and on motor and retail Health the growth for Bagic has been far better than the industry for both the quarter and the full year.
Group Health, however, continues to be a tactical play with pricing continuously under pressure. The underwriting loss for Bajic for the quarter stood at a nominal 3 crores as against a loss of 76 crores for the same period last year. This underwriting result we believe will be by far the best in the industry. They the combined ratio however, stood elevated due to the accounting anomalies which I explained a little while earlier at about 104.8% in quarter four versus 101.6% for the same period last year. However, if we exclude the impact of one regulation, the combined ratio stood at 103.1%.
The elevated combined ratio is attributable to the degrowth in GWP which we discussed earlier and and uptick in motor business during the quarter. While elevated, we believe that the combined ratio reported by Bajic will still be amongst the lowest in the multiline market. The profit after tax for the quarter stood at 363 crores, down from 380 crores last year, a decline of 4%. But this was primarily attributable to realized gain on investment which was lower in this quarter because of market conditions compared to the same period last year. However, if we eliminate the impact of the mark to market changes on investments, the pact has actually grown at a healthy 21%.
The AUM for Bajic, which represents cash and Investments as of 31st March 25th stood at 33,115 crores as against 31,196 crores per the same period last year, an increase of 6% in spite of paying a very healthy dividend in FY24 and on account of market volatility, Bagic continues to deliver superior ROE on an annualized basis at about 16% versus 15.2% last year. And if we exclude the impact of surplus capital which is taking solvency at 200%, the ROE is supposed to be even healthier at upwards of 22% for Bajic. On the customer front, BADGIC relentlessly drives the theme of caringly yours on the foundation of customer obsession through innovations in customer experience.
And accordingly, Bagic continues to have the lowest grievance ratio in the industry and the highest NPS consistently year on year in a market which is intensely price competitive. This operating result, we believe, displays Bagic’s commitment to a balanced and profitable growth on back of deep and broad distribution and prudent underwriting, while focusing on best in class customer service. In summary, despite market constraints, a decent result from Bagic in terms of growing higher than industry on core retail business lines and commercial lines and maintaining strong profitability metrics. I will now move to Ballic. During the quarter Bilic’s new business growth was muted which is in line with the industry largely impacted by the new surrender regulations and the stock market volatility.
During the second half of the year, Ballic launched Ballic 2.0 with focus on sustainable and profitable growth while restructuring products to comply with revised product regulations. Simultaneously, it restructured most of the other products as well, focused on balanced product mix and focus on cost for operating leverage. The early Results from Balik 2.0 are visible through three outcomes for the quarter. The VNB growth, the first one being the VNB growth of 14% from 480 crores to 549 crores despite the individual rated premium being flat and despite group protection de growing by 4% during the quarter. The second one being retail protection growth of 84% also backed by increase in share of higher protection Europe and focus on riders and the third and the most important being the NBM expansion by almost 4% at a strong 22.1% for the quarter as against 18% reported for the same period last year.
On the back of continued strong renewal Premium growth of 29%. Ballic GWP grew 13% during the quarter. The consistent growth in renewal premium reflects the improvement in persistency over the last five years. Overall on individual rated new business basis the mix of business for quarter four stood at par at 21%, nonpar savings at 27% term at a very healthy 6%, annuity 6% and Ulips at about 40%. Ballic has been increasingly enhancing focus on protection business and hence retail protection grew by 63% to 393 crores in FY25 versus 241 crores of premium in FY24. Ballic is also building on the data and analytics for direct sales through Upsell and Cross Sell initiatives.
It has led to Ballik’s presence in 407 cities with dedicated verticals for various customer segments. On the institutional business side the company continues to expand its network of partners and grow existing partnerships. Balic now has reasonably large number of bank assurance tie ups which should help it reduce any concentration risk. On the persistency front we have largely maintained position in line with the previous year. The profit after tax for quarter four stood at 41 crores versus 106 crores in the same quarter last year. This is lower due to lower realized gains as we saw for Magic as well and on account of higher tax provisioning.
Balic ended the quarter with an AUM of 1:23,734 crores overall, a mixed quarter for Balic but on the right trajectory of sustainable and profitable growth year on. Finally, both insurance companies are financially among the most solvent in the industry, Balik with 359% solvency and and Bajic at 325% solvency and hence both the companies are well poised to weather any external adversity. I must however reiterate that insurance is a long term business and we remain steadfast in our commitment to drive profitable growth, create sustainable value and always prioritize interest of the policyholders. Let me now move to our lending businesses BFL and BHFL to start with on BFL a very good quarter on all metrics including business volumes, aum, OPEX and credit cost the number of new loans booked in quarter 36% to over 1 crore as against 80 lakhs in the same period last year.
BFL added about 47 lakh new customers during the quarter, with customer franchise now standing upwards of 10 crores. The company’s diversified business model has enabled it to record a strong aum growth of 26% at 4,16,661 crores as of 31.03.25 as compared to 3:36,15 crore as of 31.03.24. The net interest income grew by 22% to 9,800 crores as against about 8,000 crores in the same period last year. The OPEX to total income improved to 33% as against 34% in the same period last year. Net loan losses and provisions for the quarter were about 2,300 crores. The company made an additional provision of about 360 crores on account of ECL model redevelopment in quarter four.
