Kamat Hotels India Ltd (NSE: KAMATHOTEL) Q4 2025 Earnings Call dated Apr. 28, 2025
Corporate Participants:
Unidentified Speaker
Vishal Vithal Kamat — Executive Director
Smita Nanda — Chief Financial Officer
Analysts:
Unidentified Participant
Nupur Jainkunia — Analyst
Guru Darshan — Analyst
Aman Soni — Analyst
Ankur Kumar — Analyst
Raman KV — Analyst
Neeraj — Analyst
Nitech — Analyst
Jitesh — Analyst
Krisha Kansara — Analyst
Randeep Kapoor — Analyst
Siddall — Analyst
Kunyan Gandara — Analyst
Guru Darshan — Analyst
Rakesh Banerjee — Analyst
Presentation:
operator
Being recorded.
operator
Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the Q4 and FY25 earnings conference call of Kamat Hotels India Limited. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listenerly mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call please signal an operator by pressing the star then zero on your touchstone phone. I now hand the conference over to Ms. Nupur Jenkuma from Valoram Advisors. Thank you. And over to you ma’am.
Nupur Jainkunia — Analyst
Thank you. Good evening everyone and a very warm welcome to you all. My name is Nupur Jaythania from Valoram Advisors. We represent the investor relations of Kamath Hotels India Limited. On behalf of behalf of the company and Valorum Advisors, I would like to thank you all for participating in the company’s earnings conference call for the fourth quarter quarter and for the financial year 2025. Before we begin, let me mention a short cautionary statement. Some of the statements made in today’s earnings call may be forward looking in nature. Such forward looking statements are subject to risk and uncertainties which could cause actual results to differ from those anticipated.
Such statements are based on management’s beliefs as well as assumptions made by and the information currently available to management. Audiences are cautioned not to place any undue reliance on these forward looking statements in making any investment decisions. The purpose of today’s earnings call is purely to educate and bring awareness about the company’s fundamental business and financial quarter funded review. Let me now introduce you to the management participating with us in today’s earnings call and hand it over to them for opening remarks. We firstly have with us Mr. Vishal Mittal Farmers Executive Director and Ms. Mita Nanda, Chief Financial Officer of the company.
Without any further delay, I request Mr. Vishal Vittar Kama to start with his opening remarks. Thank you. And over to you sir.
Vishal Vithal Kamat — Executive Director
Thank you very much. Namaskar everyone. I am thankful to all who are present here today and to discuss the Q4FY25 and the financial year end results of the year 2025. The results along with a comprehensive presentation has already been made available for all to view on the stock exchange. The results along with the presentation has also been shared for you all to look at based on the assumption that many of you all are here. So thank you again for being here. Despite a relatively subdued first half, I am pleased to share that we had a much better second half resulting in an overall good performance for the year.
Looking ahead, the year looks very promising for us. We have some interesting things happening which we will share going forward. Along with the Q and A session in terms of operations, we recorded a 9% growth on our ARR reaching approximately 6,500. Our goal to increase the ARR to 7,500 by FY26 also is in place. Based on the new hotel openings and other aspects. I’m also pleased to report that we’ve been able to achieve an occupancy percentage on the group level of 65% for the quarter hotel to hotel, it varies. So this has been the thing.
As part of our strategic expansion we have opened the Chandigarh Orchid Hotel which I am very pleased to inform all that we did a soft opening in the month of April, mid April and we will be having the formal opening already will happen in the first week of May. It is a 122 room luxurious property. It is the first property when you leave Chandigarh airport coming towards Ziragpur. So strategic location with a very beautiful banqueting space. We have multiple banquets. We have south of India’s restaurant which is our signature restaurant from Mumbai. We have the Boulevard coffee shop which is massive for all day dining and considering how Chandigarh is we expect that it will do really well.
We have a pool deck and a pool restaurant, small restaurant deck and Sing at the pool which is on the ninth floor and we also have a fantastic beautiful lobby lounge. So it is a FNB centric hotel and we are very proud that it has shaped up very well. Apart from this also we have signed two new properties in Rishikesh which is a 54 rooms which is scheduled to open on 1st of July and we also have signed 153 room hotel in Kutch Mandvi which is set to open by December 27th. It might be a little before that also.
So I am hoping for that. This year has been particularly significant especially considering our various other Hyderabad will open shortly. Bhavnagar was delayed due to the fire that happened in Rashkot and that stopped a lot of the hotel work and even other works including malls and other aspects which I think whole Gujarat unfortunately suffered at the hands of the tragedy. But Bhavnagar is also on track now now with the things government giving the clearances and that will open this year along with Dehradun which got delayed is also there and Gwalior. So our expansion which is going on in this year we’re very happy to see that.
You know Chandigarh has been there, Hyderabad will be there, Rishikesh will be There, Bhavnagar will be there, Dehradun and Gwalior. So all these will be added to our Kamard family, Orchid Hotels and IRA hotels. Further, we also have some improvements happening which will further enhance the EBITDA and the sale at our things which is an ongoing process as already explained in our prior, which is Orchid Pune. The work is going on over there which will upscale the hotel and take it to the next level. Operation efficiency remains a key focus. We have been implementing various tools and technologies, energy consumption devices, streamlining labor, looking at AI and bots to help us with our various processes.
And we want to take our ebitda, we want to take our debt down which we’ve been consistently doing. We were at the 150, 140 which has come down to around 105, 105 for this year right now. And as already told in the past, we are in the same direction, rapidly reducing it further. In fact by this year that’s further. So that’s also there. So also use of technology has been paramount. We’ve been using a lot of tools to further bring the efficiency in terms of our finance accounts, operations and our compliances. So that’s also something which will reap us very rich dividends in the time to come.
So I’m once again sincerely grateful to all you investors and people who have been our stakeholders, well wishers for having that continued trust in us and being part of this call. Thank you very much and I look forward to the Q and A session after Smitaji finishes her address. Thank you.
Smita Nanda — Chief Financial Officer
Thank you sir. Namaskar and good evening everyone. Let me briefly touch upon the key performance highlights for the quarter ending 31st March 2025. The consolidated revenue of 1st Q4FY25 stood up at INR 93 crore representing the growth of approximately 9.5% on year on year basis. EBITDA for the quarter was 25 crore, a growth of around 6.4% year on year basis with the EBITDA margin 26.81. The profit after tax for Q4F5FY25 stood at INR 11 crore showing the significant increase of 423% compared to IMR 2 in Q4FY24 I.e. last year for the full financial year FY25 the consolidated revenue at INR 366 resisting the growth of 19.1% on year on year basis.
Total EBITDA for the year was INR 105 crores up by 15.2% year on year basis with the EBITDA margin of 28.9%. The profit after tax for the ES2 at IMR 47 crore which is reflecting 4% growth year on year basis with the PAC margin for the period end at 12.86%. With this, I conclude my remarks and request the moderator to open the floor for the question and answer.