Adjusted for this, the loan losses and provisions for the quarter were about close to 1970 crores in quarter four. Net increase in stage two and stage three assets was only about 289 crores. Stage two assets increased by 784 crores and stage three assets decreased by 495 crores. The company has indeed started seeing improvement in early vintages across all portfolios. The GNPA and NNPA stood at 96 and 44bps respectively as of 31 March 25 as against 85bps and 37bps as of 31 March 24, which we believe is amongst the lowest in the industry. Profit after tax grew 17% during the quarter from 3,825 crores to about 4,480 crores.
Both the return on assets and return of equity remains stable. The capital adequacy remains strong at 21.93% as of 31st March 25th and tier 1 capital was at about 21.09%. Bajaj Finser app has now 7 crore net users and the Fin AI transformation is progressing well for Bajaj Finance. You would have also heard about the corporate actions declared by Bajaj Finance last evening which include a share split, bonus shares and a special interim dividend. The bonus issue and special interim dividend reflects the company’s strong financial position, robust reserves and a positive growth outlook. Moving now to Bajaj Housing Finance, the mortgage subsidiary of Bajaj Finance, A very good quarter on an overall basis.
Aum grew by 26% to 1 14,600 crores at March 25, up from 91,370 crores from the same period last year. Growth was very well distributed across all the business segments of Bajaj Housing. The home loans aum grew by 22%, loan against property grew 28%. These rental discounting grew 24% and developer finance grew by 49%. The net interest income grew 31% to 823 crores as against 629 crores for the same period last year. Operating efficiencies improved significantly with OPEX to net total income at only 21.7% in the quarter as against 27.1% in the same period last year.
The loan Provision was a BESL 30 crore in the quarter adds against 35 crores for the same period last year. Healthy asset quality was maintained with GNPA and NNPA of 29 bips and 11 bps respectively at March 25. As against sorry 27 bps and 10 bps for the same period last year. Profit after tax grew by 54% to 587 crores for the quarter as compared to 381 crores for the same period last year. Both ROE and ROA were steady. Capital advocacy remained strong at 28.24% as of March 25 and Tier 1 capital was at 27.72%.
In summary, another very strong quarter for both our lending companies Bajaj Finance Ltd. And Bajaj Housing Finance Ltd. Now let me give you an update on our platform companies which is Bajaj Finserve Health Limited also referred as EBH and Bajaj Finserve Direct referred to as Bajaj Markets and Bajaj Finserve Asset Management Company Let me start by Finserve Health the numbers for the previous year are not comparable here due to the acquisition of Vidal Healthcare in quarter 125. Hence the previous numbers have not been provided in the investor in quarter 4 FY25, Bajaj Finserve Health carried out 28 lakh health transactions versus about 23 lakh in the immediately preceding quarter which is quarter 3 of 25.
Bajaj Finserve Health continued expansion of provider network which includes about 87,000 doctors, about 4,500 lab touch points, about 15,000 hospitals. Utilizing this network strength and its tech platform, EBH is able to offer integrated OPD, IPD and wellness experience to both our retail as well as corporate customers. Moving to Bajaj Markets during the quarter, Bajaj Markets attracted about eight and a half lakh consumers on its digital platforms. BFSI lending disbursed including secured, unsecured and both through BFL and outside partnerships for the quarter stood at 1865 crores of lending for the quarter as against 1636 crores for the same period last year.
Bajaj Market has been achieving new milestones regularly, some of the highlights of which are six new partnership additions during the quarter, taking the overall unique partnership count to 96 in number. Bajajan Markets has also been achieving cash profits consecutively now for two quarters. There has been no capital infusion in the company since March 22 showing capital efficiency of the company. Now an update on the Bajaj Technology piece, the vertical closed new GCC deal and two deals in the Middle east during the quarter. It has also published two solutions from the Cloud practice in AWS Marketplace which demonstrates the AWS expertise the company has built over a period of time.
Now moving to the Asset management company. The asset management company ended the year with a AUM of upwards of 20,000 crores which is up 17% from the immediately preceding quarter which is quarter three of FY25. We believe the Bajaj Finserv AMC is the fastest to cross the 20,000 crore mark which is in less than two full years of operations. The non group share of AUM stood at a very healthy 84% of the this was the update on the performance of all our companies. Before we open the questions, considering the paucity of time, I would request the audience to kindly keep their questions brief so that we can cover more questions during the call with This I invite questions from the audience.
Questions and Answers:
operator
Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touchstone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. Will take a first question from the line of Avinash Singh from MK Global. Please go ahead.
Avinash Singh
Yeah, good afternoon. Thanks a lot for the opportunity. Two questions, the first one on basic. Now your capital position is very, very strong and also there have been some changes regarding, you know, the cross border resistance regulation and all. Do you see, I mean your retention strategy changing from here? Because I mean if I see typically of course you have been lighting crop and all that. You also partly explaining that but your retention has been lower despite the fact that your capital position is very, very strong. And now there is kind of at the margin some change is required to this cross border reinsurance and all.
So do you see yourself kind of a changing your retention strategy or increasing your retention going forward? That’s my question on basic and on Balik. Now a lot of, I mean regulatory changes are already kind of behind in terms of your standard regulation or UN regulations going forward. I mean and also that the markets are now more sort of, I would say balanced than the buoyancy it had in last year. What kind of, you know, product mix and corresponding the trajectory of VNB margin you see from here onwards. Well, thanks.
S. Sreenivasan
I’ll request Tapan to take the first one on retention please.