Smita Nanda — Chief Financial Officer
Thank you.
Questions and Answers:
operator
Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press Star and one on their touchstone telephone. If you wish to withdraw yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two participants are requested to use handset while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Guru Darshan from Kitara Capital. Please go ahead.
Guru Darshan
Yes, thank you for the opportunity. So can you please share an update on the Mahabharadi palace jda? How much capability and what kind of revenue can we expect and what could the ROC look like from this property? And second, since we’re entering the new era with higher mix of these hotels, what kind of EBITDA margin in terms of percentage can we expect this year? Thank you.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Thank you very much. So basically we had entered into a JV that JV has not progressed ahead. So we basically are looking at someone else in terms of strategic partner from that perspective for the venture. That said, certain things are already moving ahead because we already have a beautiful plan in place and there have been various people who have shown interest in terms of partnering with us for the overall project. So once the finances, parts of those are shared with, once they are finalized, then we will be in a better position to tell you what would be the certain aspects because it will be based on what is the final outcome of the GV.
That said, it’s a property which is almost 200 rooms. It will be 180 plus minus rather so 180 plus minus around maybe 180. 185. 180 room property at Puri and Puri is the kind of product that this is. It’s a very premium destination. What we can see and the kind of market that is there that have become in a few luxury players like example Taj is there and there have been some other standalone also who have enhanced themselves and the ARR in that market has driven upwards. So we are also very buoyant to see that this would be a very lucrative ARR on the higher side kind of situation.
And considering that Puri especially is already a popular mice destination, you know. So we looking at this being quite fruitful in the time to come. So this said, this is basically the outlook of Puri. And what was the other thing?
Guru Darshan
The second question is, with a higher mix of leased hotels, what kind of EBITDA margin you’re expecting it would be? Still 35% or less than 35%. Just wanted to understand from you.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
So it’s a very nice question. Basically it will definitely come down, but it will come down slowly because what’s happening is that on one hand we have our own properties which are going to go up. Like example the Orchid Pune once its renovation and its upgradation completes. We find that that will give us a huge jump in our sales as we expect. And apart from that, apart from this movement in terms of our own, we’re also going in for joint for leasing and revenue share model properties. Now the thing is that on an average these revenue share properties, they give you a net return anywhere between 10 to 15% based on whatever is the overall terms.
So for example, if I go by industry thumb rule, let’s just for hypothetical say that you have a thumb rule of say 35%. Okay? So that means on 35% if my leaving is coming to around 20%, then I will be left with 15%. If my leasing or revenue sharing comes to around say 25%, then I’ll be left with 10%. So it depends on what is the. So now if the GOP is at 40% and even if my revenue or leasing percentage is coming to 25% still I’m left with a 15% margin. So the thing is that it will come down, but come down slowly in a tapered manner.
The reason being that the assets which we own, like the Orchid Mumbai, like Una Orchid and others which are there are basically contributing heavier than the newer properties coming in. Rishikesh, while it’s a property we expect to do around, you know, say 20,000, 18,000 it will do in its because that’s the kind of market it is still it’s only a 58 room hotel. So the kind of revenue impact and the EBITDA impact that will have is smaller in its footprint. So while there will be a tapering down, it will be on a slower but it will come down.
And as we are opening up more and more and in some cases there would not be an impact. Like example in the case of Mandvi, It’s a beautiful 153 room location. Now this 153 is a management contract. So because it’s a management contract, it will add to our fee. So that is where the plus point is for our management side. Also that some of our hotels which we are signing up are in the management space also. So we are not. But we are very choosy with the kind of management space we are taking. First and foremostly, more important than a beautiful property are very good owners.
Because in a management hotel we want like minded owners and once the owner is like minded, of course the property is going to do well. We want people who are, you know, having hospitality in their thought. Not that just they want to sweat an asset only, you know, it has to be that they want to recreate or something and then support that. So maintenance, upkeep, marketing. Because many times owners, they tie up with the brand and then they say now for something as small as 50,000, your asset is worth 50 crores. But then for 50,000 per month seems to be the pinch.
So that’s where we look at and see the owner whether they are really driven in that sense that what is the aspiration money and name. So that’s how basically this will also as these properties start coming in with help our fee income go up.
Guru Darshan
Understood. Thank you.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Thank you sir. Thank you.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Aman Soni from Invest Analytics Advisory. Please go ahead.
Aman Soni
Hi, am I audible?
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Yes sir, Please tell us.
Aman Soni
Congrats for meeting the guidance. My question is on next year outlook. While in your opening remarks you mentioned about positive tailwinds that are there in the industry and we are also going for new, new hotel openings as well. So my question is why are we looking for such a conservative outlook like we did around 360cr in FY25 and in PPT you have mentioned 400cr so next year. So why this slower growth we are targeting for FY26, that is one. And secondly on the margin guidance you mentioned to the earlier participant about fall in the margins and in this quarter as well there is a dip in the margins while in last quarter you talked about 35% to be a sustained benchmark number for the upcoming quarters.
So why there is a change in stance for the EBITDA margin? Sir, so these are my two questions. Thank you very much.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Thank you very much. That’s a very good question you have asked. See it’s I rather be sincere and cautious and practical than to just be exuberant and just say something and then not meet that. So the reason that we have a conservative approach is because hotels when they start from day one. The cash register doesn’t ring. Now let’s take the case of Chandigarh. Chandigarh has opened on 12 April on a soft manner. But the occupancy on certain days has been 90% on certain days has been 5%. Because it takes time for the market to get stable for you to get listed everywhere.
So a simple thing like a listing on even though we have strong tire partnerships with a booking.com and makemytrip even then for the algorithm to take shape for 10 people Google then they’ll see, then they’ll click then that discount popular. It takes time for your everything to come up. So if today like look at the various segments. One of the segments it takes time is basically OTA like I explained to you online. Another would be our own sales team. Some of them are able to get business on books in advance, some of them cannot. So what happens is it all takes us step by step.
We have tie up with airlines, airlines people also by the time just because we open they’ll suddenly not shift. They also have a process. So various of these MNCs who are going to stay with us, they have their audit process going on where they check for their own internal compliances wherever whatever they need. So this all takes a time. And that’s basically how there’s a build up on the books. So because of this build up on the books we will not capture necessarily the full revenue of the year considering we are in the month of now, almost May, okay as good as end May.
So we have basically kept a guidance based on a certain thing that this is what is the worst I could do, not the best I can do. And that’s basically why our guidance you can say is conservative. And again now considering also that the current scenario of this tariff, current scenario of global outlook, even this tragedy which has happened in Kashmir, all these things we have to factor in so that we don’t put ourselves ahead. So that is basically why we’ve been conservative. God willing, everything will be fine. We have strong able leadership at the center.