Tapan Singhel
Thank you Lord. So I think in your question lies the answer. You mentioned that with the cbr, no rules changing and you also mentioned our strong capital which is there and also strong solvency which we have. So I think that is where the answer lies. A strong capital, a strong solvency. It doesn’t really matter if the CBR rule changes. If none of the fact gets more difficult. We have enough to be able to retain also and we have enough underwriting competence which we demonstrated over so many years to write good risk. I think the retention, if it makes sense then it’s good.
But if you look at the overall results, I think it is perfectly fine as of now the balance is pretty good in terms of what we did and what we outsource. But as you rightfully said, if there is a shortage of capacity because of strong capital base, alliance will still continue doing good and will be able to handle this very well.
Ramandeep Singh Sahni
Avinash I’ll just add to that, I think see our retention, if you see in the past has been on the lower side vis a vis the others in the market because of the bulky businesses we’ve been writing, especially in the last two years, we’ve written a lot of crop and government health. That is one reason. The second is we write a lot of commercial business also. And there you see that the growth we’ve been registering on commercial lines, which are some of the large risk there. Also because of the risk being very large, our retentions are on the lower side.
So that’s one reason you see some animal league vis a vis others in the market.
S. Sreenivasan
Just to add to what Raman and Tapan said, basically the aggregate retention for a composite insurance company is just a summation of the parts. We have multiple lines of business, the product mix changes and we have always been strong in the larger corporate and the commercial lines. Therefore line by line, if you see, I don’t think our retention has lowered at any time, but the mix of multiple businesses somewhat lower high retention will eventually determine what the net retail premium is.
S. Sreenivasan
We’ll move to Tarun for the product mix and the margins question.
Tarun Chugh
Yeah, thanks Raman. So Aginash, you’re right. Regulatory change is largely behind us in terms of product mix. You’ll see more in line with what you saw in Q4, higher growth in protection and the other part of the retail business largely remaining product mix remaining stable in the direction that you saw in Q4 as far as group protection is concerned. I think we are all waiting and watching how the interest rate change impact happens and whether we have higher growth in lending and that is what is going to decide how credit life really grows and that will impact the industry equally.
We are now well positioned because we are well diversified, not just dependent as we used to be a couple of years back in any one segment. So that should help us in terms of VNB margin trajectory. I think that’s a good point. You saw the change expansion already in Q4 beyond what you heard Raman talk about. We have also taken significant calls on cost structures, looking at more productive investments, removing wastage inefficiency and some places significant cost cuts. This is helping us leverage to an extent. You saw that operating leverage show up in Q4. We expect hence the VNB margin trajectory to be far more steeper and hence a high growth in VNB margin versus what you would see in the revenue side.
I hope that answers your question.
S. Sreenivasan
I’ll just add to what Tarun said. Avinash I think one is obviously structurally like doing more term or group is margin positive on an aggregate basis. But we are confident from a BFS level that the actions that Dialik has taken also structurally improve the margins of the other lines of business. Therefore that may fully play out only in FY27 but you should start seeing the benefits by second half of next year. So with more than margins we continue to concentrate on improvement in VNB and the growth in VNB being better than the growth in the rated premium.
Avinash Singh
Thank you. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. We’ll take our next question from the line of Swarnabh Mukherjee from BNK Securities. Please go ahead.
Swarnabha Mukherjee
Thank you for the opportunity for badit. I just wanted to understand the combined ratio outcome. So first of all the loss ratio looks very benign this quarter but I feel that the motor TP and the fire loss ratio has.
operator
I’m sorry to interrupt. Can you use your handset mode please? Your audio is not very clear.
Swarnabha Mukherjee
Yeah, is this better?
operator
Yes, please go ahead.
Swarnabha Mukherjee
Yeah, sure. Thanks. So I just wanted to understand the combined ratio outcome because loss ratio when it has been denying can see that motor TP and fire loss ratios are lower. So just wanted to check about the reserve releases there. You know which quarter I mean where you felt the need to reduce the reserve particularly looks from the triangle that is Access India 24 there has been a bit of a release. So if you could give some comments on that. And on the expense side again there has been quite a increase. So is this primarily coming due to the fact that, you know most of the growth this quarter has come from the broker segment and the outgoing has been higher.
So if you could just break down that, that would be very helpful for budget And Danik sir, first of all congrats on the VND outcome. I think very strong numbers which we have reported compared to what we are reporting historically. Wanted to understand that right now how much of cost overrun is baked into the margin. Like if we were to absorb later on what could be the possibility? If you could give some color on the structural nature of the margin for our product mix and secondly if you could call out the reasons for the operating variance and assumption changes in the EV work.
So these are for Gajik and Bang. And just a small question on Bajaj Health, there is a segment mentioned international where I think a lot of large share of claims are coming. Just wanted to understand our nature of offerings here. Who would be the customers if you could give some color and whether the claims outcome is unfavorable in this Segment. Yes, that’s all. Thank you.
S. Sreenivasan
So we’ll start with magic first. I’ll just try to answer that and hand over to Tapan or Ram. I think what’s relevant and what I mentioned earlier also if you look at the underwriting loss for the quarter is very, very low at only about 3 crore. So it’s almost close to zero. So what you’re seeing as elevated combined ratio is actually an outcome of GWP not being there in the quarter because of the one by N regulations and animal in the crop and government health distribution of premium during the year. So I think that’s causing a stress on the expense ratio for the quarter because that’s the way the combined ratio is calculated.
But I think when you see the underwriting loss, it’s up missile 3 crores. That’s why I thought I’ll just highlight that before I hand over to Tapan or Ankur.
Tapan Singhel
Noor.
Tapan Singhel
I think you covered it very well.
Swarnabha Mukherjee
Right, sir.
Swarnabha Mukherjee
This is just a follow up.
Swarnabha Mukherjee
I mean in terms of commissions etc. There is nothing very incremental even due to the channel exchange.
S. Sreenivasan
No. So I think what has changed and what I highlighted earlier also was that the growth on motor and retail health has been on the higher side both for the quarter. For the quarter actually and there obviously on new sales, you know that the commission’s on the higher side. So that’s the mix of new has moved up and that’s why the commission is looking high. So it’s only a mix variance. There’s no incremental payouts which we are doing. This should get normalized when you look at the whole year numbers and the.
S. Sreenivasan
Overall EOM is well below the regulatory allowance. So Bajic has the leeway subject to market conditions and the businesses they want to pursue. And if things start improving, I think they have the levers available to them to go back into to growth into the preferred segments.
Ramandeep Singh Sahni
Okay, we’ll move to Balik Tarun or Vipin on the.
Tarun Chugh
I’ll have Vipin if you can answer that please.
Vipin Bansal
Sure, sure. So I think Mr. Mukherjee, first question on overrun. So all the overruns are accounted when we report our GNB and margin. So I didn’t understand, but all that we incur, even if there are overruns, all of them are accounted for and they are reflected in our VNB and margin in terms of operating variance.
Vipin Bansal
There were fewer new segments that we.
Vipin Bansal
Started writing a year, year and a.
Vipin Bansal
Half back and some of them have.
Vipin Bansal
Produced a little lower persistency than what we had generally experienced. While they are still profitable to similar other products. These are new segments that we have been testing. And on ULIP side also beyond 61st month we have seen some surrenders and all of that coming. Maybe that’s because of market upside. I think those are the reasons. Purely on mortality, if that was your intent on mortality side, our experience is in line with expectations. So there are no variances there.
Swarnabha Mukherjee
Okay, sir, understood. If you could highlight the health segment.
S. Sreenivasan
Sorry.
Vipin Bansal
International peace. Devang is here, he’ll speak.
Vipin Bansal
I could not hear the question very correctly.
Devang Mody
He just wanted a flavor on the international business.
S. Sreenivasan
Okay. So I think on international side, see, our stated strategy is India has lot of volumes and we handle considerable volume. And our aim will be to convert that transaction volume into capabilities which we can probably offer to ensure international insurers in that direction. We already have two customers internationally as we speak. In last quarter we have serviced those two insurers. Our focus just now is less on business development, but to harden our capabilities which can be utilized by international insurers. We do fair bit of transactions there, but because in International Market OPD is 70% of total value disbursed by insurers.
And we have obviously over period of last six years created a lot of capability around opd. That’s why the number of transactions are very, very high interest rate. But we are just scratching the surface. As it is widely known, While India is 16% of global population, India is less than 1% of health care spend of the world. Now while these statistics are very colorful, we are very optimistic that given that we process a lot of volumes in India, our competency set in technology, in AI would create a proposition for international market. That as we continue to create this capability and service our customers, we will be able to actualize the benefit of these revenue streams.
I hope I have explained what you were looking at. Unless you have any clarification on this.
Swarnabha Mukherjee
Yes, just one small query was that in terms of profitability, if I were to think about the domestic versus the international peace, how will it stand.
Devang Mody
In terms of profitability? Obviously international is significantly higher, but actually it’s not a very Apple to Apple comparison. The investments in creating capabilities is completely absorbed by domestic business. So it’s not a Apple to Apple comparison. It’s like international business for us is it’s actually cream part of the overall business architecture and the profitability in longer term also will always remain higher in international. All of us know that India is extremely cost conscious as well as competitive market. So going forward also we believe that international will Be higher on profitability, significantly higher on profitability, but the market size there is tremendous.
So it’s not that we are pricing ourselves too high, it’s just that those markets have ability to pay more. The key for us is how do we create capabilities on what we internally call is whatever we sandbox in India. How are we able to convert that into capability which can be sold internationally? Profitability will always remain higher.
Ramandeep Singh Sahni
I think just to add to what Devang said, the 2.8 million claims that we service, it’s a fairly sizable number that kind of volumes will never get internationally in some of the countries. Therefore, this is the bread and butter of our business. That is the one which helps us as it grows. We’ll continue to invest in capability and we want to make a gold standard product in terms of technology, service, in terms of integration, digital AI, all of them linked together with the data science built in for handling, abuse management and various other things. In terms of medical understanding the medical field better and better as we do more transactions.
I think it’s a very long term business. Over the next 15, 20 years, we believe this is going to be a very large play. In India today we have a lot of fintechs, some hospitals, there are insurance companies, there are people and all of them doing bits and pieces of these. But as we see the next 15 years, we see the size of the opportunity being very large. And once we build the capabilities over the next few years, we think we should probably be in a better position than any other because we have the brand to back it up as well.
Swarnabha Mukherjee
Understood, sir. Thank you so much for the detailed answer. Thank you and all the best.
operator
Thank you. We’ll take our next question from the line of Madhukar Lada from Nuama Wealth Management. Please go ahead.
Madhukar Ladha
Hi, good afternoon everyone. Just had a couple of questions. First on Dallic, the margin improvement has been very good. Congratulations on that.