We have a very good now direction at least happening in our various states in terms of each state wanting to regardless of which political party they are. Most of the CMS are very pro business. So you know that’s another good thing. There’s an internal competition within India. Every state state is also competing among each other to target tourists. So they are giving various benefits. Recently Rajasthan government gave fantastic incentives to hotels. Incentive meaning they basically allowed fire license to be renewed for three Years which is a big cost and a big headache and small thing like that will help ease of doing business for all the hoteliers in Rajasthan.
Now that same kind of thing we are taking with as a representation of industry to other states also. So with all these things happening we have to basically be practical and conservative and definitely beat our expectations which is being shown to you. So that is basically why I would say that, you know, this is the thing. But yes, we are definitely not here to achieve what we’ve shown you to break that is our target.
Aman Soni
Secondly, on the margins part margins, I.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Think I just now mentioned to also the previous speaker that margins basically will come down based on our more leased properties opening up. Was that your question, sir?
Aman Soni
No, I was asking like in last quarter you mentioned 35% plus margin is kind of sustainable their own. But here we are speaking about coming down of the margins going ahead. So these things are not matching. So that’s why I’m asking like what, what is what? Why there is a change in stance as far as market.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Because what has happened is that a lot of the new properties which are coming in are on a more lease. We expect that this margin percentage will change if our overall self owned properties increase. But looking at the kind of opportunity we have, the pipeline that we have in our hotel pipeline, of the hotels we’re talking to as we speak, most of them have happening to be either revenue shares or leasing and few management. If you were to get some more management or if our own properties open up, then we will definitely find that the margins will be more or less similar or high or maybe go up also based on the kind of properties we are adding.
So that is basically the reason there are also certain cost impacts also which you could see in the things. So some of the cost impacts which are there, those cost impacts are also being mitigated by use of technology making certain things more streamlined, reducing certain bureaucratic things like our processes enhancing through using of software AI. So that also is happening. I must appreciate that our central team has been doing a lot of interesting things in terms of GST matching because a lot of leakages would happen with GST at times where if the vendor has not paid that falls into our responsibilities.
So we lose out sometime money there then making sure that our various payments go on time so that you comply with the rules. So these are all the things which also affect your margin which we have been working on. So we feel that in the coming time many of these things will be definitely not a problem.
Aman Soni
Understood sir, thank you very Much.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Thank you. Thank you.
operator
The next question is from the line of Ankur Kumar from Alpha Capital. Please go ahead.
Ankur Kumar
Thank you for taking my question. So my first question is OQ drop in revenue. Our utilization hasn’t dropped QoQ as in versus the December quarter. But revenue has dropped. Okay. Why, why has that happened?
Vishal Vithal Kamat
So revenue has dropped.
Ankur Kumar
Because third quarter.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Is always strong and fourth quarter, sir, see what happens now? Always it is if you see historically the normal cycle, okay. Is basically that you have a low first quarter. Okay. Let’s say if I was to say a benchmark of 100, you will have say the first quarter would be 100. The second quarter tends to be 90. The third quarter becomes 130, 120 and then the next quarter becomes 110. Broadly like this is a wave because of monsoon. Firstly because of summer and holidays based on the kind of mix we have. So in this season our Shimla Manali right now is doing exceedingly well.
It is full, kids are going, families are going. But same thing, you will find some corporate hotels of us where there might be a dip because obviously so you find that different mix, the different products are active. So this is why the fourth quarter does not perform to the same level as the third quarter. This is historically the case. And unless and until some triggers are there like some new hotel opening which then have you know the sales which add. But then next year again you will find once it naturalizes that this would be the bell curve.
This is a natural industry bell curve.
Ankur Kumar
Actually sir, page 13 has mentioned that occupancy rate is 65% both in Q3 and Q4 and ASPB. Q4 may improve. So that is why I was wondering occupancy be improved asp. We improved average room rent to be improved. So that. That is I.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
That’s a very good question. There is FND also there are other incomes also. Car hiring, spa hair, restaurant, business banqueting. So borrow. This is only based on room. But we have other incomes also which are there decoration, deposit for all that or they pay you some overall revenue. So it’s a very good question. Only room basis pay your Right. But we are also adding and talking about the other incomes that way sir.
Ankur Kumar
Got it. And sir would be as in last year we guided 1100 to 110 crore type EBITDA which we achieved so great on that sensor. But this year would you. Would you like to give some quantitative number on ebitda?
Vishal Vithal Kamat
I wouldn’t want to give any particular guidance sir. Because it would not be Like I said, we’ve been conservative in our top line. Also it’s very easy to deduct broadly what it would be. But our target this year would be to further because as we speak the company is spending a lot on technology. Some of the softwares and tools which we are looking at to enhance and reduce one is turnaround time to enhance. We are working on a lot of tat based initiatives to reduce wastage and to reduce the cost. So I think there should be some additional actual related efficiencies also coming in.
So that would probably help us with our EBITDA and overall expenses bringing down certain manpower in terms of automation. By 1st of May we had targeted that the entire Kamar Group, all the hotels will be entire digital. Your check in, your checkout, your bills in the restaurant, all on your only email and WhatsApp. So that also has happened successfully in few of our hotels. The delay from 1 May has gone to I think mota mota I would say third week of May. But entire Commerce Group will be entirely synced. Now what happens is not about only our ethos of saving paper, being an eco friendly chain.
That is one part but also very important is that today by doing these kind of initiatives, the tight integration integration happens for the accounting and finance. So your leakages chances go down, your mistakes from your employees, the chances go down. Guest is more happy because you know the records are there and many by the way considering we have so many lakhs of Orchid reward members, they get the points, they get the benefits because of which repeat business happened. I mentioned last time also 32% of commerce group is repeat business. So if 32% of our customers are coming again and again they are coming because apart from loving our food and service, they also are getting additional perks.
Late checkout, early check in if they are a reward member points. So by doing this our overall efficiency improves, our cost comes down, our compliance headache comes down. So these are all the kind of initiatives we are doing which I think this coming year will show us some dividend.
Ankur Kumar
But sir, in your earlier comment to other other parties when you said EBITDA margin will go down this year because of this, this new hotel that is.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Marginally basically based on again it will go up also because when Orchid Pune finishes renovation by this year it will finish a bulk of his renovation. There will be a good upswing in the banquets because two big banquet halls are coming in Pune. Orchid one is a 6,000 square foot banquet hall. One is a 3,000 square foot banquet hall. So two banquet halls are also being added apart from additional some rooms which we had also mentioned in the past. So all these also facilities will come now. These are our self owned properties. So considering that self owned their EBITDA will definitely help either mitigate the new properties coming in its marginal drop or it may help little increase temporarily.