Madhukar Ladha
But in terms of growth, I see that growth is slowing down, which is.
Madhukar Ladha
As per what we had discussed earlier as well. But Moving on into FY26, 27, how do you see AP growth and BNB growth panning out? Some sort of sense of there will help us. Second, on the variances, operating variance and assumption change, I understand all of this.
Madhukar Ladha
Is related to persistency or is there.
Madhukar Ladha
Any other element of mortality or expenses also?
Madhukar Ladha
So those are my questions. On Ballic, on magic, the underwriting performance has been quite good this year. However, if we look at GWP growth.
Madhukar Ladha
It’S a little bit slower.
Madhukar Ladha
So.
Madhukar Ladha
You know, we are.
Madhukar Ladha
I’m guessing losing out on market share.
Madhukar Ladha
On a few segments. Any comments around how do you look at that? And you know I sense that growth.
Madhukar Ladha
In motor also has been a little.
Madhukar Ladha
Lower than the industry. So some color around market shares would be helpful. Thanks.
Ramandeep Singh Sahni
Vipina Tarun, do you want to take the first one?
Vipin Bansal
Yeah. So maybe I’ll start off. Yeah, thanks. I think the BNB margin. I know this is the second time we’re getting this response from these questions. Yeah, the VNB margin is looking good and honestly that was to be expected. We’ve been saying this as a guidance in our last two calls that we will be making a significant strategic shift which we did make and we have ensured that our VNB margin is now moving up in the direction. But as Srini said, while we look at margins, there is a lot of noise in the margins from the group business.
Hence the VNB is what we’ll be focusing and talking about more in terms of growth. Balik has been in the last five years the fastest growing private sector, fastest growing company in the country. We’ve had a CAGR of 30% and we consciously took a pause when the entire sector just changed the traditional plans only we looked at every plan that we had. Ulip, turips, which is a term, ulips that we have nowadays and traditional plans as well. And we looked at redesigning, restructuring our products entirely. So while 50% of the products change in the market, we changed all.
We changed 100% of our products. This was to result and I think it was a call which on hindsight has gone correct because we did foresee that with so much of surrender value changes happening and all 50% of the products changing. 3 million advisors having to undergo training. All bank assurance branches having to undergo training. There will be a slowdown in the sector for the second half which is exactly the way it panned out. We hence time, we chose this time to plan more on a far more significant one time structural change which we’ve done.
Now that change on anything that we had to do on margins is behind us. Now we have to work on frugality, ensuring that we are cost efficient and that will ensure that the direction of VNB margins remain high. So your question, the second part of the first question is on will the margins be growing or will the top line be growing? As far as the top line is concerned, if I just get a little bit more detailed, the bank assurance business has picked up from where it left and the transition has been a lot more smoother.
Proprietary sales has taken a Little bit more time because we changed all the ULEIP plans as well, which nobody else changed. So. And that was a significant part of their product mix which has of course resulted in them going a little slower, although it remains still the fastest growing business for us. The agency side has required to have a lot more discussions with advisors because we change the compensation and that I think will be taking a little bit more time to settle in. So the growth we expect, which has been muted for particularly agency, shall remain slightly muted even in Q1.
But having said that, for us it is unique because we were one of the fastest growing last year, H1 as well, we grew by 31% and while our peer set was far, far lower. So that high base effect will also come in. So we’ll have to look at it and put it in perspective from that. And as Srini mentioned, H2 onwards, you see growth for top line also starting to come up significantly. But you should expect overall for us a higher growth in VNB in this coming year. And I think that’s the message I’d like to leave you with.
Tarun Chugh
Your second question is on variances, although very clearly Vipin has touched on it, but I just mentioned because he was specific, there is no impact of mortality or expenses on this variance.
Madhukar Ladha
Okay, great. Thank you for the detailed answer.
Madhukar Ladha
And on magic.
Tarun Chugh
Y es, on magic, if you look at no, if you look at the year on number we’re a bit surprised on your comment that you would have lost market share. So if you look at your year number and Rama explained the one by N that is why this is and we have a disproportionate higher share of the market of long term business. So I think that is what gives you this perception. Otherwise if you look at segment wise, you don’t know if does computer segment wise number. If you look at it then I think be it commercial lines, be it motor, be it retail health, be it government health, it be at the only two lines of business where our share would be lower than the market.
One would be crop insurance which we had mentioned earlier that if you look at this time in crop and I remember couple of years back everybody was shying away from crop and the question I was answering is that crop business we understand and we do it and we continue doing it. And then when people saw that we did it. Well, everybody is into the crop business currently. Now let’s see, when we see lot of intensity in some business and pricing is not what we feel is appropriate, then we go slow a bit. So crop insurance I think we would have a lower market share.
And in miscellaneous it is because the cattle business that we had, which we have no gone slow because the lending has gone slow, not because we have store intensity with lending on that business gone slow. Minus that, I think we would have been ahead of market in all lines of business. And we pick up the yearly number. Actually ahead of the market is the one by N which is playing out in spite of letting go of some crop business and not letting go because of lending being less in the cattle business that being bit less.
So that is where the actual question is. Ankur, you want to add something or Raman, you want to add something?
Ramandeep Singh Sahni
Maybe I can just talk about. I think one thing which is playing out is the proportion of long term business for us versus the market has been on the higher side. So on an average long term business which is impacted by the one by N regulation for us was 7% of our GWP. For the market it’s been 3%. That’s why, you know, the numbers look a little odd. But so if you like Tapan highlighted, if you look at the full year numbers, the industry growth on GWP has been about 5% both for us and the industry.
Now if I exclude the impact of government, health and crop, we have grown at about 8%. Industry has grown at about 7%. So we’ve grown 1% higher. Now if I actually negate the impact of 1N, we have grown at about 12% and the industry has grown at 9%. Now if I break that further into retail segments, which is what you were referring to on motor, in fact, our growth has been in line with the industry. Industry has grown at 7.9%, we’ve grown higher at about 8.5%. Retail health industry has grown at 8.5%, grown at about 13%.
Commercial lines, which is a summation of fire, marine liabilities, all of that put together, industry is flattish, it’s grown only 1%. We’ve grown at 8.5%. So what Tapan highlighted actually the stress is looking only from the one by N part and also the loss of some business on crop which we mentioned earlier, we will do that business only if it makes commercial sense. And we know most of the people are doing it only to get arbitrage on EOM today. So to answer your question, I think from a top line perspective, I think we’ve outperformed the market almost in all segments this year.
Madhukar Ladha
Great, Understood.
Madhukar Ladha
Thanks a lot, sir.
operator
Thank you. We’ll take our next question from the line of Manish Dhariwal from Fiducia Capital Advisors. Please go ahead.
Manish Dhariwal
Yeah, good afternoon. Am I audible?
operator
Yes, please go ahead.
Manish Dhariwal
Yeah, thank you for this opportunity.
Manish Dhariwal
So I.
Manish Dhariwal
My question was at two levels. One, that the organization, you know, the group has taken this decision of buying the 100% of the two insurance businesses now. And now, you know, your approvals and all the thing has sunk in. Earlier it was that it’s going to happen sometime. Now it’s happened. Now you’re in short, execution part is happening. I wanted to understand how say over a period of say about three to four or five years, you know, it’s a long term question. How would the flavor of these two businesses undergo a change? Like you did mention about some international forays which I’m sure earlier there was maybe some restrictions.
Alliance being a partner, already being a global player. So if you could just give us some, you know, long term perspective on both the insurance businesses that you run.
Ramandeep Singh Sahni
Sure, I think I’ll take that question. And Srini. Yeah, thanks. I think when we look at the opportunity spectrum in both the insurance spaces, it is very large. While both the businesses continue to remain very competitive and we expect more competition to come in the future. In the long run, it is a game of balance sheet size, capital and brand. We have already done the hard work over 20 years and if you see most of the people who are coming in recently are finding it more difficult because of the level of competitive intensity to get to the minimum scale that is required for a viable insurance business.
As far as the decision of Allianz to exit is concerned, it is a decision of Allianz to exit and we have executed the spa and it does give us the opportunity now to use the Bajaj brand and the capabilities that we have at the Bajaj Group to play the opportunity spectrum in insurance business. Clearly in a joint venture there are always restrictions, there are shareholding patterns and difficulties in dilution. There may be difficulties in various strategic initiatives that you may want to take. If it is not, you know, viable for both the shareholders to go ahead with that.
We think there are three, four things that we mentioned. The first is it can we now have it 100% allow lot more leeway to look at strategic opportunities which may involve dilution. Maybe we can look at other business initiatives including for example in the Gibbs City, we can look at the pension business. Potentially we can look at international foray as well because this is a sign of a very large amount being put up as domestic capital and we have fair confidence, confidence that this Capital will yield the shareholders a very good return over the years to come.
So there are many levers that will play out and we are not short term players. We are more than 100-year-old group and therefore we have the patience and the resilience to be able to play it with the aid of the surplus capital and the power of the brand that we have or we lack a little bit in flexibility. We get that as well now.
Manish Dhariwal
Yeah. Thank you, thank you. And some bit of favor on the, on the health business. The way, you know, like the number of transactions are increasing, vital acquisition happening, SOAP steps are happening, you know, like more and more hospitals and you know, the footprint is expanding. How, when are you seeing this to emerge and a meaningful business, say three years, four years, five years, where the numbers actually make an impact on the balance sheet.
Ramandeep Singh Sahni
Yeah, let me take that first before I pass it on to Devang. As I said earlier, we believe health care, healthcare services, the entire space spectrum of healthcare from tooth to tail is going to be a significant industry in India. We have a significant proportion of the population which require government schemes to be able to support health care. We also see that the insured population is much smaller because of the higher price and the fact that insurance today covers only the hospital. And there is a missing middle and all of these are continuing to grow.
Therefore, we believe there is a long term opportunity. We already have made the most difficult part of building the network for the OPD services. It is easier said than done because it is a very small, I mean it is a significant amount of effort, capital and time. And then you have to then build a model out of it with the tpa, with our insurance company in Bajic and the OPD capability and the initial foray into international business that we already have. We believe we have all the tools available now, but we need the volumes to be able to further sharpen our capabilities.
So we are very confident. At bfs, the value may or may not come from the traditional way of measuring profit in terms of profit and equity, but in the long run, value will emerge because of the size of the opportunity and how long we remain invested in the business. And we have all intention of being remaining investor in the business.
Devang Mody
I think you, your question was about relevant for numbers.
Devang Mody
Of course we are meaningful, meaningfully meaningful numbers.