But as we keep growing and as more and more properties we take on lease or revenue share, you will find that there.
operator
Sorry to interrupt, we have lost a connection on the management line. Please stay connected. Ladies and gentlemen, the line for the management has been connected. Yes sir, please go ahead.
Ankur Kumar
Yes.
operator
Oh yes sir, please go ahead.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Yeah, my apologies, the call dropped on the. So that’s basically it that. It is basically that that’s how it will fall. But it will not fall rapidly. It will fall as we have more lease and revenue share. And the reason we are more keen for lease and revenue share is because it allows us to operate the hotels as how we want. The top line, the bottom line, both are in our control as compared to a management where at times it is not, you know, it becomes a challenge with the owners. So that basically is what our comfort factor lies.
So that’s basically.
operator
Sorry to interrupt sir, the current participant has been disconnected. We will move on to the next question. It’s from the line of Raman KV from Sequent Investments. Please go ahead.
Raman KV
Hello sir, can you hear me? Yes Namaskar sir, I have two questions. One is with the secular tech part. So in the presentation you mentioned that you will introduce the tech so significantly. So my question is the debt has come come down from around 2,200 to like 202, 105. How much debt reduction are we expecting this year and what will be the. You know, with respect to the. On the quarterly basis how much this will be carry forward to the patent. Firstly let me share with you that even though our Debt is around 105cr, we today are sitting with cash in hand also which is approximately 25cr.
Unidentified Speaker
That is the cash in hand reserves we have. And we are in hurry to give this to the bank because we are sitting at a 10.5 interest rate which will come down in the near future. Okay, for that already Sridharji and team are working because a company like us with the kind of performance we are doing, they are eligible for much, much, much much lower rates of interest and they are doing the needful on that. But let’s assume for a second even that it is at 10.5 right now even by me giving this 25cr to the bank.
All I’m going to say for the year is a very limited amount of interest which is only 2.5 cr for the whole year. Instead we’d rather keep this money in hand because there are some interesting things which we can always keep seeing. You know if tomorrow something else happens in the world we should have money to be able to carry us. Now 25cr can comfortably carry us for a good amount of time throughout the year. So we’d rather keep this cash in rather than. We’re already sitting at around, you can say, you know around 80 crore of only debt against an EBITDA today of around 105.
102. Sorry. 102. Okay. So 102. Anyway, so basically you can see that we are very, very comfortable in our position right now. So we are in no hurry to look at reducing the debt aggressively. In terms of what we are looking at is that in this coming year, this 105 on its own based on our payouts and other things will come down to around 75.
Raman KV
Hello. Yeah, sorry, I was asking the timeline. Timeline is it’s a routine payment as per the year. So it will go as per the daily payoffs that we do. You know whatever that every month we have to pay.
So as per that it is there. So that means we’re talking about. So we’re looking at basically 2er. So I think you can say sir that this 75cr figure will be by the end of this year. It will come down every quarter by around. Around 8 max. 8 odd cr every quarter. 78 cr every quarter.
operator
Sorry to interrupt. Mr. Raman. I would request you to please come back in the queue for further questions. Also participants are requested to limit your questions to two per participant. The next question is from the line of Neeraj from White Pine Investment Management. Please go ahead.
Neeraj
Can you hear me right?
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Yes. Namaskar Niraji.
Neeraj
Yeah. Hi. Hi Vishal. Hey. One thing to check because this I’m not going to understand the maths. Few resumes are in the quarter. If you. If you do the revenues of the company in the quarterly numbers our revenues are 92 crores versus 110 crores on a sequential basis. December quarters 111 or so and 92 and a half is around. This is a fall of almost 2019 crores or so. But if you look at the table that you have given on 14 site 14 of 22, your occupancy is same, your rates are higher. If you think overall consolidated Type occupancy is 65 percentage.
If you look at the consolidated I’m comparing with the December quarter the rates are higher. 6500 is Q4 25 and 6377 Q3 condition. It’s actually a higher number. Occupancy is 65% and 65% is a flat. So and the revenues have fallen by almost in percentage terms almost 17%. So can you explain this slightly this number because if the boom revenues are same and generally SNB revenues are 60% or so of the revenues a 17% fall is a quite meaningful fall. So either the data that you have shown is not real or there’s a significant fall in the FNB file.
So just wanted to come rack your brains on that.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Yeah. So you are right Neeraji that occupancy of the rooms has been better this quarter. Okay. There is no 65% of the FND. FND normally is around 35. 40% goes up in quarter three. It then drops because the S dates, wedding date, those may be lesser in the third in the fourth quarter. So while the rooms have done well there has been a dip in the fnb. Okay. And that is where the other incomes basically plays the holistic. So you are correct in your assessment. Occupancy of rooms and other things has been good. Okay. And but there has been a dip in other revenues which is basically the thing and then new season, third quarter you have Christmas new year this year Diwali was also there.
Various other, you know our Hindu festivals and other festivals being there we have done better in our FNB also. So that is definitely there which is the case over here. And FNB mota motor depending on hotel hotel it changes anywhere between 25 to 40% not 65% sir. So it’s a good question. I answered this actually same point to the gentleman beforehand also I know your.
Neeraj
Answer but the number is quite starting. That is when I ask you second question is you know number of rooms that is increasing. It’s quite meaningful in percentage terms. Right. And for next year. So the number of rooms that you’re projecting to be increased from this quarter and two next year and it’s quite meaningful like but the revenue potential that you’re talking about is not as meaningful. So is it because they’re back ended or is it because you know they have a lower ARR or can you see some thoughts on that why you’re you are forecasting only revenues of 400 crores rather than a much higher potential.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Now very good question. I. I’ve opened the Sheet also. So I can.
Neeraj
Yeah. So which is the numbers 1800 going to 24, 2500 rooms which is a jump for almost 40%. We expecting a room rate to also go up which is a jump of almost 15%. But revenue is 10% only.
Neeraj
So.
Neeraj
So is that. Is it because you are expecting this to be an exit fund rate or is it that you are building too much of conservative or you are building lower? Just some thoughts. One thing aside, probably takes time.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
So example of the Hyderabad. We expect to open by July. If it opens before then also that’s fine. But it’s a very room centric property. It is in fact this 50 rooms may increase as we speak. It may go up a little. But again what is going on is only room revenue over there. There’s only one restaurant. There’s no banqueting. But it’s an excellent location in the heart of high tech city. So we expect only zoom income to come here. Here in fact every definitely maybe not even 15% of the revenue. When we talk about Rishikesh.
Rishikesh. So Hyderabad opening in July. It will start doing well from the month of July itself. Because Hyderabad is that kind of market. But it has lost the first three months. So even if I expect it to do a full year revenue of say 100 but it is actually only going to do 75 rupees considering that the first quarter is gone. Similarly in Rishik the reason we are targeting July to open is because the Dham starts. Dham Yatras and other things which are there. But it’s a 54 room property. It’s a resort kind of destination.