Devang Mody
Yeah. We are very proud to have very large companies in the group which contribute substantial portion of consolidated revenue and so see our view as a group about health businesses. Health remains one of the largest spend item for Indian consumers and it will only Grow further in percentage spend of Indian households in coming years. Point number one, correct. Point number two, health has ripe for disruption in our view with ingestion of new technologies, specifically AI. Because there are certain nuances of health business which are very suitable for usage of AI. Globally, health thrives on unstructured data because every patient is different.
And third point is India has tremendous population and hence in technology world, if I say humongous training data, this can be put to use to service Indian consumers and also to monetize those capabilities globally. But it is a health has longer gestation. So number relevance is a matter of spreadsheet work. What we are focused on is that we add value to Indian ecosystem and take those capabilities globally to add value to some of our international customers. So it’s a longer journey. But as a group we are, in my view we are extremely suitable because we are long term players in anything we do to add to solve this problem over a period of time.
So it’s a very contextual question. Number answer would require a lot of spreadsheets and we are not focused on that. Relevance on spreadsheet. Yeah.
Manish Dhariwal
Thank you. Thank you. That, that helped. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, before we take the next question, would request participants to keep their questions back brief as we have other participants waiting for their turn. We’ll take the next question from the line of Umang Shah from Banyan Tree Advisors. Please go ahead.
Umang Shah
Hi sir. Am I audible?
operator
Yes, please go ahead.
Umang Shah
Yeah. Thank you, sir. Just one question on Balik. What would be what how much of our AP would be coming from the largest banker partner that we work with? This was for Balik or Magic.
S. Sreenivasan
Okay, so the largest one contributes to about 22% of our business.
Umang Shah
Answer. With that player now looking to acquire an insurance company that we compete with, would you be looking to reduce your presence there or would that business be coming at a lower profit than other channels?
S. Sreenivasan
See, we are talking of access very clearly here, right?
Umang Shah
Yes, yes, yes.
S. Sreenivasan
I’ve had the player has had an investment already and they have been in and they were declared promoters of that company, which was the intent, I guess from them for a long time.
And they were very clear when they added us that they would be a partner that they would be going ahead and adding a lot many partners in the bank itself for life insurance. And despite, you know, the fact that they already have their own company, we are still maintaining 25% plus minus 1% here and there. Margin. Sorry, margin as in the market share in the, in the, in the bank and as far as margins are concerned, we don’t talk about margins individually for players. These are bilateral transactions.
Umang Shah
Sure, sir, thank you so much.
operator
Thank you. We’ll take our next question from the line of Sanket Goda from Avendus Park. Please go ahead.
Sanketh Godha
Yeah, thank you for the opportunity. So I have two, three questions on Dajic. First, sir, if you look our tender based business is almost 25% of our total GWP. See honestly the predictability of the growth of this particular number looks. Looks very difficult for us to estimate. So just wanted to understand how confident you are that this business which is 25% of your business will repeat again next year. And suppose if you don’t win then you have a game plan probably to substitute that business with some other line of business. Just want to understand that thought process on the continuity on growth given, given tender based business is 25% of total GWP.
That’s one thing. And second is on reinsurance acceptance because the rates are little better. So there are a couple of insurance companies which have already alluded that they might be little aggressive with respect to accepting as a reinsurance business which could help in GWP growth. So have you, do you have any thoughts on those lines of the business? And lastly on data keeping on magic, can you give two, three figures, advanced premium number, duration of our bonds and yield to maturity on the bonds. Yeah, that’s on magic.
Sanketh Godha
Maybe.
Sanketh Godha
I have two questions on Dalik. Sorry.
S. Sreenivasan
Okay, so let’s look at when we talk of bulky business tender business, whether it comes, doesn’t come. You understand the nature of dimensions business. It comprises of two, three parts and it is inherent part of business. One is retain. No, Second would be tender based tender basis. Not only in terms of when you talk of government government or you talk of crop, it’s also in commercial lines of businesses. Lot of large risks also are tender based in the marketplaces commercial lines also. And if you look at the segmentation, the tender based business in the total industry portfolio would also be close to what if I’m not wrong, about 30% or so or more.
That is there now it’s a large company. It’s a, a company with among the largest number of customers in India. If you’re a company which is top three including government companies in India in terms of top line. If you’re a company which is among the best combined ratio company in India, you will reflect what the market is. If the market tender business is close to about 30, 35% business and you have a 25% tender based business. I think it’s perfectly fine because you can’t be a large company and say there are not a tender based business at all.
Now the second part of the question is that how will it play out? Now we have been doing it for so many years. I don’t think that something is new. Some tenders we win, some tenders we lose. It’s inherent part of business over it goes. And sometimes if we lose lot of tenders then obviously that part of business market share may drop for some time. Like in we didn’t crop this time and we found the tenders being very aggressive in terms of the pricing which was about 30, 40% lower. We reduced our presence. We never exit any business and we always there we still have, we are still on the leading crop insurers in India even today.
And we still are there will be there and keep on participating in that. But it has no bearing in terms of that. No, we feel that it will just disappear, become zero or no, it will become like 100. It doesn’t work like that. As a large player you would be present in all lines of businesses. You would be having a substantial market share in all lines of businesses. And what makes sense in terms of our underwriting principle, that is where we will be disproportionately higher, where it doesn’t make sense will be lower in the market.
And this keeps on changing. It is not like written in stone. This year this will be, next year the same will happen. It keeps on changing. But this is inherent nature of business. I don’t think that’s something which one has to really be surprised about. And we have to look at each line of business separately, each product separately and each. We should write well and serve the customers very well. If you look at our grievance ratio and these are publicly available data at IID and we have been the least among the least grievance ratio in the country for so many like over a decade now.