So again opening from the month of July. So I may not get the full year benefit. I’m only going to get 3 quarters per benefit. Bhavnagar is only 61 rooms but opening in October. So we are only going to get Mota Mota 5 months benefit or 6 months benefit or maximum 5. Because first one month goes in setup, you know, same way Dehradun. Dehradun. We expect it to be opening by suppose December which is our target. Then we’ll only get two, three months of the year ending. Gwalior also is expected to open by December. We will only get two, three years of the ending.
But Gwalior is a hula case. Gwalior though it’s a 50 room hotel, it has huge banqueting and very good potential for banqueting. So there the FNB to room ratio may end up being 50, 50 if not 60, 40. You know. So these are the Hotels which as of now we are opening this year. And as you can see we are not unable to. We are unable to take the full advantage of all the hotel being open in this year. So that is basically why we’ve kept our outlook conservative. I do agree it is conservative but I’d rather be conservative and beat my expectation than to unnecessarily just say something.
Because unfortunately these hotels are not opening full. Now see Chandigarh is opened at the right time of April. So this 11 months, next 10 to 11 months which I have in my hand will give me some meaningful and reasonable outcome in terms of the overall sales. So that will definitely also help adding in terms of our targets.
operator
Thank you. I would request Neeraj to please come back in the queue for further questions. The next question is from the line of Nitech from Envy Alpha Fund. Please go ahead.
Nitech
Hi sir. Thanks for the opportunity. So my question is in terms of Capex, what would be the requirement for this year? I believe we are doing some renovation in the Pune hotel. So what would be your Capex is required to do the same. And will some keys remain shut while we are renovating the Pune hotel?
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Yes. So basically just like we have, you know, Pune work going on, it is from the internal accruals only. We are not using any outside money. We are using from internal accruals and whatever is generated by the company that in even last year the work which is been going on, the work has been going on and yet the company has a purpose of 25cr in its hand. So we will be using our cash very efficiently in terms of doing both increasing our property value in terms of aspiration and in terms of sale while also having prudent cash flow management and creating these reserves also and reducing the debt altogether.
So I think the Masmita Ji and team are doing a very good job in that regard. So it’s all from internal accruals and it will be completed again. It’s in a phased manner. So it will continue over the next almost would say 18 months. Because Poona Orchid is a very large hotel. It’s a 410 room hotel which eventually will become approximately 460 rooms. So we intend that all the rooms will be renovated based on blocks. So the hotel will always have not less than 350 rooms for sale. So that’s how we intend to do the renovation.
So that I think will be the reason why the sales also will continue to support our overall and there is no dip in our revenue. Or maybe the banquet also will come Two banquet halls like I mentioned before will also come into the picture.
Nitech
Right. But any number you would want to give in terms of how much you are going to be spending this year in the next 18 months say for the same for whatever donation that is left.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Around 40 crore rupees is what we expect the thing to be.
operator
So the next question is, you know over the last year in both Orchid brand and Era brand has seen occupancy rate drop year over year. So sir, what is the reason for that?
Vishal Vithal Kamat
So what happens now when we talk about Orcade? Unfortunately it also includes some of the hotels which are like example Jam Nagar. So in Jam Nagar being an Orchid brand and this being a brand orchid, it does not reflect the true occupancy or the true ARR of the Orchid like say Mumbai or where there has been an increase in the ARR and the occupancy. So last year basically we did 6069. This year we did 6900 for the orchid. ERA did last time 5600. This year it has done 5900. So it’s not dropped, it’s gone up.
But it still does not reflect the real ARR of IRA Mumbai. Real ARR of IRA Mumbai is much north of this. Yeah. 6500 plus and Orchid Mumbai 7200 plus. So it’s not a true reflection of the performance of individual hotels. But as a brand now what happens again where they are selling around 3 and a half to 4000 rupees brings the overall Era brand car ADR down. So that’s basically what the thing is. So ARR has gone up from last year, last quarter, in the quarter to quarter. But this is not what you call. But you’re right that it does not reflect the true operational improvements in the unit level like Orchid Mumbai.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Gitesh from Mind Rava Global Capital. Please go ahead.
Jitesh
Hi, Sir Am I audble
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Yes. Yes, sir. No, sir.
Jitesh
So sir, I have two questions. Given the merger of Trio Resorts that is in Palagar and the acquisition of the Chandi Hospitality. Would the board quantify the revenue contribution from the Palagar Luxury.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
So you’re talking about the Chandi Hospital. I’m sorry, AGOR considers the use of Chandi Hospitality. And. And what? Can you please repeat your question?
Jitesh
Sir, given the merger of the Trio Resort which is in Palang. Yeah. The acquisition of Chandi Hospitality.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Yeah, yeah.
Jitesh
You quantify the revenue contribution that the property makes.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
So Chandi hospitality has the Chandigarh Orchid Hotel. Okay. We expect that in its mature like phase it should do anywhere between around 30cr. Top line it should do okay. Which is the thing. But this is open just now. So this year we had be conservative to say that it would do about maybe anywhere between 20 and 22 cr. Okay for this year is what we are expecting. But that’s our conservative take on a practical take on Chandigarh Orchid and Palgar basically is very interesting that we basically had this property which we were looking at acquiring and doing and unfortunately at that time we were very poor in communicating the benefits and the things of this entire.
But today this turned out to be a boom boom because it is right near the Wadhvan port. There is an airport coming near our property. Whatever valuation and value we had at that particular time it has way surpassed that entire piece of. It’s a 16 acre property at Palhar and it’s a now its property value has shot up and its demand also shot up. So the company has decided not to do anything right now to it. One is that is a pending a merger. So pending the merger because we are awaiting SEBI approval. Correct. So we are awaiting this Sebi approval approval.
Once the Sevy approval comes okay. And then I think then approval that will be the process and then the members approval. So based on this fulfilling the company will have at those valuations a massive chunk of land which it needs intends to exploit in not just in a resort manner but even from the real estate perspective because we have been approached by various people to look at developing because that Algar and that entire Manur Algar Wadhwan area is right now extremely hot. So we’re just waiting for certain things to happen. Once this all happens then accordingly a right kind of good name partner there are various who are interested would be associated and we would look at a mix of 16 acres being a breakup between a fantastic resort Orchid Hotel along with commercial residential development also.
And it’s a very scenic spot right on the main highway. So we are quite keen that once this statutory challenges not challenges but the statutory processes once this gets complete. Because it has been quite long Sebi has been taking its due time on many things. So once that completes then we will be able to monetize this and we are very happy to see that its value is literally doubled tripled because of the airport and other things and all coming out. So I’m very happy for us all as Commodore Hotel’s shareholders. But at that time I think we had not fully explained properly the overall benefits that are there.
So thank you for Asking that question.
Jitesh
That’s great news. Sir. I had one more question. Could you also provide some clarity on the resolution, some sort of timeline concerning the Enforcement directorate investigation that is currently going on and when we can expect the 500 lakh to be released. Considering that we have already made an exceptional income of 160 lakhs just from the accrued interest or what can we expect going forward?
Vishal Vithal Kamat
So that’s a very nice question. Let me share with you and I’ll tell you in very brief for all my listeners and for them to understand what is the PD matter. In 2013 when the company was in finance financial challenges we had a loan to be paid to Punjab National Bank. So the company at that time decided that let us sell our Bhubaneswar asset. It is worth 30 cr. Loan of Punjab National bank was around 21 cr. And the balance amount which was around 8 or 20 to 21 whatever 8 odd cr. We would use that to settle other banks in commerce, hotels and come out of the things as conventional logic.
So when they did this that time they had floated various interest obviously through brokers and others. And all that time there was a company called as Micro finance and Leasing who came to us. They did a genuine transaction, we did a genuine transaction where there was a genuine sale to be done. And just as in any genuine sale you will take a token. So the company had taken a token of three crore rupees based on which in 2014 and agreement was entered. An agreement was entered with various timelines and hurdles to be done. One of the hurdles being getting approval from the government of Odisha that also the company fulfilled its obligations.
But in 2014, 2015 during that time we were not aware that who these people and most of India has dealt with various kinds of. You know, these kinds of chit fund kind of people who have, you know done legitimate and illegitimate transactions. Ours is a clean, clear, legitimate transaction. That is why we were able to get this order. The order is very simple that earlier because of certain actions of the ED a lot of our money had to be deposited in the court. Finally the court has said no, you do one thing, you keep only five.
Because their demand is only three crore rupees. But 15 crore rupees across approximately of our money had got stuck because of the ED matter. Now out of this 15 crore rupee the court said yes, if they are asking for three, they are entitled for three crore. So you give them three crore along with this. Keep this two crore rupee extra interest with them. Okay? So that they Also will not. They are also not objected. They also accepted. And the balance money will come back to Commerce Hotel India Ltd. This said and done. The court also has identified as has we also and as we have our rights to further claim this 5 crore back based on the guidance, advice and the actions of our advocates and other legal team.
So the company while it has currently deposited is not deposited. It will deposit once we get the money from the court. It is right now all deposited in court within the next week 10 days we should get this entire 16 and a half half crore rupees broadly 16 and a half crore rupees back from the court. Out of that 16 and a half crore rupees 5 crore will be deposited with the PD with considering the full rights to demand this also back which the company will continue to do. And the balance 11 odd crore rupees will be with the company to be utilized as it being fit.
So that is broadly the CD matter. Okay. We are. I’m very happy that to tell you that we have gone through our trial by fire and we have come out clean that yes this has been a business legitimate transaction. But as in any matter it takes time to what you call resolve. Okay. And we are intending on that. So I hope this explains the whole picture.
operator
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Krisha Kansara from Molecule Ventures. Please go ahead.
Krisha Kansara
My first question was already asked by a participant. But I just wanted to confirm the capex amount. So you mentioned that you will spend 40 crores for renovating two properties, right? One is the Goa property and one is ohppl.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
This is only. This is only OH ppn. This is only not what has been already done and completed and it is operational also it is started operations of late, right?
Krisha Kansara
So what amount did we spend in the Goa Properties renovation?
Vishal Vithal Kamat
14Cr okay.
Krisha Kansara
14Cr okay. Okay.
Krisha Kansara
And you mentioned that our merger is currently. You know we are awaiting SEVI approval and then of course we’ll go to NCLT approval and etc. So could you put a timeline to it by when will we be able to conclude the merger? And then once the merger is concluded what. What are our expansion plans on. On the land that we have in Savarwadi?
Vishal Vithal Kamat
I have already answered this just now before madam. So I don’t want to take all the participants time. Again I cannot give any timeline because it is only based on Sebi approval. Sebi has been sitting on it. Once they give an approval we will be in a position to expedite all the other things.
Krisha Kansara
Okay, sure. Thank you.
operator
The next question is on the line of Randeep Kapoor from Invest Higher Investments. Please go ahead.
Randeep Kapoor
Hi, thanks for the opportunity. My question is specifically for the four new hotels with the company hold. One is Ayodhya, Zoida, Jamnagar and Aurangabad. How did they perform in FY22 in terms of ARR and office?
Vishal Vithal Kamat
That’s a really good question. It did very well. I’ll start with Ayodhya. Ayodhya did exceedingly well especially because of the Kumbh Mela. Kumbh Mela time it did exceptional ARR fluctuating anywhere between 10 to 14,000 rupees with an occupancy of 90 odd percent during the Kumbh Mela. So that has done exceedingly well. And even the people are appreciating the food in our hotel.
So it is one of our top performing hotels in the Ayurveda market. It is, you know it is arguably between number one and two between us and another foreign brand. So that’s how well IRA has been able to do in for itself in Ayodhya. Which other hotel did you ask sir? Noida, Jamdagar and Aurangabad. So Noida has been basically started off slow. It’s been picked up did exceedingly well because especially in the third, in the fourth quarter there were various events in Noida which happened like the Auto Expo and other expos and because of our strategic location opposite Google and opposite Cognizant and other such corporates we are basically getting a lot of good movement which has started now.
So it has also been doing exceedingly well. The ARR over there fluctuates anywhere between four, four and a half to up to seven, seven and a half, half also and maybe or sometimes it anomaly falls down even more. And this has been our first sequence so we did not know many things which we have learned now and next year we expect it to do much, much better. In fact right now it’s only operating with 32 rooms. 34 rooms. But the additional 26 rooms will come. Once that comes as a 60 room hotel it will do even better.
So we are awaiting the second phase work with which is already going on as we speak. So yeah, that’s Noida then. Sambaji Nagar has done really well in terms of the rooms. While it was a strategic move, it was a strategic call. We are very keen that we are already having a strength in Mumbai, Pune. A lot of the factories, Skoda and various other companies, MNCs, they have a setup in Pune and in Sambhaji Nagar or they have a setup in Samadhi Nagar and Mumbai. And we wanted to, basically because of our network, we wanted to be in Sambaji Nagar.
So we took this. Even though Satiti Moons is a very small property for us. But I’m very happy to tell you it’s doing very well. Especially during season Here also the ARR fluctuates between anywhere between 3 and a half to 6 and a half depending on the season. Because Aurangabad, especially during summers the rates fall because the low people more or less it’s extremely hot. But in the winters and during wedding times again it has a very good pickup and a very good boom. So that’s also doing well. And which one else are you wanting to know? Jam Nagar started off slowly but then thanks to certain nice events which happened over there, one of the biggest weddings in the country or maybe the world that has happened, that helped us a lot over there to do well.