Every quarter, every time IIT publisher been there, serve the customer well this is a principle of the business. So I don’t think that is something which we have to know really be very worried about or take strides.
S. Sreenivasan
What happens if we lose a tender? Gain a center. It’s part of the business. That was your first question. Second question was what on Bilik I.
Sanketh Godha
Was asking about a couple of companies are doing more reinsurance acceptance compared to what they were doing in the past. So.
S. Sreenivasan
So what people are talking about is not reinsurance acceptance. It’s about writing commercial lines of businesses See they make treaties and they make faculty. That is a. That is just kind of a plan in way of protecting a balance sheet. There’s no question of regional acceptance by companies. Now they will look at commercial lines of businesses. But as Raman mentioned his talk we look at last year industry was growing at about what 1% or less than 1%. We are growing at 8% 8 times the industry growth in commercial lines of business. And we have been doing that.
So why would we slow down? I think whenever the pricing is right and where we can serve the customers well, we understand the risk. We would have a disproportionate market share there. So any change of stance would happen. Thank you.
Sanketh Godha
And that data keeping question actually advanced premium duration of bonds and YTM.
S. Sreenivasan
Sanket is closer to 2,500 crore rows.
Sanketh Godha
Okay. And duration of our bond
Anckur Anil Kanwar
around 5.5
Sanketh Godha
and current YTM.
Anckur Anil Kanwar
So the reliability is 8%.
Sanketh Godha
8. 8% you said right?
Sanketh Godha
Un.
Anckur Anil Kanwar
Yeah. The realized is 8% slightly in excess of 8%.
Anckur Anil Kanwar
8,003.
Sanketh Godha
Yeah.
Sanketh Godha
Okay. Okay. Perfect, perfect. Thanks. And maybe on this one question on Dalic see this. This strategic shift probably impacted meaningfully the agency channel as you alluded so and that’s almost till first half it was more than 40% of our EP. So you are fairly confident that the reset is already done or it will take some bit of more time and therefore, therefore the growth probably in this channel will be little back ended or you pick or you believe that in FY26 agency might be little muted because of the strategic shift what we have done on dallic side.
So this just one question on that side and if you can give your contribution of Access bank. That’s the second one.
Anckur Anil Kanwar
Yeah, yeah. I’ll answer the second part which I just did. Access is 22% of our business and overall if you notice that most of our peers set their largest bank is upwards of 40 to 50 to 60% as well. And it was a studied strategy that we shall not be dependent on one banker partner. And I think that’s how the banker partner also wants it. So I think that strategy has played out quite well and we’d like to have all businesses to grow at their healthy pace and not be over dependent on one coming back to axis.
Sorry to agency. The agency agency is a 1 lakh 50,000 agents business and we’ve been looking at changing the product mix for some time. And finally we landed up doing it in the second half of the year. It required a lot of reset and that reset is in place. We are Seeing positive green shoots come in in terms of activity productivity, which are the usual bits of first indicators. Engagement from agents has been reasonably on the uptake. We added about 57,000 agents last year and we opened 60 offices. Largely these offices are used by agency itself.
We are continuing to grow in the where we are hiring more agents. So that is only going to be a positive as we as we go ahead in time. In terms of growth rate. I did mention that we did have a significant growth in the first half last year. In fact, even agency in H1 grew by 23%. So that higher base is going to impact I’d say in mathematically the expected growth rate from agency which is obviously going to be muted in the first half and second half you should see a significant climb back in again because mathematically it was bad for the entire sector.
But even otherwise my indicators will be more on number of agents getting active, the segment of agents getting active, how many policies are they doing, whether they’re consistent or not. All the usual distribution parameters. If you look at and they are all in, I’d say the green shoots are visible and directionally we are feeling a lot more confident because don’t forget agency has been our mainstay all this while and agency shall remain a very strong part of our growth engines.
Sanketh Godha
Perfect. Perfect. That answers my questions.
Sanketh Godha
Thanks.
operator
Thank you ladies and gentlemen. We’ll take that as the last question for today. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Ajit Kumar from JM Financial for closing comments. Over to you.
Ajit Kumar
Thank you to all the participants for joining the call and a special thanks again to the management team of Bajaj and Sir for giving us the opportunity to host the call. Anything else, Srini? Sir, you want to add?
S. Sreenivasan
No, nothing else. I think we are the first half. We still believe the geopolitical and external environment will continue to be. We need to watch. It can be volatile but we are looking. We are very cautiously optimistic about H2 of the coming year when we should come back to growth. So we are using this opportunity on feedback AI in the airfl in looking at our OPEX cost in bandic and the margin profiles, restructuring the business on the surrender charges and in the case of Bajic we are waiting for the to continue our calibrated growth with a focus on strong underwriting performance.
Our platform businesses, we want to see them achieve more scale in terms of number of transactions. Both historically of direct and the health business. The mutual fund can be, you know, depending on how the market is the AUM growth can be volatile but we believe that we continue to differentiate in terms of each of our funds. And we’ll continue to build on distribution and grow the business from here. So this is largely what we are looking at over the next 12 months.
operator
Thank you. Thank you, sir. On behalf of JM Financial Institutional securities Ltd. That concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us. And you may now disconnect your lines.
S. Sreenivasan
Thank you.
Ramandeep Singh Sahni
Thank you very much, guys.