But now we find that there’s a good, stable, consistent market which has developed because it is by far the best product in Jamnagar. And it is doing in terms of the client profile we are getting is very different from what other hotels are being getting. So it is doing well. But yes, it’s a tough ARR market. In fact, it is the kind of ARR which has brought down our overall orchid brand ARR that fluctuates anywhere between three and a half and five and a half. Four and a half, five and a half. It is a tough market.
But we think that once we are soon looking at certain opportunities in Dwarka and Rajkot and once this Dwarka Rajkot happens, this will be a natural tool circuit which is currently already there in place. So that will further help our overall business in Jam Nagar also. Okay, thank you so much, sir. I think moderator, in interest of time we can take two more questions and then we can wind up. If you don’t mind, when unless anyone else has.
operator
Okay, sir, the next question is from the line of Siddal from RV Investments.
operator
Please go ahead.
Siddall
Good evening. Audible. So given the occupancy ratio current one, do you anticipate this level of performance to be sustainable over the next year?
Vishal Vithal Kamat
What is sustainable, sir? Sorry, your voice was cracking.
Siddall
So given the current occupancy ratio, do you anticipate this level of performance to be sustainable over the next year?
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Yes, sir, we definitely hope that we don’t just sustain this.
Siddall
Okay, sir, that was my question. Thank you very much.
operator
Yes, sir. Yeah, we have I think around six people still Left for questions. So let’s finish all the six people Visa. In respect for all who have been patient till now, let’s finish all the six who are currently there. Huh? Okay.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Okay.
operator
Sir. Yeah.
operator
The next question is from the line of Kunyan Gandara from Tao Ventures.
operator
Please go ahead.
Kunyan Gandara
Thank you sir for taking the question. So I have an accounting question. In December 24 quarter revenue which was around 110 crores, was it. I mean did it have any exceptional item? Because the notes mentioned that some 8, 9 crores was due to some reversal of property tax dispute with BNC which was recognized as operating income. So was it like our actual revenue was 102 odd?
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Yeah. So basically as already in the entire city of Mumbai there are certain challenges happening which is matter is well known and in the Supreme Court also. Okay. Whereby there was a way of calculating tax between what I believe to be called as capital gain system and the old method. I just call it an older new method for easy parliament. So there was a challenge between the old and the new and there was a gap. So finally I think when our board decided that we are doing all these kind of cleanups, making everything, we don’t want to unnecessarily pay penalties and other things.
And based on that we basically finished off whatever pending challenges were there in the property tax and other things also. So we are very happy to tell you that ever since that cleanup and the NOC being getting from the BMC and all, we have no dues left with the bmc which is a very good thing for us both. Reputation wise, property safety wise in all wise. So the company has used a lot of its energy and effort in the last one and a half years to clean up all these kinds of miscellaneous things also. So we don’t want to keep any, you know.
That’s why this year when the balance sheet comes out it will be much thinner than before because so many of these kind of earlier matters which were mentioned are now not there. This is basically what used to be mentioned in the earlier balance sheets also that as per capital gain, this, that whatever that it’s called a capital system or whatever they call it. So basically this was the challenge. So this is there in the whole city of Mumbai. But we decided to resume it with the BMC as each one can as a citizen. So thank you.
Thank you.
operator
Does that answer your question?
Kunyan Gandara
Yes.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Yes. And thank you sir.
operator
The next question is a follow up question. It’s from the line of Amansoni from Invest Analytics Advisory. Please go ahead. Amansuni Your line has been unmuted. Please go ahead with your question.
Aman Soni
My question is already answered.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Thank you, sir. Thank you. Appreciate it.
operator
The next question is from the line of Guru Darshan from Kitara Capital. Please go ahead.
Guru Darshan
Yes, sir. Thank you. So just wanted to understand for the properties that are on lease or any of coming up for renewal this year, are we planning to renew them or are we looking to give up any of these existing properties?
Vishal Vithal Kamat
No, there is no properties for renewal or anything like that per se. We are all our long leads or long term tie ups. So they have a long time to end. So thank you, sir.
Guru Darshan
All right. Thank you sir. Thank you.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Thank you sir. Will be the last Persona as we already discussed. Mr. B will be the last.
operator
Okay. The next question is from the line of Neeraj from White Fine Investments. Please go ahead.
Neeraj
Thank you for the follow up. I had one question you said about the conservatism in forecasting. Appreciate that. But since your lot of revenue will be coming from the room side, you know, rather than SMB. And Zoom has had operating leverage both sides. Right. So do you see the data margin for the company in improving or slightly sort of falling this some guidance from you would be.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
So definitely the EBITDA in terms of volume like today we are at 100, 202. So definitely this 102 figure will go north. Because Chandigarh Hotel will contribute a good portion to this. Then Rishikesh, even if it will not be its full potential, it will add something more to the EBITDA bottom line. Similarly other hotels like Hyderabad, this will also participate in this. So I think that definitely we can see this EBITDA line of ours improving considerably in the coming year. And yeah, it will do. It will definitely add.
Neeraj
Okay, great. Thank you.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Thank you sir.
operator
The next question is from the line of Rakesh Banerjee from RAP Capital. Please go ahead.
Rakesh Banerjee
Yeah, thanks for the opportunity. Sir, my question is, let’s say we assume that none of our new properties are coming online this year. Now given that you have given a guidance that our ARR will be improving from 6,500 to 7,500 which is almost around 15%. And at the same time the occupancy ratio is for the existing property on year, on year basis has been only 55%. Now even if there is no new property occupancy, we consider even then also from the existing property as we know that as and when the hotel matures the occupancy rate to improves.
So let’s say if we can improve from 55% to 60%. Just 5% over here. And the ARR guidance that you have given is around 15 over the last year. So even then also there should be 20 growth in the revenue. So I just wanted to understand what made you like even if we do not consider the new properties that is coming online, even then also there should be 20 kind of growth as far as per our understanding.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Yes. So I can explain you. Let’s understand sir, that average room rate as shared in slide number. What is this number slide 10 and which you are referring to? This is an increase in room rate. It does not necessarily reflect for the entire group sir. The reason being that today with the Rishikesh coming and if it is going to do an 18 ARR, even though it is a small base of 58 rooms, the ARR will go up. So what we are looking at with Chandigarh where the Chandigarh also ARR market we are expecting a very healthy ARR.
We have premium properties coming in this year. Dehradun also when it comes will be a premium ARR in the sense that it will be a hundred dollars bracket which will be $90 to 128,000. 10,000. So when we’re looking at an ARR increase it is not consuming necessary to the entire thing. I think we smita should make this very clear. Because see we are on one hand talking about different brands. We should make this clear. So I think we have not correct. I think that’s a very good question you asked sir and made me realize this.
What we need to present better. The average room rate will go up, definitely go up for the brand. But it is not across all the 2000 plus keys that is there, those will go up based on each. Like example, some may go 5%, some may go up 8%, some may go up 10%. But the percentage is not directly mentioned by you on their denominating factor. So it’s a very good question question. And I think sir, we will connect this part and make it more specific. Next. Next is me.
Rakesh Banerjee
That’s one. And second part is sir, like now we have reduced the debt substantially and with our kind of clean balance sheet we are in a position to negotiate with a bank for a, you know, cheaper credit cost. Also my question is why we are trying to be completely debt free rather than why not. But if our, you know, if we are sustainably making 20% ROCE or return on equity and if you are Getting loan at 10% for example we are making 10% alpha in the business. So instead of using that debt judiciously. Why we are targeting to be completely debt free.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
So sir, we are not targeting to be debt free. Honestly speaking we were looking at that we will eventually, eventually come down to broadly 80 crore rupee debt. Have two banks with us to support us today. We are grateful to Axis bank that they have implicit faith in us. We are grateful to all our past lenders who we have dealt with. And though we have a problem with ARC and others with them including SBI bank, all these people today, they have a strong faith in us because we paid them also. We came back out of this also and they know, they respect us as a genuine business gone down and bounced back.
So I agree with you sir, our intention is not to be fully debt free. But we as you rightly also said that we must bring our interest which is today 10.5 that to target around 9ish or maybe sub 9 if possible. And have two good strong bankers to be able to support us. As for our expansion, ultimately sir, with so much cash being generated and conserved there is obviously a plan in the future for us to look at. But those are for the future things. Today the company wants to just keep itself neat, clean, nimble.
So that it can take advantage of any opportunities which may come in the future.
Rakesh Banerjee
Fine sir, another last question is that on year, on year basis if we see our occupancy ratio has remained almost same it might have happened that we have added couple of key rooms. And that is why the occupancy even if on percentage term is remaining same. But on absolute term it has increased. But going forward, let’s say all our existing property, I’m not talking about the new properties but for our existing property. What sort of occupancy increment we are looking for and what are the steps that we are taking for that.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
You know your hotel to hotel like example Mumbai hotels are in the highest 70s, you know on a PI TD basis. But then there are certain which are at a little lower. Like you rightly correctly said many a times what happens sir is that the new properties which come in they bring down the overall error of the overall hotel. So you know it’s basically just about being concerned consistently at it. And as these new hotels will become mature, the overall scenario will improve. Thank you sir.
Rakesh Banerjee
Okay. Thank you so much.
operator
Thank you. I think we finished all the things. Sir.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
There’S two more.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Okay, let us, let us. One is Mr. G and Mr. Raman. Apart from these two then we will end it.
operator
Okay sir, the next question is some Raman from CQN Investments. Please go ahead.
Raman KV
I just have one question with respect to the Rishikesh property as well as the which will be open in first half of the this year. So how much incremental revenue will they be adding to the company’s consolidated revenue this year? And what is the the optimum use case? What is the incremental revenue from those two property? So sir, we think that it should do around 12cr for us if all things go well. Okay, so that basically would be the broadcast broadly. Yeah, around you can say plus minus 11 to 13. Both the. Both the properties inclusive, right? Rishikeshna.
Raman KV
Rishikesh. And.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Yeah, so in both together we’ll do 12cr, right? Both will work. Both together will do 12gr right? Or individually Rishikesh will do 12cr and Hyderabad will do 12cr. No, Hyderabad will do different. Sir, this I’ve told you is only Rishikesh, Hyderabad, Hyderabad Hydrobad. One second. Hyderabad should do somewhere around 7 to 8 cr. 7 cr is about 60. Okay, answer. The 16 acre property in Palkar, what is the current plan value of those that property? Sir, right now the land value is substantially high. Let certain things develop. Sir, we will sing it because neither now, neither the company, it’s right now in the midst of a merger.
So it’s not fair for me to speculate on this. Definitely. You know it’s not correct to speak about its value. But let’s just say that whatever it is, it’s been considerably high. And going up further now with the other also. Okay, thank you sir. Thank you sir. Thank you.
operator
The last question is from the line of Gold, an individual investor. Please go ahead.
Unidentified Participant
Hello.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Yes, hello.
Unidentified Participant
I’m audible.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Yes sir, you are.
Unidentified Participant
Yes sir.
Unidentified Participant
So my question is regarding dividend payout. So I mean when do we plan to enter the dividend paying list of companies given that the stocks are re rated. I mean once we start paying dividend and my name is Gunit from Counter circuit pmsar. Gunit, thank you for being the last caller of the day. Regarding dividend, I think that’s something which we will definitely put this point to the board. So this is something more the board will decide. I cannot speculate on that. But yeah, so definitely dividend one thing and that will definitely help us if you’re saying what other four part was there of your question? Sir, my second question would be that we have about 16 hotels operational currently.
Unidentified Participant
So I mean this question has like 2, 3 sub questions.
Unidentified Participant
So how long does it take for a hotel to stabilize. And what kind of optimal occupancy do we expect by a hotel for the.
Unidentified Participant
Rooms number one and number two, the currently operational hotels if we consider them to be stabilized what kind of revenue.
Unidentified Participant
Potential at that optimal utilization do we expect from optimal occupancy do we expect from from the current operational hotels? That and we also have about seven to eight hotels coming up. So I mean I would like to understand the revenue potential from those as well.
Vishal Vithal Kamat
Yeah. So sir, a lot of this, what you asked for is already given in the presentation which we’ve shared. A lot of these details are there in that which is already been given. So that will help answer at least 70% of queries. One of the things which you asked about stability, I’ll just tell you that generally sir, it takes a few months, anywhere between two to four months for the hotel to stabilize.
Bring up certain things come into play that it just takes some time. It depends again on location location. Hyderabad will happen in not more than a month whereas a Rishikesh may take four months. We don’t know basically based on various factors. But as I’m giving you industry general thumb rule and second is 65% is generally what the industry looks at in terms of reasonable occupancy for a year to date depending on again property to property, city to city. A city like Mumbai should be in the 70s with a very good ARR or with a considerably compromised ARR.
But then in the 80s in occupancy same way for Delhi. So it’s a very subjective and a very important thing. Rest of the things like I mentioned is there in our presentation. So with that I’d like to thank you all for participating. I’m really grateful to the numerous people who asked the questions. Some of them patiently came back also in line. I really thank you once again and namaskar everyone.
operator
Thank you on behalf of Kamath Hotels India limited that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us and you may now disconnect your lines. Thank you.